Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[lazyboy97o]

I think you or others have said that 3-4 times this week and it's been pointed out that airflow patterns are quite different in terminals and airplanes. Airplanes have pretty strong downflow of air, so it mingles less with air in the seats before and behind you and they ahve HEPA filtration of all the air with a pretty high turnover rate. none of that is true in the terminal.

Just because "the science" isn't immediately obvious or understandable doesn't mean it isn't there.

There also just seems to be this issue with understanding the issue cumulative exposure. It’s not all or nothing.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

I have a hard time believing some of the science though when the science is different depending on which site or source it comes from.

Going to the airport recently where we all lined up 6ft apart to check in and board and then cram the plane full next to each other made no sense to me so that’s why I think some of it is whatever looks and makes people feel good whether it is or not

going out to eat and everyone immediately removing our masks when we sit down and then the waitresses or waiters come to our table right next to us and take our order...how many of them have had covid because of that? Not sure many or they wouldn’t allow that to be

The science stays the same except for adjusting when new data comes in. Has been that way since the beginning of time, let alone this pandemic. Now where you go for your information I would agree with you. Taking the 2 extremes, Fox and CNN, you may get the science but with so many talking heads and points of view it can be confusing but the science is the same.
Science said this is not the time to losses all restrictions because we are getting vaccinated. Also says no unnecessary travel... keep the masks on.. stay the distance.. these are tried and true methods to get back to where we want to be. Unfortunately people are tired and want things back 6 months ago. So this is why cases are going back up.

US first to surpass 30 million infections; health officials concerned as cases stop falling despite vaccines: Live COVID-19 updates

Experts are warning of a fourth surge of coronavirus cases as new variants spread rapidly through the U.S. Latest COVID-19 news.

www.google.com

But the science hasn’t changed, people are just itchy.

 

[wdwmagic]

Great news for CMs!

 

[ABQ]

Brazil does look bad, though their current surge is just now getting to where the US was in mid January. Hopefully it turns around for them.

India has weathered Covid surprisingly well, but their surge in the past 3 weeks is also alarming.

India is just not a place conducive to social distancing, I suppose. Not sure much of Brazil is either.

 

[TTA94]

I get all of that but it’s going to be interesting to see who makes the first lesser restriction move (Uni or Disney) because the other will likely have to follow soon thereafter

virus risk or not disney will likely remain as is capacity wise until they can bring back night shows parades and remove the masks as many will not pay the same for less of the experience

Now that everyone in FL will be able to get vaccinated in April, Hopefully that rumor of entertainment returning this summer is looking way more promising! However, there is still two big potential issues remaining, even if the majority of FL residents gets vaccinated, will WDW choose to wait until the majority of the world is able to get the vaccine? Secondly and more of a major setback, will Disney wait for children to be eligible for the vaccine?

 

[James J]

The results for AstraZeneca have now been updated for the US trial: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-56521166

From the article:

The Anglo-Swedish firm has now adjusted the efficacy rate of its vaccine from 79% to 76%.
Further data from the US trial showed efficacy among the over 65s rose from 80% to 85%.
AstraZeneca said it now looked forward to getting US regulatory approval.
The company said the trial results confirm the vaccine "is highly effective in adults" and it remains 100% effective at preventing severe cases of the disease.

 

[GimpYancIent]

I just can’t fathom how the cruise line handles an anti-masker. We’ve all seen/heard stories of passengers that take their mask off mid-flight, or the Disney guest that sheds his mask when he’s alllllll the way in the back of the park. Those situations are resolved quickly.

What repercussions are there for someone who behaves like that on a cruise ship?

Set them adrift in a life boat?

 

[disneygeek90]

I just can’t fathom how the cruise line handles an anti-masker. We’ve all seen/heard stories of passengers that take their mask off mid-flight, or the Disney guest that sheds his mask when he’s alllllll the way in the back of the park. Those situations are resolved quickly.

What repercussions are there for someone who behaves like that on a cruise ship?

Wouldn't the idea be that masks wouldn't be necessary if you're traveling with a fully vaccinated (or negative test I suppose) ship?

 

[danlb_2000]

I have a hard time believing some of the science though when the science is different depending on which site or source it comes from.

Going to the airport recently where we all lined up 6ft apart to check in and board and then cram the plane full next to each other made no sense to me so that’s why I think some of it is whatever looks and makes people feel good whether it is or not

going out to eat and everyone immediately removing our masks when we sit down and then the waitresses or waiters come to our table right next to us and take our order...how many of them have had covid because of that? Not sure many or they wouldn’t allow that to be

I know it’s bad. I received the vaccine the other day. I get it but a lot I don’t and I think unfortunately a lot of it is still political and over the top with such a high survival rate. Just my opinion. Hoping the new Pfizer drugs pill form will help keep those who do get it from potentially being hospitalized so then the severity will seem less

The science has shown that dining in a restaurant is risky. The wait staff might be a slightly less risk since they can wear masks the whole time, but I am sure they are getting infected. There are scientists who say that restaurants should still be closed.

