Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Sirwalterraleigh]

You misunderstand what I mean by finally. I'm talking how hard the process was to find him a shot. I had appointments canceled on me with no reason only to have the slot remain available. Spent hours refreshing and looking and worrying others would cancel without cause. Also on multiple no show lists to be called. That's the finally - finally done spending ours on this for him. Both my MIL and my dad took literal hours to get signed up. That's not good for those who have no ability to spend the hours looking.

No...I gotcha. I’m just saying it’s easy to overlook the scale of this...and the stress

 

[correcaminos]

It seems to be that way most places. Lots of who you know and getting the information ahead of the masses.

I wish I knew people. I just made it a goal to get loved ones signed up. No tricks for me in getting nor info above the masses. I found out when others did. We were all fighting for the same slots at the same time. I'm really just that persistent. I spent hours also doing my MIL in FL 3 weeks ago. She's getting her 2nd shot hopefully Friday. Not all have people like me who spend hours looking. That's rather unfair to them and I wish we could all help out.

Though maybe my 5G enhancement from being in the trial helped me load faster lol

I do think for this time of the year in the midwest, I prefer appointment stress. When we had to do the H1N1 in 2009 that was an even bigger mess. Toting a toddler under 2 as well.

 

[GoofGoof]

States are saying that they're running out, yet, they have still to deliver half the doses given to them.

You can’t instantly deliver every dose the moment it arrives. If they have received 100M or 200M doses and still only half have been used it’s a problem. It makes perfect sense to me right now. Remember a week ago the percentages were in the 30s. With statistics some times raw numbers matter too, not just percentages. Simple example:

Logistically I will always have some number of doses ready for appointments tomorrow or later this week. Let’s say that number is around 1M for a county. In the beginning when I have received 1.5M doses I use 500K and hold back 1M. It shows I’m only using 33%. Flash forward a few weeks and I have now received 2M total doses so if I used or allocated all available doses for appointments this week I still would be holding the same 1M doses but I’m now at 50% used. Flash forward a month and I have now received 10M doses overall and have the same million waiting to be used this week it now shows I‘ve used 90% of my doses. As the amount of doses received increases the amount “held back“ each week will increase because in most places they are getting the doses 1 day a week and spreading them over the 7 days.

 

[GoofGoof]

I wish I knew people. I just made it a goal to get loved ones signed up. No tricks for me in getting nor info above the masses. I found out when others did. We were all fighting for the same slots at the same time.

Though maybe my 5G enhancement from being in the trial helped me load faster lol

I know nobody. Since I stoped going to the barbershop my pipeline of inside info is dead. A couple of the barbers are also volunteer firefighters so they know literally everything going on around us.

 

[correcaminos]

I know nobody. Since I stoped going to the barbershop my pipeline of inside info is dead. A couple of the barbers are also volunteer firefighters so they know literally everything going on around us.

I am not sure knowing people helps really in this situation anyway. But would be nice for an inside scoop.

 

[Chomama]

I am not sure knowing people helps really in this situation anyway. But would be nice for an inside scoop.

I am In Alabama. If you look at the data we are close to the bottom Of the charts for % of our shots administered. My neighbor is an oncologist who has had both doses. She made it her mission to find vaccine for all of the grandparents in our neighborhood group (3 families that travel and dine together during normal times). We have all spent hours online, on phones and driving around the state to various health departments. As of today all of the grandparents have it (69 and older), 5/6 parents (ages 40-50). Most of that was sheer luck of lingering at the end of the day and hoping for extras and calling pharmacies and health depts over and over. We are very grateful to have gotten it BUT it was very difficult. There is no organization and no way someone with less resources could find a way to get it. I suspect this is why so few in our state have gotten it. We have a ton of vaccine to the point that we now have several counties doing no appt walk ins for anyone over 70 and will give it to people that show up if they have extra. There is no system, no statewide website or phone number and there is only one pharmacy that is it in our county (largest one in the state). Rural counties have excess. I hate to say it but likely bc of their political leanings. When I got mine I asked the 6 nurses if they had side effects. They laughed and said no way they or anyone in their families would take it. We are in a poorly educated and far right state and outside of the cities there is vaccine to be had. In summary, it is a mess.

