Is attendance really down at WDW this or…

[Minnesota disney fan]

FWIW: We have been going to Disney since l977. We went yearly or twice a year from 2011. We definitely noticed a change in the staffing around 2018. A lot of the attraction capacity was less, with only one track or side operating most of the time. The number of CM's were down too. And this was before Covid and what it is now. I remember we spoke about this trend and didn't like it at all. We even went at slow times (yes, there were once slow times So, this has been coming on for quite a while now, but just exacerbated post covid.

 

[monothingie]

I was just talking to someone the other day. While you or I might not buy it, a lot of people, right or wrong, have the perception that they HAVE to buy it or they wont be able to get on any attractions at the parks. They can hike the pricing to limit people who will purchase it, but that might drive people away from doing the vacation at all. They can limit the number sold but again this might turn people off, as some think they HAVE to have this to do the parks successfully. So this is where we are right now. Marie

I think an interesting piece of data to see would be how many people after using it would/do buy it again.

One thing I've rarely heard is people raving about the service or have been excited to have purchased the service. Rather, it seems most guests have begrudgingly purchased the service.

 

[Jrb1979]

I was just talking to someone the other day. While you or I might not buy it, a lot of people, right or wrong, have the perception that they HAVE to buy it or they wont be able to get on any attractions at the parks. They can hike the pricing to limit people who will purchase it, but that might drive people away from doing the vacation at all. They can limit the number sold but again this might turn people off, as some think they HAVE to have this to do the parks successfully. So this is where we are right now. Marie

I put that blame on fully on Disney for guests having that mindset. Prior to FP, guests may have complained about long waits, still went and had no issues with waiting in standby.

 

[BrianLo]

I do wonder if that "revenge" travel theory really just meant pushing WDW's normal audience to further destinations like DLR or DLRP since they had the savings and opportunity to pay for it.

The cruise question is an interesting one because generally, cruising is an entirely different genre of vacation from theme parks. If it shows a long term trend away from people wanting to be crammed up in a theme park, and standing in long lines (maybe a natural reaction to surviving a global pandemic?) that could manifest in a huge cultural shift.

Disney's indications on spending toward the cruise line seems to indicate they might be seeing that at a deeper level.

It’s different, but it is adjacent. It is also ‘within the market’ as opposed to further flung non Florida options, which I don’t feel compete as heavily. For the moment, it still maintains a significant cost edge.

I think they are a bit asleep at the wheel as Royal Caribbean rolls in Star of the Seas and Utopia of the Seas to Port Canaveral.

It’s not Epic, but it is 4.5 million passenger days competing for central Florida tourism, just on those two ships alone. Critically Royal is after that same Disney/Uni demographic these days. Compound other operators and even Disney Cruise Line itself.

 

[wannabeBelle]

@BrianLo Absolutely correct on the Royal Caribbean comment. Add in more family friendly locations on the ships, more water park options onboard, specialized dining locations for families, etc. Royal is certainly courting the same audience. Marie

 

[JoeCamel]

I put that blame on fully on Disney for guests having that mindset. Prior to FP, guests may have complained about long waits, still went and had no issues with waiting in standby.

Attendance is up 50% from that time, has there been capacity constructed to accomodate those people or do they just lump them in with the whole?

On another note what happened to all the people claiming Dis would never monetize FP? I never see them around any more

 

[el_super]

I think they are a bit asleep at the wheel as Royal Caribbean rolls in Star of the Seas and Utopia of the Seas to Port Canaveral.

They are planning at least two more Triton class ships and opening another private resort. Sounds like they are also getting more coming down. I think Disney knows they have a niche market in the cruise business, but even that niche is growing.

I think the deeper question is why is the cruise industry as a whole booming in Florida if the theme park business isn't. Why the shift?

 

[Jrb1979]

Attendance is up 50% from that time, has there been capacity constructed to accomodate those people or do they just lump them in with the whole?

On another note what happened to all the people claiming Dis would never monetize FP? I never see them around any more

I do agree they needed to add capacity for that growth in attendance. That's a whole seperate issue though. Even now look at the complaints people make on even 60 minute waits.

 

[Jrb1979]

They are planning at least two more Triton class ships and opening another private resort. Sounds like they are also getting more coming down. I think Disney knows they have a niche market in the cruise business, but even that niche is growing.

I think the deeper question is why is the cruise industry as a whole booming in Florida if the theme park business isn't. Why the shift?

Value for the dollar is my guess. WDW used to be good at feeling like an inclusive, with free FP+, Free Airport shuttle and the dining plan. Now 2 of those things are gone.

 

[el_super]

Value for the dollar is my guess. WDW used to be good at feeling like an inclusive, with free FP+, Free Airport shuttle and the dining plan. Now 2 of those things are gone.

