Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[GoofGoof]

I'll be damned; maybe the "Sweden" method is working

What’s the Sweden method?

 

[schuelma]

That's a great positivity number. If this truly is the start of a trend maybe my mid-November trip could actually happen!

 

[Jrb1979]

What’s the Sweden method?

No lockdowns and no rules as some believe that's what happened. When in fact they did have restrictions and limited capacity at all restaurants. The majority of their population worked from home and most stayed home when they could. Don't let those facts get in the way.

 

[Piebald]

I know this is WDW but I've been to all their parks now and am at Universal today.

I've got to say, people who have said Universal is doing a better job than Disney are insane. Universal as a resort is following the right steps (and in one case even excelling versus disney where they force sanitizer into your palms before every ride) but it is SO BUSY. The waits right now are insane. 140min for Hulk, 75 for Shrek. They are clearly not putting a cap on the parks. If we didnt have express pass I have no idea what we would do.

I've been here many times before and it was usually not too busy but JFC this is bad, and I'm not trying to be hyperbolic. I mean good for them for packing the house in (I overheard a TM asking people in queue how their day was and where they were from...lots from Texas) with tourists but man...

I get that attractions have limited occupancy but Shrek being 75 minutes is concerning even if they only allowed 25% of folks every 2 rows. There is no spacing when walking around and the queue markers are often ignored.

 

[Jwink]

I hate to be Debbie Downer but I’m still really concerned that Florida will be... too ‘Florida-y’ and throw caution to the wind... then BOOM...

Good thing they are delaying school openings to be smart and let the numbers contin.... oh.... wait

 

[GoofGoof]

No lockdowns and no rules as some believe that's what happened. When in fact they did have restrictions and limited capacity at all restaurants. The majority of their population worked from home and most stayed home when they could. Don't let those facts get in the way.

What FL did was not the Sweden model. They had stay at home orders and then re-opened just like the majority of the US. They just moved a little too quickly and without masks. People got over confident and celebrated victory prematurely. Then the summer wave hit. As a result of the massive spike in cases they eventually reacted and shut down bars, limited indoor dining capacity at restaurants and the largest population center of Miami implemented even further restrictions. Most of the urban centers put in mask rules even if the state refused to do a statewide mandate. It’s revisionist history to say Florida did nothing and was successful in taming the virus. If anything the curve of cases is further evidence that masks, social distancing, no bars and a restriction on large gatherings works. Before those things were implemented the cases were rising steadily. After the restrictions cases fell.

 

[GoofGoof]

I hate to be Debbie Downer but I’m still really concerned that Florida will be... too ‘Florida-y’ and throw caution to the wind... then BOOM...

Good thing they are delaying school openings to be smart and let the numbers contin.... oh.... wait

Maybe people learned the lesson from the “lost summer”. I am a bit nervous about the desire to have football games with fans in the stands. God I’d love to be able to go to tailgates and a game right now, but it’s just not a good idea. We need to have some self control and show restraint or you are right...we will be right back in the same boat.

 

[Rteetz]

 

[SamusAranX]

No lockdowns and no rules as some believe that's what happened. When in fact they did have restrictions and limited capacity at all restaurants. The majority of their population worked from home and most stayed home when they could. Don't let those facts get in the way.

thank you, rude sir, for speaking for me and putting words in my mouth.

@GoofGoof there is a reason I put “Sweden” in quotation marks. Their model had some restrictions but for the most part did not actually impose a strict mandate and lockdown; rather they emphasized personal responsibility and encouraged working from home and so on; whether intentional or just pure bumbling, after lifting the partial lockdown this has been somewhat similar to what Florida did; no statewide mask mandate; encourage personal distancing and responsibility ; companies voluntarily working from home (mine has been allowed to be back in person for months but has actively encouraged us to keep working from home).

does it work? That will be up for hindsight to debate. I will just keep wearing my mask and avoiding crowded places, but I can’t speak for everyone else. We’ve also agreed before that reopening schools in person can be disastrous in more ways then one, for Florida and for any other state

 

[LittleBuford]

does it work? That will be up for hindsight to debate.

We already know that it resulted in many more deaths in Sweden than in other Scandinavian countries.

 

[lazyboy97o]

We already know that it resulted in many more deaths in Sweden than in other Scandinavian countries.

And no amusement parks this summer.

 

[SamusAranX]

We already know that it resulted in many more deaths in Sweden than in other Scandinavian countries.

I don’t think it’s fair to make comparisons until the dust settles. The other Scandinavian counties are experiencing spikes and second waves that Sweden so far has avoided

 

[Jrb1979]

thank you, rude sir, for speaking for me and putting words in my mouth.

