Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Chi84]

For a day park like Universal there‘s almost no risk of an actual outbreak being traced back to them. Too hard to prove.

I could see an unlikely scenario for bad PR where an 8 year old gets Covid and ends up in the hospital or worse and the family claims the kid got infected at Universal (no need for proof where they got sick in the court of public opinion). It gets worse if the family admits they didn’t make the kid wear a mask and nobody questioned it even though he was clearly not vaccinated.

Unlikely is a vast understatement for that scenario.

 

[Parker in NYC]

For a day park like Universal there‘s almost no risk of an actual outbreak being traced back to them. Too hard to prove.

Yes, I know there couldn't be an actual outbreak being traced back to them. I was merely inferring that even if that were possible, they'd still be absolved by the CDC recommendations.

I could see an unlikely scenario for bad PR where an 8 year old gets Covid and ends up in the hospital or worse and the family claims the kid got infected at Universal (no need for proof where they got sick in the court of public opinion). It gets worse if the family admits they didn’t make the kid wear a mask and nobody questioned it even though he was clearly not vaccinated.

But all it takes is one lawsuit and a viral (ha) social media post to start things up again. Though no one pays attention to anyone but Disney, right?

 

[mmascari]

I'm most concerned with the juvenile infection rate, most Adults have vaccines available if they choose to become protected.

They're not independent, but very related. If the infection rate in general is higher because of unvaccinated adults, the juvenile rate will also be higher because of their exposure to adults. Likewise, if the general risk is very low because enough adults are vaccinated, then the risk to juvenile is low for all of those adults interactions. The juvenile rate on it's own may have a larger impact in schools, sports, or other activities where the exposure is primarily other kids.

I know a family with young kids who are not eligible to be vaccinated yet. They had a trip planned two weeks from now. They were comfortable wtih the guidelines as they were in place when they booked the trip, booked the plane tickets, made reservations, etc. Now, they are quite upset and not sure what to do. They don't feel comfortable with the risks for their kids.

This is why we moved our trip to next year (again), also because we could move it. We made the decision long before the conditions on our trip date will be known. It could be completely fine by then, but by moving it earlier, we're not losing any money. We were also able to plan an alternative trip with more options that can be adjusted based on conditions at the time and less money committed to activities we may decide not to do if conditions worsen.

Right now, with FL at 11/100K and 0.26/100K we wouldn't want to put an unvaccinated kid, even in a mask, in indoor scenarios with unvaccinated unmasked others for long durations. That's before we even talk about restaurants with increased capacity.

By our trip date, FL could easily be at 3/100K and 0.05/100K, a metric we would feel much better with. Or, FL residents could be saying "hold my beer" and plateauing at a number above that and below today.

What seems to be clear is that people planning summer trips should assume there will be increased capacity, reduced distance, and elimination of masks and other mitigations while still largely at the same community metrics as today. If someone isn't good with that, committing money on the hope it's lower is a gamble. Might win, might not. If someone is fine with that, and they end up better (likely at least some better), then it's a bonus win.

Just like if someone only wants to commit the spend for a WDW trip if there will be fireworks, shows, and other currently missing items. Might happen, might not. The gamble depends on how disappointed they'll be if it doesn't happen.

 

[Parker in NYC]

What seems to be clear is that people planning summer trips should assume there will be increased capacity, reduced distance, and elimination of masks and other mitigations while still largely at the same community metrics as today.

Stop, this might as well be an aphrodisiac for some on the forum.

 

[Jrb1979]

I don't think this will change anything. The notion that it would be safe for vaccinated people to cross the border without restriction is pretty obvious. Just like the CDC saying vaccinated people don't need masks is obvious, but isn't going to necessarily lead to immediate rule changes.

WDW still requires masks indoors because it would be impossible to check everyone's status and an honour system poses risk.

Based on how things have been handled in Canada thus far, I still think it will be more of a universal approach. The borders will open once it's safe for everyone.

At this point it sounds like everyone 12 and up will be fully vaccinated by August, so re-opening a month or two early for a portion of the population may simply be seen as more trouble than it's worth.

I think proof of vaccination will be the new requirement for the next year or so. It's not just about the US/Canada border but all international travel.

 

[DisneyCane]

On another note, any news or rumors about when muffins and cookies will return to Sunshine Seasons?

They were self service but I don't know why they can't be served from behind the counter.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

I think proof of vaccination will be the new requirement for the next year or so. It's not just about the US/Canada border but all international travel.

Maybe, but I still don't think there will be early access to vaccinated individuals.

The USA has also indicated resistance to vaccine passports as well if I'm not mistaken. Would there be a mish mash of rules at the border? Canada requiring proof of vaccine but the USA hesitant to provide it?

 

[disneygeek90]

Honestly, as someone who is fully vaccinated, the mask while indoors/in lines was a good compromise. I'm not sure why they felt the need to drop that so incredibly quick.

Theme Parks aren't your normal grocery store or Target. There's an incredible amount of people day in and day out. I hope this doesn't backfire as we are starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel and it wasn't too fast too soon. I didn't see anyone fighting the rule when walking into a store so it seems a bit knee jerky to me.

 

[Parker in NYC]

Honestly, as someone who is fully vaccinated, the mask while indoors/in lines was a good compromise. I'm not sure why they felt the need to drop that so incredibly quick.

Theme Parks aren't your normal grocery store or Target. There's an incredible amount of people day in and day out. I hope this doesn't backfire as we are starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel and it wasn't too fast too soon. I didn't see anyone fighting the rule when walking into a store so it seems a bit knee jerky to me.

