Bad Guest Behavior and Disney's reactions to it...

[UberMouse]

I've said this in a couple other threads, but I think it's a long-term disaster in the making.

I agree, and on many levels other than just advertising. Another bad move I believe is with WDW/WDI focusing some of the newer attractions on trendy Disney characters, or themes rather than timeless themes that used to be the norm. Snow White, Peter Pan, POTC, Haunted mansion, etc will always be what they are, and will always be big draws. They just need to watch what they theme a ride after in the future, and make them as future proof as possible. Buzz light year and Stitch seem to be the thing for Disney right now, and you can include the Monster's Inc franchise in that as well, however in 20 years they are just not going to hold up as well as the more classic themed rides and attractions.

-Jeff

 

[Tom]

So how do you propose they fix this?

Disney doesn't. I mean, they could make a trip cost so much that only "rich folk" could go, but then they'd go bankrupt.

The only way to fix this problem is to go back in time 20 years and start letting natural selection work its course by weeding people out of the gene pool that help propagate this problem.

I won't go into all the things that are tearing us down (because this thread would then turn political), but it's a hole that I don't see the US digging itself out of in my lifetime - unless, of course, they pass a law to let me clean the "pool" with my 9mm.

 

[fosse76]

I don't think this really comes down to class. Of course there are always some who just have no respect who will ruin it for everyone but I think the whole problem is just a changing social attitude.

I have met plenty of very affluent people who will do what they want. This is especially true to teenagers who seem to think that if the worst happens, Daddy will sort it out for them.

I honestly believe that the problem comes down to people being more aware of the way parks are run. They know that forcibly removing them from the park is not easy, they know that could try and sue if they are removed and they know full well that even being confronted with a CM or security guard is unlikely (no disrespect to CMs. I just mean your very out-numbered and there is only so much action you can take).

What do they have to fear? I'm sure 20 years ago people were a little less aware of the policies etc and feared the consequences of actions a little more.

I think you hit the nail on the head. With the mantra that "[t]he customer is always right" ingrained in every consumer, I think that Disney is partially to blame for its own problems. Everyone knows Disney (and other businesses as well) will do almost anything to appease an irate guest in the name of customer service. As word spreads, people become more and more complacent about rules, because they know that they "are right." And they expect to either get away with practically anything or be compensated in some way. So while it is a societal problem, it was pretty much brought on by the companies themselves. I think sometimes the consumer needs to be told "no." And if you lose their business, it's unfortunate, but you can't please everyone all of the time.

 

[WDW1974]

People have quite correctly stated that a lack of class/civility/manners isn't a matter of social class/education/money/status.

Boorish behavior crosses all divides, and I agree that there has been a huge upswing of it post-9/11, although I think it was starting to build before that.

And Disney, which is so about many things (say the dude and his standing wheelchair), mostly looks the other way when people act in a way that infringes on the enjoyment of all. It is passed down from TDO, which looks at guests as simply dollar signs and it doesn't want to pi$$ any of those dolllars away. So, sadly, most folks can get away with anything. Destroy property? Check. Use obscene language or physical abuse of your kids? Check. Becoming physical with CMs? Check.

I'm about to head to WDW and the one thing I least look forward to is spending time there with the 'dirty, huddled masses' ... but it COULD be improved.

A written code of conduct and sending folks home (or to the OC lockup in many cases) would certainly make WDW more magical for the many guests who do know how to behave in public. And it would make for a much more magical working experience for the poor CMs.

 

[ligarced]

I think that it is more or less a sign of the times guys. I can remember going to WDW when 20 years ago, I was 12 years old, and my mom was pregnant and didn't really want to leave the room, so my Dad stayed with her and my brother and me went to the parks all by ourselves. My Brother would have been 9 at the time. We rode everything, and as I recall we both behaved as if our parents were with us. I guess it is a quality of how some people are raised now days too. We were raised with a firm hand, and were taught respect. Of course, there are many people my age now that act stupid, and probably are stupid, and mess up everyone's experience. We leave will be at WDW for 8 days starting this Saturday, and it will be the first time there for my father-in-law since he was about 8 years old. So we are hoping to have fun showing him around the park, all while keeping our fingers crossed that some moron does not tick him off and ruin his experience.

