Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Chi84]

Right..:but you’re expecting “weak willed” to be a factor in a huge, once in a century economic and health situation again.

I’m not saying I’m not tired as hell and looking to break some rules as well. I want action like Poison 1987.

But this is the old military paradigm.
Everyone cares what the soldiers think in their boots in peacetime...but when the shooting starts you want the smart guys at the head of the column.

I think it could be argued that “weak willed” already has been a factor in this pandemic. It’s true that we had worse than no leadership at all, but I think if everyone did the best they could given their particular circumstances, we would be in much better shape. Maybe the current leadership can inspire people to be better in the coming months. I’m doubtful, though. Just my opinion.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I think it could be argued that “weak willed” already has been a factor in this pandemic. It’s true that we had worse than no leadership at all, but I think if everyone did the best they could given their particular circumstances, we would be in much better shape. Maybe the current leadership can inspire people to be better in the coming months. I’m doubtful, though. Just my opinion.

I would say most have “tried”...not done “their best” as a collective.

I was talking to some Disney contacts via zoom on Wednesday...and if you look at Florida’s numbers - which are awful considering we are now a year in - they agreed it would be MUCH worse if they had to retreat inside like the rest of the country in the winter. Bodies would be piled up.

Because they can’t think straight...and have a pied piper of stupidity in front. Not all failure...but not focused on preventing them either.

And that doesn’t make that a straight line political assessment. I work some with New York Health on occasion and wasnt surprised at all of the emerging scandal. The whispers were there and some should and will pay for it.

It needed a holistic approach that’s never happened. If you dug up James Madison and asked what he thought about rules now he would think we all are mercury poisoned nuts in the head.

“What? I wasn’t talking about “individual liberty” with this...who’s dumb enough to fall for that?”

 

[techgeek]

Is your current hesitation elevated risk of getting infected or being worried about spreading it to others?

Personally, I am enjoying the ridiculously low airfares (lower price than I paid 20 years ago without adjusting for inflation) to fly on mostly half empty planes. I'm following the same protocols and basically doing the same types of things where I travel to that I do where I live so the act of traveling isn't changing my risk or my risk to others (I guess it is different people but not statistically more people).

It’s important to consider the economy as a factor in the driver of travel downturn as well. Yes, there’s great opportunity for those that can afford it to take advantage of discounts, but there’s many that didn’t have a very good 2020 financially and will spend 2021 either recovering from that or holding onto what savings they have until there’s less uncertainty.

Personally, I would have loved to take a (socially distanced) road trip last year while I was out of work and had the time too, but without our primary income the budget didn't allow. Now I'm in a new job, but now I'm stuck watching my vacation accrual build up and our discretionary budget rebuild for a good part of 2021. We're thinking about a modest getaway in the fall if all goes well, but it's a decision based as much on finances as it is on the assumption Covid will be under control and we'll have gotten a vaccine by then.

And I'm one of the lucky ones that was able to career hop and find another job. There's a lot of my former colleagues still looking, or still waiting it out in hunker down mode.

 

[DisneyCane]

I was talking to some Disney contacts via zoom on Wednesday...and if you look at Florida’s numbers - which are awful considering we are now a year in - they agreed it would be MUCH worse if they had to retreat inside like the rest of the country in the winter. Bodies would be piled up.

So, FL's "numbers" are "awful" a year in but NJ's aren't at the same point in time? I also don't get this perception that people in FL spend all of their time outdoors. In the summer, it is miserable to be outdoors and most people spend an enormous amount of time indoors in the air conditioning. Even during this time of year, most people still spend the vast majority of their time indoors at work, in school, shopping, eating, etc.

What about CA which has had much worse recent "numbers" than FL? Last time I checked, the climate there (especially in the most populated areas) is conducive to year round outdoor activities and doesn't force people to retreat inside like the rest of the country.

You just can't admit that it turned out that further restrictions weren't necessary. FL ended up with overall "numbers" similar to or better than the States that implemented much more severe restrictions.

I'm glad the "pied piper of stupidity" was the one who led the charge to prioritize vaccinating the 65+ population, who are clearly the most vulnerable to fatalities from COVID-19. The few weeks of lead in that policy over most of the rest of the country will end up saving hundreds, if not thousands, of lives. How about a little credit for that?

 

[DisneyCane]

It’s important to consider the economy as a factor in the driver of travel downturn as well. Yes, there’s great opportunity for those that can afford it to take advantage of discounts, but there’s many that didn’t have a very good 2020 financially and will spend 2021 either recovering from that or holding onto what savings they have until there’s less uncertainty.

