Can We Agree to Stop Complaining Disney About Prices? Let's Talk Value

[jakeman]

ehhhh most large companies have social media experts that compile all the things people are saying about them on forums, facebook, and twitter.

Yeah, but letting them know directly a specifically what the issues are would be more efficient in incessant complaining hoping you get swept up in a social media algorithm. Just my opinion though.

Simply staying home and not participating isn't really all the effective either. More often change comes from using the power of speech to influence the decisions of others.

That said - it's not my personal intention to go on a campaign against WDW. While I don't have the excitement about WDW the I used to, I still like the place enough to go from time to time. Yet, if someone brings up a discussion about value, I'll share my thoughts.

Power of speech is overrated on the internet. Especially in specialized forums like this. It's easy to just dismiss whole groups of people when their forum is viewed as one giant echo chamber.

Hit them in their wallet or complain somewhere that doesn't have a reputation of being the harbor of WDW negativity and make it stick then you're getting somewhere. This forum is all preaching to the choir.

And looking at my post, it looks like I'm saying we are both right...from a certain point of view...

 

[ParkMan73]

Yeah, but letting them know directly a specifically what the issues are would be more efficient in incessant complaining hoping you get swept up in a social media algorithm. Just my opinion though.


Power of speech is overrated on the internet. Especially in specialized forums like this. It's easy to just dismiss whole groups of people when their forum is viewed as one giant echo chamber.

Hit them in their wallet or complain somewhere that doesn't have a reputation of being the harbor of WDW negativity and make it stick then you're getting somewhere. This forum is all preaching to the choir.

And looking at my post, it looks like I'm saying we are both right...from a certain point of view...

Well done - nice Obi-Wan reference!

I would certainly concur that power of speech on the internet is limited - and yes - posts here can certainly be like preaching to the choir.

 

[crazynakedguy]

Yeah, but letting them know directly a specifically what the issues are would be more efficient in incessant complaining hoping you get swept up in a social media algorithm. Just my opinion though.

oh i know what you mean but after being at the parks just last month and taking another survey about my magic + its clear those avenues are closed. They design the inpark surveys so you can't ever give a negative response.

The questions are phrased like "Which part of My Magic + was the most convient" and so on.

The whole thing has been a mess for them and they are trying to squash any bad reports it seems.

 

[jakeman]

oh i know what you mean but after being at the parks just last month and taking another survey about my magic + its clear those avenues are closed. They design the inpark surveys so you can't ever give a negative response.

The questions are phrased like "Which part of My Magic + was the most convient" and so on.

The whole thing has been a mess for them and they are trying to squash any bad reports it seems.

Nah, you can't judge a survey just on what you saw, especially if it was a branching survey. I've done a few surveys throughout the years and I've run into a mix of "only positives" to both options being available.

Don't believe everything that is posted here about MM+ being a flaming turd. Some folks are extremely emotionally invested in MM+'s failure as a validation of their opinion.

The truth about MM+ is somewhere between the doldrums of opinions here and the corporate rainbows of Disney.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

The Power of Speech on the internet is an amazingly powerful thing. Here in the depths of the WDWM Forums? Not so much.

 

[Goofyernmost]

shareholders. My Magic + was pitched with the idea that investing the 2 billion would yeild greater profits. However it turns out that they will never see a return on the 2 billion and over the years it will cost even more to upgrade and maintain it. My Magic + will never even break even.

WDW was chosen because its the only park that has these problems. Of course all of these problems could have been fixed with more people eaters.

You think that they are going to spend 2 billion on every other park when the other parks don't have the same crowd issues that WDW has?

To end this discussion as far as I am concerned, you don't know 1) if it will ever return the investment or 2) how much incentive that the profit was in deciding to upgrade the system, or 3) that the entire premise was that they would eventually be able to spread the costs over all the parks to minimize the hit that (it appears) that WDW is taking now. I doubt that WDW is taking the cost by itself now anyway.

Once everything is ironed out it will not be a billion dollar investment per park anyway. I would be surprised if it wasn't already figured in to the overall cost to begin with.

Anyway, we can continue this banter back and forth forever, but, frankly I'm getting a little bored with it. I made the statement that it was my opinion that it would be everywhere before long. I stick with that opinion because it is the only way that this will work and make any return to Disney overall. It all lies in the definition of what constitutes return. Time will tell, but, I'm hard pressed to think that they would invest that kind of money in something and then just throw it out. They will get whatever they can from it and live with it for quite sometime. Heck the ability to plan staffing based on FP reservations alone is almost worth the investment.

