Alcohol in the Magic Kingdom

[King Racoon 77]

And page 32 is where it all went wrong ... Farewell Alcomahol thread your days are numbered

 

[flynnibus]

Right so a restaurant that serves alcohol. Sounds familiar and it serves hard liquor not just beer and wine.

The fact that it was exclusive to wealthy guests doesn't change the fact that it was a place within the park that served alcohol. Those who were members (or guests) there had the option to consume alcohol and then leave the restaurant to go into the parks. If Walt didn't want anyone who consumed alcohol in the parks he could have built a members only club outside the parks.

They also didn't perform sobriety checks at the gates. I'm not really going to spend any more energy trying to explain to you the difference between onstage and private areas or events. What is served in private verse in the park has always been different.... even for walt's own parties inside the park. Just because he poured on the steamer... he still didn't have people pour for DL guests.

 

[SorcererMC]

Oh, my point was merely that alcohol was not hidden in Disney movies and parks in previous eras. And that despite this alcohol was not served at the MK, as a deliberate policy.

With respect to this policy change deviating from Walt's vision and legacy for the parks, I completely understand where you are coming from on that (which may not have been clear from my posts).

ETA: Earlier in the thread Pinocchio and Sleeping Beauty were being used as examples, and I think the messages of more recent/ modern depictions are quite different, hence the Tangled pic. (I half-shudder at that drunk cupid every time - which I think was John Lasseter's idea or something like that.) Anyhow, I was not trying to mock Walt's policy so much as show the paradigm shift that has occurred.

 

[21stamps]

Well, I am seriously conflicted on this subject. I think I liked posts on both sides of the spectrum. I am far from a teetotaler and on a couple of occasions even half stumbled around the WS. When adult beverages are offered at a MK dining location there is a good chance I will order a beer or 2. But I also like the idea that MK is a dry park, it was Walt's vision and it still resonates to this day is some aspects. It's pure family escapism and I would like to keep it that way.

As far as 21+ places, I certainly think there should be some more. I think we are up to about 4-5 that we have totaled( is Splittsville still 21 after 9?). I still think there could be a few more. I fully believe that a bar/lounge is meant for adults. Not to save my precious child from seeing people consume adult libations but for the actual adults trying to enjoy themselves. When I'm drinking the last thing I want to do is be concerned about saying an off colored word or toning down my buzzed antics. In the establishments where I live, if there is a separate bar area within a restaurant, children cannot be seated in that section.

Also, children have a wide spectrum of behaviors even under responsible parents. It's not so easy(sometimes even impossible) for parents especially with multiple children to get them to toe the line of respectfulness and placidity. So I agree with no children at lounges for those 2 factors.

What keeps confusing me about these statements is this,

One line you guys are talking about "Walt's vision"
The next line-
Children shouldn't be allowed in a lounge restaurant at WDW.

What am I missing? To me it just looks like a contradiction.

I've attached a few photos. I think there may be confusion as to what people think these places are. The Wave is somewhat different..that feels more 'night time loungeish' to me and not somewhere we would go together. The tables in these photos are about the same distance as tables are from the bars at the pools, which always seem to be quite busy, and there are a lot of children around. In my opinion if you are cursing loud enough for the table next to you to hear, then maybe you shouldn't be in a lounge for much longer? Or at least switch to water at that point. I'm an adult and don't want to hear loud cursing while I'm having a mojito.

 

[GoofGoof]

he still didn't have people pour for DL guests.

We can agree to disagree on this. I don't see how guests who happen to be members of an exclusive club are not DL guests.

 

[GoofGoof]

In my opinion if you are cursing loud enough for the table next to you to hear, then maybe you shouldn't be in a lounge for much longer? Or at least switch to water at that point. I'm an adult and don't want to hear loud cursing while I'm having a mojito.

There are adult conversations and actions that don't involve cursing or foul language. Some topics shouldn't be discussed around children. Some of my neighbors found this out the hard way when talking about Trump and the election in front of their kids...but that's a fun story for a different board.