If it does backfire, it can't be traced back. It's a win-win for them. And also... even if it were to backfire, I doubt it would change many people's minds.

 

[Jrb1979]

Maybe, but I still don't think there will be early access to vaccinated individuals.

The USA has also indicated resistance to vaccine passports as well if I'm not mistaken. Would there be a mish mash of rules at the border? Canada requiring proof of vaccine but the USA hesitant to provide it?

I don't think they will give early access. I'm saying when they do open the border, proof of vaccination will most likely be a requirement going forward. I see no issue with it being different rules for different countries.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

Honestly, as someone who is fully vaccinated, the mask while indoors/in lines was a good compromise. I'm not sure why they felt the need to drop that so incredibly quick.

Theme Parks aren't your normal grocery store or Target. There's an incredible amount of people day in and day out. I hope this doesn't backfire as we are starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel and it wasn't too fast too soon. I didn't see anyone fighting the rule when walking into a store so it seems a bit knee jerky to me.

People from all over the country as well. People who have been on planes and through crowded airports. People are focused on Florida case counts, but is that really a great metric when discussing an international tourist destination?

Some people will spin this cautious approach (stick with masks indoors for a few more months) as "people want masks and restrictions to be in place forever!"

 

[Parker in NYC]

Some people will spin have spun this cautious approach (stick with masks indoors for a few more months) as "people want masks and restrictions to be in place forever!"

Fixed that (with kindness).

 

[GoofGoof]

Unlikely is a vast understatement for that scenario.

Which part. I think it’s highly likely that many people will allow their unvaccinated kids to go to Universal without a mask if the park isn’t enforcing the rule. I still get a few e-mails a week from my son’s elementary school about positive cases at the school so kids are certainly still getting Covid. Sadly I also don‘t think it’s a far fetched scenario that if a kid gets sick the parents blame it on Universal for lack of enforcement even though they are the ones who allowed the kid to go without a mask. I don’t think that it’s Universal’s responsibility to police that and certainly it wouldn’t be a big legal issue for them, but in the court of public opinion that’s another story. It’s pretty low risk, but any time you set a safety protocol and then blatantly ignore enforcement you open yourself up to some level of criticism.

 

[mikejs78]

Which part. I think it’s highly likely that many people will allow their unvaccinated kids to go to Universal without a mask if the park isn’t enforcing the rule. I still get a few e-mails a week from my son’s elementary school about positive cases at the school so kids are certainly still getting Covid. Sadly I also don‘t think it’s a far fetched scenario that if a kid gets sick the parents blame it on Universal for lack of enforcement even though they are the ones who allowed the kid to go without a mask. I don’t think that it’s Universal’s responsibility to police that and certainly it wouldn’t be a big legal issue for them, but in the court of public opinion that’s another story. It’s pretty low risk, but any time you set a safety protocol and then blatantly ignore enforcement you open yourself up to some level of criticism.

What will really be a PR nightmare is if some family who did have their kid in a mask but still catches COVID then blames Universal.

 

[CosmicRays]

What will really be a PR nightmare is if some family who did have their kid in a mask but still catches COVID then blames Universal.

I feel like that would have happened already on the PR side over the past year if it was going to.

 

[Chi84]

Which part. I think it’s highly likely that many people will allow their unvaccinated kids to go to Universal without a mask if the park isn’t enforcing the rule. I still get a few e-mails a week from my son’s elementary school about positive cases at the school so kids are certainly still getting Covid. Sadly I also don‘t think it’s a far fetched scenario that if a kid gets sick the parents blame it on Universal for lack of enforcement even though they are the ones who allowed the kid to go without a mask. I don’t think that it’s Universal’s responsibility to police that and certainly it wouldn’t be a big legal issue for them, but in the court of public opinion that’s another story. It’s pretty low risk, but any time you set a safety protocol and then blatantly ignore enforcement you open yourself up to some level of criticism.

I was referring to the statistics concerning children and COVID. Elementary school is required; going to WDW is not. Most contact with unrelated kids at a theme park would be brief - unlike what happens at school. The CDC guidelines are based on what the agency feels is safe, and they have always (in my opinion) been on the conservative side. If parents nonetheless feel their children are at risk, it would be wise to put off a WDW trip right now. That’s what we did last October when we didn’t want to wear the required masks.

 

[mikejs78]

I was referring to the statistics concerning children and COVID. Elementary school is required; going to WDW is not. The CDC guidelines are based on what the agency feels is safe, and they have always (in my opinion) been on the conservative side. If parents nonetheless feel their children are at risk, it would be wise to put off a WDW trip right now. That’s what we did last October when we didn’t want to wear the required masks.

Elementary schools are considered safe **if** masks and distancing are enforced.

 

[Chi84]

Elementary schools are considered safe **if** masks and distancing are enforced.

That's true. But the type of close, prolonged contact that takes place in elementary schools is not likely to happen at a theme park.

 

[networkpro]

Honestly, as someone who is fully vaccinated, the mask while indoors/in lines was a good compromise. I'm not sure why they felt the need to drop that so incredibly quick.

Theme Parks aren't your normal grocery store or Target. There's an incredible amount of people day in and day out. I hope this doesn't backfire as we are starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel and it wasn't too fast too soon. I didn't see anyone fighting the rule when walking into a store so it seems a bit knee jerky to me.

I'm fully vaccinated as well (For Covid and lots of other things), but people are giant Petri dishes of communicable illnesses. Masks are good for lots of others as well.

 

[oceanbreeze77]

Does Universal have a union like disney?