Disney (and others) at the Box Office - Current State of Affairs

[Ghost93]

I think Fantastic Four is just suffering from a damaged Marvel brand. Too many mediocre or bad movies and TV shows have come out in the past 5 years.

Black Widow was seen as mediocre and Eternals and Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness were — at best — divisive. Meanwhile, Thor: Love and Thunder, Ant-man and the Wasp: Quantumania, The Marvels and Captain America: Brave New World were just straight up bad movies.

But the movies weren't the only problem. The Disney Plus shows — most of which weren't that great — created a feeling of "too much homework" and made the MCU too hard to keep up with for the average fan. Of the shows, only WandaVision and Loki were universally loved, and it helped that they made their debut in a time where theaters weren't in operation. I really enjoyed Agatha, Hawkeye and Moon Knight and those were generally well received, but they didn't enter the zeitgeist like WandaVision and Loki. Meanwhile, Falcon and Winter Soldier, Ms. Marvel and Daredevil were seen as messy mixed bags while She-Hulk and Secret Invasion were hated. I personally didn't think She-Hulk was that bad, but Secret Invasion was unwatchable. Echo and Ironheart just sort of flew under the radar.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Fantastic Four isn't from the back of the comic book store. They're a bigger property than the Avengers were when they were adapted. And definitely bigger than no-names like Black Panther or Captain Marvel. I remember when I was a kid, I didn't like superheroes at all but I still knew who the Fantastic Four were. And fast forward to me being an actual comic bool reader, I think they have better source material and are less derivative than the Avengers. Yet I did not and will not see the film. Why?

The reason FF is failing is actually just stupidity in three regards:

1. Disney made a number of stupid decisions that have tanked the Marvel brand (they started in the comics, didn't work there, did them on screen and, surprise! it didn't work there either)

2. Disney is too stupid and too arrogant to change course

2. agreed that Disney-Marvel massively oversaturated the market, and refuses to just......stop. for just a second. and let it breathe

Fantastic four just doesn’t resonate as a mass entertainment vessel…they keep trying…with similar or worse results

It’s lauded by big fans…dismissed by casual consumers

 

[Ghost93]

Fantastic four just doesn’t resonate as a mass entertainment vessel…they keep trying…with similar or worse results

It’s lauded by big fans…dismissed by casual consumers

I think Fantastic Four suffers the John Carter problem where the derivative works it inspired made it to movies before it could. The Incredibles borrowed heavily from Fantastic Four (and did it a bit better TBH) and made it to the big screen before any of the Fantastic Four movies did. Even though FF came first, to the general public, it feels more like it's derivative of the Incredibles rather than the other way around.

Similarly, John Carter heavily inspired Star Wars, but by the time the film version came out, it felt like a Star Wars ripoff to the uninformed consumer.

 

[Hawkeye_2018]

I’ve been to the theater once this year and there’s a lot of movies I really want to see. Cost is the number one reason

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I think Fantastic Four suffers the John Carter problem where the derivative works it inspired made it to movies before it could. The Incredibles borrowed heavily from Fantastic Four (and did it a bit better TBH) and made it to the big screen before any of the Fantastic Four movies did. Even though FF came first, to the general public, it feels more like it's derivative of the Incredibles rather than the other way around.

Similarly, John Carter heavily inspired Star Wars, but by the time the film version came out, it felt like a Star Wars ripoff to the uninformed consumer.

If we step back and take a bird eye of the problem…it seems kinda obvious…

What franchise that isn’t totally oversaturated would have need for “relaunch” after 30 movies in close to 20 years?

I think it’s an Occam’s razor scenario for MCU

Fantastic Four's box office drop proves Marvel is losing average moviegoers

Even the Fantastic Four can't keep regular moviegoers interested in new Marvel projects.

ftw.usatoday.com

 

[Nevermore525]

66% drop for second weekend. Will pass Cap 4 after tomorrow domestically

 

[TalkingHead]

The Marvel fans I’ve talked with seemed pretty lukewarm on Fantastic Four. “Better than the last Captain America and Pedro Pascal is nice to look at” is hardly a ringing endorsement.