 

[Disney Experience]

Past posters have wondered why are the reported shot usage less than 50% when end points are saying they can get shots in the arm if they are given shots.

Recent anecdotal evidence is that shots are the limiting factor, that site have the ability to administer shots, but do not have the shots.
Yet reported usage is under 50%.

It would seem that reconciling these two conflicting data points would be worthwhile by authorities even if only to increase public confidence.

I can describe from other logistical system factors that in the days before internet could cause errors, such as:

Time of reporting. I know of a project decades ago that in real-time predicted logistical needs. But getting "truth on the ground" was not as straightforward as it might otherwise seem.
Some of the sources did not give real time reporting to the logistics system, rather they were big reoccurring customers who would locally collect information (with timestamps) and send it weekly. This would skew your realtime estimate of logistical needs unless you model the delay data points coming in. (And no model is perfect).

So I do wonder what the truth on the ground is for covid vaccine delivery and why they cannot get closer to that ground truth in the reported supply and usage of covid vaccines. Knowing if there are problems in getting shots into peoples arms is useful, thinking there are problems in logistics if the real problem is mostly reporting practices is a different problem, with a different (lower) priority. Federal, state. and local administration should understand both their part in the supply chain/logistics and their part in providing timely and sufficient information on the supply chain/logistics.

 

[Disney Experience]

It seems to be that way most places. Lots of who you know and getting the information ahead of the masses.

Healthfirst the largest healthcare provider in Brevard County Florida administered the initial vaccinations they first received to their staff (As was expected), and then to their staff's family (not what was expected). So who you know definitely made a difference in that county. (But since the fact they did this is public, doing it did not generate good PR )

 

[Disney Experience]

You can’t instantly deliver every dose the moment it arrives. If they have received 100M or 200M doses and still only half have been used it’s a problem. It makes perfect sense to me right now. Remember a week ago the percentages were in the 30s. With statistics some times raw numbers matter too, not just percentages. Simple example:

Logistically I will always have some number of doses ready for appointments tomorrow or later this week. Let’s say that number is around 1M for a county. In the beginning when I have received 1.5M doses I use 500K and hold back 1M. It shows I’m only using 33%. Flash forward a few weeks and I have now received 2M total doses so if I used or allocated all available doses for appointments this week I still would be holding the same 1M doses but I’m now at 50% used. Flash forward a month and I have now received 10M doses overall and have the same million waiting to be used this week it now shows I‘ve used 90% of my doses. As the amount of doses received increases the amount “held back“ each week will increase because in most places they are getting the doses 1 day a week and spreading them over the 7 days.

I sometimes hope that the problem is just that. But I would expect as we approach two months into the ramp up of vaccination that the percent used converges towards a high number, not 50% or less. The reason for the perceived discrepancy of shots delivered vs shots in arms should be something that is understood and publicly reported.50% used without explanation of why it is only 50% is not good public relations.

 

[Heppenheimer]

Stay at home order being lifted in California!

California lifts regional stay-at-home orders as ICU crowding eases

California health officials ended the state's regional stay-at-home order on Monday, saying the latest projections for intensive care unit capacity allowed the restrictions to be lifted.

www.cnn.com

The Disneyland forum is about to get interesting again.

