Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

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GimpYancIent

Well-Known Member
Not again. This has been refuted and I've posted articles that say this is not a concern. Illegals are here by legal means most of the time and just staying past allowed, not sneaky stuff.
Not again. Yes, sneaky, despicable, disgusting stuff and lots of it. Choosing a few carefully selected articles does not cut it. There is too much information, data and reports. Just watching T.V. (any channel liberal or not) and your statement is immediately refuted.
 

CatesMom

Well-Known Member
Its fine to go to 3 feet vs 6 feet for distancing, but that only works with masks too. I’d prefer kids to actually get the vaccine instead of going back to school in the Fall with masks and even 3 feet of distancing. They aren’t doing the Full range of extracurricular activities either. I think it’s very short sighted to just ignore kids when it comes to vaccinations. It’s possible that once we get to Fall Covid is gone and vaccinations won’t matter, but much more likely it’s still around in some capacity and that means some form of restrictions for kids. Another partially lost school year. That’s tragic considering the low risk vaccines present and how easy it would be to just ramp up trials now.

Edit: on the Disney parks front, a change to 3 feet for distancing would immediately relax distancing on just about all ride vehicles and also allow queue distancing to shrink. That’s good news for expanding capacity
My daughter’s school has been open all year at 3 feet (state approved with masks), so it works.
 

DC0703

Well-Known Member
I saw a quote yesterday about optimism in the pandemic. "Optimism is what got us here." Meaning, optimism, the idea that "it will be fine," is what drove people to gather when they shouldn't, take less precautions than they should have. Optimism is how we ended up with 550K dead instead of a lower amount. It didn't have to be like this, if we had been more serious when we needed to be, instead of waiting for things to get bad to recognize how bad it could be and not "it will be fine."
My problem with that quote is that there's a difference between optimism and denial. When people said "It will be fine," it was usually followed by "because this thing is overblown" or "because it's no worse than the flu." They weren't being optimistic, they truly believed that COVID was no big deal and acted accordingly.

Politics and misinformation caused the inflated death rate, optimism is what helped us stay the course.
 

hopemax

Well-Known Member
It’s just plain silly to blame optimism for how things have gone with covid. If anything many of the people not following covid protocols in the past year did it in the name of pessimism. The going narrative was we didn’t know when covid would end of if it ever would so we had to just learn to live with it. If people stayed optimistic that the end would come and successful vaccines would be developed we may have been better off.

I see no reason not to be optimistic about the vacines and the vaccine rollout today. What’s happening right now is nothing short of miraculous and will most likely go down in history as one of the greatest scientific achievements of modern days. There’s nothing wrong with feeling optimistic about how things are going at all. Just because people are optimistic that the end is in sight and the vaccine rollout is going great doesn’t mean they are not wearing masks or distancing or following other protocols.

On the issue of wanting to know the truth and sandbagging I think the latest remarks from Biden tell us all we need to know. They corrected the past mistakes made with conflicting stories and overly cautious timelines. They changed the return to normal from 2022 with the potential to see family at Christmas into family gatherings for July 4th, a very large increase in the timeline based on expected vaccine rollout which makes a lot of sense. They also moved up the timeline for when all adults would have access to the vaccine from end of July to mid-May. Again, a very large increase in the timeline and as is the case with the return to some version of normal projections it’s also backed by actual projections of vaccine rollout, not just an arbitrary date. So yes, people want to know the true projections and not some conservative estimate. If they really felt the timeline needed to be longer than say it, but explain why. All of the talk of July 4th was very carefully caveated to include the disclaimer that it’s only possible if enough people are vaccinated. That was smart.

As far as April 30 goes, the pandemic won’t be over but if we reach the vaccine projections that the manufacturers have set we will have a large number of people vaccinated. There’s no reason to think we won’t see a sharp decline in cases as a result. Nobody knows what level of vaccination we need to get to. Recently one of epidemiologists from the CDC said their agency was projecting we needed to get to 60% immunity to reach a level of herd immunity. I’ve seen projections all over the place, most higher than that, but in mot cases they are saying higher so that people don’t get complacent and stop getting vaccinated. A valid reason to estimate higher. We also need to see how many of the unvaccinated people are naturally immune. That number will grow by the Summer. So take total percent vaccinated plus unvaccinated but naturally immune and subtract anyone who got vaccinated but it didn’t work and that’s the true immune number. At some point we may need to adjust for natural immunity that no longer works since we are over a year now on natural infections.

In conclusion I still feel our best hope is to get as many people as possible vaccinated and do it as quickly as possible. I believe 100% that promoting all of the positives that can come from being vaccinated will attract a lot more people who are on the fence about doing it than projecting a lot of negative things. I think Biden laying out a goal of 4th of July parties is a great way to promote vaccinations. Optimism is the best way to get to our goal of getting enough people vaccinated. The talk of a return to normal in 2022 or Christmas made no sense, helped nobody and only hurt the cause.
Oh, come on, you've never heard of optimism bias? As fate would have it, this article from November came across my timeline tonight.


This is 3 times you've referenced the CDC person and the 60%. How about Dr. Walensky's statement while answering questions, that because of the increased transmissible variants, they have had to revise their assumptions upwards from the 60%-70% of this summer to 70-85%? Does that hold any weight, or is it like all the other people who previously have latched onto best case scenarios, "Since we don't know what will be true, I'm going to choose to hitch my wagon to someone other than the CDC director?"



