Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[havoc315]

No, no you are not. That's not how it works.

Of course that's exactly how it works. Government can pass laws that prevent you from putting other people in danger. Whether that be a speed limit, public health requirements, laws against murder.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

It's more complicated than that. I'd imagine if a car manufacturer only sold cars in the State in which they are incorporated and manufacture, the US Federal Government couldn't mandate anything. Of course, the State would have highway funding tied to requiring seatbelts so it is unlikely that any State wouldn't require them.

With respect to vaccines, there is absolutely no way that the US Federal Government can require any person be vaccinated for anything. In Florida law, the "State Health Official" can order vaccinations during a "Public Health Emergency." If a person refuses to be vaccinated they are subject to isolation or quarantine.

I'm sure there would be court challenges if they actually tried to do it but the power exists in the Florida Statutes.

Wow, we may agree on something? I said we may. The Federal Government MAY not be able to mandate anyone to get a vaccine but there’s precedent on the books for states to do it. Actually, government may be able to loophole the whole thing but not with a lot of resistance.

Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health

Protecting Health, Saving Lives—Millions at a Time

www.jhsph.edu

 

[GhostHost1000]

no yikes...

they knew this would happen...but the question is: do those people end up with severe cases?

the statistical answer is “no”

we carry germs around all the time without severe illness. It’s part of living on this space rock

I guess I meant yikes in that some will use this to keep us masked and social distanced forever lol

 

[DisneyCane]

Yes, it does. If you don't take the vaccine and thereby spread the virus to someone else, and killing them, or causing them to be hospitalized, etc -- You are infringing on their right to live.

No different.

It is COMPLETELY different. It is illegal to kill somebody if you make a decision to do so or make a decision to do something that can be reasonably expected to result in their death. Jim Boeheim (Syracuse basketball coach) killed somebody running them over on a highway. He wasn't doing anything wrong that could have been reasonably expected to kill the person, therefore it was not illegal.

Not taking a COVID vaccine can not be reasonably expected to cause somebody's death, especially once the other people have the opportunity to take said vaccine which is almost 100% effective in preventing death.

 

[HauntedMansionFLA]

Really weird post.

Not really. Just reporting a fact that millions do not want to be a human experiment. Just ask Hank Aaron and Marvin Hagler.... oh, wait.

 

[jaklgreen]

Theres still a huge amount of the population unvaccinated. It would be doom and gloom if thousands of them die over the course of the next few months.

Some of that is supply. My husband is wanting to get it but there are no appointment times available where we live. They opened it up to everyone over 18 and it's impossible to get one now.

 

[DisneyNittany]

Of course that's exactly how it works. Government can pass laws that prevent you from putting other people in danger. Whether that be a speed limit, public health requirements, laws against murder.

Yes, that's how the governments works. They aren't in the business of protecting rights.

However, if you decided to NOT get vaccinated, you are NOT infringing on any of my rights. None. It's not a hard concept.

I'm not even saying you have to agree with it, but you can't just pick and choose which rights of others you are good sacrificing for the greater good. I mean, you can, but that doesn't make you the moral compass, upstanding citizen that you think it does.

 

[Figgy1]

That is only people allergic to the vaccine, everyone else can and is recommended to get the vaccine.

There are a few other medical conditions but they are very rare

 

[Disney Analyst]

no yikes...

they knew this would happen...but the question is: do those people end up with severe cases?

the statistical answer is “no”

we carry germs around all the time without severe illness. It’s part of living on this space rock

I just wanted to counter the poster saying this doesn’t happen.

It does. It’s still being studied.

Also in that article it does say 2 vaccinated people in their 80’s did die. All of this is being studied.

“However, at least eight people with breakthrough cases have been hospitalized. The Washington State Department of Health is also investigating two potential breakthrough cases where the individuals died. Both patients were over 80 years old and suffered from underlying health issues.

The Washington State Department of Health said further investigation will help identify patterns among the breakthrough cases, such as if a variant of the novel coronavirus may have caused the infection.”

 

[disneygeek90]

Since this seems to be the topic the last 23 pages: yes, you can become infected after full vaccination.

This isn't really news/surprising. A 95% success rate means there's 5% fail rate. Though these individuals should experience a considerably less intense infection.

 

[DisneyCane]

Wow, we may agree on something? I said we may. The Federal Government MAY not be able to mandate anyone to get a vaccine but there’s precedent on the books for states to do it. Actually, government may be able to loophole the whole thing but not with a lot of resistance.

Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health

Protecting Health, Saving Lives—Millions at a Time

www.jhsph.edu

I knew there had to be something we'd agree on!

I don't know if they could get it passed but the Federal Government could tie some kind of COVID-related funding to the States mandating vaccination. However, issues may arise if there are States where their constitution or existing legislation prohibits doing that.

As the article you posted says, the Supreme Court ruled that the States CAN have a vaccine mandate but not that they have to or that it needs to be constitutional in that State.

