Avengers Endgame Spoiler Discussion

[yeti]

Saw it this morning. Despite being spoiled beforehand by our resident Thanos @Captain Obvious , I thoroughly enjoyed it...but with numerous setbacks that hold it back from the same euphoric and brilliant highs of Infinity War. Black Widow's death being one example, a tonally awkward funhouse mirror version of the Soul stone scene from IW that was hamfisted into the "fun and games" part of the story and left people in the theatre scratching their heads instead of crying. On the other hand, I bawled when the departed avengers finally arrived for the royal rumble, so there's that.

Also would've preferred if the Thanos they fought was somehow the present-day one....he was more of a moustache-twirling monologuer than a villain with actual depth like in the last one, which is a shame. Killing off "our" Thanos in the first twenty minutes was bold but ultimately didn't quite pay off IMO.

Overall it's probably in my top ten MCU movies but not top five. It was just a little too all-over-the-place, but still an amazing climax to the Infinity Saga.

 

[Phicinfan]

I think with a $1.2 bil earth shattering take...

They are having a champagne party in Burbank WITH tissue for them all to cry in.

This is the classic blessing/curse. I’m not sure they ever stopped in the last 10 years and realized what they were building and how if they crossed the line they now have crossed - it can never be replicated.

Evans and Downey are going to be missed financially. Big time. They did not want to pay them a ransom for these movies (what I call jack sparrow syndrome)...Downey was paid a reported $50 for this and Hemsworth and Evans got $15...so they are trying the hard reset.

Johansson got $15 for her last movie to come. Larson got $5 and up for a 7 movie deal (2
Down)...and boseman is getting less per picture.

A lot of where endgame came from had to do with the money behind the scenes. So they “culminated” it and squeezed the wine from the grapes.

Hemsworth going to guardians is an attempt to mitigate that - my opinion.

But Disney is a stock ho-ing company these days. They’re not gonna get $2 bil takes from black panther sequels and captain Marvels. And now the fox properties are gonna require a lot of cash for reboots.

I would think “bettersweet” might be the best word of the weekend.

While I don't totally disagree, I want to wait and see what the new properties they are going to add will bring. Eternals will be a great thermostat for if they can keep introducing new and bringing in the $$$$. I also want to see what happens with Dr. Strange 2 and Black Panther 2. I personally don't think you will get a good read with Far from home, as it will still have the Endgame halo around it, and has been announced as the end of Phase 3.

So really looking forward to Eternals and seeing how they tie it in, and....is it pre-IW - so Thanos is there...

 

[Phicinfan]

I have to agree with @Sirwalterraleigh again, the whole ending was just beautiful - yeah don't get too excited...this won't happen often

but first I loved the Irony(yes spelled with irony ) that Thanos loses by being dusted - his whole mission in life, and that it was Tony and that line... "I am Iron Man" that made it perfect.

I also KNEW what was going to happen to Cap, as soon as he saw Peggy Carter while back in time, you could almost see the wheels turning in his head. The death of Tony I think sealed it for him. The fact he left with the stones, with no help.... AND the Hammer locked it for me.

I will add of all of them, Bucky knew as well, as he said specifically I will miss you. He knew Cap was moving on. How they handled it, with him sitting there, and Bucky looking and finding him, also was perfect.

AS for Sam being Capt. America....I see it, I get it, and alot of you made great points. But I just don't see Cap being the draw with Sam as Cap. So someone is going to have to step up and be that glue. Spiderman can't, nor can Panther. I also don't think Marvel can either. Maybe Dr. Strange, but not sure he will be used in Avengers again. then again, I am not sure there WILL be another Avengers.

Deep down, I would love to see Dr. Strange, Hulk, Valkyrie and other start the defenders....but that may also have sailed.

but yes, this was the perfect ending, and I am not sure they can repeat that again.

 

[Mike S]

It seems obvious now, but Doctor Strange giving up the Time Stone to save Tony was not just in a butterfly effect kind of way... he was always going to be the one to end it.

Seeing it the second time, Tony's death hit me a lot more. Knowing what was going to happen (and it not being 1 AM by the end of the movie), I picked up on the foreshadowing much better. As soon as Strange said, "If I tell you what happens, it won't happen", you can tell Tony already sort of knows by that point. Then when Strange holds up his one finger...

 

[LSLS]

In all this praise has anyone here given a shoutout to Rocket yet? Or how great Nebula was?

I was actually thinking Scarlet Witch. I LOVED how she pretty much destroyed Thanos. I'm WAY more interested in her in the future than I was going to be.

Also, wen't back and read the controversy of "Heil Hydra." I LOVE that is in there now (not that I didn't like it before knowing the backstory). Going again this week, super excited.

 

[Hakunamatata]

This may have already been covered but in the Tony Stark memorial scene wherebthey are panning back to ultimately Marvel and Nick Fury, there is one teenage boy standing by himself. I did not recognize him. My first thought its the kid from Iron Man 3 and he is being set up to take over the Iron Man Mantle?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

While I don't totally disagree, I want to wait and see what the new properties they are going to add will bring. Eternals will be a great thermostat for if they can keep introducing new and bringing in the $$$$. I also want to see what happens with Dr. Strange 2 and Black Panther 2. I personally don't think you will get a good read with Far from home, as it will still have the Endgame halo around it, and has been announced as the end of Phase 3.

So really looking forward to Eternals and seeing how they tie it in, and....is it pre-IW - so Thanos is there...

I’m in near complete agreement with your prognosis.

The reality is that the grosses of black panther, captain marvel, homecoming continued to grow because the original avengers existed. Their presence and crossovers pulled all the new avenues along with them.

Now that’s done...so it leaves a lack of basis/Depth

And Disney knows it...why else force the captain marvel character that had very little to do with the story into endgame?

It because they need the crossover for the box office.

But it will take 2 years or so to sort it out.

The MCU is a fantastic success if they never make another movie - to be honest. The greatest franchise ever put to film in a cynical, modern time.

And many know it pains me to call the reality that another franchise can never beat this...it’s impossible now.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

This may have already been covered but in the Tony Stark memorial scene wherebthey are panning back to ultimately Marvel and Nick Fury, there is one teenage boy standing by himself. I did not recognize him. My first thought its the kid from Iron Man 3 and he is being set up to take over the Iron Man Mantle?

Yep...that was him and that’s where they are a heading.

Nick fury is in Spider-Man...so he will continue to be “glue”

 

[Hakunamatata]

Yep...that was him and that’s where they are a heading.

Nick fury is in Spider-Man...so he will continue to be “glue”

Dang it feels good to be right. Lol.

 

[Mike S]

I was actually thinking Scarlet Witch. I LOVED how she pretty much destroyed Thanos. I'm WAY more interested in her in the future than I was going to be.

Also, wen't back and read the controversy of "Heil Hydra." I LOVE that is in there now (not that I didn't like it before knowing the backstory). Going again this week, super excited.

Scarlet Witch was so freaking satisfying to watch. So much emotion in that scene behind her power. As an unfair comparison, Captain Marvel’s fight with Thanos seemed like it was there just to show her power.

 

[Mike S]

Yep...that was him and that’s where they are a heading.

Nick fury is in Spider-Man...so he will continue to be “glue”

Really? He’s going to be Iron Man? That could be pretty cool.

 

[mf1972]

In all this praise has anyone here given a shoutout to Rocket yet? Or how great Nebula was?

i was joking with my wife on who’s the real unsung hero in this movie. the rat that feeed lang from the quantum realm. if lang didn’t break free from there, the entire time travel plan never would never have been a reality. that poor rat isn’t getting enough credit

 

[LSLS]

Scarlet Witch was so freaking satisfying to watch. So much emotion in that scene behind her power. As an unfair comparison, Captain Marvel’s fight with Thanos seemed like it was there just to show her power.

Yeah it did. But again, I wasn't super upset by her like others. She could have been done better, but getting upset at a character who was on screen like 3 minutes in a 3 hour movie? I'll live. I thought her being offscreen made sense in my eyes as well in the scheme of things. Think I said it before, but her returning after seeing the dusted people on another planet randomly returning makes total sense to me.

I like they kept her off to the side to let the originals get their finale. And looking back at Infinity Wars, I love how they dusted all the newer characters who are moving on to phase 4 even more.

My largest interest in the second showing (which will officially be tomorrow now) is to see what I think of the first half of the movie. I think I was so ready for epicness, I didn't fully appreciate the start. Knowing where it goes, I'm curious if it still feels slower. That is really the only reason I'm not sure I put it over Infinity Wars. We will see. I know I'm STOKED to be going with a work friend who has yet to see it yet just to get his reactions.

 

[DisneyJayL]

You also notice the theme from First Avenger starts up when Sam raises the shield.

And yes, @DisneyJayL, he is Captain America now.

Well, the show is Falcon and the Winter Soldier so, I’m not so sure.

 

[Mike S]

Yeah it did. But again, I wasn't super upset by her like others. She could have been done better, but getting upset at a character who was on screen like 3 minutes in a 3 hour movie? I'll live. I thought her being offscreen made sense in my eyes as well in the scheme of things. Think I said it before, but her returning after seeing the dusted people on another planet randomly returning makes total sense to me.

I like they kept her off to the side to let the originals get their finale. And looking back at Infinity Wars, I love how they dusted all the newer characters who are moving on to phase 4 even more.

My largest interest in the second showing (which will officially be tomorrow now) is to see what I think of the first half of the movie. I think I was so ready for epicness, I didn't fully appreciate the start. Knowing where it goes, I'm curious if it still feels slower. That is really the only reason I'm not sure I put it over Infinity Wars. We will see. I know I'm STOKED to be going with a work friend who has yet to see it yet just to get his reactions.

For me I wanted to see character development from her. It could’ve been done while still giving everyone their proper sendoff. Her appearance in this movie was really hyped up and then... nothing.

 

[LSLS]

For me I wanted to see character development from her. It could’ve been done while still giving everyone their proper sendoff. Her appearance in this movie was really hyped up and then... nothing.

Yeah dont disagree, but I'm not even upset about it as long as they continue on with her development in the next phase.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

I half expected Bucky and Cap to kiss at the end.

EDIT: not surprisingly, multiple internet articles have already been written on the subject

 

[Animaniac93-98]

I've seen complaints online about Cap going back in time to be with Peggy Carter and not doing anything to stop Hydra's takeover of S.H.I.E.L.D. or them torturing Bucky. I wasn't thinking about that in the moment of watching the movie, but it is an unanswered question. One would hope someone like Steve Rogers would not sit back and let that happen, despite the consequences of affecting the future.

We've also know for some time that Falcon would become the next Captain America, but IMO it would have been more satisfying to pass the mantle to Bucky as both a recognition of their friendship and because he's the stronger of the two (I think? Superpower wise?).

 

[Tony Perkis]

I have seen A4 twice now, and this is the order of the MCU for me at this point.

1) Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2



2) Thor: Ragnarok
3) Guardians of the Galaxy
4) Ant-Man and the Wasp
5) Avengers: Endgame
6) Captain America: The Winter Soldier
7) Iron Man
8) Avengers: Infinity War
9) Spider-Man: Homecoming
10) Captain America: The First Avenger
11) Iron Man 3
12) Captain America: Civil War
13) Ant-Man
14) The Avengers
15) Black Panther
16) Doctor Strange
17) Thor
18) Avengers: Age of Ultron
19) Iron Man 2
20) The Incredible Hulk
21) Captain Marvel
22) Thor: The Dark World

 

[erasure fan1]

I've seen complaints online about Cap going back in time to be with Peggy Carter and not doing anything to stop Hydra's takeover of S.H.I.E.L.D. or them torturing Bucky. I wasn't thinking about that in the moment of watching the movie, but it is an unanswered question. One would hope someone like Steve Rogers would not sit back and let that happen, despite the consequences of affecting the future.

They made it pretty clear that you can't change the future by what you do in the past. At least that's how I took it.