 

[Polkadotdress]

This just in...India discovers a "double mutant" strain.

India records spike in Covid-19 cases as several variants detected, prompting fears of a second wave | CNN

India on Thursday recorded 53,476 new Covid-19 cases, marking the highest single-day rise in cases since October 23, according to a CNN tally of figures from the Indian Ministry of Health.

www.cnn.com

UGH.

 

[ABQ]

The science has shown that dining in a restaurant is risky. The wait staff might be a slightly less risk since they can wear masks the whole time, but I am sure they are getting infected. There are scientists who say that restaurants should still be closed.

In my own experience, I find I feel safer at a restaurant, though in my area they are still limited to just 25% indoor capacity, than I do going to the supermarket. At least in the restaurant, people tend to stay within their own area. One way isles in a supermarket are a dubious idea at best and then by the time you get to the checkout, self serve or not, everyone packs in , touches the same surfaces, etc... Rubbing elbows all the while.

 

[tommcp516]

I just can’t fathom how the cruise line handles an anti-masker. We’ve all seen/heard stories of passengers that take their mask off mid-flight, or the Disney guest that sheds his mask when he’s alllllll the way in the back of the park. Those situations are resolved quickly.

What repercussions are there for someone who behaves like that on a cruise ship?

They could always bring back this oldie but goodie...

 

[DisneyDebRob]

In my own experience, I find I feel safer at a restaurant, though in my area they are still limited to just 25% indoor capacity, than I do going to the supermarket. At least in the restaurant, people tend to stay within their own area. One way isles in a supermarket are a dubious idea at best and then by the time you get to the checkout, self serve or not, everyone packs in , touches the same surfaces, etc... Rubbing elbows all the while.

That’s why I do hope many things that have changed because of the pandemic continue. I never realized how much I disliked going to get groceries or running to the store. I love ordering online and going to a spot where they bring the stuff out to your car. I’ve done in multiple times with home depot, Walmart and others. The Instacart service is new to me also and I love it. Takeout has never been easier and I’m supporting the local businesses more then ever because of the convenience.
Of course in the future we will be dining out again but I’m really not missing it which surprises me. Enjoying the bit of distance between people and more convenience. Hopefully, some of it stays and I think it will. Things will be a bit different moving ahead IMO.

 

[Chi84]

I have a hard time believing some of the science though when the science is different depending on which site or source it comes from.

Going to the airport recently where we all lined up 6ft apart to check in and board and then cram the plane full next to each other made no sense to me so that’s why I think some of it is whatever looks and makes people feel good whether it is or not

going out to eat and everyone immediately removing our masks when we sit down and then the waitresses or waiters come to our table right next to us and take our order...how many of them have had covid because of that? Not sure many or they wouldn’t allow that to be

I know it’s bad. I received the vaccine the other day. I get it but a lot I don’t and I think unfortunately a lot of it is still political and over the top with such a high survival rate. Just my opinion. Hoping the new Pfizer drugs pill form will help keep those who do get it from potentially being hospitalized so then the severity will seem less

Mitigation measures aren't just based on science. They have to be both effective and reasonable, and what is considered reasonable depends on factors that are often social, business-related or political (in the general sense) in nature.

Businesses like airlines and restaurants do what they are able within the confines of their particular business needs. The reasonableness of a measure is judged in light of the amount of good it actually does. People on planes need to sit close together; at one point, the airlines were blocking middle seats, but the amount of good that was doing in such close quarters led that practice to be abandoned. Table service restaurants by their nature will have people indoors for a significant length of time without wearing masks. People seem to be okay with wearing masks entering and leaving, but the idea of asking them to put on masks between bites was rejected because it would not provide enough added protection to justify the downsides of the practice (fewer customers).

People differ immensely in balancing reasonableness with effectiveness, which is what we're seeing in many of these arguments. When people had no way to protect themselves from the virus, they were willing to accept a high level of restrictions as reasonable. This is going to change as more people are vaccinated. People are going to look more critically at restrictions, asking not whether they do anything at all, but how much they are actually helping.

 

[GhostHost1000]

Mitigation measures aren't just based on science. They have to be both effective and reasonable, and what is considered reasonable depends on factors that are often social or political (in the general sense) in nature.