-Jeff

I agree with you. Im in my 20s and when I was growing up my parents taught us to respect people. If we were bad we would get a spanking. But after one it never happened again. My parents are hard workers and arent rolling in money. My dad is a meat manager in a food store and my mom works in a grammer school cafeteria. They still got us on vacation and we loved it and looked foward every year to go away. I have 3 kids and we just got back from Disney. They were very well behaved. I think they knew if they weren't good they would spend their vacation in the hotel with 2 angry parents. Of course our 2 yrs old cried at some points. It made us feel good when a few cast members told us how polite our children were. They would always say please and thank you for everything. Now when we are home its totally different, when dad's at work they are bad but when we are out they are extremly good.

We got real mad when we were walking out of fantasyland over by storytime with Belle. Some lady plowed right into our 5 yr old and knocked her down. No sorry she just looked and kept on walking leaving our daughter there crying. My husband was so angry if I wasnt there to keep him calm he would have been banned from Disney. If you knock over a kid you say sorry or see if she is ok. Absolutly no reason for that.

 

[mickeymatt]

I don't know what it is. Everybody has good theories. I think parenting is a lost art. All i know is from my experience. I have stayed at POP. I have stayed at Music during free dining and on our last trip we stayed at POR during free dining and the crowd and atmosphere was by far better at POR than at the values. I don't think I will stay at the values again but that's just me.:shrug:

 

[Phonedave]

So how do you propose they fix this?

I know many that still feel that Disney is the most special/magical vacation that anyone can take, and many of my clients agree.

I'll begin by relating my personal story. I first went to WDW as a young teen with my parents. It was fun, I had a good time, but I had a "been there done that" attitude.

Now fast foward 10 years or so. I am married and my (now ex) wife wants to go to WDW with the kids. I have no great love of Disney. Be it WDW or any other product. I took a look at it, and said "wow, thats pretty expensive for a theme park, but it will be a "special" event so we will go". We went, and I loved it. Not because of the attractions or because of the characters, but because of the attention to detail. Cast Members smiled and said "hi", walkways ways were spotlessly clean, grass was trimmed, paint was fresh, shelves were neatly stocked, etc. It was a special place and it felt like a special place. That attention to detail has been neglected. THAT is what WDW needs back. It's the little things that make it special. I still go because I have come to enjoy the Disney brand, and I also enjoy the memories I have made while there, but quite honestly, the feeling that I am in a special place when I am there is all but gone.

Maybe you play golf. There are some very nice public County courses around here. The courses are well kept, they are perfectly OK to play, and they are quite enjoyable. However, when you go to a private course, and there is a person who cleans your clubs for you, loads your cart and takes your shoes - thats special. When there are nice finishes in the clubhouse and you sit at a wood table and eat off of a china plate, as oppsed to at a formica counter and a paper plate, it feels special. I find myself acting accordingly. I am not rude or boorish on a county course, but I do dress differently. I also tend to play a different level of golf. Of course those extras all cost money, and you pay for it in the higher greens fees.


This is the same thing WDW has done. They have kept their "greens fees" low. Well, lower, it still is not cheap. In doing so they have forsaken a lot of the small but important things that made WDW feel like a special place.

Sure it is going to feel special to people who go there onvacation. It's a family vaction where memories are made. There is a run down cabin on a lake in Canada with no shower and a cast iron stove for heat that is very special to me. Not because of the cabin itself, but because I spent many childhood family vacations there. That does not mean though that somone walking into that cabin would say "wow, this is a special place, let me act accordingly'. Your clients feel that WDW is magical/special because THEY have made it special, not because Disney has made it special.

-dave

 

[worldfanatic]

I have to agree with Phonedave
It's not always a popular opinion, but higher prices really do a good job of keeping out the riff-raff.

 

[talfonso]

Lap bars on IASW - heck, I can endure it, even if it's not going to happen anytime soon! If I have nerves of steel that enables me to muddle through a day filled with chanting turismos (Brazilian tour groups and Argentinean youth herds), I can bear a new annoying boat ride with lap bars!

 

[talfonso]

I think a big part of it is simply stupidity of the guest. We were waiting to get onto POTC ( we were loading from the cave side, they were loading from the opposite) and I witnessed a group of Brazilian women (yes, from a tour group) change seats after the load gates had closed and the ride was in motion, one woman who was seated in the rear of the boat, actually got onto the walkway inside the load gates and ran up to sit closer to the front with the rest of her party ... like I said, while the ride was in motion. When the CM confronted them they just gave him a blank stare and one actually said 'No english.' Then they proceeded to ruin the ride for everyone else by using the strobe on their camera's through the entire ride. However one good note was that security was waiting for them when they disembarked.

Turismos - oh joy... :brick: