could be....im not sure
i thought i read on one of the pamphlets form D23 there would be caves
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AVATAR land coming to Disney's Animal Kingdom
- Thread starter DocMcHulk
- Start date
i thought i read on one of the pamphlets form D23 there would be caves
danlb_2000
Premium Member
Yes, they will promote it, the question is will that promotion be enough to convince people to go I large quantities, or will it take word of mouth from people who actually went.
if the land looks like the model the people will show up in droves
Just my opinion of course
WildcatDen
Well-Known Member
Good luck with that. Why not just invent your own Kobayashi Maru test involving Pandora and the underdog/sleeper label?
flyerjab
Well-Known Member
Agreed.
They can spend a zillion dollars promoting this expansion but in my opinion, the best way to sell it is when people are lining up to get in the park and they actually see the floating mountains looming over the tree line. Social media will also help. I don't have much faith in Disney's marketing team.
Kamikaze
Well-Known Member
No, the question will be will people actually care. Are there people that liked Avatar that much to go on vacation just to see it?
The promotion will be there. The people will not.
I don't need any tests, no-win or not. Its simple: The way they are using the terms don't fit the definition of those words when applied to the facts of the build. Period.
DisneyRoy
Well-Known Member
At first. Like stated above, I think the social media and word of mouth will help it travel. I agree in the beginning it take some time for people to understand all the work and dedication going into this land. Once it is experienced...I think it will shatter expectations.
Kamikaze
Well-Known Member
First - the general public does not care about the 'work and dedication going into this land'. They don't, they won't, and its completely inconsequential in the end.
I completely agree with you that the LAND itself will be stunning. I don't think the rides will hold up their end, because the source material for those attractions is bad. But the theming will be spectacular.
Does theming make people go on vacation? Not in droves.
Social post: (Picture) Pandora looks amazing!!! #WDW #PANDORA
Comment: How were the rides?????! (smiley smiley smiley)
Reply: They were OK.
That won't put butts in the seats. The rides need to deliver to make it truly successful, regardless of how amazing some floating mountains are. I believe they will not.
flyerjab
Well-Known Member
I believe that you are absolutely incorrect. I believe that the land and the rides/attractions are going to be incredible. Hence why I said what I said. But since you are such a stickler for terminology, I will simplify my stance to state that I think that this expansion will surprise the general sentiment of many people. I don't have facts to back me up on this, just something that I choose to believe. I suppose I choose to believe it since Cameron is heavily involved with this project. Additionally, I fully enjoy most of what Joe Rohde has put into DAK.
And no, I am not a huge fan of the movie. Having said that, the movie does not need to be a success for rides/attractions to be an success.
Kamikaze
Well-Known Member
The movie WAS a success. But its not something like Potter or Star Wars where there are legions of royal fans. It just doesn't live in that same 'air' as those franchises. Thats the problem.
Next Big Thing
Well-Known Member
They were perioscoping so i'm not sure there actually is more.
djkidkaz
Well-Known Member
If people don't show up to Avatar it could force their hand into another project for AK. I think with all the other new stuff coming though it's going to be hard for it to fail. Even if Avatar doesn't interest you, the night safaris or ROL most likely would. Not to mention a new Soarin and Frozen.
oh i agree with this..i also think its just starting with three new movies coming out who knows where it will go...i dont think James Cameron will let it fail, no chance, the most watched movie in the 21st century is bound for success for the sequel
also, we need to remember what DAK is about
its about environments which puts you into the story...Joe Rohde has said several times DAK is a first person park this is not about you riding a ride and getting retold the story, its your personal experience
this is indeed the direction Pandora is going
nothing from the movie will be retold so even if you didnt like the movie thats ok its about the setting and your experience
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Incomudro
Well-Known Member
I can't imagine moving images of Pandora when it is fully fleshed out will not entice people to go.
Incomudro
Well-Known Member
Disney's appeal is at least as much theming as it is the rides.
Even though everyone talks about the rides - and the rides are the "goal" it's the entire immersion that makes Disney - Disney.
Additionally, you claim the rides will not hold up their end?
Based on what?
They're not even completed yet.
yeah i agree
the idea that the ride quality is based on quality of IP is flimsy at best...too many examples prove this ie TOT splash mtn
ill will wait and judge the rides when they open
BrianLo
Well-Known Member
History has again and again demonstrated that the quality of source material has very little correlation on the quality of theme park product. They are independent from one another.
A quality source material usually gets people to show up on day one. A quality product gets people to actually continue to visit or spread good word of mouth back home. The same applies to movies where a big opening is great, but a movie with 'legs' through word of mouth is even better.
-Potter is the rare mix of both, the source material and the product are both grade A. It brought people in droves and it continues to do so.
-New Fantasyland had some great source material but a middling product. People showed up, but no one is exactly continuing to book vacations for New Fantasyland specifically.
-Cars is arguably not the greatest source material, but the product was so good that word of mouth spread and people who probably have little affection for the movie specifically booked vacations to see Radiator Springs.
