Canadian pavilion: poorly designed?

[ArielBelle]

Canada is necessary because it borders the United States. Therefore Canada and Mexico border the entrances to World Showcase.

wow, i never ever thought of it that way! thank you kumbarider for teaching me something very interesting today! that is a great fact

 

[KumbaRider]

wow, i never ever thought of it that way! thank you kumbarider for teaching me something very interesting today! that is a great fact

No problem. Canada is also located slightly north of Mexico along the lagoon.

 

[tomm4004]

Canada is necessary because it borders the United States. Therefore Canada and Mexico border the entrances to World Showcase.

That could be the reason for the placement, but who knows. The other placements seem rather random. I'm still not convinced about the origins of the pavilion. I'll have to do some research. I just don't think Disney threw it in there to be geographically correct. Besides, it would have thus made more sense to have Canada and Mexico next to the American Adventure.

 

[Interruption?]

The stores at the top of the Canadian pavilion have been closed for some time now while stores in other countries have been expanding. My original thought was: Canadian goods just aren't unique enough to be hot sellers; now I'm thinking it's a matter of design.

Imagine you're a first time visitor to EPCOT. You walk by China and see a crowd of people watching the acrobats. Awesome, aren't they? Then you notice the temple and the people filing in. It's a movie. You enjoy the film and exit into the tempting store. After dropping a few bucks (at least) you walk by the restaurant and make a note to come back and eat - and ask for a window seat!

Now imagine that you walk by Canada. You see a set of steep steps, and a winding path to a lovely garden. Which do you take? The path of course. Then you see the restaurant and make a note to come back for lunch. You stroll down the tempting boardwalk by the waterfall and end up at the mine. It's a movie. You watch and head back down the trail and get a couple seats for lunch. Then you pass the garden and hear music and see guys in kilts. You listen, then you walk off toward the United Kingdom. At no time do you hike up the steps - to where the stores at the top used to be.

The Italian and German stores are right on the street. The French design is similar to the Chinese. To get to and from the Mexican ride and restaurant you have to pass the stores. The Norway ride dumps you into a store. Could the demise of the stores in Canada - not including the Trading Post on the main level - have been inevitable due to the design of the pavilion? Did they originally think that people would hike the stairs, shop in the stores, head down to the film, and then walk past the waterfall to the garden? Or that they would leave the film and hike up the stairs and past the stores, even though the easier exit and the restaurant lay along the flat trail?

Actually, I think the fact that Canada is a welfare state caused the demise of all economic stability in the Canada pavilion

 

[wedway71]

I was really hoping for a "STRANGE BREW" attraction when it opened-lol

 

[KumbaRider]

That could be the reason for the placement, but who knows. The other placements seem rather random. I'm still not convinced about the origins of the pavilion. I'll have to do some research. I just don't think Disney threw it in there to be geographically correct. Besides, it would have thus made more sense to have Canada and Mexico next to the American Adventure.

Those locations are very intentional. Maybe you'll understand it better if you are standing from the American Adventure facing Spaceship Earth. There is a central axis running from the entrance through SSE and the Fountain to American Adventure. From there, you will see Canada and Mexico bordering the entrances to the showcase. It makes perfect sense.

In response to the idea that the placements are random...well, to the average guest they may appear to be so. However, many of them have hidden meanings and purposes that when put into context make sense. There is a strong intellectual quality in the design of both Future World and World Showcase. Everything is deliberate, and nothing is simply 'placed'. For another example, look at France and the United Kingdom. The river that connects World Showcase Lagoon to Crescent Lake and separates the two is symbolic of the English Channel. France is geographically located in Epcot on the southern side of this channel. United Kingdom is to the north, exactly the same way as they are in reality. There is so much more about each pavilion, but that would be a book.

Whether the average guest knows or cares, the locations of these pavilions as well as many other parts of WDW are quite deliberate.

 

[notnothin]

Very interesting, I've never considered this before. Thanks for sharing.

 

[marni1971]

Here`s another snippet, regarding 2 well known but never built rides.

Switzerland was going in with the Matterhorn. Japan was getting Mt. Fuji. Switzerland was therefore going to go between Italy and Germany for 2 reasons - it would be Geographically correct, and also to balance out the horizon when viewed from Futureworld; a mountain on each side of and perfectly symmetrical with the southern shores horizon.

 

[tomm4004]

In response to the idea that the placements are random...well, to the average guest they may appear to be so. However, many of them have hidden meanings and purposes that when put into context make sense. There is a strong intellectual quality in the design of both Future World and World Showcase. Everything is deliberate, and nothing is simply 'placed'.

Is this a theory or based on fact? How do you explain China beside Mexico (before Norway came), or Japan beside Morocco?

I would love to read a book about the origins of EPCOT. I think the economics of it would be intriguing.

 

[tomm4004]

Switzerland was going in with the Matterhorn. Japan was getting Mt. Fuji.

Were there plans to build both rides? I thought it was one or the other. I couldn't see them having two rollercoasters through mountains. Other than balancing they would actually fight with each other and take away their uniqueness.