Businesses like airlines and restaurants do what they are able within the confines of their particular business needs. The reasonableness of a measure is judged in light of the amount of good it actually does. People on planes need to sit close together; at one point, the airlines were blocking middle seats, but the amount of good that was doing in such close quarters led that practice to be abandoned. Table service restaurants by their nature will have people indoors for a significant length of time without wearing masks. People seem to be okay with wearing masks entering and leaving, but the idea of asking them to put on masks between bites was rejected because it would not provide enough added protection to justify the downsides of the practice (fewer customers).

People differ immensely in balancing reasonableness with effectiveness, which is what we're seeing in many of these arguments. When people had no way to protect themselves from the virus, they were willing to accept a high level of restrictions as reasonable. This is going to change as more people are vaccinated. People are going to look more critically at restrictions, asking not whether they do anything at all, but how much they are actually helping.

Well said

 

[ABQ]

That’s why I do hope many things that have changed because of the pandemic continue. I never realized how much I disliked going to get groceries or running to the store. I love ordering online and going to a spot where they bring the stuff out to your car. I’ve done in multiple times with home depot, Walmart and others. The Instacart service is new to me also and I love it. Takeout has never been easier and I’m supporting the local businesses more then ever because of the convenience.
Of course in the future we will be dining out again but I’m really not missing it which surprises me. Enjoying the bit of distance between people and more convenience. Hopefully, some of it stays and I think it will. Things will be a bit different moving ahead IMO.

We try to do as much like as as possible, but we've had terrible luck when it comes to the markets picking our fruits, veggies and meat and fish. Most they are good at are canned and dry goods.

 

[Chi84]

We try to do as much like as as possible, but we've had terrible luck when it comes to the markets picking our fruits, veggies and meat and fish. Most they are good at are canned and dry goods.

We did delivery, then curbside pickup and had problems with both. It's just the two of us, so one time we ordered two individual russet potatoes and found out when we got home that they had loaded two 10-pound bags into the trunk. Luckily, my MIL makes a really good potato soup.

 

[Kevin_W]

This just in...India discovers a "double mutant" strain.

India records spike in Covid-19 cases as several variants detected, prompting fears of a second wave | CNN

India on Thursday recorded 53,476 new Covid-19 cases, marking the highest single-day rise in cases since October 23, according to a CNN tally of figures from the Indian Ministry of Health.

www.cnn.com

UGH.

As the article itself says:

"The strain first found in the UK, formally called the B.1.1.7 variant, has 23 mutations compared to the original strain found in Wuhan, according to the American Society of Microbiology. The Brazil variant known as P.1 has 17 mutations, and the South Africa variant known as B.1.351 also has multiple mutations, according to the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC)."

So I'm not sure what calling this a "double mutant" really even means.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

We did delivery, then curbside pickup and had problems with both. It's just the two of us, so one time we ordered two individual russet potatoes and found out when we got home that they had loaded two 10-pound bags into the trunk. Luckily, my MIL makes a really good potato soup.

That’s really surprising. We have had a problem 2 times with a Walmart pickup order, not that they got it wrong it’s just that they replace items if they are out which I don’t like. But everywhere else has been spot on.

 

[GoofGoof]

I get all of that but it’s going to be interesting to see who makes the first lesser restriction move (Uni or Disney) because the other will likely have to follow soon thereafter

virus risk or not disney will likely remain as is capacity wise until they can bring back night shows parades and remove the masks as many will not pay the same for less of the experience

We will see. Disney did wait 6 weeks to open last Summer so they won’t necessarily change right away if Universal does. They have overlords in CA to answer to. Even though Universal’s parent is in Philly they seem to be way less hands on with the parks. Disney seems to want to keep the rules the same in CA and FL.

On a positive note FL is opening vaccines to the general public starting April 5. That means Disney can facilitate CM vaccinations pretty soon. In order to reopen this past Summer Disney made an agreement with the unions on many of the safety protocols. Once CMs are vaccinated that removes one of the obstacles to relaxing safety protocols. Entertainment is also more possible as performers who have to be in close proximity to each other can all be vaccinated now. It also helps with the “sense of safety” if guests know the CMs they interact with will be much less likely to pass the virus to them.

I am actually pretty optimistic that by early Summer we will see the impact of the vaccines and start to see more significant relaxing of covid restrictions everywhere and specifically at WDW. The remaining ride vehicle distancing needs to go first and in conjunction some of the entertainment and people eating shows need to come back. Then you can remove park capacity limits and ramp up business. I still think masks are last to go since you can remove other restrictions and still falll back on masks as the remaining protocol similar to airlines no longer leaving empty seats but still requiring masks. Once the CDC changes their guidelines to say people who have been vaccinated no longer need to wear a mask then Disney will probably change their policy. That assumes the vast majority of people take the vaccine. I can’t see us all wearing masks for an extended period of time once most people are vaccinated. I think that time is coming sooner than some people are thinking.