Between the TTC and Contemporary...

[Kingdom WDW]

While wasting time on Google Earth and Live Local, I noticed a huge parcel of land between the TTC and Contemporary. They mentioned it on Lou Mongello's show that they tested to see if steel pliers could be put in there but sunk easily.

Then again I remember reading somewhere that there were going to be hotels like the Venetian and Asian around the Magic Kingdom area and one of them would be in that same spot, and another would be north of Fort Wilderness on Bay Lake.

Anyone know about this? Any rumours? Very curious...

 

[unkadug]

Jim Hill recently did a pretty good article on all these. :wave:

http://jimhillmedia.com/blogs/jim_h...tian-and-persian-resorts-never-get-built.aspx

 

[beachclubbasics]

Wouldn't it be great if they could build those resorts? I would think that the Venetian would be a carbon copy of the Mediterranean resort at TDSea and it would be wonderful if you could stay in authentic Japanese rooms complete with shoji, tatami mats and futon (edit: oops, just realized that it was supposed to be a Thai themed resort).

 

[radiohost]

Well, if it were to be built, there goes the great open view of the Magic Kingdom you have while your riding the monorail

 

[jasondiff]

... steel pliers ...

It's a good thing that steel pliers aren't the only thing needed to support a new hotel.

But seriously though, that is the choicest piece of land remaining for building a hotel. The fact that there's nothing there yet pretty much means they can't put anything there without some technological breakthrough.

 

[Kingdom WDW]

It would be cool if they put some hotel that represented all of the hotels, with an emphasis on a huge pool and a marina, similar to that of the Y&B Club and Grand Floridian, respectively. Guests would park at a lot at the TTC and would be a short walk away from the hotel.

The buildings would all have names like "Biscayne Bayou" and would refer to places like Port Orleans and Caribbean Beach, but on a much grander and luxurious scale.

Diners would be able to watch fireworks from the Falling Water Grille, a restarurant high atop the main building (about the size of the Grand Flo's main building), and kids would love swimming in a huge (think Y&B club size, but bigger and grander) pool.

Just doing some Blue Sky stuff here, don't mind me.

And no, I am not an Imagineer....yet.:brick: :brick: :brick:

 

[maelstrom]

The land set aside for the Venetian is unsuitable to build on, currently. They tried, but the ground gobbled up the test pylons.

The Asian will never be built because the land that was so carefully carved out for it is now inhabited by the Grand Floridian. The Persian won't be built because it's in an odd spot now after how things grew and also because of the current political situation.

I think maybe someday we'll see something built on the Venetian's site, if they can figure out a way to support it, but not necessarily the Venetian.

 

[WDWSEARCHER]

perfect opportunity

As the monorail often does, mine stopped in this area while waiting for the train in front to pull out of the TTC so we could pull in. I got to really look at this area. I do wish they could do something with it. There looks to be the remains of a dirt road running through it. The vegetation is not very attractive. It seems this area would be perfect to attach another hotel to the monorail loop.

 

[marni1971]

The area has been cleared for tests several times - I recall in 1990 it was an empty dirt site for the Meditteranean Resort.

Try a thread search for Venitian or Med resorts; we`ve discussed this indepth a while back.

 

[Master Yoda]

If it was possible to build on that section of land Disney would. It is probably the most valuable piece of undeveloped real estate in all of WDW. The area was surveyed and land was cleared to build a resort but once test piles were driven they discovered that the area suffers from a condition called negative skin friction. This basically causes any type of column that is driven into the ground to be sucked right into the ground. From what I heard the area is so unstable a pile would have to be driven 180' into the ground just to support the planned resort.

 

[marni1971]

From what I heard the area is so unstable a pile would have to be driven 180' into the ground just to support the planned resort.

Even more than that - the last piles I believe went 220ft (the AAs `War Wagon` pile depth) and they sank too.

 

[Master Yoda]

Even more than that - the last piles I believe went 220ft (the AAs `War Wagon` pile depth) and they sank too.

That is just insane. I have seen quite a few engineering anomalies but to think a 220 deep pile would sink under it's own weight just boggles the mind.

 

[jasondiff]

Any idea how deep the piles are for the TTC or the monorail track that runs nearby? They are so close to this area I'd be worried about them too, but it seems in 36 years nothing's happened!

At 220 ft they have to be close to bedrock, I would think. SSE's piles were driven into bedrock, right Martin?

 

[scpergj]

For some reason, I seem to remember (from LONG ago) that this area once had some nice small hills (really mounds, like on a Florida golf course), green grass, and Disney character topiaries...do I really remember that, or am I way off?

Kevin

 

[marni1971]

At 220 ft they have to be close to bedrock, I would think. SSE's piles were driven into bedrock, right Martin?

Off the top of my head SSE went 120ft before hitting rock.

 

[Kingdom WDW]

I believe it may be interesting to point out that Florida is basically floating on the sea. I don't know too much about geology, but Florida is basically swamps and sea. Miami and Sout Beach are basically on sand bars. The water table is so high that that is the reason why the Magic Kingdom is elevated so high.

I bet to make it (the development site) suitable for a building(s), you must elevate the land up, so it would be like the hotel would be a few feet higher than the road by the TTC. Maybe if you layer it with concrete or rocks higher and higher off the ground, you might be able to build a hotel, unless that sinks, too.
Which, come to think of it, would seem really cool if you're driving up to valet your car and you see the hotel logo in bronze and you go up a slight hill, making it similar to a Southern mansion in appearence and charm.

 

[miles1]

For some reason, I seem to remember (from LONG ago) that this area once had some nice small hills (really mounds, like on a Florida golf course), green grass, and Disney character topiaries...do I really remember that, or am I way off?

Kevin

Yes, I remember that too. The topiaries were one of the first "themed" items you saw going to the MK on the monorail. And the monorail spiel used to include comments about how they were created. At my age, the 1970's weren't that LONG ago.

 

[WDWSEARCHER]

Topiaries

I remember those topiaries also. My first trip to WDW was a high school graduation gift from my parents. We stayed at the Contemporary. This was the summer of '74. Boy, I'm old!
As far as the use of this section and the sinking problem. I certainly do not dispute what you all have posted earlier, but, Disney has proven over and over again that logistical problems can be over-come. Remember Walt said,
"It's kinda fun to do the impossible". At any rate, I'm sure the cost would be huge, but, with high attendance, another deluxe resort would pay for itself in no time. I really like the building up idea. You know it would be visually stunning. However, I guess it would steal a little bit of the Contemporary's visual thunder. But, then, so did the addition of the conference center and the addition that's going on, on the other side of it.
Personally I'd love to see another resort accessable by monorail!

 

[marni1971]

However, I guess it would steal a little bit of the Contemporary's visual thunder. But, then, so did the addition of the conference center and the addition that's going on, on the other side of it.
Personally I'd love to see another resort accessable by monorail!

That`s what I though initially, however both designs for the Med resort and the Venitian all had the main guest buildings towards the shoreline, west of the monorail line. The Contemporary would still hold that wonderful position it has when seen from the T&TC.

Personally I'd love to see another resort accessable by monorail!

One Med plan had a monorail station, one did not, and the Venitian was to have been on a diverted track route. 2 out of 3...