Of course, that's not being plastered everywhere, because as you say the messaging has gone out to sell vaccines through positivity. Despite the "tell us the truth," crowd, what actually works on people is to tell them what they expect to hear, otherwise they think manipulation and lies, and you're facing an uphill battle. So the truth about needing to get to 2022, is being back-burnered, and we're back to giving people milestones instead of the finish line. First, we'll get people to May 1 and then July 4th. Then I expect it will be: get people to Labor Day with the carrot of all schools reopening as normal, then Thanksgiving, and then 2022. "Talk about degrees of normalcy," which people happily extrapolate as normalcy. You heard "small gatherings with a lot of caveats," others obviously think the limitation of small gatherings is just as ridiculous as your thoughts about what Christmas will look like and they expect fireworks and family reunions. I personally, expect that the earlier messaging that got the, "Don't say that or people won't behave the way we need!" freak out, will bear itself out. They are sitting on the troublesome parts because we have proven we aren't capable of dealing with it. And now that we have the vaccines to focus on, it's not as imperative we understand it today. Right now, it's phase one: May 1, phase 2: July 4, let people focus on a summer which should be manageable, and we'll worry about the rest when it's more obvious there is more work to be done. I don't think they sped up the timeline at all, but are choosing to focus on the expectation of oscillating seasonality. Summer isn't an actual return to normal, but a false normal that will placate the masses, while experts continue to model and plan for fall/winter because they know we aren't there yet.
 

Lilofan

Well-Known Member
Not again. This has been refuted and I've posted articles that say this is not a concern. Illegals are here by legal means most of the time and just staying past allowed, not sneaky stuff.
That is a broad assumption. It is a concern believe or not when undocumented cross into TX and AZ with help from cartel coyotes and then blend in and go to their destination in the USA. No stop to say hola como esta to border patrol etc to show vaccine documentation etc.
 

seascape

Well-Known Member
It's Monday and the numbers are out from Sunday testing. I am not a fan of these numbers because they vary so much. However, there are still 3 states in the 30 plus category with NJ increasing to 41 but NY dropping to 34. 9 states are in the 20's, 33 states in the 10's and 6 in single digits. The country reported 38,034 new cases. That is 11.5 cases per 100,000 but remember it is a Sunday testing and we really want to get down to less than 33,000 a day within the next 2 weeks so the country falls below 10 cases a day per 100,000. It can be done and should be done.

As for NJ, we need to do better. We now have 20.6% more cases that neighboring NY and 95.2% more than Florida. Who would have thought that NJ will soon have more than twice as many cases as Florida? Please do something to stop the increase. It is up to us, not the State Government to stop it.
 

Kevin_W

Well-Known Member
My problem with that quote is that there's a difference between optimism and denial. When people said "It will be fine," it was usually followed by "because this thing is overblown" or "because it's no worse than the flu." They weren't being optimistic, they truly believed that COVID was no big deal and acted accordingly.

Politics and misinformation caused the inflated death rate, optimism is what helped us stay the course.

I agree, I think the "optimism got us here" is misusing the word optimism
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
I rode at DLR August 2019 before the apocalypse was upon us. I can’t comment on the covid changes but the ride works best when all 6 seats are filled since each group has different tasks to perform. We had 4 people and rode with 2 strangers.

Same. Need all seats filled for it to make sense.

50% vs 5% chance (groups of 1 almost always get the engineer role even if not in the SRL) wining the driver role increased my enjoyment emmesely but getting engineer and plexiglass is a huge let down.
Same. The back 2 seats are pointless. The ride also has little repeat appeal. I’ve been on it twice in Anaheim and I’m gonna have to convince my kids to bother to go on it again.

Not the crown jewel of WDI.
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
Yep, I read this earlier. Great goals.. big plans.. don’t know how they are going to do it but I’m hoping. PA is still one of the lowest states at around 6-7 percent vaccinated. Us here in counties, where you and I love GoofGoof, can’t seem to get a good supply in.. we are still way behind on 1a group. I just looked on the one list I’m on and there’s about 100000 people I’m behind and haven’t even heard from the other places. Have no idea how this is going to happen but I still am holding out hope.

Just some random anecdotes....but it seems like a lot of Pa’s problem is distributing doses to counties equally without much regard to who’s more likely to take them.

A ridiculous, pa. concept. 63 counties but a lot of them are “flag” counties and they can’t seem to get enough takers. My brother went from a biped county to one still dragging knuckles to get his an hour away...they wouldn’t take it because they thought it was gonna keep the mine form reopening or something? 🙄
 

DisneyDebRob

Well-Known Member
Just some random anecdotes....but it seems like a lot of Pa’s problem is distributing doses to counties equally without much regard to who’s more likely to take them.

A ridiculous, pa. concept. 63 counties but a lot of them are “flag” counties and they can’t seem to get enough takers. My brother went from a biped county to one still dragging knuckles to get his an hour away...they wouldn’t take it because they thought it was gonna keep the mine form reopening or something? 🙄
Agreed. Was really worried more about parents but they were able to get their shots almost a hour and a half away. It’s crazy. Trying everything to get my wife vaccinated, she’s in the 1a group with no luck. Seems like they have a 100 shots a week and it’s gone before they even put up the reservation chart. PA is having major problems compared to a lot of other states. Just hoping it picks up and I can get her in.
 
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