I'd much prefer a financial incentive to get vaccinated via a tax credit or something like that. Anything punitive for not being vaccinated will backfire and lead to fewer people getting vaccinated, mandates or not.

 

[Disney Analyst]

This isn't really news/surprising. A 95% success rate means there's 5% fail rate. Though these individuals should experience a considerably less intense infection.

Precisely.

But this is still why maintaining masks and distance is important. The spread can still happen, and that’s what we need to slow down whilst also vaccinating.

 

[jaklgreen]

I am about to bang my head against a brick wall over the number of people here who do not want to see restrictions relaxed unless there is 100% protection, zero cases, or some other absolute. Folks, that is unattainable. It will never happen. There will always be a chance you may catch Covid. There will always be a chance you might even die from it. Eliminating that risk is not the point. Getting the risk to a manageable, acceptable level is.

The data shows that once you are vaccinated, the risk of catching, spreading, or having serious complications from Covid drops to virtually zero. No, not absolutely zero. Yes, there's still a slight chance you could get sick or spread it. Yes, there's a slight chance a variant might pop up that beats the vaccine. But it is the closest you can possibly get to complete protection.

Again, my opinion is that if you want vaccines in arms, you have to tell people that they can get vaccinated and then drop the restrictions. Nothing else is going to sell it on the scale we need.

I completely understand what you are saying, and if the majority of people were reasonable, that would work. The issue that I see is that, once you say that some people can drop the mask, that will be an open invitation for everyone to do so. You will have plenty of unvaccinated people saying F it. And no one is going to stop them in the grocery store to ask to see their proof of vaccination so that they can walk around without a mask. What these people do not understand/comprehend/care about, is that they are prolonging this by NOT getting vaccinated. You can't change these people's minds because they have already been corrupted with lies and misinformation. That is what happens when you have those in authority lying to everyone. Too many do not have free thinking ability and common sense. I wish that there was a way to have those of us that have been vaccinated to ditch the mask, but I don't see that happening until we get to the point where enough people have become vaccinated.

 

[disneygeek90]

Precisely.

But this is still why maintaining masks and distance is important. The spread can still happen, and that’s what we need to slow down whilst also vaccinating.

I've been very pro masks + distancing the whole time but I think once everyone has the vaccine available that needs to go away. We can't just continue to do this forever because 5% of the population may experience weak/non life threatening symptoms. And if everyone else is also vaccinated, the risk for severe community spread becomes incredibly low.

 

[GimpYancIent]

I've been very pro masks + distancing the whole time but I think once everyone has the vaccine available that needs to go away. We can't just continue to do this forever because 5% of the population may experience weak/non life threatening symptoms. And if everyone else is also vaccinated, the risk for severe community spread becomes incredibly low.

Now you are talking! Point to you.

 

[Touchdown]

There are a few other medical conditions but they are very rare

What, pregnancy is no longer one of them. The only other one was getting monoclonal antibody treatment for Covid would delay your shot by 3 months, but that’s been taken off the market due to the varients so that will not be a problem come December.

 

[Disney Analyst]

I've been very pro masks + distancing the whole time but I think once everyone has the vaccine available that needs to go away. We can't just continue to do this forever because 5% of the population may experience weak/non life threatening symptoms. And if everyone else is also vaccinated, the risk for severe community spread becomes incredibly low.

And when you allow that much spread to take place still, and a variant pops up that’s worse and defies the vaccine, so you’re back at square one... now what?

We need to be patient. We need to get as many people vaccinated as possible, and truly see the spread drop significantly.

Right now the risk is still too high for all of your vaccination work going out the window if a new variant pops up that doesn’t play nice.

 

[DisneyNittany]

I've been very pro masks + distancing the whole time but I think once everyone has the vaccine available that needs to go away. We can't just continue to do this forever because 5% of the population may experience weak/non life threatening symptoms. And if everyone else is also vaccinated, the risk for severe community spread becomes incredibly low.

We crippled our economy, drove the wage gap even farther apart, forced small businesses to close while large corporations were free to fully operate, inhumanely locked people in and caused a significant increase in depression, suicide, domestic assault/killings, etc. over ~2% of the population (actually lower, since all ~330M people weren't tested in the US) dying from the virus (which was significantly tilted to a particular demo), but now we don't care about those 5%? Why?

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

I've been very pro masks + distancing the whole time but I think once everyone has the vaccine available that needs to go away. We can't just continue to do this forever because 5% of the population may experience weak/non life threatening symptoms. And if everyone else is also vaccinated, the risk for severe community spread becomes incredibly low.

I haven’t seen anyone suggest we keep doing masks and distancing forever.

inhumanely locked people in

Nobody in the USA was “locked in”

 

[aliceismad]

Some of that is supply. My husband is wanting to get it but there are no appointment times available where we live. They opened it up to everyone over 18 and it's impossible to get one now.

Yes. In my state we're opening vaccines to the general public soon but people on the priority list are still scrambling to try to find appointments. In another state I know family members have experienced the same.