Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[pocketlint]

COVID-19 victims’ autopsies detect virus in eyeballs: study

COVID-19 has been detected in the eyeballs of patients who have died from the illness, a new study says. Researchers from the Center for Vision and Eye Banking Research in Eversight, Ohio, performe…

nypost.com

 

[Miss Bella]

1 per million is actually 99.9999% survival or put another way with Covid deaths in the US so far 600+ people per million have died from Covid so it’s 600 times more deadly than a vaccine . With those stats I assume the “Covid is no big deal” crowd will gladly line up for the vaccine.

The other benefit of a vaccine is we all get to go back to normal life. For the sake of society and the economy and all the people out of work and all the people who are high risk and all the people who are suicidal I would hope people would consider taking the vaccine.

You do realize she was teasing the poster over the hysteria and panic not comparing the death rates of vaccines and covid. It was sarcastic. I can't believe that was lost on so many people. I have no idea if that poster has even given an opinion on vaccines.

 

[GoofGoof]

We can infer from all the other vaccines on the market. But yes, you are correct we don't know the full safety profile yet and that should be reviewed prior to any person agreeing to take the vaccine.

Of course we need to see what the trials show and what the risks are for a vaccine. Nobody is saying just blindly take a vaccine if it’s dangerous. For me it goes without saying that any time I talk about a vaccine it’s assuming the clinical trials go well and the vaccine is approved. I’m not trying to change anyone’s mind on this, just presenting my point of view and some info that may help people decide what to do. It’s not an easy call.

Just some historical context. Perhaps the most talked about vaccine “disaster” in the US happened in 1976 when the swine flu thought to be the same strain from the 1918 pandemic came back. There was an all out sprint to vaccinate people to avoid another pandemic. The vaccine developed had a higher instance of Guilin-Barre Syndrome and was eventually stopped after 40 million Americans got vaccinated. Estimates are different depending on where you read, but somewhere around 500 people are thought to have developed GBS after receiving the vaccine and 25 died. The federal government paid millions in damages to people or their families. On its face that may seem like a frightening incident, but if you break down the math from the incident 12.5 people per million got GBS and 0.62 per million died. Right now close to 24,000 people per million in the US have tested positive for Covid and 654 people per million have died, or put another way 4 times as many Covid deaths were reported today alone in just the state of FL than all the deaths from the botched 1976 H1N1 vaccine combined. Just something to consider.

 

[Chi84]

1 per million is actually 99.9999% survival or put another way with Covid deaths in the US so far 600+ people per million have died from Covid so it’s 600 times more deadly than a vaccine . With those stats I assume the “Covid is no big deal” crowd will gladly line up for the vaccine.

The other benefit of a vaccine is we all get to go back to normal life. For the sake of society and the economy and all the people out of work and all the people who are high risk and all the people who are suicidal I would hope people would consider taking the vaccine.

I predict the public's tolerance of face masks, social distancing, outdoor dining, remote learning, virtual church services, limited capacity businesses, etc. will go out the proverbial window upon the appearance of a safe, effective, widely distributed vaccine.

 

[GoofGoof]

You do realize she was teasing the poster over the hysteria and panic not comparing the death rates of vaccines and covid. It was sarcastic. I can't believe that was lost on so many people. I have no idea if that poster has even given an opinion on vaccines.

It wasn’t lost. It was super clever I don’t know what his opinion on vaccines is either. Not sure what in my post has anything to do with his opinion or anyone else’s. Just a simple comparison of how many people have survived Covid vs how many survive getting vaccinated.

 

[GoofGoof]

I predict the public's tolerance of face masks, social distancing, outdoor dining, remote learning, virtual church services, limited capacity businesses, etc. will go out the proverbial window upon the appearance of a safe, effective, widely distributed vaccine.

Let’s hope people actually get the vaccination and we can all put that stuff behind us. I don’t disagree that there will be a knee jerk reaction to remove all restrictions as soon as a vaccine is approved but it’s going to take some time to get people vaccinated. Could make for a pretty contentious start to 2021 in some places, especially with the toxic political environment that‘s unlikely to resolve itself any time soon.