Personally, I would have loved to take a (socially distanced) road trip last year while I was out of work and had the time too, but without our primary income the budget didn't allow. Now I'm in a new job, but now I'm stuck watching my vacation accrual build up and our discretionary budget rebuild for a good part of 2021. We're thinking about a modest getaway in the fall if all goes well, but it's a decision based as much on finances as it is on the assumption Covid will be under control and we'll have gotten a vaccine by then.

And I'm one of the lucky ones that was able to career hop and find another job. There's a lot of my former colleagues still looking, or still waiting it out in hunker down mode.

You do make some great points about the economic factors. Part of my thought process is that since I can afford to travel, I am helping people earn a living at my destinations. Same reason I try to dine out at least as frequently as pre-COVID. When I dine out, I tip around double what I used to (and my normal was 20% or more if the service was good) because I appreciate the struggles that servers have had.

Queue @Sirwalterraleigh to tell me that I shouldn't be doing these things but I should keep telling myself things to make me feel better.

I was very fortunate that my job was 80% work from home to begin with. I am part owner of a small business and although we took a hit last year, it wasn't catastrophic. I am one of the luckier ones. I'm not one to tell other people what to do so I won't tell people that if you have the means, you should be traveling or dining out or whatever. Everybody should make their own individual risk assessment.

 

[DCBaker]

"A global study of nearly 44,000 found that the COVID-19 vaccine made by Johnson & Johnson is 66% effective in preventing moderate to severe disease.

The study was conducted in the U.S., Latin America and South Africa. The vaccine did better at preventing disease in this country – 72% percent — and less well in South Africa – 57% efficacy. The efficacy seen in Latin America was 66%.

The South African results are troubling because the coronavirus spreading there and that has now been detected in the U.S., raising concerns that the vaccines developed so far might not work as well against it.

The vaccine did demonstrate complete protection against COVID-19 serious enough to require hospitalization, according to a news release from the company. The vaccine was 85% percent effective in preventing severe forms of the disease.

The company says it plans to apply to the Food and Drug Administration for emergency use authorization to distribute the vaccine.

The Johnson & Johnson vaccine is given as a single shot, unlike the vaccines from Moderna and Pfizer that require two shots given weeks apart. The Johnson & Johnson vaccine also doesn't require ultracold storage."

Johnson & Johnson Vaccine Is 66% Effective In Preventing Moderate To Severe COVID-19

The vaccine did better at preventing disease in the U.S. – 72% — and less well in South Africa – 57% efficacy. The efficacy seen in Latin America was 66%.

www.npr.org

Direct link to the J&J release -

Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 Vaccine Authorized by U.S. FDA For Emergency Use - First Single-Shot Vaccine in Fight Against Global Pandemic

Data demonstrated protection against COVID-19 related hospitalization and death, across countries with different variants Available on not-for-profit basis for emergency pandemic use Shipping vaccine immediately, delivering more than 20 million doses to U.S. in March, 100 million doses in first…

www.jnj.com

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

So, FL's "numbers" are "awful" a year in but NJ's aren't at the same point in time? I also don't get this perception that people in FL spend all of their time outdoors. In the summer, it is miserable to be outdoors and most people spend an enormous amount of time indoors in the air conditioning. Even during this time of year, most people still spend the vast majority of their time indoors at work, in school, shopping, eating, etc.

What about CA which has had much worse recent "numbers" than FL? Last time I checked, the climate there (especially in the most populated areas) is conducive to year round outdoor activities and doesn't force people to retreat inside like the rest of the country.

You just can't admit that it turned out that further restrictions weren't necessary. FL ended up with overall "numbers" similar to or better than the States that implemented much more severe restrictions.

I'm glad the "pied piper of stupidity" was the one who led the charge to prioritize vaccinating the 65+ population, who are clearly the most vulnerable to fatalities from COVID-19. The few weeks of lead in that policy over most of the rest of the country will end up saving hundreds, if not thousands, of lives. How about a little credit for that?

You comment...but you don’t read.

New Jersey is not doing well...compared to where they were in the fall...but their overall numbers are still heavily weighted by the upfront spike when no one knew a thing.

Governor spray tan had a large early warning...and pooched it.

Use the “Florida superiority” routine on someone who is that gullible.

