ImperfectPixie
Well-Known Member
Think about this question for a minute.
With the laws regarding parental rights and sex-ed in schools having already been on the books for decades...what is the purpose of this new law?
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Bob Chapek's response to Florida's 'Don't Say Gay' bill
- Thread starter Disney Analyst
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Think about this question for a minute.
With the laws regarding parental rights and sex-ed in schools having already been on the books for decades...what is the purpose of this new law?
EricsBiscuit
Well-Known Member
Funny how you don’t see any of the woke Disney fans/CMs complain about Disney’s ties to the genocidal Chinese Communist Party.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
Apparently it's to prevent 2nd grade teachers from introducing "sexual orientation" and "gender identity" into classroom discussions with 7 year old kids.
There are public schools in Chicago, San Francisco, LA, etc. that introduce those concepts even earlier than 2nd grade. And introduce stuff like HIV and condom use by 4th grade.
Apparently the Florida legislature did not want to go down that educational path with very young children under age 8, so they passed this law to prevent talking about "sexual orientation" and "gender identity" before the 4th grade.
I guess that still leaves open the subject of condom use and HIV transmission though. After finger painting and naps.
EricsBiscuit
Well-Known Member
It seems perverted to want to talk to 8 year olds about the topics covered in this bill.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
Isn't it fascinating?
Communist China, home to two Disney theme park resorts and a bunch of Disney retail and media companies, has laws expressly forbidding gay marriage, gay adoption, and even now bans "sissy men" from appearing on Chinese TV.
But yeah, forget about Communist China. Florida won't let 2nd graders learn about sexual orientation!
The mind boggles how all these virtue signalers work that out in their brain. Beijing = Good. Tallahassee = Bad.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
I agree. And I'm gay. Been gay since grade school, thinking back on it. Knew it by junior high school. DEFINITELY knew it by high school. By the time I was 20, I was a legend!
But I can't imagine talking to an 8 year old 3rd grader about this stuff, let alone a 5 or 6 year old. It's just so weird.
EricsBiscuit
Well-Known Member
I don’t understand why they insist on introducing these topics to kids so young. Bearing in mind our brains aren’t fully developed until 25~, how do we expect these kids to be able to think critically about these subjects? They can’t. Most 8 year olds even struggle with consistent rational decision making. To me it seems like they want to brainwash our kids.I agree. And I'm gay. Been gay since grade school, thinking back on it. Knew it by junior high school. DEFINITELY knew it by high school. By the time I was 20, I was a legend!
But I can't imagine talking to an 8 year old 3rd grader about this stuff, let alone a 5 or 6 year old. It's just so weird.
EricsBiscuit
Well-Known Member
And that’s not even mentioning Xinjiang.
Sorry if you find that a teacher explaining to kids that one of their classmates shouldn't be bullied because she has two moms is "perverted," but Disney is a welcoming place and if you have problems with LGBT persons, perhaps its not for you.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
Again, this isn't an issue for Disney World's operation of theme parks and hotels. It's a piece of legislation put forth and signed into law by a majority of Florida's democratically elected leaders.
That said, I don't think anyone here has said that young children shouldn't be bullied. A teacher needs to step in and shut that sort of thing down ASAP, regardless of the topic a child uses to bully another child.
But then that teacher doesn't have to get into the whole Lesbian thing about why Billy has two moms instead of a mom and a dad. Leave that for the parents. Or at least 5th grade.
I guess the issue here is that to many folks this sexual orientation issue isn't a conversation that should be happening at the 2nd grade level. It just seems creepy at that young age, where children don't know how to process that info.
That said, if there's a parent couple out there who wants to explain that concept to their 2nd grader, then they have every right to do that. Get into all sorts of stuff by 2nd grade around the dining room table; sexual orientation, gender identity, polygamy, whatever. But to have 2nd grade teachers include that stuff as part of the regular curriculum? That seems inappropriate for that blanket age level in a public school.
Honestly, why not just focus on sentence construction and penmanship and basic math in 2nd and 3rd grade? With maybe some arts n' crafts, or music lessons. Plus recess. And a snack.
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TP2000
Well-Known Member
No kidding. Freaking internment slave labor camps! With forced abortion, forced sterilization, and other horrors.
But sure, let's focus on Florida not wanting 2nd graders to learn about sexual orientation after recess.
Don't you mean after a napNo kidding. Freaking internment slave labor camps! With forced abortion, forced sterilization, and other horrors.
But sure, let's focus on Florida not wanting 2nd graders to learn about sexual orientation after recess.
Again:
1) These things organically come up when kids are asked to make family trees, play show & tell with family photos, have two moms picking them up from school, etc.
2) The bill is so broadly written that only a small part of it applies to K-3. Parents can still sue teachers post-3rd grade if they find anything remotely inappropriate.
Plus, this doesn't even have touch on the outing of older kids to their potentially homophobic parents, which is pretty horrific on its face.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
None of those arts n' crafts or parental pickup scenarios are illegal under this legislation. The 2nd grade teacher simply can't expand on Billy's crayon drawing of two mommies to explain how Lesbianism works to the rest of the class.
But, if a parent wants to explain to their 2nd grader why Billy has two mommies, the parent can do that. Or not do that. And a parent should be able to make that choice themselves with such a young child, since parenting is up to the parent.
