Any word about Pirates upgrade?

[Miss Bell]

I'm all for updates to keep things clean and running smoothly, but I do wish they would post the major closings early. We usually plan our trip 9 months to a year in advance-- I don't want to book a trip only to find out later, that one of my favorite attractions is closed for a 9 month re-furb. Small World isn't exactly my fav, but it was weird to not pay homage to such a classic. There is sentimental value attached to rides like that, isn't that part of the reason we go year after year?

 

[ToTBellHop]

I would say, to move things along for the 50th, each land pick a ride to be re-done, and then, by the time the 50th comes, everything will be sparkling new. Start tomorrow. lol. It would move things along. it may mean lots of things are down for this fall, but the park would be in top shape for the upcoming celebration, that will bring much attention to all the Disney Theme Parks. So...here's my list...

Adventureland=PotC (keep JC on the scedule)

Fronterland=CBJ (now major changes, just a paint job, don't get worried grizz :lol: )

Liberty Square=HM, new seats for HoP (they aren't comfy anymore)

Fantasyland=PPF. IASM is being done, and SW just got done. Pooh is pretty new, MTP just needs a paint job and oil-down.

Toontown=Paint job for everything.

Tomorrowland=CoP & Timekeeper & a oil-ing and paint job for Space. Astro is on the agenda, and the TTA just needs some paint.

ok...so that's my opinion. The paint stuff could just be done after hours.

POTC before the mansion! But both need it!

If Disneyland didn't get those upgrades, WDW shouldn't. Disney World isn't the resort turning 50. Personally, here is what I'm thinking:

"it's a small world" reopens next March after 9 months.
Pirates closes March 2005-Christmas 2005
Haunted Mansion Holiday is presented next fall, and after it closes, Haunted Mansion stays closed for 9 months for a bunch or upgrades and opens the following fall as Haunted Mansion Holiday, again, with the original Haunted Mansion reopening January 2007.

 

[marni1971]

See both Pirates and HM (PM) how they can be done - Disneyland Paris!

 

[PeterAlt]

Allow me to disagree. Haunted Mansion is actually looking very good these days -- better than it did through most of the 1990's -- with the current exception of a MIA singing bust (he fell off his pedestal; Glendale needs to send another) and some iffy audio.

By comparison, Pirates is a mess. The figures are jerky, the lighting is getting haphazard, and a lot of the shortcuts Imagineers took to get the thing in on time and under budget are getting more and more obvious as each year goes on. My vote is for Pirates. And although in my opinion no amount of work will bring us up to being on par with the excellence of the Disneyland original, I can think of a dozen-odd things that would help.

As far as having more animals in our Pirates scenes: I don't think this is true. I think you're thinking of the auction, but the layout of the farm animals in both versions is exactly the same. If anything, DL currently has *more* figures than we do with the addition of two new scenes to the former "chasing women" set almost 10 years ago.

And I'm sorry, I think the raid scenes is where our version begins to most notably pale next to DL's version. Just check out our burning town and notice how much of ours is obviously painted-on details, and how much of Disneyland's comparable scene is actual materials. This is most obvious with rockwork and wooden doors. We also have about half of the "burning embers" effects we should have to sell the fire effect.

So yeah. I think Pirates is in desperate need of a major refurbishment, followed by Mansion. I can tell you that a Mansion refurbishment is planned, including a major upgrade of all the projected effects and the relocation of all the sound system apparatus to the same show building on new digital repeaters rather than the old analog transmitters we still use.

Thanks for the reply. I could have sworn that our fire effect looked more real than DL's, but any way... maybe they should just replace it with real fire ala The Great Movie Ride or Catasophe Canyon... You seem to know what's going on... what exactly is the extent of the rehab they are planning for WDW? Is it just a band-aid rehab with newer AA's, or a total redo ala IASW? And when is it scheduled to begin... next fiscal year or later?

 

[PeterAlt]

I like the Flying Carpets. :fork:

The DLP version is fascinating, but I still perfer Disneyland's, which I think is brilliant.