I’m not from New Jersey originally...and I also lived in Florida.
I’m just too old to fall for it

 

[Incomudro]

They're going to lose a lot more money from guests who won't visit while masks are required than they make from selling masks. Once a significant number of people are vaccinated, it's going to be very hard for Disney to keep its current policy. We've canceled two WDW vacations so far, and it looks like May 2021 is endangered. It's going to be interesting to see how things develop over the next several months.

I cancelled last May's trip due to covid, and while I'm very close to pulling the trigger for this April or May, I'm not sure if I'm going to.
And that's at the risk of losing "free" flights from JetBlue's travel bank.
And it's due to masks.
If mask restrictions were dropped by spring, I would book.

 

[dreday3]

"A global study of nearly 44,000 found that the COVID-19 vaccine made by Johnson & Johnson is 66% effective in preventing moderate to severe disease.

The study was conducted in the U.S., Latin America and South Africa. The vaccine did better at preventing disease in this country – 72% percent — and less well in South Africa – 57% efficacy. The efficacy seen in Latin America was 66%.

The South African results are troubling because the coronavirus spreading there and that has now been detected in the U.S., raising concerns that the vaccines developed so far might not work as well against it.

The vaccine did demonstrate complete protection against COVID-19 serious enough to require hospitalization, according to a news release from the company. The vaccine was 85% percent effective in preventing severe forms of the disease.

The company says it plans to apply to the Food and Drug Administration for emergency use authorization to distribute the vaccine.

The Johnson & Johnson vaccine is given as a single shot, unlike the vaccines from Moderna and Pfizer that require two shots given weeks apart. The Johnson & Johnson vaccine also doesn't require ultracold storage."

Johnson & Johnson Vaccine Is 66% Effective In Preventing Moderate To Severe COVID-19

The vaccine did better at preventing disease in the U.S. – 72% — and less well in South Africa – 57% efficacy. The efficacy seen in Latin America was 66%.

www.npr.org

Direct link to the J&J release -

Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 Vaccine Authorized by U.S. FDA For Emergency Use - First Single-Shot Vaccine in Fight Against Global Pandemic

Data demonstrated protection against COVID-19 related hospitalization and death, across countries with different variants Available on not-for-profit basis for emergency pandemic use Shipping vaccine immediately, delivering more than 20 million doses to U.S. in March, 100 million doses in first…

www.jnj.com

If it can prevent cases from requiring hospitalization, then that's good.

But I guess if I were the public who hasn't had the vaccine I'd be like, nah, I'll wait for the good ones..

 

[Chip Chipperson]

"A global study of nearly 44,000 found that the COVID-19 vaccine made by Johnson & Johnson is 66% effective in preventing moderate to severe disease.

The study was conducted in the U.S., Latin America and South Africa. The vaccine did better at preventing disease in this country – 72% percent — and less well in South Africa – 57% efficacy. The efficacy seen in Latin America was 66%.

The South African results are troubling because the coronavirus spreading there and that has now been detected in the U.S., raising concerns that the vaccines developed so far might not work as well against it.

The vaccine did demonstrate complete protection against COVID-19 serious enough to require hospitalization, according to a news release from the company. The vaccine was 85% percent effective in preventing severe forms of the disease.

The company says it plans to apply to the Food and Drug Administration for emergency use authorization to distribute the vaccine.

The Johnson & Johnson vaccine is given as a single shot, unlike the vaccines from Moderna and Pfizer that require two shots given weeks apart. The Johnson & Johnson vaccine also doesn't require ultracold storage."

Johnson & Johnson Vaccine Is 66% Effective In Preventing Moderate To Severe COVID-19

The vaccine did better at preventing disease in the U.S. – 72% — and less well in South Africa – 57% efficacy. The efficacy seen in Latin America was 66%.

www.npr.org

Direct link to the J&J release -

Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 Vaccine Authorized by U.S. FDA For Emergency Use - First Single-Shot Vaccine in Fight Against Global Pandemic

Data demonstrated protection against COVID-19 related hospitalization and death, across countries with different variants Available on not-for-profit basis for emergency pandemic use Shipping vaccine immediately, delivering more than 20 million doses to U.S. in March, 100 million doses in first…

www.jnj.com

I read in another article that they are also testing a 2-dose regimen of the vaccine. I'll be interested to see if that provides any additional protection.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

It’s important to consider the economy as a factor in the driver of travel downturn as well. Yes, there’s great opportunity for those that can afford it to take advantage of discounts, but there’s many that didn’t have a very good 2020 financially and will spend 2021 either recovering from that or holding onto what savings they have until there’s less uncertainty.

