News Avatar Experience coming to Disneyland

[mickEblu]

I’m all for this. I’ve given up on thematic integrity at DCA; let’s just bolster the park’s attraction roster. Avatar > Marvel.

Obviously it shouldn’t go into Disneyland, but I’m not worried; I can’t imagine where they’d find the real estate (especially if, as suggested, this will add capacity).

The fact that Iger said “version of) Pandora and that we’re not losing an attraction for it disqualifies Disneyland IMO. No room for a land anywhere in DL without losing anything.

 

[mickEblu]

Unless of course Iger meant not losing attractions/ capacity loosely and they shrink down Autopia and put an Avatar ride where motorboat and part of Autopia is. Would that even be enough room? I hope not.

 

[Californian Elitist]

If nothing is truly going to be torn down for this project, then I assume it won’t be an actual land with a ride or two, but instead and maybe just a walk-through or a statue of one of the Na’vi to look at. I can’t think of any potential free space that would be spacious enough for something on a big scale.

 

[pandoraexotica]

Considering the lush rainforest environment at DAK's Pandora would be quite challenging to pull off in SoCal & Disney might want to keep it unique to DAK, I think they may take a different approach. As a HUGE Pandora fan, my hope is that they finally bulldoze over Autopia and Launch Bay and incorporate the Sub Lagoon to construct a mini-land built around the Metkaiyina village featured prominently in Way of Water & future sequels. The tropical beach/mangrove/coral reef environment would be unique, easier to maintain in SoCal, would blend in nicely with the vibrant sub lagoon and ties directly into the future of Avatar films. You know Disney loves that SYNERGY! Does anyone know just how much capacity per footage something sprawling like Autopia affords Disneyland? I would think the juice is hardly worth the squeeze but what do I know?
James Cameron has also mentioned recently he has had conversations with Imagineering about updating Flight of Passage to incorporate new environments from the upcoming films. I can only imagine Disney is quite frustrated with having the one theme park representation of the spectacularly bioluminescent world of Pandora existing solely in a park that regularly closes at or before sundown. They're leaving a lot of money and capacity(!) on the table. They have the potential to make something really unique and spectacular here at Disneyland. I hope they take it!

However, my biggest question is: What is Pandora without Joe Rohde?
Unless...

 

[MagicHappens1971]

If nothing is truly going to be torn down for this project, then I assume it won’t be an actual land with a ride or two, but instead and maybe just a walk-through or a statue of one of the Na’vi to look at. I can’t think of any potential free space that would be spacious enough for something on a big scale.

I personally think this will be a purpose built attraction that will be cloned at DAK. Maybe not something on the scale of FoP or Navi River but something that fits a happy medium

 

[BrianLo]

The way he said that so matter-of-factly really caught me off guard. He seems to think that Pandora was successful because of it being based on Avatar, while the general consensus seems to be that it was successful in spite of its source material.

Pandora at DAK was a success for many reasons, almost none of which have anything to do with Avatar itself:

• It added a new headliner attraction to the resort (with thrills mild enough to still be accessible to the overwhelming majority of Disney's core demographics), at a park that was heavy on C- and D-ticket experiences (by WDW standards, at least) but lacked the variety of E-tickets that can be found at other parks
• It added a significant amount of indoor space (and time-consuming indoor space) in a park that is almost entirely outdoors. With Orlando's brutal summers and frequent rainstorms, the park simply needed space for guests to shelter from the elements, and Pandora provides that better than the rest of the park
• Although Navi River Journey is strained by its low capacity (and FOP's low capacity next door) and is a couple minutes too short, it's a return to the classic dark ride style that really set Disney parks apart from the competition; it fits right in alongside Pirates and the old Future World attractions
• It focused on a moody, atmospheric, experiential placemaking and attractions, rather than a linear story-driven approach. (With the exception of the awful FOP preshows) this makes it approachable to everybody, whether they actually saw the movie or not, and creates a more repeatable experience where the guest can connect the dots themselves rather than being spoonfed a set narrative
• It looks great in easily-marketable photos, but is actually even more impressive in person. Unlike so many recent additions, it wasn't designed to only look great from one angle, but rather works on many levels as you move around and explore the space
• In conjunction with a new nighttime spectacular and new parkwide evening entertainment (nearly all of which has since been removed), new signature dining restaurant, and overhauled safari, it finally gave guests a reason to stay in the park after 3pm

In many way, Avatar is the opposite of a typical Marvel movie: it has great placemaking and world building, but largely forgettable characters. This makes it an especially good source material for a theme park addition, but also one that most people just don’t have a lot of affinity for. Even among the various online fandoms, Avatar just doesn’t seem to have many diehard fans.

