As older attractions are retired.....

[wizards8507]

You just hit the nail on the head as to why I consider Disneyland FAR superior to the Magic Kingdom. Other than sadly missing Country Bear Jamboree and Mickey's Philharmagic, and having a still-unused People Mover track, it's Practically Perfect In Every Way. The number of Classics found at Disneyland missing from the MK and not found in any of the other WDW parks is mind-blowing. (approximately 20!) Six alone just in Fantasyland!

Point well taken, but the Magic Kingdom vs. Disneyland argument isn't meant to happen. Disneyland is the highlight of a three- or four-night vacation. The Magic Kingdom is one piece of a seven- to fourteen-night vacation as part of an all-inclusive resort. Disneyland has to be better because it essentially stands alone.

 

[David S.]

I guess it depends on what you consider an attraction also. If the basis of an attraction is that it attracts people to the park, I'm not sure I would count the penny arcade, any type of boat, or toon town houses. These are things to do when people are in the parks and add to the experience, but likely do not have influence over whether someone comes to the park or not.

Maybe toon town as a whole area could be counted as an attraction. And if you are going to count something unique to DL that has not yet been removed from WDW, than why not include 7 Dwarves and Little Mermaid? In my opinion, I have DL at about plus 5 on the attractions. I think the difference is often overstated.

Well, for me the Toontown components are attractions but I do acknowledge I may be in the minority, at least online.

I thought about listing the upcoming MK Mermaid ride and the upcoming Dwarf coaster but didn't for the following reasons:

* They haven't opened yet

* DCA is getting the Mermaid ride, so it wouldn't be fair to list that as "MK Exclusive" for the same reasons I didn't list Star Tours and Eo/HISTA as being unique to DL - they are in other WDW parks.

* Listing the Dwarf coaster would distinguish it as different from the Snow White dark ride. Therefore, listing the Dwarf coaster as a MK exclusive compared to DL would necessitate listing the traditional Snow White dark ride as a DL-exclusive, which I also left off of their list. Essentially, the two will cancel each other out in the totals, just like Tiki Room/New Management and Swiss Family Treehouse/Tarzan's Treehouse, which I also didn't list as being "unique" for either park.

 

[David S.]

Point well taken, but the Magic Kingdom vs. Disneyland argument isn't meant to happen. Disneyland is the highlight of a three- or four-night vacation. The Magic Kingdom is one piece of a seven- to fourteen-night vacation as part of an all-inclusive resort. Disneyland has to be better because it essentially stands alone.

Maybe so, but I wasn't really going by how long people stay there. I was just comparing the Artistic merits of each park as "which one is the better Magic-Kingdom style "Castle Park"? And regardless as to the whys and wherefores of WHY DL has the better lineup, I was expressing my opinion that it DOES have the better lineup, and is therefore a much more appealing "Magic Kingdom-style Castle Park" for my taste.

 

[Crazy Harry]

Well, for me the Toontown components are attractions but I do acknowledge I may be in the minority, at least online.

I thought about listing the upcoming Mermaid ride and the upcoming Dwarf coaster but didn't for the following reasons:

* They haven't opened yet

* DCA is getting the Mermaid ride, so it wouldn't be fair to list that as "MK Exclusive" for the same reasons I didn't list Star Tours and Eo/HISTA as being unique to DL - they are in other WDW parks.

* Listing the Dwarf coaster would distinguish it as different from the Snow White dark ride. Therefore, listing the Dwarf coaster as a MK exclusive compared to DL would necessitate listing the traditional Snow White dark ride as a DL-exclusive, which I also left of of their list. Essentially, the two will concel each other out in the totals, just like Tiki Room/New Management and Swiss Family Treehouse/Tarzan's Treehouse, which I also didn't list for either park.

But if the purpose of the discussion is to point out the different attractions between the two MK parks, then shouldn't we leave the other parks out of the discussion. If Little Mermaid is not valid because it will be at California Adventure (although I do understand why you did it that way), then shouldn't all of the other attractions at the other parks be valid for discussion?

I know it may seem like I am picking at small points, but I also think it will focus the discussion more. Otherwise, I can say Everest cancels Matterhorn and Finding Nemo at Epcot cancels the sub ride, then someone will say that's not fair because WDW has more parks then someone else points out that's a reason DL MK has more attractions because the resort includes less space to work with. Now its a discussion about the two resorts and not singling out the individual parks.

 

[David S.]

But if the purpose of the discussion is to point out the different attractions between the two MK parks, then shouldn't we leave the other parks out of the discussion. If Little Mermaid is not valid because it will be at California Adventure (although I do understand why you did it that way), then shouldn't all of the other attractions at the other parks be valid for discussion?