Personally, I would have loved to take a (socially distanced) road trip last year while I was out of work and had the time too, but without our primary income the budget didn't allow. Now I'm in a new job, but now I'm stuck watching my vacation accrual build up and our discretionary budget rebuild for a good part of 2021. We're thinking about a modest getaway in the fall if all goes well, but it's a decision based as much on finances as it is on the assumption Covid will be under control and we'll have gotten a vaccine by then.

And I'm one of the lucky ones that was able to career hop and find another job. There's a lot of my former colleagues still looking, or still waiting it out in hunker down mode.

People forget where things were at BEFORE last March...

The Fed/Treasury “poofed” $7,000,000,000,000 of Monopoly money into existence in the last 18 months. Half was BEFORE the corona shutdowns.

Why? “Market softening”

When you live on steroids, you will crash. Inevitable.

There were signs that the Circus Maximus routine was coming to halt before this...which means the pain will not end soon. It was overdue...but not avoidable.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

"A global study of nearly 44,000 found that the COVID-19 vaccine made by Johnson & Johnson is 66% effective in preventing moderate to severe disease.

The study was conducted in the U.S., Latin America and South Africa. The vaccine did better at preventing disease in this country – 72% percent — and less well in South Africa – 57% efficacy. The efficacy seen in Latin America was 66%.

The South African results are troubling because the coronavirus spreading there and that has now been detected in the U.S., raising concerns that the vaccines developed so far might not work as well against it.

The vaccine did demonstrate complete protection against COVID-19 serious enough to require hospitalization, according to a news release from the company. The vaccine was 85% percent effective in preventing severe forms of the disease.

The company says it plans to apply to the Food and Drug Administration for emergency use authorization to distribute the vaccine.

The Johnson & Johnson vaccine is given as a single shot, unlike the vaccines from Moderna and Pfizer that require two shots given weeks apart. The Johnson & Johnson vaccine also doesn't require ultracold storage."

Johnson & Johnson Vaccine Is 66% Effective In Preventing Moderate To Severe COVID-19

The vaccine did better at preventing disease in the U.S. – 72% — and less well in South Africa – 57% efficacy. The efficacy seen in Latin America was 66%.

www.npr.org

Direct link to the J&J release -

Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 Vaccine Authorized by U.S. FDA For Emergency Use - First Single-Shot Vaccine in Fight Against Global Pandemic

Data demonstrated protection against COVID-19 related hospitalization and death, across countries with different variants Available on not-for-profit basis for emergency pandemic use Shipping vaccine immediately, delivering more than 20 million doses to U.S. in March, 100 million doses in first…

www.jnj.com

I read in another article that they are also testing a 2-dose regimen of the vaccine. I'll be interested to see if that provides any additional protection.

Yeah...not good enough.

In normal times...sure. But you already have two better alternatives.

J&J has a huge manufacturing capacity (I’m not talking about q-tips...they make drugs all over the world)....so they may get the DPE treatment of this doesn’t get going fast

 

[JoeCamel]

People forget where things were at BEFORE last March...

The Fed/Treasury “poofed” $7,000,000,000,000 of Monopoly money into existence in the last 18 months. Half was BEFORE the corona shutdowns.

Why? “Market softening”

When you live on steroids, you will crash. Inevitable.

There were signs that the Circus Maximus routine was coming to halt before this...which means the pain will not end soon. It was overdue...but not avoidable.

They will pump a few trillion more into the stream this year as well so I'm all in for the ride.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

You do make some great points about the economic factors. Part of my thought process is that since I can afford to travel, I am helping people earn a living at my destinations. Same reason I try to dine out at least as frequently as pre-COVID. When I dine out, I tip around double what I used to (and my normal was 20% or more if the service was good) because I appreciate the struggles that servers have had.

Queue @Sirwalterraleigh to tell me that I shouldn't be doing these things but I should keep telling myself things to make me feel better.

I was very fortunate that my job was 80% work from home to begin with. I am part owner of a small business and although we took a hit last year, it wasn't catastrophic. I am one of the luckier ones. I'm not one to tell other people what to do so I won't tell people that if you have the means, you should be traveling or dining out or whatever. Everybody should make their own individual risk assessment.

Daily affirmation?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

They will pump a few trillion more into the stream this year as well so I'm all in for the ride.

No doubt...

Jay and Jan are probably having a power breakfast going over it right now!!