The Avatar addition to DAK wasn't popular simply because it was Avatar; it wasn't even because it was a new land that was designed in response to the park’s other weaknesses. It drove massive attendance growth because it filled key voids in the park's roster, while meshing seamlessly with the park's style and philosophy against all odds. While DLR is often better than WDW at tapping into the popular zeitgeist, I'm not sure how Iger thinks that an Avatar addition will help the resort any (particularly since, despite its box office successes, Avatar isn’t really a “hot” property); DLR's needs are different from what Pandora provided to WDW, and regardless, almost none of that had to do with Avatar itself

I very much agree and disagree with you. Pandora was incredibly well received obviously because it was well done. But I think the in-spite aspect comes from an old belief that we've more recently debunked. The belief that somehow Avatar was a one and done property.

I'd argue now more than ever Avatar is a good property that clearly has broad appeal, it simply lacked an adequate steward. Fox itself did almost nothing with it, ironically it was Iger himself that did. Iger alluded in the interview how good the Disney company is at being a steward (or cynically 'milking') their IP.

Like all things though it always matters what they do with the property over the property itself, of course. I just firmly believe Avatar is not the dead on arrival thing it has been made out to be since 2010.

 

[BasiltheBatLord]

@marni1971 would you be able to comment here? Where is this going and how big is it?

 

[Consumer]

I very much agree and disagree with you. Pandora was incredibly well received obviously because it was well done. But I think the in-spite aspect comes from an old belief that we've more recently debunked. The belief that somehow Avatar was a one and done property.

Agreed. Avatar and its sequel are solid movies with overall good morals (except for the whole "reject your humanity and turn your back on your people" message, but that's corrected in the second installment). My only issue with Avatar in Disneyland is it is not a piece of Americana in the way of classic Disney, Star Wars, Indiana Jones, Twilight Zone, or other IP that have been found in the parks.

 

[BrianLo]

I am all over the map with this is. Very much my reaction was Star Wars Launch Bay at best. But then if he lead with the comments on the parks and expansion later, I'd conclude it's a land, but somewhat different than Animal Kingdom.

I still don't even know if we can conclude what park its in based on Bob's vagaries. I was hoping for a Disney blog post today, but Bob has a history of announcing Avatar projects before Imagineering is even aware of the homework assignment.

This definitely needs to go into DCA, be a Disneyland forward project, or be an entirely different locale to actually fit in DL. The scale is way too large to be anywhere near Tomorrowland.

 

[BasiltheBatLord]

Just found this post over in the DLP forum from Martin:

Worse, it might just be the boat ride. Or a few FoP VR glasses in a booth.

EDIT: After reading more closely, I think he's talking specifically about DLP here. Sorry if this is a false alarm.

 

[MagicHappens1971]

I am all over the map with this is. Very much my reaction was Star Wars Launch Bay at best. But then if he lead with the comments on the parks and expansion later, I'd conclude it's a land, but somewhat different than Animal Kingdom.

I still don't even know if we can conclude what park its in based on Bob's vagaries. I was hoping for a Disney blog post today, but Bob has a history of announcing Avatar projects before Imagineering is even aware of the homework assignment.

This definitely needs to go into DCA, be a Disneyland forward project, or be an entirely different locale to actually fit in DL. The scale is way too large to be anywhere near Tomorrowland.

A few weeks ago rumors from some insiders said that imagineering was allegedly asked to develop “something big” weeks ago but we obviously don’t know what that means

 

[Californian Elitist]

I personally think this will be a purpose built attraction that will be cloned at DAK. Maybe not something on the scale of FoP or Navi River but something that fits a happy medium

What do you think something like that could look like?

