Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

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Chip Chipperson

Well-Known Member
If I do not feel well, I stay clear of others to not pass it onto others. A standard behavior I practiced long before COVID19 came on to the scene. Don't need a test to confirm that I am not feeling well.

But if you could find out that you have the virus even just 1 or 2 days sooner, wouldn't that help limit how many people you expose while also allowing you to contact anyone you had been around to let them know that they may have been exposed and should isolate and test themselves?
 

Lilofan

Well-Known Member
But if you could find out that you have the virus even just 1 or 2 days sooner, wouldn't that help limit how many people you expose while also allowing you to contact anyone you had been around to let them know that they may have been exposed and should isolate and test themselves?
That would not even be realistic to contact ones who may be exposed if you are the covid carrier ( ie airports, WDW, etc ).
 

dreday3

Well-Known Member
Yes. Intelligent people are perfectly capable of making stupid decisions. Dehumanising and belittling those we disagree with only widens the gap, which is the last thing we need.

Sorry, but no more making excuses for the unvaccinated. They made their (ignorant) choice and didn't give a crap about how it affected others.

Not getting vaccinated (outside of medical limitations) is not the intelligent choice. Period. And their choice is hurting others.
 

LittleBuford

Well-Known Member
Sorry, but no more making excuses for the unvaccinated. They made their (ignorant) choice and didn't give a crap about how it affected others.

Not getting vaccinated (outside of medical limitations) is not the intelligent choice. Period.
I’m not making excuses for them, nor am I saying their choice is intelligent. I explicitly said the opposite, in fact.
 

LittleBuford

Well-Known Member
A question for those of you who like to brand unvaccinated people stupid and/or selfish: What do you hope to achieve? I can only assume it’s a way for you to let off steam rather than a strategy for actually changing anyone’s mind. I can’t imagine a more counterproductive approach to getting someone on side than insulting them.
 

dreday3

Well-Known Member
A question for those of you who like to brand unvaccinated people stupid and/or selfish: What do you hope to achieve? I can only assume it’s a way for you to let off steam rather than a strategy for actually changing anyone’s mind. I can’t imagine a more counterproductive approach to getting someone on side than insulting them.

I have no interest in getting anyone on my side at this point. If you don't know by now to get the vaccine, you just aren't someone I would interact with by choice. End of story.

I don't apologize for or try to understand any people who are harming other people with their choices.
I wish we could just ignore the unvaccinated and just move on. Let them deal with their own choices, but they keep messing it up for everyone else.
 

correcaminos

Well-Known Member
A question for those of you who like to brand unvaccinated people stupid and/or selfish: What do you hope to achieve? I can only assume it’s a way for you to let off steam rather than a strategy for actually changing anyone’s mind. I can’t imagine a more counterproductive approach to getting someone on side than insulting them.
I have stubborn and selfish family who will not vaccinate. I have the right to how I feel after all I've heard and said to them. However while I feel they are selfish, I keep that to myself. I just say it here. Calling someone selfish won't help. Using their hesitations even if they are being selfish works for some. Selfish people sometimes cave when you show why being selfish - without saying as much - is bad. Every person has their own reasons. We have to understand them. Are they still selfish? Yes in some cases. Nothing personal, but you need to let people have their emotions. Many are tired.
 

GimpYancIent

Well-Known Member
That’s the biggest problem with Covid-19 though, you can be asymptomatic (feel 100% fine) and still be contagious.
Sooooo the number of home testing kits are totally inadequate, a drop in the bucket, all show because everyone will need to test themselves daily (say as part of a morning routine) in order to have some reassurance they have not contracted COVID19. I agree the testing has it uses as a data collecting tool, but it does not stop the illness. Vaccines have impact, so I will stick with the vaccine and not worry about these tests.
 

Lilofan

Well-Known Member
I have no interest in getting anyone on my side at this point. If you don't know by now to get the vaccine, you just aren't someone I would interact with by choice. End of story.

I don't apologize for or try to understand any people who are harming other people with their choices.
If one is not vaccinated by choice they are slowly finding out they will be denied entrance to a number of places, some fired from their jobs for non compliance to get vaccinated, feeling like being treated like second class citizens, or not invited to family gatherings ( personal exp w/ in-laws ). They made their bed, they better be prepared to sleep in it.
 

dreday3

Well-Known Member
January 3rd Chicago will start requiring us to show proof of full vaccination to dine inside or visit gyms or entertainment venues where food and drinks are being served.

According to the new guidelines, those 5 and older must show proof of full vaccination, but anyone ages 16 and older will also need to provide identification that matches their vaccination record. Employees at such venues will also need to either be vaccinated or wear a mask and show proof of weekly negative COVID-19 tests.

The city noted its indoor mask mandate also remains in effect.
 

Lilofan

Well-Known Member
So finally the powers that be will send out tests. 500M to be distributed!
Maybe we can bring the pandemic picture into focus and use some focused measures to kill it
Biden timed his live covid speech to the nation at the right part of the day. The stock market seems to be reacting favorably to his plan with the markets on the upswing today.
 

Vegas Disney Fan

Well-Known Member
Sooooo the number of home testing kits are totally inadequate, a drop in the bucket, all show because everyone will need to test themselves daily (say as part of a morning routine) in order to have some reassurance they have not contracted COVID19. I agree the testing has it uses as a data collecting tool, but it does not stop the illness. Vaccines have impact, so I will stick with the vaccine and not worry about these tests.
To some extent I agree, it’s a feel good measure if it’s only done one time. If we could test ourselves 2-3 times a week, even if for only a few weeks during Omicron, it could have a massive impact though.

The NHL tests daily, 99.5% are vaccinated, and currently 15% test positive, almost all asymptomatic, without the tests they’d still be mingling and infecting more teammates.