And I'm not talking about the broken singing bust, I'm talking about the one that is *not there*. At all. Farthest on the right. He's been gone since early June.

The idea of Spaniard pirates running around speaking and singing in French just makes queezy (is that a word?). Pairs' version may be the best (I can't wait to see it some day), but French speaking pirates? Come on! Yelp!

 

[PeterAlt]

I like the Flying Carpets. :fork:

The DLP version is fascinating, but I still perfer Disneyland's, which I think is brilliant.

And I'm not talking about the broken singing bust, I'm talking about the one that is *not there*. At all. Farthest on the right. He's been gone since early June.

The idea of Spaniard pirates running around speaking and singing in French just makes queezy (is that a word?). Paris' version may be the best (I can't wait to see it some day), but French speaking pirates? Come on! Yelp!

 

[MissM]

I don't care what anyone says, I LOVE PoTC. Is it old? Yeah. But it's classic. It's a must-see every time I'm there. Often times we ride it a few times in a day simply because it's just fun. I suppose it could use freshing up a bit, but I'd be really sad if they actually tore through it and really changed it.

I love HM too. The only thing I know really needs help is the audio. There's stretches of like six Doom Buggies in a row where the audio doesn't work in them - a sure sign there's some updating needed. Beyond that though, I don't think it needs changing. A fresh coat of paint maybe, but why tinker with the classics?

Look what happens when they do? Imagination anyone? *shudders* There's a bit of magic in those old rides - shabby, old technology, bad audio and all. And it's one thing to repair something but it's another to change it. Was it's a small world... cheesey? Dated? Yeah. But you loved it anyway didn't you? Aren't you the least bit nervous about it being changed?

Call me old fashioned but I love that things stick around as long as they do. Something I saw as a kid is still there. I just hate when people get this idea they need to change everything and make it cooler or more modern. More often then not, it just ruins it.
-m

 

[EpcoTim]

I don't care what anyone says, I LOVE PoTC. Is it old? Yeah. But it's classic. It's a must-see every time I'm there. Often times we ride it a few times in a day simply because it's just fun. I suppose it could use freshing up a bit, but I'd be really sad if they actually tore through it and really changed it.

I love HM too. The only thing I know really needs help is the audio. There's stretches of like six Doom Buggies in a row where the audio doesn't work in them - a sure sign there's some updating needed. Beyond that though, I don't think it needs changing. A fresh coat of paint maybe, but why tinker with the classics?

Look what happens when they do? Imagination anyone? *shudders* There's a bit of magic in those old rides - shabby, old technology, bad audio and all. And it's one thing to repair something but it's another to change it. Was it's a small world... cheesey? Dated? Yeah. But you loved it anyway didn't you? Aren't you the least bit nervous about it being changed?

Call me old fashioned but I love that things stick around as long as they do. Something I saw as a kid is still there. I just hate when people get this idea they need to change everything and make it cooler or more modern. More often then not, it just ruins it.
-m

---Very well said.

 

[pppapazo]

I don't care what anyone says, I LOVE PoTC. Is it old? Yeah. But it's classic. It's a must-see every time I'm there. Often times we ride it a few times in a day simply because it's just fun. I suppose it could use freshing up a bit, but I'd be really sad if they actually tore through it and really changed it.

I love HM too. The only thing I know really needs help is the audio. There's stretches of like six Doom Buggies in a row where the audio doesn't work in them - a sure sign there's some updating needed. Beyond that though, I don't think it needs changing. A fresh coat of paint maybe, but why tinker with the classics?

Look what happens when they do? Imagination anyone? *shudders* There's a bit of magic in those old rides - shabby, old technology, bad audio and all. And it's one thing to repair something but it's another to change it. Was it's a small world... cheesey? Dated? Yeah. But you loved it anyway didn't you? Aren't you the least bit nervous about it being changed?