 

[Lilofan]

I am In Alabama. If you look at the data we are close to the bottom Of the charts for % of our shots administered. My neighbor is an oncologist who has had both doses. She made it her mission to find vaccine for all of the grandparents in our neighborhood group (3 families that travel and dine together during normal times). We have all spent hours online, on phones and driving around the state to various health departments. As of today all of the grandparents have it (69 and older), 5/6 parents (ages 40-50). Most of that was sheer luck of lingering at the end of the day and hoping for extras and calling pharmacies and health depts over and over. We are very grateful to have gotten it BUT it was very difficult. There is no organization and no way someone with less resources could find a way to get it. I suspect this is why so few in our store have gotten it. We have a ton of vaccine to the point that we now have several counties doing no appt walk ins for anyone over 70 and will give it to people that show up if they have extra. There is no system, no statewide website or phone number and there is only one pharmacy that is it in our county (largest one in the state). Rural counties have excess. I hate to say it but likely bc of their political leanings. When I got mine I asked the 6 nurses if they had side effects. They laughed and said no way they or anyone in their families would take it. We are in a poorly educated and far right state and outside of the cities there is vaccine to be had

I'm amazed that nurses laughed when you asked them that question. For me the side effects were real, fatigued for two days , arm soreness for the same time frame and my workouts in the gym were challenging. For my upcoming second Moderna shot I'm ready with or without the side effects.

 

[Chomama]

I'm amazed that nurses laughed when you asked them that question. For me the side effects were real, fatigued for two days , arm soreness for the same time frame and my workouts in the gym were challenging. For my second Moderna shot I'm ready with or without the side effects.

They laughed because they refuse to take it and think no one should

 

[DisneyCane]

Healthfirst the largest healthcare provider in Brevard County Florida administered the initial vaccinations they first received to their staff (As was expected), and then to their staff's family (not what was expected). So who you know definitely made a difference in that county. (But since the fact they did this is public, doing it did not generate good PR )

Did they administer to family members under 65?

I've heard of hospitals vaccinating people who are 65+ and live in the household with staff after staff. This policy was based upon not knowing if the vaccines prevent transmission which would make somebody 65 or older at higher risk if they live in the household of a healthcare worker than a random person of the same age.

 

[Disney Experience]

Speaking of help dealing with an end point logistics problem for administering covid19 vaccines ( I remember someone in this forum saying In-n-Out and Chick-fil-a know how to handle crowds):

https://www.radio.com/kluv/latest/chick-fil-a-manager-assists-covid-vaccination-drive-thru

 

[Disney Experience]

Did they administer to family members under 65?

I've heard of hospitals vaccinating people who are 65+ and live in the household with staff after staff. This policy was based upon not knowing if the vaccines prevent transmission which would make somebody 65 or older at higher risk if they live in the household of a healthcare worker than a random person of the same age.

It looks like they did from the articles posted at that time. Their rational was that if the family got covid the health worker would have to quarantine and thereby depriving the community of the health care workers services for a few weeks during the pandemic. (There are a few problems with their logic, at least in prioritization)

Health First workers’ spouses vaccinated ahead of general public, sparking anger for some

Though health workers’ families were not specifically provided for in any vaccination plans set by both Florida and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, spouses of Health First associates have already started receiving first doses.

www.clickorlando.com

 

[Lilofan]

Speaking of help dealing with an end point logistics problem for administering covid19 vaccines ( I remember someone in this forum saying In-n-Out and Chick-fil-a know how to handle crowds):

https://www.radio.com/kluv/latest/chick-fil-a-manager-assists-covid-vaccination-drive-thru

At the very least they better give that a guy and his family a Moderna shot.

 

[DisneyCane]

I am In Alabama. If you look at the data we are close to the bottom Of the charts for % of our shots administered. My neighbor is an oncologist who has had both doses. She made it her mission to find vaccine for all of the grandparents in our neighborhood group (3 families that travel and dine together during normal times). We have all spent hours online, on phones and driving around the state to various health departments. As of today all of the grandparents have it (69 and older), 5/6 parents (ages 40-50). Most of that was sheer luck of lingering at the end of the day and hoping for extras and calling pharmacies and health depts over and over. We are very grateful to have gotten it BUT it was very difficult. There is no organization and no way someone with less resources could find a way to get it. I suspect this is why so few in our state have gotten it. We have a ton of vaccine to the point that we now have several counties doing no appt walk ins for anyone over 70 and will give it to people that show up if they have extra. There is no system, no statewide website or phone number and there is only one pharmacy that is it in our county (largest one in the state). Rural counties have excess. I hate to say it but likely bc of their political leanings. When I got mine I asked the 6 nurses if they had side effects. They laughed and said no way they or anyone in their families would take it. We are in a poorly educated and far right state and outside of the cities there is vaccine to be had. In summary, it is a mess.