Sure. If people are swapping out WDW for DCL, Disney wins either way. Too bad Universal doesn't have a cruise line.... yet.

 

[Splash4eva]

I was just talking to someone the other day. While you or I might not buy it, a lot of people, right or wrong, have the perception that they HAVE to buy it or they wont be able to get on any attractions at the parks. They can hike the pricing to limit people who will purchase it, but that might drive people away from doing the vacation at all. They can limit the number sold but again this might turn people off, as some think they HAVE to have this to do the parks successfully. So this is where we are right now. Marie

Im just confused why people will not buy it? All of a sudden out of principle we dont want to give the mouse more money? People been doing it for decades and those still going still are. Why wouldnt you want the ability to skip plenty of lines… yes its an added cost but to me it makes the trip so much better to have that ability…

 

[JD80]

I have a vague recollection that one of the things Genie would do would offer food discounts or the like. Is this a Mandela effect thing? I feel like Josh announced it.

I knew it made suggestions, I never heard of discounts.

 

[wannabeBelle]

Im just confused why people will not buy it? All of a sudden out of principle we dont want to give the mouse more money? People been doing it for decades and those still going still are. Why wouldnt you want the ability to skip plenty of lines… yes its an added cost but to me it makes the trip so much better to have that ability…

For the most part, I dont need it to make my trip enjoyable. Disney for me was always about the whole experience not ticking attractions off a list, so if I dont get on an attraction, especially as I am usually doing something else such as meeting with friends, checking out musical acts, etc., it isnt a big deal to me. Marie

 

[rd805]

Im just confused why people will not buy it? All of a sudden out of principle we dont want to give the mouse more money? People been doing it for decades and those still going still are. Why wouldnt you want the ability to skip plenty of lines… yes its an added cost but to me it makes the trip so much better to have that ability…

If it's just me and my GF - I will probably buy it almost every day.
When i went with my father (we had a big group back in like Dec2022?) - he bought it for our whole party.

We are ride pounders - to me it's worth it. It's expensive, but it's worth it.

 

[James Alucobond]

Im just confused why people will not buy it? All of a sudden out of principle we dont want to give the mouse more money? People been doing it for decades and those still going still are. Why wouldnt you want the ability to skip plenty of lines… yes its an added cost but to me it makes the trip so much better to have that ability…

You can ask this about anything. Why would you NOT purchase a fireworks viewing party? Why would you NOT hire a VIP tour guide? Why would you NOT upgrade to club level? All of them make your trip better, but people don’t have infinite money and also don’t place importance on the same things. Like others, I’ve been on most of the rides enough times that I am not looking to jam-pack every moment with attraction hopping, especially in EPCOT and Animal Kingdom where wait times are generally reasonable outside of one or two things and there are a plethora of wait-free things to do.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Im just confused why people will not buy it? All of a sudden out of principle we dont want to give the mouse more money? People been doing it for decades and those still going still are. Why wouldnt you want the ability to skip plenty of lines… yes its an added cost but to me it makes the trip so much better to have that ability…

4 kids, two parents, maybe grandparents, it adds up quick. its like instantly adding the cost of Genie+ to the entry price.

 

[HauntedPirate]

Im just confused why people will not buy it? All of a sudden out of principle we dont want to give the mouse more money? People been doing it for decades and those still going still are. Why wouldnt you want the ability to skip plenty of lines… yes its an added cost but to me it makes the trip so much better to have that ability…

Because sometimes the attraction is more than just the ride. Many don't consider rushing from ride to ride to ride to be enjoyable. There are other reasons as well, I'm sure people will chime in with some.

We've done everything so many times we don't care if we don't get on x, y, or z because it went down or the lines were too long.

And I don't want to give Bob any more of my money than he's already getting.

 

[SourcererMark79]

Im just confused why people will not buy it? All of a sudden out of principle we dont want to give the mouse more money? People been doing it for decades and those still going still are. Why wouldnt you want the ability to skip plenty of lines… yes its an added cost but to me it makes the trip so much better to have that ability…

Because the price increase of the base model experience is sticker shock. Adding G+ on for 4 or 5 days makes it hard to swallow the extra cost when food, airport shuttles and airfare has gone up too.

 

[Chi84]

4 kids, two parents, maybe grandparents, it adds up quick. its like instantly adding the cost of Genie+ to the entry price.

There are 8 of us (plus 2 under 3 years old) for our next trip. With the price increases and using the LLs about the same as last time, I’m figuring between $1,500 added to the vacation. That’s eye-opening.

 

[Disstevefan1]

There are 8 of us (plus 2 under 3 years old) for our next trip. With the price increases and using the LLs about the same as last time, I’m figuring between $1,500 added to the vacation. That’s eye-opening.

$1,500 for Genie+ wow.