...Just as long as those GameStop brats don’t get any

Jamie Dimon is having a third waterski mount installed on the 267 next week and can’t be bothered with “disruptions”

 

[Disney Experience]

Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 Vaccine Authorized by U.S. FDA For Emergency Use - First Single-Shot Vaccine in Fight Against Global Pandemic

Data demonstrated protection against COVID-19 related hospitalization and death, across countries with different variants Available on not-for-profit basis for emergency pandemic use Shipping vaccine immediately, delivering more than 20 million doses to U.S. in March, 100 million doses in first…

www.jnj.com

 

[DisneyCane]

"A global study of nearly 44,000 found that the COVID-19 vaccine made by Johnson & Johnson is 66% effective in preventing moderate to severe disease.

The study was conducted in the U.S., Latin America and South Africa. The vaccine did better at preventing disease in this country – 72% percent — and less well in South Africa – 57% efficacy. The efficacy seen in Latin America was 66%.

The South African results are troubling because the coronavirus spreading there and that has now been detected in the U.S., raising concerns that the vaccines developed so far might not work as well against it.

The vaccine did demonstrate complete protection against COVID-19 serious enough to require hospitalization, according to a news release from the company. The vaccine was 85% percent effective in preventing severe forms of the disease.

The company says it plans to apply to the Food and Drug Administration for emergency use authorization to distribute the vaccine.

The Johnson & Johnson vaccine is given as a single shot, unlike the vaccines from Moderna and Pfizer that require two shots given weeks apart. The Johnson & Johnson vaccine also doesn't require ultracold storage."

Johnson & Johnson Vaccine Is 66% Effective In Preventing Moderate To Severe COVID-19

The vaccine did better at preventing disease in the U.S. – 72% — and less well in South Africa – 57% efficacy. The efficacy seen in Latin America was 66%.

www.npr.org

Direct link to the J&J release -

Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 Vaccine Authorized by U.S. FDA For Emergency Use - First Single-Shot Vaccine in Fight Against Global Pandemic

Data demonstrated protection against COVID-19 related hospitalization and death, across countries with different variants Available on not-for-profit basis for emergency pandemic use Shipping vaccine immediately, delivering more than 20 million doses to U.S. in March, 100 million doses in first…

www.jnj.com

I think the biggest positive from the release is:

"The Janssen COVID-19 vaccine candidate demonstrated complete protection against COVID-related hospitalization and death, 28 days post-vaccination. There was a clear effect of the vaccine on COVID-19 cases requiring medical intervention (hospitalization, ICU admission, mechanical ventilation, extracorporeal membrane oxygenation (ECMO)), with no reported cases among participants who had received the Janssen COVID-19 vaccine, 28 days post-vaccination."

Since that appears to include the South Africa results, even if it isn't as effective against that strain, it still appears to prevent the worst of the outcomes.

 

[Disney Experience]

Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 Vaccine Authorized by U.S. FDA For Emergency Use - First Single-Shot Vaccine in Fight Against Global Pandemic

Data demonstrated protection against COVID-19 related hospitalization and death, across countries with different variants Available on not-for-profit basis for emergency pandemic use Shipping vaccine immediately, delivering more than 20 million doses to U.S. in March, 100 million doses in first…

www.jnj.com

Not as good as the MRNA vaccines nor as good as hoped. But better than the sinovac vaccines.

Single shot no extreme storage requirements.

 

[Disney Experience]

Not as good as the MRNA vaccines nor as good as hoped. But better than the sinovac vaccines.

Single shot no extreme storage requirements.

Edit: Lol looks like I am a little late posting.. Just caught up to a new page. So my post is a bit redundant

 

[dreday3]

I think the biggest positive from the release is:

"The Janssen COVID-19 vaccine candidate demonstrated complete protection against COVID-related hospitalization and death, 28 days post-vaccination. There was a clear effect of the vaccine on COVID-19 cases requiring medical intervention (hospitalization, ICU admission, mechanical ventilation, extracorporeal membrane oxygenation (ECMO)), with no reported cases among participants who had received the Janssen COVID-19 vaccine, 28 days post-vaccination."

Since that appears to include the South Africa results, even if it isn't as effective against that strain, it still appears to prevent the worst of the outcomes.

Not as good as the MRNA vaccines nor as good as hoped. But better than the sinovac vaccines.

Single shot no extreme storage requirements.

Yes. It's still good enough to get the job done of reducing hospitalizations and severity, so it should be used where needed most. All the while production ramps up on the "good" ones, so they can become more widely available and perhaps places can work on the storage issues in the meantime.