Call me old fashioned but I love that things stick around as long as they do. Something I saw as a kid is still there. I just hate when people get this idea they need to change everything and make it cooler or more modern. More often then not, it just ruins it.
-m

Personally, from what I have heard and read about the proposed It's a Small World rehab, I am not worried at all. The rides which opened with the Magic Kingdom are now almost 35 years old and showing their age. Installing a new sound system, more advanced Audio-Animatronics, and a more attractive queue would go a long way to preserving the ride and restoring it to its old glory.

Now, if the Imagineers also want to change some of the scenes a bit, I'm fine with that, too. The international landscape has changed quite a bit since 1964 and it might be nice to have that reflected in It's a Small World. In addition, the Imagineers have since designed another incarnation of the ride in Disneyland Paris, and if they can incorporate some of the things they learned from that experience, I think the ride will be better for it.

New scenes or gags are not what leads to failed rehabs. Note how Pirates of the Caribbean in Disneyland was improved when some of the Audio-Animatronics from World of Motion were incorporated. What leads to failed rehabs is a change in the spirit and tone of the ride.

In spite of the fact that we've seen some classics significantly changed over the past several years, something tells me that this won't be the case with the planned rehabs for It's a Small World, Pirates of the Caribbean, Haunted Mansion, and even Space Mountain at Disneyland.

Peter

 

[pppapazo]

As for HM, it will be upgraded, probably in the next fiscal year (it was originally scheduled for this year, from what I read). They have to upgrade things, such as the the sound system in order to get it ready for HM Holiday.

I think I may be the only person not excited about Haunted Mansion Holiday coming to Walt Disney World. I know that it has received rave reviews at Disneyland, bringing in throngs of crowds to see it, but the logistics and economics are so much different at that park.

First of all, many more of Disneyland's visitors are locals and can make special trips to see the attraction during the season when it is open. I doubt that this attraction alone will significantly add to the throngs of people who visit Walt Disney World during the holiday season.

Similarly, the Disneyland locals are not as affected by the down time that it takes to install and remove the Haunted Mansion Holiday overlay each year. If they want to see the standard version, they can always go from February to Sepatember. Most tourists to Walt Disney World, however, can't just go again a couple of months later to see a different version, and people who go during most of October or January will likely not be able to see the Haunted Mansion at all.

Finally, Walt Disney World has much more room for expansion than its sister park in Anaheim. I would heartily welcome a Nightmare Before Christmas attraction, which could fit nicely at the Disney-MGM Studios or even in Fantasyland. Disneyland may not have had the room for it, but that excuse doesn't fly in Florida. I guess I figure that bringing Haunted Mansion Holiday to the Magic Kingdom is a way of management cheaping out on us again and missing an opportunity to give guests a great new reason to visit the parks year round.

Peter

 

[HMGhost13]

as long as thet don't ruin the rides (hm, potc) that's fine.

and by ruin i mean AE ruin.

 

[Lee]

Was it's a small world... cheesey? Dated? Yeah. But you loved it anyway didn't you? Aren't you the least bit nervous about it being changed?

Nope.
Trust me...there is NOTHING they could do to Small World that would make me nervous...

...except make me ride it. :hammer:

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

Nope.
Trust me...there is NOTHING they could do to Small World that would make me nervous...

...except make me ride it. :hammer:

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[SpaceMountainUK]

The idea of Spaniard pirates running around speaking and singing in French just makes queezy (is that a word?). Pairs' version may be the best (I can't wait to see it some day), but French speaking pirates? Come on! Yelp!

i dont think its anymore queezy than a spanish pirate speaking in an american pirate voice.

 

[DisneyFan 2000]

papazo, I'm with you 100%!

 

[Djali999]

PeterAlt: I'm afraid I don't know much about any kind of refurbishment beyond talking to folks and deducing what they're going to have to do. Doombuggies have been occasionally and secretly replaced wth new versions over the years, and I haven't had a single doombuggy problem in years. Compare this to 2000, when every other doombuggy seemed to be broken.