 

[MagicHappens1971]

What do you think something like that could look like?

I would imagine either a pretty detailed walk through attraction with creatures, flora and fauna from the Avatar universe, or maybe instead of a boat ride an Omnimover dark ride. I think there’s a lot of options here

 

[mickEblu]

Just found this post over in the DLP forum from Martin:

I’d be good with a plussed up NRJ boat ride for DCA. Add a drop and some more AAs and we’re in business. I can’t think of a better IP for a boat ride off the top of my head. I’d rather have Avatar than Moana. It will feel more real and other worldly. And I always thought if they ever make a Coco ride it should be suspended and not a boat ride.

NRJ and a version of Pandora for the Hollywood Backlot/ Eastern Gateway expansion area confirmed.

 

[Consumer]

I’d be good with a plussed up NRJ boat ride for DCA. Add a drop and some more AAs and we’re in business. I can’t think of a better IP for a boat ride off the top of my head. I’d rather have Avatar than Moana. It will feel more real and other worldly. And I always thought if they ever make a Coco ride it should be suspended and not a boat ride.

NRJ and version of Pandora for the Hollywood Backlot/ Eastern Gateway expansion area confirmed.

The eastern half of the park could certainly use a water attraction, but I'll echo your thoughts that if we're getting NRJ it better be significantly superior to the attraction at DAK. More diverse scenery, more animatronics, more action. If this takes the place of the Carousel Theater, I would not take offense, so long as the architecture of the show building is good. Frankly, building a new ride on that plot and connecting whatever is erected to the Space Mountain complex would be ideal in helping unify Tomorrowland.

 

[mickEblu]

Avatar boat ride, suspended Coco ride, Avengers ride and an indoor coaster and DCA is solid.

 

[MagicHappens1971]

The eastern half of the park could certainly use a water attraction, but I'll echo your thoughts that if we're getting NRJ it better be significantly superior to the attraction at DAK. More diverse scenery, more animatronics, more action. If this takes the place of the Carousel Theater, I would not take offense, so long as the architecture of the show building is good. Frankly, building a new ride on that plot and connecting whatever is erected to the Space Mountain complex would be ideal in helping unify Tomorrowland.

Pandora has no place in Tomorrowland. Or Disneyland Park IMO

 

[BrianLo]

A few weeks ago rumors from some insiders said that imagineering was allegedly asked to develop “something big” weeks ago but we obviously don’t know what that means

Yes, I guess the aspect I have to acknowledge is that whatever it is, it's literally just been breathed into existence. Certainly was not a Chapek move and almost certainly Iger made a call in January when he started to see the WoW numbers.

His use of the word 'experience' may simply be, "I threw a bunch of theoretical future money at imagineering and told them Disneyland Resort needs to add this IP".

I really, really like retiree's Bob sudden come-to-Jesus that price hikes and cramming more people in is not growth. Investing in expansion is. Whether the company lives by that mantra we pretty much can see play out by D23 2024.

 

[mickEblu]

The eastern half of the park could certainly use a water attraction, but I'll echo your thoughts that if we're getting NRJ it better be significantly superior to the attraction at DAK. More diverse scenery, more animatronics, more action. If this takes the place of the Carousel Theater, I would not take offense, so long as the architecture of the show building is good. Frankly, building a new ride on that plot and connecting whatever is erected to the Space Mountain complex would be ideal in helping unify Tomorrowland.

Tomorrowland wouldn’t be my first choice but if it was only taking the place of the carrousel theatre/ Pizza Planet I wouldn’t be upset. Not sure how ambitious something in that space could be though.

 

[BrianLo]

I just want to point out Josh's quote from his letter to Parks and Resorts division

"Yesterday’s announcement of an Avatar experience coming to the Disneyland Resort is just one example of this."

I think we can safely wind Bob's Disneyland comment as a nothing comment. To me that means they either don't know where it's going yet (likely) or it's DCA.

But again the use of Experience I don't love. Either it's a we don't know what it is fully yet... or it's nothing special. Or I guess it could be in flux between a land and an attraction still. Experience under-promises.