 

[Tony the Tigger]

I predict the public's tolerance of face masks, social distancing, outdoor dining, remote learning, virtual church services, limited capacity businesses, etc. will go out the proverbial window upon the appearance of a safe, effective, widely distributed vaccine.

I hope that’s justified.

 

[Chi84]

Let’s hope people actually get the vaccination and we can all put that stuff behind us. I don’t disagree that there will be a knee jerk reaction to remove all restrictions as soon as a vaccine is approved but it’s going to take some time to get people vaccinated. Could make for a pretty contentious start to 2021 in some places, especially with the toxic political environment that‘s unlikely to resolve itself any time soon.

That’s why I said “widely distributed.” One person’s knee-jerk reaction is another person’s reasonable response. Should be interesting.

 

[Dan Deesnee]

Let’s hope people actually get the vaccination and we can all put that stuff behind us. I don’t disagree that there will be a knee jerk reaction to remove all restrictions as soon as a vaccine is approved but it’s going to take some time to get people vaccinated. Could make for a pretty contentious start to 2021 in some places, especially with the toxic political environment that‘s unlikely to resolve itself any time soon.

Considering some polls show over 50% of Americans saying they will never take the vaccine, I wouldn't count on your scenario playing out.

Why would a perfectly healthy 30 year old subject themselves to a rushed vaccine? Vaccines typically require 10-15 years and several stages of development to ensure safety.

The vaccine is, in my opinion, never going to be the big public event many think it will be. Several will come out next year, they'll be available to the most at risk only due to supply constraints, likely for quite a while. During this time antibody testing will improve and millions will find they've already had it. Life will go on and get back to normal at some point with the covid vaccine being optional and more widely available within a couple years.

 

[Miss Bella]

It wasn’t lost. It was super clever I don’t know what his opinion on vaccines is either. Not sure what in my post has anything to do with his opinion or anyone else’s. Just a simple comparison of how many people have survived Covid vs how many survive getting vaccinated.

99.7% survive Covid without being vaccinated too... there is that. If I really thought vaccines were deadly I couldn't in good conscience inject people. There are posters on here who are for mandating vaccines that debate came up a few months ago. I remember who they are and I expect that to be a contentious topic when the vaccine is released.

I haven't given a flu vaccine this year. Everyone I admit declines it. The reason I usually get is they don't work.

 

[GoofGoof]

That’s why I said “widely distributed.” One person’s knee-jerk reaction is another person’s reasonable response. Should be interesting.

Once the vaccine is widely distributed Covid restrictions will go away if enough people participate to get us to a low enough case total. If not then restrictions will likely continue indefinitely until the case numbers drop enough or better treatments are developed. We don’t need a vaccine to get past this pandemic, it’s just the fastest way there.

Considering some polls show over 50% of Americans saying they will never take the vaccine, I wouldn't count on your scenario playing out.

Why would a perfectly healthy 30 year old subject themselves to a rushed vaccine? Vaccines typically require 10-15 years and several stages of development to ensure safety.

The vaccine is, in my opinion, never going to be the big public event many think it will be. Several will come out next year, they'll be available to the most at risk only due to supply constraints, likely for quite a while. During this time antibody testing will improve and millions will find they've already had it. Life will go on and get back to normal at some point with the covid vaccine being optional and more widely available within a couple years.

Covid restrictions are only going to go away if cases go way down. If the vaccine isn’t widely used then restrictions continue. The economy stays in the toilet, WDW stays a shell of itself, etc. A healthy 30 year old can still get very sick and/or die from Covid. Why wouldn’t they get the vaccine?

 

[Dan Deesnee]

Once the vaccine is widely distributed Covid restrictions will go away if enough people participate to get us to a low enough case total. If not then restrictions will likely continue indefinitely until the case numbers drop enough or better treatments are developed. We don’t need a vaccine to get past this pandemic, it’s just the fastest way there.