I know it may seem like I am picking at small points, but I also think it will focus the discussion more. Otherwise, I can say Everest cancels Matterhorn and Finding Nemo at Epcot cancels the sub ride, then someone will say that's not fair because WDW has more parks then someone else points out that's a reason DL MK has more attractions because the resort includes less space to work with. Now its a discussion about the two resorts and not singling out the individual parks.

Point taken about how a discussion comparing just the "Castle Parks" should not include the other parks. You can count the Mermaid ride for MK regardless of whether it will be at DCA. But then, by that same logic, Star Tours and Eo and the Monorail would have to count for Disneyland even though they are found at other WDW parks, which would make the number gap of "attractions found at DL but not at MK" even larger. When I first made the list and left those off of Disneyland's count, it was to be as "fair" as possible to MK and also because I figured someone would object to including things in Disneyland's "exclusive" count that WDW had in other parks.

 

[Crazy Harry]

Point taken about how a discussion comparing just the "Castle Parks" should not include the other parks. You can count the Mermaid ride for MK regardless of whether it will be at DCA. But then, by that same logic, Star Tours and Eo and the Monorail would have to count for Disneyland even though they are found at other WDW parks, which would make the number gap of "attractions found at DL but not at MK" even larger. When I first made the list and left those off of Disneyland's count, it was to be as "fair" as possible to MK and also because I figured someone would object to including things in Disneyland's "exclusive" count that WDW had in other parks.

Yeah, I guess you could go either way, it gets to be a tricky discussion no matter how you look at it.

 

[Disneygal1]

Rest assured, Peter Pan is WAY too popular to be replaced. Not only that, but it's a ride system Walt himself helped design (for DL) so that by itself makes it a classic that they won't replace.

Toad was replaced because Pooh is a more popular property.
Snow White is being replaced because they are building another Snow White ride in the new Fantasyland.

Pan should be perfectly fine. It badly needs a major refurbishment, but other than that, it will remain where it's at.

I totally agree. Have you seen the lines for Peter Pan? They waits are very long whereas Snow Whites wait time was never long, nor that popular...

 

[Thrill]

Like others here, I am more worried about Jungle Cruise, Country Bear Jamboree, and possibly the most at risk, Carousel of Progress. The latter of the three has been rumored for closure for years. Peter Pan might be slightly at risk, but I'd say it's safe for a few years. A refurb is necessary, and I hope it will happen soon. Actually, all of the attractions I previously mentioned could use some refurbishment and modernization.

"When I was a kid, we didn't have LaserDiscs or car phones."

 

[Chef Mickey]

Like others here, I am more worried about Jungle Cruise, Country Bear Jamboree, and possibly the most at risk, Carousel of Progress. The latter of the three has been rumored for closure for years. Peter Pan might be slightly at risk, but I'd say it's safe for a few years. A refurb is necessary, and I hope it will happen soon. Actually, all of the attractions I previously mentioned could use some refurbishment and modernization.

"When I was a kid, we didn't have LaserDiscs or car phones."

It would be blasphemy to get rid of COP. This could be an amazing ride with proper updates with the times and a fresh look. It was one of Walt's favorites and I'd be saddened to see it completely go.

I do agree it's on borrowed time.

 

[Disneygal1]

I don't think they will get rid of Carousel of Progress, Walt made it, that would be a slap in the face. I agree that it needs some refurbishment.

 

[WDW_Emily]

CoP might be at risk but I think it is more likely to get updated rather than completely taken down. What I really like about CoP is that along with being an attraction that Walt did, it also fits in with the tomorrowland theme(unlike some other rides inside that area).

 

[steamboat_tyler]

If anything, they would just refurb CoP. It was one of Walt's favorites. Jungle Cruise would be more at risk, but it needs just a major refurb like small world got in 2005. IMO.

 

[DisneyNut2007]

I hate this thread almost turned into yet another "WDW vs. DL" thread. It's so annoying and needs to stop.

DL is not the end-all be-all of Disney parks, so get it through your thick skulls already, folks!

Besides, DL has its flaws too, you know.

 

[Walt Disney1955]

The real question is why do new rides have to replace old ones. Why can't they just add new ones and keep the classics. There is plenty of room to expand. MK has far fewer attractions than DL, so it's not too unreasonable to have more attractions in the park.