 

[njDizFan]

What keeps confusing me about these statements is this,

One line you guys are talking about "Walt's vision"
The next line-
Children shouldn't be allowed in a lounge restaurant at WDW.

What am I missing? To me it just looks like a contradiction.

I've attached a few photos. I think there may be confusion as to what people think these places are. The Wave is somewhat different..that feels more 'night time loungeish' to me and not somewhere we would go together. The tables in these photos are about the same distance as tables are from the bar at the pools. In my opinion if you are cursing loud enough for the table next to you to hear, then maybe you shouldn't be in said lounge for much longer? Or at least switch to water at that point. I'm an adult and don't want to hear loud cursing while I'm having a mojito.

The difference is in my opinion that an open air establishment like a pool you should expect a mixed crowd of demographics. But Disney needs to set the expectations via atmosphere and theme/decor for other lounges. Just like the signature dining establishments "require" you to be dressed appropriately, adult lounges should set the expectations that it is for adults. Now unless it's duly restricted by the bar(Disney) it's up to the customer to make that distinction, which we know by now means nothing. So Disney needs to impose restrictions on age for certain places.

 

[Ricky Spanish]

I could use a drink right about now.

 

[21stamps]

There are adult conversations and actions that don't involve cursing or foul language. Some topics shouldn't be discussed around children. Some of my neighbors found this out the hard way when talking about Trump and the election in front of their kids...but that's a fun story for a different board.

The difference is in my opinion that an open air establishment like a pool you should expect a mixed crowd of demographics. But Disney needs to set the expectations via atmosphere and theme/decor for other lounges. Just like the signature dining establishments "require" you to be dressed appropriately, adult lounges should set the expectations that it is for adults. Now unless it's duly restricted by the bar(Disney) it's up to the customer to make that distinction, which we know by now means nothing. So Disney needs to impose restrictions on age for certain places.

We're just going to disagree on this. You're talking about 3 resorts that are the most convenient to Magic Kingdom, probably the 3 most popular resorts of parents with younger children who frequent MK during their trip.
It's a lot easier to swallow $500+ per night for a basic hotel room when the resort has several amenities, including places to get food and alcohol without reservations. Taking away those places would be counter productive to a large portion of your clientele.

As far as children behaving though.. I know all are different but what I've learned (through mistakes) in the past 6 years about my own child- he is less likely to act out when he is not completely overstimulated. Example- after a long day at MK being rushed to get ready and head to our next reservation, where we check in, sit and wait in loudness, and then get seated surrounded by more loudness and being rushed to finish chewing what's in his mouth bc whatever character is almost to our table.lol. It's a huge advantage to have a more relaxed option walking distance from your room, or a quick boat ride away. I'm talking 8-9pm. I've luckily never seen anyone in heated political or inappropriate loud discussion at that time wherever we've been.
Plus, like I said, these places do not have children's menus, and their drinks, including non alcoholic are not inexpensive. Right there you're going to eliminate a lot of children. Similar to Shula's which is why you probably never see a ton of kids in there. Places like that will never have a large amount of children in them on a regular basis.

WDW at its core is a family destination resort. It always has been. You can have adult only places, but you can't take the family out of all non reservation but non QS venues, it's against what the destination stands for.

 

[Sir_Cliff]

I recently discovered much to my horror that in Norway you have to go to the government Vinmonopolet (literally Wine Monopoly) store to get anything stronger than a beer, so perhaps a little Wandering Oaken's Vinmonopolet in Fantasyland is in order?

Honestly, I'm a bit surprised at all the hostility directed at 21stamps for wanting to enjoy a drink without having to hire a babysitter while at WDW. I don't have kids and I don't think every bar is appropriate for kids. Still, it really rubs me the wrong way when hipster cafes and bars give parents a hard time and it seems strange to me that people would go to Disney World and complain there are too many children.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Personally, I can't wait until they grow pot in The Land. At that point, what the hell does anything matter. Life is a , the only way we can enjoy anything is if we have a buzz on or are stoned. Make sure our children know that a crutch is needed to get though a day, even at WDW. Sad, state of humans I guess, although I can understand the feeling. I feel the same way about the unbelievable requirement that people have for coffee and I, myself, once had the same need for cigarettes, so I do understand the human "needs". However, I don't think that any of the just mentioned items are things that people cannot get through a day without. And things that can be used to show strength of personal convictions and control over our own bodies by going a whole 8 or so hours without. To much to ask, I guess. Do I think that having alcohol there is in and of itself a bad thing? No, not really, but, to me it's just another example of the lack of strength of the human race. My opinion completely, your mileage may vary.