The never ending serialization and conveyor belt filmmaking by committee has caught up with the brand. Unless there’s an event aspect (like Deadpool 2024) general audiences seem pretty checked out. Not sure what Disney should do at this point short of put the franchise on ice for a year or two (which they can’t/won’t do) in order to give excitement and demand a chance to build.

 

[Serpico Jones]

The old fart that owned Viacom was wrong. Content is not king.

Distribution is king.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

2. agreed that Disney-Marvel massively oversaturated the market, and refuses to just......stop. for just a second. and let it breathe

How many Marvel movies and TV shows have been released in just the last 6 months?

Most people don't care about a lot of these characters.

When people say they like Marvel movies, what they really mean is they like Spider-Man, Deadpool and X-Men.

...or when a guy named Chris is not wearing a shirt.

The most successful example of the MCU plucking characters from obscurity and turning them mainstream is GotG, followed by Black Panther (more successful, but not as obscure).

 

[Nevermore525]

Through 2 weekends. Superman was at around $410M by its second weekend:

 

[Nevermore525]

Internationally Superman and F4 are still equivalent. Superman just a higher domestic draw IP than the F4.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

The Marvel fans I’ve talked with seemed pretty lukewarm on Fantastic Four. “Better than the last Captain America and Pedro Pascal is nice to look at” is hardly a ringing endorsement.

The never ending serialization and conveyor belt filmmaking by committee has caught up with the brand. Unless there’s an event aspect (like Deadpool 2024) general audiences seem pretty checked out. Not sure what Disney should do at this point short of put the franchise on ice for a year or two (which they can’t/won’t do) in order to give excitement and demand a chance to build.

It’s only gonna get worse

Any creative enterprise can’t post gains/wins every 3 months…the world isn’t built that way.

It’s infected every aspect of the TWDC.

The more they push…the lesser return

Thus

 

[Animaniac93-98]

Sony is also to blame for oversaturating the market with Marvel content (that's even worse in quality)

 

[DKampy]

Naked Gun, a slam dunk? An adult comedy with a new cast trying to revive a moribund franchise where the last film made a little over $100M over 30 years ago? A slam dunk? Who said that? You’re stretching more than Mr. Fantastic.

One would of thought it could open better then the awful Friedburg and Seltzer films like Meet the Spartans and Epic movies… those usually opened to about 18 million unadjusted

 

[DKampy]

…I hear it’s pretty good…don’t know how that translates to money…but a nice diversion.

You should watch it if you like the old ZAZ movies…. As it is the best spoof since the old ZAZ movies

 

[Nevermore525]

Lilo and Stitch up to around $1.020B with about $3M still to go to hit top domestic grosser thus far:

 

[easyrowrdw]

If we step back and take a bird eye of the problem…it seems kinda obvious…

What franchise that isn’t totally oversaturated would been for “relaunch” after 30 movies in close to 20 years?

I think it’s an Occam’s razor scenario for MCU

Fantastic Four's box office drop proves Marvel is losing average moviegoers

Even the Fantastic Four can't keep regular moviegoers interested in new Marvel projects.

ftw.usatoday.com

For me, it felt complete after Endgame. There were holdovers like Spider-Man and to a lesser extent Guardians that I wanted to see “wrap up,” but that was about it. I just don’t feel much of a need or interest in starting down another connected path of comic book movies.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

For me, it felt complete after Endgame. There were holdovers like Spider-Man and to a lesser extent Guardians that I wanted to see “wrap up,” but that was about it. I just don’t feel much of a need or interest in starting down another connected path of comic book movies.

Apparently 7.5 billion people on the planet agree with you

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

You should watch it if you like the old ZAZ movies…. As it is the best spoof since the old ZAZ movies

I’m definitely gonna get there

I loved the old movies

 

[FrontierSpirit]

So you guys think Fantastic ends its run at $520- $570 million? Is that good? You guys are calling these movies loss leaders and will make its money back on Disney plus.

Going forward make films between 124-150 million, make them as cheap as possible.