Nothing is stopping this illness, not even the vaccines, but that doesn’t mean we don’t keep trying to lower cases.
 

mmascari

Well-Known Member
A question for those of you who like to brand unvaccinated people stupid and/or selfish: What do you hope to achieve? I can only assume it’s a way for you to let off steam rather than a strategy for actually changing anyone’s mind. I can’t imagine a more counterproductive approach to getting someone on side than insulting them.
On posts here, it's all as rebuttals to anti-vax talking points and misrepresentations or actual falsehoods. Along with being a valid description of the decision.

None of it is to convince someone to get vaccinated. In fact, most of the posters saying those things are already vaccinated, they're just spreading noise to encourage/support others not getting vaccinated.

Actual posters that have been here over the last year with personal concerns about vaccination have all been met with support and encouragement to get vaccinated. I think most (all?) of them ended up getting vaccinated eventually then, even if it took a few months for some.

In general, there is no way to convince those anti-vaccine to change their minds and hasn't been for a long time already. The ones that respond to polls with "never get it", and even the "unlikely to get". Instead, and this is where most of the conversation has been for months, we need to provide alternative reasons for them to get vaccinated despite them being anti-vaccine. The mandates are the simplest example of this. This allows those people to be both "right" that they're never going to get the vaccine, an opinion that defines part of them for whatever reason, they do not need to give up that identity, do not need to change their mind. Instead, they get vaccinated for some other reason, to keep a job, go to concert, visit someone, travel, avoid frequent extra testing, whatever.

This type of resolution doesn't involve convincing anyone to change their mind on the topic. There is no need to confront if a prior decision was right or not, or any impact that prior decision had. It becomes a new independent decision that is completely independent of the first.

Cash rewards and lotteries were the earliest example of this. It didn't matter if you were anti-vaccine or not. If you wanted the reward, you would get vaccinated anyway. In fact, you could easily hold the decision that you only did it for the reward.

Work mandates are raising the level on that. They're generally working too, with few hold outs. For the same reason, it's easy to hold the decision that you only got vaccinated to keep a job and are still anti-vaccine at heart and true to yourself.

Work mandates, assuming it all settles out and end up true for everyone over 100 employees is probably the most effective. Even if 2% of people opt out to go work for smaller employers. That could still get us to 95% vaccinated. Assuming 95% is enough with Omicron, we can afford to have some hold outs, there's just to many right now.
 

Chip Chipperson

Well-Known Member
That would not even be realistic to contact ones who may be exposed if you are the covid carrier ( ie airports, WDW, etc ).

But you could contact friends and family. Nobody could realistically be expected to find the names and contact information of every person they passed in an airport, supermarket, etc. But if you could say, "Hey, Aunt Sally, I tested positive for COVID-19 and wanted to let you know since we met for lunch on Thursday, so you should isolate and get tested," then your hypothetical aunt could avoid going to work and potentially exposing her co-workers and any other family or friends she may have planned to meet up with.
 

dreday3

Well-Known Member
To be fair, while I agree with vaccine mandates and requirements of proof of vaccines...even I can see when places take it a little too far...

There is a bakery on the Northside of Chicago that not only requires vaccines, but now requires boosters to dine in. Okay, well I guess...but then they said that it's possible soon they will also require - in addition to vaccines/boosters - proof of a negative covid test in order to dine in.

Okay, I don't need your baked goods that bad! 😂
 

mmascari

Well-Known Member
Sooooo the number of home testing kits are totally inadequate, a drop in the bucket, all show because everyone will need to test themselves daily (say as part of a morning routine) in order to have some reassurance they have not contracted COVID19. I agree the testing has it uses as a data collecting tool, but it does not stop the illness. Vaccines have impact, so I will stick with the vaccine and not worry about these tests.
Right now, when the unvaccinated pool of transmission is so high, you need both. The spill over effect into the vaccinated group is high enough that it's an issue too. Testing helps when actions are taken based on the test results, not just collecting them as abstract data.

Yes, 0.5 billion tests is and inadequate number if that's all we get for an entire year. Did they announce a time frame or duration or just that it's coming? Did you think we all thought they were doing a stellar job with testing?

Ideally, if we're talking about a one year time frame, 52 weeks, we want more like 50 billion home tests. That would let 300 million people test 3 or 4 times a week. Not quite every day, but way more than the less than once a week going on now. If you wanted the smallest possible number, perhaps 10 billion over 12 weeks for about 3 tests a week.

Even so, starting with 0.5 billion is better than starting with 0, which is where we were. Maybe nobody (or not enough) sign up for them, maybe they don't actually use them. If we have enough tests for 300 million people to test 4 times a week, but only 100 million actually request them and they only test 1 time a week for 5 weeks, then 0.5 billion was right on the money. Might as well start with that and ramp up as you get people on board.
 

GimpYancIent

Well-Known Member
But you could contact friends and family. Nobody could realistically be expected to find the names and contact information of every person they passed in an airport, supermarket, etc. But if you could say, "Hey, Aunt Sally, I tested positive for COVID-19 and wanted to let you know since we met for lunch on Thursday, so you should isolate and get tested," then your hypothetical aunt could avoid going to work and potentially exposing her co-workers and any other family or friends she may have planned to meet up with.
The hypothetical "Aunt Sally" will not be happy with you.
 

Chip Chipperson

Well-Known Member
The hypothetical "Aunt Sally" will not be happy with you.

I imagine she'd be more pi**ed off that I had it, knew I had been around her, and didn't tell her. Plus, you and Sally are assuming that I may have given it to her rather than the other way around. That's why nobody visits Aunt Sally anymore - she's too judgmental and defensive. But I still don't want her to die. ;)
 
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