 

[Goofyernmost]

So have we agreed yet?

I agree that today is Friday. Does that help?

 

[MerMom1981]

Don't be ridiculous. Disney is not avalue. It's overpriced any way you slice it. Just because we choose to pay the price, doesn't not mean we should device ourselves.

My family of ffour took a 9-day vacation this winter that did not cost as much as our trip to Disney the year before. We flew to San Juan, took a 7-night cruise of the Southern Caribbean with activities like kayaking in St Croix, returned to San Juan and stayed in an amazing luxury resort on the beach and still came in under Disney budget. The only thing that pushed us over was a submarine tour in Barbados, but that's a once-in-a lifetime experience.

A value is spending the same $$ to be on actual Caribbean beaches, not the CB resort. I'm not trying to hate on Disney. I love, love, love it! But let's call a spade a spade, shall we?

 

[thomas998]

Just because it's a business doesn't mean we should simply accept high prices & medicore investment in their offerings. I don't mind higher prices, but I'm not seeing the value in a trip that I used to. So, I go less frequently than I'd like to. However, I can still be vocal about it.

Using the power of speech to to attempt to influence a companies practices is a legit response when a business has a strategy you don't like. The answer doesn't always have to be "stay home".

Then the business model is working. The reality is WDW is a set size. No matter how you slice it they can only physically get a certain number of visitors in during a given year. If they raise the prices to the point that their existing customer come less often (like yourself) but are able to bring in more visitors from other places to make up the difference then they win. It really wouldn't matter to them if people only came one time only in their entire life as long as they filled the park up each year with new first timers. Given that WDW caters to international visitors and other economies are growing to give them more potential customers you shouldn't expect anything to change in your favor. That might be different if there was a global recession and the rest of the world sank into an economic abyss but until that happens the US visitor is becoming less and less important to WDW.

 

[ParkMan73]

Then the business model is working. The reality is WDW is a set size. No matter how you slice it they can only physically get a certain number of visitors in during a given year. If they raise the prices to the point that their existing customer come less often (like yourself) but are able to bring in more visitors from other places to make up the difference then they win. It really wouldn't matter to them if people only came one time only in their entire life as long as they filled the park up each year with new first timers. Given that WDW caters to international visitors and other economies are growing to give them more potential customers you shouldn't expect anything to change in your favor. That might be different if there was a global recession and the rest of the world sank into an economic abyss but until that happens the US visitor is becoming less and less important to WDW.

From what I read, WDW is not as full as it could be. Yet, for the sake of argument, let's say that it is running at max capacity now.

So, by that argument, WDW could reduce the value they provide - by increasing the costs and reducing the offerings, or both - and still reach peak capacity. Giving them a pass for doing that feels like a cop out to me.

 

[crazynakedguy]

Nah, you can't judge a survey just on what you saw, especially if it was a branching survey. I've done a few surveys throughout the years and I've run into a mix of "only positives" to both options being available.

Don't believe everything that is posted here about MM+ being a flaming turd. Some folks are extremely emotionally invested in MM+'s failure as a validation of their opinion.

The truth about MM+ is somewhere between the doldrums of opinions here and the corporate rainbows of Disney.

i live in florida i've been to Disneyworld 5 times in 2014 alone. Trust me it is a flaming turd. It treats frequent vistors and florida residents like second class citizens.

Let me put it this way I have yet to eat at Be Our Guest because it's impossible to get reservations.

 

[crazynakedguy]

Then the business model is working. The reality is WDW is a set size. No matter how you slice it they can only physically get a certain number of visitors in during a given year. If they raise the prices to the point that their existing customer come less often (like yourself) but are able to bring in more visitors from other places to make up the difference then they win. It really wouldn't matter to them if people only came one time only in their entire life as long as they filled the park up each year with new first timers. Given that WDW caters to international visitors and other economies are growing to give them more potential customers you shouldn't expect anything to change in your favor. That might be different if there was a global recession and the rest of the world sank into an economic abyss but until that happens the US visitor is becoming less and less important to WDW.

actually its not because they are still 2 billion in the hole for My Magic Plus and they lost 3% of the market share to universal.