But the audio is a serious issue. Part of what makes it so darn easy to put HMH in DL in a few weeks is because they can just change the tracks of the digital repeaters DL switched over to in 1995. WDW still uses old analog narrow-band radio transmitters that were the peak of technology in 1971. Small World's new digital sound system gives me hope; they may be wanting to try something simpler before getting into the audio mire that is Pirates or Mansion.

The other major problem is the projected effects, which are still blurry and off. Expect the images to switch over to a laserdisc or digital system soon...

Peter: I agree with all of your reasons as to why HMH will not work at WDW. However, I think your comment that WDW management is giving us the "cheap route" by utilizing the HMH model is somewhat off. Considering that a Nightmare Before X-Mas attraction was never even a possibility at WDW, Disney is actually dropping an incredible amount of money on this proposed overlay. The audio system is going to have to be totally gutted and re-tuned before anything can begin to happen - and that won't be cheap. Factor in labor, manufacture, a new line of merchandise, advertising, and whatever else they decide to do, and we're talking a major investment here.

Consider that DL already knew their "Holiday" overlay concept was viable with Small World Holiday, and that HMH was a mid-priced but carefully put together refurbishment. WDW has no such history and, for once, we're looking at the "suits" dropping a lot of cash on something that is, in no way, a sure thing. Is anybody else at least a little happy about that? WDW has been playing it safe since 1996...

 

[imagineer boy]

Here are my thoughts on rehabs:

POTC needs a seriouse rehab like IASW is getting. The animatronics are not as good as DL's and need updating. Make a better begginning and end ( atleast have a go up the waterfall effect like DL. Replace AAs, sound, better Special effects, use X Antincio's voice for the talking skull instead of the crappy one now, ect.

Jungle Cruise needs updated AAs. Other than that, its in good shape.

HM needs some rehabbing too. The sound needs the most help. Maybe a couple of new AAs, better projections. A few minor things need fixing like the fact that the safty bar keeps lowering before the ghost host says that he'll lower it for you.

Peter Pan needs a HUGE GIGANTIC LARGER THAN LIFE REHAB. Better AAs, special effects, pain, no more tin foil in the volcano!

Space Mountain needs a good rehab like DL's. New track, better special effects, better themed qeue.

TTA either needs new trains or completely rehabed trains because the current ones are in seriouse help. I noticed that my car was wobbling a bit on the track and the doors squeak when they close which needs to be fixed.

Astro Orbiter needs some new paint and bring the planets back and make them spin!

Those are just a few of my thoughts on the rehabs

 

[pppapazo]

Peter: I agree with all of your reasons as to why HMH will not work at WDW. However, I think your comment that WDW management is giving us the "cheap route" by utilizing the HMH model is somewhat off. Considering that a Nightmare Before X-Mas attraction was never even a possibility at WDW, Disney is actually dropping an incredible amount of money on this proposed overlay. The audio system is going to have to be totally gutted and re-tuned before anything can begin to happen - and that won't be cheap. Factor in labor, manufacture, a new line of merchandise, advertising, and whatever else they decide to do, and we're talking a major investment here.

Point well taken. I suppose what I should have said is that the Nightmare Before Christmas characters have proven themselves to be extraordinarily popular and viable as a basis for an attraction. My question, then, is: Why has there been no proposed stand-alone attraction AT WDW based on this film? Sure, it wasn't a blockbuster but neither was Song of the South.

Peter

 

[Number_6]

The idea of Spaniard pirates running around speaking and singing in French just makes queezy (is that a word?). Paris' version may be the best (I can't wait to see it some day), but French speaking pirates? Come on! Yelp!

Hey, there were French Pirates in the Caribbean. Just as there were English and Dutch Pirates. It's just that there were more Spaniards because for a good stretch, the Spanish owned most of the Caribbean.

 

[PlaneJane]

I don't believe a going up the water fall thing is ever going to be added to WDW PoTC, because if you have ever watched the extra ride video on the PoTC movie. One of the original designers (i think) said that they hated the water fall up part and designed WDW version to let the riders skip that part.