Covid restrictions are only going to go away if cases go way down. If the vaccine isn’t widely used then restrictions continue. The economy stays in the toilet, WDW stays a shell of itself, etc. A healthy 30 year old can still get very sick and/or die from Covid. Why wouldn’t they get the vaccine?

I said why in my post. Vaccines take 10-15 years to ensure safety. Why would someone young with no risk factor for covid take a improperly tested, potentially dangerous vaccine?

Sure it kills people in their 30s, almost every time with major pre existing conditions.

 

[Chi84]

Once the vaccine is widely distributed Covid restrictions will go away if enough people participate to get us to a low enough case total. If not then restrictions will likely continue indefinitely until the case numbers drop enough or better treatments are developed. We don’t need a vaccine to get past this pandemic, it’s just the fastest way there.

Covid restrictions are only going to go away if cases go way down. If the vaccine isn’t widely used then restrictions continue. The economy stays in the toilet, WDW stays a shell of itself, etc. A healthy 30 year old can still get very sick and/or die from Covid. Why wouldn’t they get the vaccine?

I don’t believe the restrictions will continue indefinitely - people won’t stand for it. No sense in arguing over something neither one of us knows though. I don’t envy the next administration.

 

[Miss Bella]

Considering some polls show over 50% of Americans saying they will never take the vaccine, I wouldn't count on your scenario playing out.

Why would a perfectly healthy 30 year old subject themselves to a rushed vaccine? Vaccines typically require 10-15 years and several stages of development to ensure safety.

The vaccine is, in my opinion, never going to be the big public event many think it will be. Several will come out next year, they'll be available to the most at risk only due to supply constraints, likely for quite a while. During this time antibody testing will improve and millions will find they've already had it. Life will go on and get back to normal at some point with the covid vaccine being optional and more widely available within a couple years

Sounds about right.

 

[Miss Bella]

Sure she was. Nice revisionism there.

That was my interpretation, but you can ask her. Tone, sarcasm, and intent aren't the easiest things to interpret on a forum.

 

[GoofGoof]

I said why in my post. Vaccines take 10-15 years to ensure safety. Why would someone young with no risk factor for covid take a improperly tested, potentially dangerous vaccine?

Sure it kills people in their 30s, almost every time with major pre existing conditions.

Do you have a link to some evidence that the vaccines currently under development are improperly tested and dangerous? I just haven’t seen that reported anywhere.

 

[GoofGoof]

There are posters on here who are for mandating vaccines that debate came up a few months ago. I remember who they are and I expect that to be a contentious topic when the vaccine is released.

Vaccines won’t be mandated for the general public. If there’s an approved vaccine for children it may possibly be mandated for kids to return to school since there’s lots of precedent to support that. I don’t think we will ever get to the point where you need to be vaccinated to get into WDW or get on an airplane or a cruise ship or anything like that.

 

[Miss Bella]

Vaccines won’t be mandated for the general public. If there’s an approved vaccine for children it may possibly be mandated for kids to return to school since there’s lots of precedent to support that. I don’t think we will ever get to the point where you need to be vaccinated to get into WDW or get on an airplane or a cruise ship or anything like that.

I would like to think you are right, but what I've seen over the last year makes me believe otherwise.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

Vaccines won’t be mandated for the general public. If there’s an approved vaccine for children it may possibly be mandated for kids to return to school since there’s lots of precedent to support that. I don’t think we will ever get to the point where you need to be vaccinated to get into WDW or get on an airplane or a cruise ship or anything like that.

But then how will Bill Gates track us all?

 

[Dan Deesnee]

Do you have a link to some evidence that the vaccines currently under development are improperly tested and dangerous? I just haven’t seen that reported anywhere.

The fact that the process is designed to take a decade or more, and these vaccines will be coming out after only a year is proof enough of the inherent risk factor.

Besides that, several vaccines have had problems recently. I don't have time to pull all the updates on all the Covid vaccines that have had issues but one just today actually:

https://www.jnj.com/our-company/joh...en-covid-19-vaccine-candidate-clinical-trials