 

[21stamps]

I recently discovered much to my horror that in Norway you have to go to the government Vinmonopolet (literally Wine Monopoly) store to get anything stronger than a beer, so perhaps a little Wandering Oaken's Vinmonopolet in Fantasyland is in order?

Honestly, I'm a bit surprised at all the hostility directed at 21stamps for wanting to enjoy a drink without having to hire a babysitter while at WDW. I don't have kids and I don't think every bar is appropriate for kids. Still, it really rubs me the wrong way when hipster cafes and bars give parents a hard time and it seems strange to me that people would go to Disney World and complain there are too many children.

I don't know if it's a "hipster" mentality or what now. I vividly remember times when in a lounge environment or nice restaurant with my parents when I was a child. Sitting in my dress and sipping a Shirley Temple thinking I was "so grown up". I don't remember getting dirty looks from the other patrons. Maybe I did and was too high up on Cloud 9 to notice.

I'm the first to admit that I did not want children during my 20s, nor did I want to be surrounded by them often. I hung out at places that weren't frequented by kids..including a lot of adult only resorts. I also went to WDW, but didn't dine at character meals and inside the parks we were doing our own thing and weren't bothered by them..bc I realized the place I was in.lol

 

[Sir_Cliff]

I'm the first to admit that I did not want children during my 20s, nor did I want to be surrounded by them often. I hung out at places that weren't frequented by kids..including a lot of adult only resorts. I also went to WDW, but didn't dine at character meals and inside the parks we were doing our own thing and weren't bothered by them..bc I realized the place I was in.lol

This is just it. I like some of the more "adult" experiences at WDW, such as having a nice meal and drink in a good restaurant or bar. But, let's be honest, Walt Disney World is not an ultra-sophisticated venue aimed at the discerning gentleman and woman. It's a family resort with theme parks as its main draw.

 

[GoofGoof]

I recently discovered much to my horror that in Norway you have to go to the government Vinmonopolet (literally Wine Monopoly) store to get anything stronger than a beer, so perhaps a little Wandering Oaken's Vinmonopolet in Fantasyland is in order?

Honestly, I'm a bit surprised at all the hostility directed at 21stamps for wanting to enjoy a drink without having to hire a babysitter while at WDW. I don't have kids and I don't think every bar is appropriate for kids. Still, it really rubs me the wrong way when hipster cafes and bars give parents a hard time and it seems strange to me that people would go to Disney World and complain there are too many children.

Hostility? It's OK to disagree with someone isn't it?

I think the point has been beaten into the ground already, but I'll try again to summarize. There are multiple bars/lounges at WDW in the resorts and at Disney Springs. There are several (3 or 4) out of all that exist that are adult only and of those I believe only Jelly Rolls is 21+ all of the time. The other 2 or 3 are adult only at night after a certain time. Someone made the simple suggestion that they could use a few more adult only options at WDW. Trader Sams was used as an example of the successful execution of this concept. After 8PM it's adults only and it ususally has a decent sized crowd with a waiting list at times. At no point did anyone suggest that all bars/lounges should be adult only. Even if there were a few more adult only options it would leave a large number of options for parents with kids. Also, nobody is complaining that there are too many children at WDW or that the place needs to be less family friendly. I have kids myself but I can see the need for adult only options for other people even if it won't likely directly benefit me.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

I am. What's your point?
I couldn't care less about beer or wine being served at MK TS restaurants. I don't drink. Hubby does.
And oh yeah, he's also an Evangelical Christian - which brings me back to ... What's your point?