-Then you have weak source material and a terrible product... those usually don't last long. I'm looking towards Fast and the Furious if the current rumours hold true.
-Tokyo remains a good demonstration of how the *same* source material can produce an excellent product, while in other parts of the world they've achieved the opposite. Winnie the Pooh and the upcoming Scandinavia port are two shining examples of this.
That's all a very long way of saying I don't think any of us can determine the quality of the rides based solely off source material. Although people would like to believe otherwise; to somehow support their internal narrative that Pandora was the greatest mistake in the history of WDW... (spoiler: it is clearly not going to be)
I personally do not think Pandora is going to move the resort wide needle in a meaningful way compared to say Potter and Star Wars. I do think it has the potential to gain a lot of good word of mouth and most importantly shift the multi-day pass-holder crowds around. The park will retain way more guests into its new nighttime hours and if it really does an effective job, attract more than one day worth of park-hopping. Guest satisfaction with the park will sky-rocket and it should at least provide the one resort-wide respite from the over-packed MK, in construction shambles DHS and the woefully outdated Epcot.
That will all happen if the product is good enough... which again I think we now know has nothing to do with whether or not anyone has affection for the source material.
I remain perplexed by the number of people who think that the "source material" (Avatar, the movie) will have any significant bearing on how the public responds to the land. Although the source material of Harry Potter had a big influence on the initial popularity of the land, that, is, by far, the outlier exception. And, moreover, its long-term popularity does not depend on harry potter fans (nor could it be sustainable on that alone). To the contrary, I suspect the vast majority of visitors to Universal are not hardcore fans (as I am not), but rather people that instantly appreciated its themeing and immersive experience (regardless of whether the Leaky Cauldron looked like the movie/books or the bank and goblins were consistent with source material -- I had NO idea regarding their meaning and authenticity, other than it looked very cool and magical), and the two rides were great, although not plentiful. Carsland was a smash at DCA because of the immersive themeing and one great ride -- not because the movie was an enduring Pixar classic or because the vast majority of the people who are attracted to it are going because they are fanatics of the Cars movie and saw the fidelity between the theme park sets and movie.
Setting aside that Avatar was actually the biggest grossing movie in the history of cinema (in non-inflation-adjusted dollars
), and thus does have a large built-in audience of people who "loved" Pandora and the ecological theme of it (people may forget about the news stories of fans who were "depressed" after the movie and longed to go see Pandora -- I'm not kidding), I am very confident it will be incredibly popular for the same reasons as Harry Potter and Carsland: immersive themeing coupled with cool rides (or even a single cool ride - cf. Carsland and Harry Potter) are what counts. There can be no doubt that seeing floating mountains, waterfalls, rainforests, and not mention the bioluminescent coolness at night, will more-than-fit-the bill (assuming it is captured in the way we see from concept drawings and construction so far). And unless the rides completely wet the bed (pardon my french), then there is no reason to think they won't be sufficiently interesting to make it a big hit. Although I have no idea about the actual ride or the rumored Vekoma ride system, I am quite confident that with Cameron at the helm, the visual effects, the projection system, and the sound will be absolute top of the line. I'm sure the motion system will be great, and given that little ol' Soarin' still wows them and packs them in at Epcot (with none of the above), I can't imagine that most of the general public won't be blown away by a next generation Saorin' model, if that indeed is all it is (and I suspect it is not). The boat ride will just be gravy.
I predict this will move the theme park needle.
/end rant.
Setting aside that Avatar was actually the biggest grossing movie in the history of cinema (in non-inflation-adjusted dollars
), and thus does have a large built-in audience of people who "loved" Pandora and the ecological theme of it (people may forget about the news stories of fans who were "depressed" after the movie and longed to go see Pandora -- I'm not kidding), I am very confident it will be incredibly popular for the same reasons as Harry Potter and Carsland: immersive themeing coupled with cool rides (or even a single cool ride - cf. Carsland and Harry Potter) are what counts. There can be no doubt that seeing floating mountains, waterfalls, rainforests, and not mention the bioluminescent coolness at night, will more-than-fit-the bill (assuming it is captured in the way we see from concept drawings and construction so far). And unless the rides completely wet the bed (pardon my french), then there is no reason to think they won't be sufficiently interesting to make it a big hit. Although I have no idea about the actual ride or the rumored Vekoma ride system, I am quite confident that with Cameron at the helm, the visual effects, the projection system, and the sound will be absolute top of the line. I'm sure the motion system will be great, and given that little ol' Soarin' still wows them and packs them in at Epcot (with none of the above), I can't imagine that most of the general public won't be blown away by a next generation Saorin' model, if that indeed is all it is (and I suspect it is not). The boat ride will just be gravy.I predict this will move the theme park needle.
/end rant.
PorterRedkey
Well-Known Member
I think that resort-wide is the key point. Maybe, visitors that would have skipped AK, will now spend a full day there. This MAY add a day to their visit, however, with the state DHS is in, they may just substitute AK for a day they normally would have spent in the DHS (or DCS Disney Construction Studios).
As for the first part of your post, I couldn't have said it better myself. Great post!