Although people in rural Alabama might be poorly educated, the nurses aren't. They all had to have post high school education and complete nursing school. What you experienced is more from people who believe crazy conspiracy theories than people who lack education.

Distrust in government and reluctance to be vaccinated occurs at both ends of the political spectrum just for different reasons.

 

[JAKECOTCenter]

https://www.wesh.com/article/sports...ed-as-fema-covid-vaccination-centers/35306231 Good move.

 

[DisneyCane]

It looks like they did from the articles posted at that time. Their rational was that if the family got covid the health worker would have to quarantine and thereby depriving the community of the health care workers services for a few weeks during the pandemic. (There are a few problems with their logic, at least in prioritization)

Health First workers’ spouses vaccinated ahead of general public, sparking anger for some

Though health workers’ families were not specifically provided for in any vaccination plans set by both Florida and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, spouses of Health First associates have already started receiving first doses.

www.clickorlando.com

I don't know what consequence somebody could come up with but that practice (if the way it is presented in the article is correct) clearly violated Governor Desantis' executive order given on 12/23/2020.

 

[mmascari]

I can’t say what’s going on everywhere in the country, but where I live we have the capacity to do many more vaccinations a day. We just need the shots.

In an email last Friday, the Broward County Mayor said they have stopped negotiating with the State to use leftover CARES act funds to increase the capacity to give shots because the capacity without the additional funding exceeds the expected supply. He said they are currently administering around 25,000 doses a week and have the capacity to do over 50,000.

States are saying that they're running out, yet, they have still to deliver half the doses given to them.

Past posters have wondered why are the reported shot usage less than 50% when end points are saying they can get shots in the arm if they are given shots.

Recent anecdotal evidence is that shots are the limiting factor, that site have the ability to administer shots, but do not have the shots.
Yet reported usage is under 50%.

It would seem that reconciling these two conflicting data points would be worthwhile by authorities even if only to increase public confidence.

All of these can be true at the same time. There's nuance, or missing nuance in all of the reporting. It's likely they're not all talking about the same thing.

We like to read these as if there's just one distribution channel. But, it's not that simple. My guess, based on our state and county reporting is that the reporting on "total distributed to states" is a top line number, every dose shipped. While the "states running out" is more likely a "state controls the distribution channel" number. There's an obvious gap there, all the doses the state gave to another entity to distribute. Reports seem to be consistent that those distribution channels are not performing as well. Especially hospitals.

They only schedule what they know will get both doses. So if a county is told only 50 doses a day delivery they have to hold enough back for the 2nd dose =25 people with appointments. They are "running out" of being able to schedule more people because the county has not been allocated more.
My step-dads first dose isn't scheduled until Feb 20th, both his doses in essence already accounted for in Indiana.

This isn't the same everywhere and is very dependent on the state and county. There doesn't appear to be any guideline, so every state and county has it's own plan. Plus every other distribution channel has it's own plan too.

In my county, the county finds out over the weekend how many doses they'll get on Tuesday. Sometimes they don't find out until Monday and it's not consistent. Because of this, they don't schedule much until Monday when they have the numbers. They get two numbers from the state, how many total doses and how many are reserved for second shots. Something like 11,900 doses, 4,600 are for second doses. Then, Monday night the pool of 200,000 who are eligible based on phase try to sign up for those 7,300 spots. Including people who could get it through a different channel but haven't been able to yet. Before the week ends the county will have given out all 11,900 doses and could have done more.

Our governor is particularly upset with the nongovernmental distribution channels, since that seems to be the largest gap for whatever reasons.