Disney Execs, read this. This is exactly what is supposed to seperate Disney from the other parks. Snow White has been there since the beginning, I love that ride. I know the Mine ride is going to replace it, but there can never be enough homage paid to the main reason there actually is a DisneyWorld/Land in the first place. That's right, if Snow White bombed in the box office in 1937 there wouldn't have been a Disney World. All that new room in Fantasyland and they can't afford to keep a classic ride?

 

[Walt Disney1955]

If Snow White is going to be replaced like what is being said, what exactly is going to go in there? Another dark ride?

Why not just do a refurb on the ride?

 

[NYwdwfan]

If Snow White is going to be replaced like what is being said, what exactly is going to go in there? Another dark ride?

Why not just do a refurb on the ride?

No - and please don't shoot the messenger although I am surprised this will be news - a Princess Meet & Greet (and with that I duck for cover)

 

[mrtoad]

In regards to Jungle Cruise, it was rumored when AK was built that it was going to go away. Nearly a decade an a half later and it is still is there. It still draws crowds and it is more seen as a campy fun attraction, it is not expected to be the same thing as a safari at AK. I am not saying it won't someday be replaced, just saying the logic that AK is going to be the cause of it does not make sense.

In regards to Snow White going away, in as long as I can remember I have not waited in line more than 5 minutes on a normal day. We were even in WDW for Thanksgiving and we got on it in less than 10 min. Peter Pan even in mid Winter if you go mid afternoon you are looking at 50 minutes or more. It still draws crowds so I don't see it being in danger of going away. Though a refurb would be a welcome sight, it surely needs it....

 

[FutureCEO]

Like others here, I am more worried about Jungle Cruise, Country Bear Jamboree, and possibly the most at risk, Carousel of Progress. The latter of the three has been rumored for closure for years. Peter Pan might be slightly at risk, but I'd say it's safe for a few years. A refurb is necessary, and I hope it will happen soon.

Jungle Cruise is a great ride. I think you could add more AA's to it. The Country Bears should just go away. I haven't even bother with that ride for years. The Carousel of Progress should be made into a dark ride instead of a show or knock it down although. Peter Pan is tied for the worst ride in Fantasyland along with Pooh and Snow White. They could be better than what they are.

Not that some of the expansion plans are better. Two dumbos....why isnt two enough already (dumbo and the aladdin clone)? and then a princess meet and greet.

 

[Walt Disney1955]

Jungle Cruise is a great ride. I think you could add more AA's to it. The Country Bears should just go away. I haven't even bother with that ride for years. The Carousel of Progress should be made into a dark ride instead of a show or knock it down although. Peter Pan is tied for the worst ride in Fantasyland along with Pooh and Snow White. They could be better than what they are.

Not that some of the expansion plans are better. Two dumbos....why isnt two enough already (dumbo and the aladdin clone)? and then a princess meet and greet.

We should thank God you aren't a CEO or anyone in charge of making decisions. It's sad that there are people out there who can't enjoy the uniqueness of Carousel of Progress and the innocent fun of Country Bear Jamboree. Again I ask, even if you hate the attraction, what in the world do you plan on putting in the Bears' place in that little space?

I totally agree. Have you seen the lines for Peter Pan? They waits are very long whereas Snow Whites wait time was never long, nor that popular...

Has anyone realized that Peter Pan is one of the WORST rides for loading? It's worse than Snow White for sure. You can generally only get two people on the Pan ride. Snow White you can easily get 4. Which ride do you think will load faster? In reality, when you look at the actual amount of people in line for each ride there really isn't all that much of a difference. I agree Peter Pan is a popular ride, but when you see the wait time at 45 minutes it is rather deceptive. There is simply just a longer wait because the ride does not load very fast. Where with Snow White even when the line is at it's max you load within 10-15 minutes. Snow White is still a very popular ride, don't kid yourself. This is just some dumb hotshot at Disney who has no clue about the significance of Snow White who wants this taken down.

 

[Magenta Panther]

Peter Pan is immensely popular and always has ridiculous long lines. Snow White was never a huge draw. I don't think we have to worry about Peter Pan leaving for a while.

I think it's time the Pan ride got plussed. You're entirely correct, it's very popular (the lines have been pretty dense every time I've visited WDW), but it's also dated. I could see a great new ride being built of it, one that retains some of the simpler, charming aspects of the original attraction with new ride technology. Forget Harry and his broomstick - imagine flying over moonlit London via fairy dust, heading for the second star to the right and bursting into Neverland. Peter and Tinkerbell could lead the way, and we'd be menaced by Hook's flying ship and the man-eating crocodile. It could be a much more magical version of Soarin'. The Pan ride has lots of possibilities for an upgrade. I hope the Imagineers will someday consider it...