 

[KumbaRider]

Is this a theory or based on fact? How do you explain China beside Mexico (before Norway came), or Japan beside Morocco?

I would love to read a book about the origins of EPCOT. I think the economics of it would be intriguing.

I just wrote a 20 page paper on the use of symbolism and narrative in the design of Epcot. I have read multiple books, taken tours, talked to people, etc for my information. Like I said, it would take a novel to explain all of the various details and specifics. Right now I recommend you read Vinyl Leaves, by Fjellman....It's a little old (1992) but it has some interesting information. I would also suggest you take some of the tours offered at Epcot if you are still interested. Read some of the Epcot facts on various websites as well.

You should be able to answer a majority of these questions with the help of these sources.

 

[KumbaRider]

Were there plans to build both rides? I thought it was one or the other. I couldn't see them having two rollercoasters through mountains. Other than balancing they would actually fight with each other and take away their uniqueness.

Through asymmetrical design the two would give balance.

 

[tomm4004]

Right now I recommend you read Vinyl Leaves, by Fjellman....It's a little old (1992) but it has some interesting information.

Thanks. I'll look for that.

I once jokingly wrote that World Showcase was designed to show U.S. domination. For example, it is at the center with its North Amercian neighbours at the fringes as if to say, "we're the center of the continent." Also, the American Adventure is between Japan on one side and Germany/Italy on the other - the WWII axis powers. This is their way of saying that it was America that came between and defeated these powers!

I also notice that Morocco (once a French colony) is next to France. I wonder if this was intentional and if they mentioned this to the Moroccans?!

 

[KumbaRider]

I also notice that Morocco (once a French colony) is next to France. I wonder if this was intentional and if they mentioned this to the Moroccans?!

The pathway changes color, from coral to gray between the two pavilions, symbolic of the Strait of Gibraltar.

 

[tomm4004]

I just read that the original plan was to have America at the front between Canada and Mexico, but they changed that so America would be the weenie that drew people in. It also said that countries would go geographically, but they decided to split China and Japan because they were afraid Americans wouldn't be able to tell the difference. Oh, brother. So I guess if they had gone UK, France, Morocco, then Italy, Germany, and then to Asia there could be a geographic logic to it.

Strait of Gibraltar - I guess, except that Spain is actually on the other side.

 

[tirian]

I enjoy the fact that there's a quiet spot at the back of Canada.

 

[Rob562]

For another example, look at France and the United Kingdom. The river that connects World Showcase Lagoon to Crescent Lake and separates the two is symbolic of the English Channel. France is geographically located in Epcot on the southern side of this channel. United Kingdom is to the north, exactly the same way as they are in reality.

The one problem is that they messed this design up a little when they added the International Gateway. The IG is themed similarly to France. I believe they even use the same lampposts. So even though it's on the UK side of the "Channel", it looks like France. The reasoning behind that was that from the IG, the only country you could see is France, so they continued the theme.

One thing to look at as you walk through World Showcase are the lampposts. They show you where one pavilion ends and the next begins. Each country has their own specific design. There's also what I call "World Showcase Generic" for the spans of walkway where there isn't a country.
I believe the one exception to this is in the area with the garden railroad in Germany. Because that section wasn't originally part of Germany, the lampposts are the "generic" design. It wasn't until one of the F&G festivals that they installed the temporary train display that eventually became permanent.

-Rob

 

[Rob562]

Brian Bennett has told me that prior to a mid-1990s redesign guests had to access the movie by climbing the stairs and walking past the stores. I vaguely recall this, although I'm not sure how they prevented people from going through the "EXIT" (the pathway from the garden was meant to be an exit) and to the restaurant.

Anyway, even if that were the case then the pavilion would essentially be backwards. Usually, the shops are after the ride and not before. That's the idea. You see the attraction, and that makes you want to buy something.

I agree that the Canadian pavilion is a triumpth aesthetically.

Technically the wooden walkway from the waterfall out through the gorge is an exit from the area, and also the handicap entrance to the movie theater. I think there's a sign on the Le Cellier end that says something like "Handicapped Entrance Only".

The top level (by the closed shops) is accessible via ramps. They snake back and forth to either side of the stairs going up. It's just there's no longer any real reason to go up there other than for the view. Someone in a wheelchair would have to go back down and around to get to the movie.

And as a side note, they should at least raise the Canadian "Rockies" a few feet to hide Soarin' and the Beach Club Villas. At least for while you're *in* the Canadian pavilion. (I know that hiding Soarin' from across the lagoon is another whole matter entirely, but you still shouldn't see it from within Canada)

-Rob

 

[Bill Smugs]

Something I was thinking that would be really cool how about change the circle vision 360 movie into theretres like soarin and have soarin over canada. The building could be built into the mountain and hide the curent siarin building and the line could use the ramps as over flow and wind through the Hotel du Canada. The exit then could come out of the mine.

 

[mousermerf]

This picture is taken at the highest point in the Canadian pavilion (the overlook before the falls) and as you can see...

http://www.mouseinfo.com/gallery/files/4/4/2/6/100_0980.JPG

It's not easy to see Soarin' so I don't feel it's a problem that needs to be addressed.