View attachment 179955

It's just most of the folks I know that are anti-alcohol are Evangelical Christian. I know a few that are anti-alcohol because of personal/family issues/events. Obviously not all Evangelicals are anti-alcohol, your DH being a great example. But most of the Evangelicals I have met are.

I was just curious as to if that may be part of why he is so against it. I wasn't trying to be disrespectful. I thought I asked politely.

 

[Pleakley]

The Disney lounges just need to stay open later, that should naturally weed out the young children. Especially in areas like the Boardwalk. This year I went to MNSSHP on a Friday and got back to the BWI before 1, and besides a moderately busy Jellyrolls, the place was so dead it was eery. Kimono's at the Swan, however, was still hopping. I think they do it right there. I had a great time as a kid, and now I've gotten to see it get pretty rowdy late at night. Karaoke starts at 9 or 9:30, and those under 21 can only sing until 11. Kids do not necessarily have to leave, but most families, unless they have teens, tend to pack it up. And just naturally there is a change from Disney tunes to something more sultry.

 

[Sir_Cliff]

Hostility? It's OK to disagree with someone isn't it?

Ok, "hostility" was probably the wrong word and Trader Sam's does seem to have executed the concept well.

I think we're probably coming from similar places in that it's preferable to me to not have kids running around when I go for a drink. However, I do completely understand how someone might feel coming back from the parks and being excluded from a bar because they have kids. I'm willing to compromise on that, particularly at Disney World.

 

[21stamps]

Hostility? It's OK to disagree with someone isn't it?

I think the point has been beaten into the ground already, but I'll try again to summarize. There are multiple bars/lounges at WDW in the resorts and at Disney Springs. There are several (3 or 4) out of all that exist that are adult only and of those I believe only Jelly Rolls is 21+ all of the time. The other 2 or 3 are adult only at night after a certain time. Someone made the simple suggestion that they could use a few more adult only options at WDW. Trader Sams was used as an example of the successful execution of this concept. After 8PM it's adults only and it ususally has a decent sized crowd with a waiting list at times. At no point did anyone suggest that all bars/lounges should be adult only. Even if there were a few more adult only options it would leave a large number of options for parents with kids. Also, nobody is complaining that there are too many children at WDW or that the place needs to be less family friendly. I have kids myself but I can see the need for adult only options for other people even if it won't likely directly benefit me.

It was specifically suggested that lounges should be 21+ and that it would make sense for the ones on the monorail line to be restricted to adults.

Ok, "hostility" was probably the wrong word and Trader Sam's does seem to have executed the concept well.

I think we're probably coming from similar places in that it's preferable to me to not have kids running around when I go for a drink. However, I do completely understand how someone might feel coming back from the parks and being excluded from a bar because they have kids. I'm willing to compromise on that, particularly at Disney World.

I'm actually in agreement with this as well. I like these places because the lack of children's menus excluded many kids., I've said that a thousand times. I've yet to see mobs of children in a lounge at WDW, pre 2010 or post 2015.

 

[GoofGoof]

Ok, "hostility" was probably the wrong word and Trader Sam's does seem to have executed the concept well.

I think we're probably coming from similar places in that it's preferable to me to not have kids running around when I go for a drink. However, I do completely understand how someone might feel coming back from the parks and being excluded from a bar because they have kids. I'm willing to compromise on that, particularly at Disney World.

I agree that I don't want to see people being completely shut out. Most of the deluxe resorts have multiple bar options so for example if you are staying at the Poly and it's after 8PM you can't go to Trader Sams but you still have Tambu Lounge plus the pool bar (for as late as that stays open) and the Kona Island Sushi Bar. You are also a short monorail ride away from various options at the other resorts. It's a good compromise to have a few adult only options (and after 8PM makes it even less restrictive). I don't think it's necessary to have adult only options in the parks themselves (especially if they exist at the resorts and Disney Springs).

 

[Tony the Tigger]

Honestly, it isn't normally the kids, it's the parents who think their children don't need to be supervised as they run around a lounge screaming.

Ding! Ding! Ding!