@GoofGoof there is a reason I put “Sweden” in quotation marks. Their model had some restrictions but for the most part did not actually impose a strict mandate and lockdown; rather they emphasized personal responsibility and encouraged working from home and so on; whether intentional or just pure bumbling, after lifting the partial lockdown this has been somewhat similar to what Florida did; no statewide mask mandate; encourage personal distancing and responsibility ; companies voluntarily working from home (mine has been allowed to be back in person for months but has actively encouraged us to keep working from home).

does it work? That will be up for hindsight to debate. I will just keep wearing my mask and avoiding crowded places, but I can’t speak for everyone else. We’ve also agreed before that reopening schools in person can be disastrous in more ways then one, for Florida and for any other state

I wasn't trying to be rude, just tired of hearing about the Sweden comparison.

 

[LittleBuford]

I don’t think it’s fair to make comparisons until the dust settles. The other Scandinavian counties are experiencing spikes and second waves that Sweden so far has avoided

I suppose it’s not impossible that the numbers will even out over time, but as of 18 August, the Scandinavian death counts are:

Sweden: 5,802
Denmark: 621
Finland: 334
Norway: 262

That’s a pretty stark and (to my mind) telling disparity.

 

[Jrb1979]

I don’t think it’s fair to make comparisons until the dust settles. The other Scandinavian counties are experiencing spikes and second waves that Sweden so far has avoided

I honestly believe why many European countries and parts are of the US are seeing these spikes is from people traveling. Our numbers in Canada have been low due to many not traveling and our border being closed

 

[GoofGoof]

thank you, rude sir, for speaking for me and putting words in my mouth.

@GoofGoof there is a reason I put “Sweden” in quotation marks. Their model had some restrictions but for the most part did not actually impose a strict mandate and lockdown; rather they emphasized personal responsibility and encouraged working from home and so on; whether intentional or just pure bumbling, after lifting the partial lockdown this has been somewhat similar to what Florida did; no statewide mask mandate; encourage personal distancing and responsibility ; companies voluntarily working from home (mine has been allowed to be back in person for months but has actively encouraged us to keep working from home).

does it work? That will be up for hindsight to debate. I will just keep wearing my mask and avoiding crowded places, but I can’t speak for everyone else. We’ve also agreed before that reopening schools in person can be disastrous in more ways then one, for Florida and for any other state

What did FL do that was different from anywhere else in the country that opened too quickly? Their cases spiked like TX and AZ and CA and the rest of the sun belt. They pulled back on re-openings, they closed bars, they reduced capacity for indoor dining, in all of the major population centers they mandated masks. It’s almost exactly what TX did or AZ. The fact that there was no statewide mask mandate is essentially a political stunt where the governor can save face and say he didn’t mandate it, but it’s still mandated most places anyway. The point is that what this has shown us is opening too fast or with too few restrictions resulted in a major spike in cases and eventually actions were taken to reverse that trend.

In Sweden the people self regulated and it wasn’t necessary for the government to do as much. In FL when they opened bars they were jammed with people not following good safety practices and it took governments regulations to reverse that.

 

[GoofGoof]

I honestly believe why many European countries and parts are of the US are seeing these spikes is from people traveling. Our numbers in Canada have been low due to many not traveling and our border being closed

Absolutely true. It’s no coincidence that the spike happened right after Memorial Day which kicks off the summer vacation season. In PA through contact tracing they were able to determine that a substantial amount of the new infections this summer started with people who traveled to hot spots for vacation. This is also why I’m hopeful that as the summer winds down people stay more local and the numbers improve even more.

 

[SamusAranX]

I suppose it’s not impossible that the numbers will even out over time, but as of 18 August, the Scandinavian death counts are:

Sweden: 5,802
Denmark: 621
Finland: 334
Norway: 262

That’s a pretty stark and (to my mind) telling disparity.

not to be flippant but...

Sweden pop. : 10,343,403
Denmark: 5,824,000
Finland: 5,528,000
Norway: 5,432,850

source Wikipedia.
So Sweden should have more deaths yes but the disparity is still there. The issue with Sweden was their failure to protect nursing homes properly. Yet the other night New York’s five or describes his states response as “ beautiful” with 20000 plus deaths.
Again, with waves coming and going and The Who director saying this is here to stay we should wait until it’s all said and done to say what worked for sure and what

 

[SamusAranX]

I honestly believe why many European countries and parts are of the US are seeing these spikes is from people traveling. Our numbers in Canada have been low due to many not traveling and our border being closed

agreed. International travel is a bad idea still imo

 

[SamusAranX]

I wasn't trying to be rude, just tired of hearing about the Sweden comparison.

Apologies; my position isn’t one of that Sweden is necessarily the correct one, just that it will be interesting to see how all the different strategies play out.
With people dying, there are never “winners”.