 

[crazynakedguy]

Don't be ridiculous. Disney is not avalue. It's overpriced any way you slice it. Just because we choose to pay the price, doesn't not mean we should device ourselves.

My family of ffour took a 9-day vacation this winter that did not cost as much as our trip to Disney the year before. We flew to San Juan, took a 7-night cruise of the Southern Caribbean with activities like kayaking in St Croix, returned to San Juan and stayed in an amazing luxury resort on the beach and still came in under Disney budget. The only thing that pushed us over was a submarine tour in Barbados, but that's a once-in-a lifetime experience.

A value is spending the same $$ to be on actual Caribbean beaches, not the CB resort. I'm not trying to hate on Disney. I love, love, love it! But let's call a spade a spade, shall we?

someone hit the nail on the head. This is a sentiment shard by many we LOVE disney but it is in no way a value.

Oh hey remember when WDW had submarines......

 

[crazynakedguy]

To end this discussion as far as I am concerned, you don't know 1) if it will ever return the investment or 2) how much incentive that the profit was in deciding to upgrade the system, or 3) that the entire premise was that they would eventually be able to spread the costs over all the parks to minimize the hit that (it appears) that WDW is taking now. I doubt that WDW is taking the cost by itself now anyway.

Once everything is ironed out it will not be a billion dollar investment per park anyway. I would be surprised if it wasn't already figured in to the overall cost to begin with.

Anyway, we can continue this banter back and forth forever, but, frankly I'm getting a little bored with it. I made the statement that it was my opinion that it would be everywhere before long. I stick with that opinion because it is the only way that this will work and make any return to Disney overall. It all lies in the definition of what constitutes return. Time will tell, but, I'm hard pressed to think that they would invest that kind of money in something and then just throw it out. They will get whatever they can from it and live with it for quite sometime. Heck the ability to plan staffing based on FP reservations alone is almost worth the investment.

we do know. My Magic + doesn't actually produce any income and it doesn't do anything to bring new customers in. There have already been articles about the projected cost of upkeep for it and its not looking good.

Yes they do plan on basing staff on FP reservations alone and that is a huge problem.

Meanwhile Universal is aggressively building.

 

[Matt_Black]

shareholders. My Magic + was pitched with the idea that investing the 2 billion would yeild greater profits. However it turns out that they will never see a return on the 2 billion and over the years it will cost even more to upgrade and maintain it. My Magic + will never even break even.

Do you have a source for this claim, like a reputable business publication, or are you just going to link to another forum thread?

 

[Matt_Black]

i live in florida i've been to Disneyworld 5 times in 2014 alone. Trust me it is a flaming turd. It treats frequent vistors and florida residents like second class citizens.

If it's a flaming turd, why on earth have you gone 5 times in less than 5 months?

 

[BigTxEars]

actually its not because they are still 2 billion in the hole for My Magic Plus and they lost 3% of the market share to universal.

And yet WDW still had record profit and guest numbers last quarter. I guess they may know their business a wee bit better than you

Disney stock is up 9% in the last 3 months, that ain't too bad now is it

Seems the investors are pretty happy with the results you keep saying are so bad.

BTW Comcast is down 1% over the same timeframe.

Now what about the recent improvements to FP+ and the announcements of the moves of execs at WDW? Good stuff right? Things are moving forward.

You speak about guest not liking the new systems but then go on to say you can't eat at BOG because you can't get a reservation. I guess somebody is liking the new system, or reservations would be easy to get at BOG.

Your all over the place, maybe putting some clothes on would make you less cranky

 

[BigTxEars]

Ya know, I love Disney, but for our first time last summer, we did a "split" vacation between Uni/IOA and Disney. I'll just say that Disney does have some good competition and they do need to keep an eye on that. Everything at Uni was pretty awesome and modern.

Uni runs a darn good park, we enjoy them greatly. I still prefer WDW as there is just more immersion and more to do for a week for us. Of course WDW should keep an eye on Uni, and on Dreamworks in the movie business. I like the fact that they drive performance from each other. We all win with that going on.

 

[Matt_Black]

Oh, they're keeping an eye on Dreamworks. Touchstone Pictures is the distributor for Dreamworks films, meaning Disney makes money off of them.

 

[crazynakedguy]

Oh, they're keeping an eye on Dreamworks. Touchstone Pictures is the distributor for Dreamworks films, meaning Disney makes money off of them.

they made money off of Uni directly as Disney owns marvel