Once kids get towards 6th grade or Junior High, my opinion changes on this topic. I think at that point it's appropriate to fold in homosexuality and transgenderism (is that a word?) into the broader school-based conversation about sexual health and changing bodies that must take place at that age.
Us boys got marched off to the gym in 8th grade for a Sex Ed lecture from Coach Ladd. It wasn't that informative.
I understand the views people have on the bill. However, this is all political and has nothing to do with visiting the themeparks. Disney should stay out of politics and so should this section of the boards. If WDWMagic wants to bring back a political section then it could be discussed there but otherwise this thread should be removed. Personally I would like the political section returned.
None of those arts n' crafts or parental pickup scenarios are illegal under this legislation. The 2nd grade teacher simply can't expand on Billy's crayon drawing of two mommies to explain how Lesbianism works to the rest of the class.
But, if a parent wants to explain to their 2nd grader why Billy has two mommies, the parent can do that. Or not do that. And a parent should be able to make that choice themselves with such a young child, since parenting is up to the parent.
Once kids get towards 6th grade or Junior High, my opinion changes on this topic. I think at that point it's appropriate to fold in homosexuality and transgenderism (is that a word?) into the broader school-based conversation about sexual health and changing bodies that must take place at that age.
Us boys got marched off to the gym in 8th grade for a Sex Ed lecture from Coach Ladd. It wasn't that informative.
But, again, if Billy is being bullied by the class for one of those presentations - as teasing is elementary school right of passage - the teacher should absolutely say that Billy's family situation is no lesser than anybody else's - that some kids can have two moms, two dads or just one parent.
You want to leave it up to the parents to do the educating on this but what happens when kid's bring wrongheaded knowledge they learn from parents (gay parents are sinners, etc). The teacher is just supposed to sit there while that kid spouts off all his "learning" from his own parents, making the students with same sex parents upset? Would you feel the same way if a kid came in spouting off racist beliefs and a law forbade teachers from saying that all races are equal?
Such basic family fundamentals should be taught to kids. Nobody has to get into more detail than that. Why is LGBT the ONE area that is verboten? It's discriminatory, plain and simple.
Plus, you say that starting in 6th grade its okay to explain these things, but the Florida bill is so broad that a parent could still sue if they find something "inappropriate" in the later years of their child's education.
Also, the bill allows schools to "out" kids of all ages to their parents, many of whom are likely homophobic.
This bill is wrong on so many levels.
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Disney is in the never ending game along with many companies - you take care of me, I take care of you. The idea of that stopping is purely wishful thinking.
Sir_Cliff
Well-Known Member
I think these are the two things that are really energising those who oppose the bill. Let's also not be naïve, we live in an era where goading people to bring lawsuits about contentious issues has become part of the political playbook. This bill seems to be written precisely to both have a chilling effect on any acknowledgement of (non-heterosexual) sexual orientation in schools and to provoke lawsuits over what is age-appropriate at any level. Perhaps even parents who oppose the bill bringing lawsuits about books or movies depicting heterosexual sexual orientation being discussed in school as a way of responding and/or ridiculing the legislation.
The other thing I don't think we should be naïve about is that this narrative about gay people seeking to recruit children has a long history. I mentioned Anita Bryant earlier in the thread, and her movement against an LGBT anti-discrimination bill in Dade County, Fl back in the 1970s was called "Save Our Children" and pushed this angle about gay recruitment in schools as a way of supporting the right to discriminate against gay people in other areas of society. Now the emphasis is more on trans, but the same principle exists.
The problem Disney had in this scenario was specifically that it gave money to all the sponsors and co-sponsors of the bill while having made a big deal in recent years about being all about diversity and inclusion. Honestly, I suspect that if Chapek had of released a brief statement that the company was not supportive of the legislation and would not in the future donate to the bill's sponsors most would have been satisfied. If you think the legislation is reasonable, I guess you would think Chapek should have stuck to his guns. However, we've seen what that led to. Essentially, this shows you can't walk both sides of the street without being called out for it.
The comments on China remind me of those complaining about all the coverage of Ukraine vs. X conflict/s. There is some truth to it, but just because you don't talk about everything doesn't mean you can't talk about anything.
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Jlasoon
Well-Known Member
'If that’s the hill they’re going to die on, then how do they possibly explain lining their pockets with their relationship from the Communist Party of China? Because that’s what they do, and they make a fortune, and they don’t say a word about the really brutal practices that you see over there at the hands of the CCP'
Not a hill you want to die on Disney - move along like nothing happened. Those of us who live in Orlando & understand your business dynamics with the state recommend you STFU right about now. Florida isn't Cali, never will be.
The Governor can make your life a living nightmare. And its not like you can pack up & leave Florida. Just put your head down & move on. You're in a no win situation.
Not a hill you want to die on Disney - move along like nothing happened. Those of us who live in Orlando & understand your business dynamics with the state recommend you STFU right about now. Florida isn't Cali, never will be.
The Governor can make your life a living nightmare. And its not like you can pack up & leave Florida. Just put your head down & move on. You're in a no win situation.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
…I wouldn’t…Also you, when the bill gets to the part where Pre-K through 3rd grade would not be taught sexual orientation or gender identity in general:
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