EPCOT Epcot Forever to debut as interim show before full Reflections of Earth replacement

[hpyhnt 1000]

They’re probably gonna have to change SOMETHING if they want to keep the sustained ADRs and dessert parties profitable

I was thinking about this as well. For me (and I'm sure many others), a big reason for spending an evening at Epcot was because you knew the night was going to end with Reflections of Earth. Don't get me wrong - World Showcase is a great place to be in the evening on its own, but RoE just elevated it so much. And it was the sum of everything, from the pre-show through the show itself to the post-show, that created an atmosphere that was just sublime.

Epcot Forever doesn't come close to matching the ambiance, the grandeur of RoE. It really was the cherry on top of a total experience that made an evening at Epcot so special. I would go out of my way to end a Disney day at Epcot because of RoE; I'm not sure I would do the same with Epcot Forever. TBD if other guests react in the same way.

 

[JohnD]

They’re probably gonna have to change SOMETHING if they want to keep the sustained ADRs and dessert parties profitable

Exactly. Once they start seeing declining revenue from dining packages and dessert parties, they'll change the show pronto.

 

[danlb_2000]

Epcot is an IP by itself... the pavilions, the logos... all.

When people talk about IP use in the parks they are not using it in the general sense but instead are referring to creating attractions based on existing movies and tv shows as opposed to having a clean creative slate to come up with original ideas. Figment is an IP but he was created specifically for the attraction he appeared in.

 

[FigmentJedi]

Can’t wait for the meltdowns from those that don’t realize that HarmoniUS is all IP driven.

I dunno, they've been pretty clear at marketing it as such, so people already have expectations for it to be another IP driven nighttime spectacular.

 

[Dizknee_Phreek]

Exactly. Once they start seeing declining revenue from dining packages and dessert parties, they'll change the show pronto.

Yup!! My husband and I happily paid the hefty price tag for the Illuminations Dining Package at Rose and Crown. NO WAY I would do that for EF.

 

[CJR]

After watching this, I can honestly say that we were all (my family) disappointed. My DW asked me if we'll have to stay during future trips to Epcot to watch this. We agreed that it felt random and disorganized. I've talked to a lot of people that feel the same way and it seems to be echoed here on WDWMagic.

It will be interesting to see how the lagoon area looks about a month from now, in that gap between Halloween and Thanksgiving. That'll be really telling.

If things like dessert parties and ADR's fall apart, it'll be interesting to see what they do. Improve the existing show? Bring back Reflections of Earth (still possible, I'd guess)? Bump up HarmoniUS? Just close Epcot without a show? I'm very curious.

Any major changes probably won't happen until January at the earliest, and the Candlelight Processional should prop Epcot up over the holidays. They'll really need to deliver on the holiday tag this year though.

 

[HauntedPirate]

Just watched a video of last night's first show. Initial thoughts:

- The kites look really cool. Seriously well done.
- Fireworks are good. I enjoyed some of the variety, and coupled with the lasers they created some great visuals. I can't decide, however, if they are good because of quality or quantity, because a lot seem like they were included just to woo the "we love fireworks!" crowd.

That's about it for the good, sadly. Now...

- Music: I didn't really care for it, to be honest. I couldn't help but think - "This is an ADD nightmare". 3-5 second snippets of songs stitched together, jumping from one song/pavilion to the next. In fact, at one point there were 3 different song bites in the span of about 5 seconds, leading up to the "Cha-cha-cha". Nothing is allowed to breathe or build to anything but the next 3 second song snippet. And the re-recordings, IMHO, aren't all that great, and lack the soul of the originals, which seems to be par for the Iger/Chapek course. In fact, I'm kind of surprised they didn't brand these as "timeless re-recordings".
- Not a fan of the child narration. It feels out of place, almost pandering.
- Who is the "EPCOT Center fan" that they were trying to appeal to, exactly? It honestly felt like a bunch of executives who think they know what EPCOT Center was about decided to green-light a show, plus "give some tips" to the show designers about what to include, based on a PowerPoint presentation they saw one time about EPCOT Center.
- The Walt quotes felt insulting to me, like, "Hey, if we trot out some audio from that old dead guy we'll really win over those annoying old park fans!". "Always in a state of becoming" is translated into, "See? Even Walt supports what we're doing!". No. Just... no.
- The ending... Whiskey tango foxtrot. That felt like the tractor pushing the last pile of dirt onto the grave of what was a great theme park. I, sadly, have little optimism left about the future of Epcot.

I'd like to see it in person, and hopefully will next year, but my initial reaction is... this is not something I'd go out of my way to see more than once. I can't see how this is going to get any better than lukewarm reactions over the next year. I can't and won't say it's a disaster, because there are parts which are genuinely well done, like the kites. But 'hot garbage' isn't out of the realm of possibility right now.

 

[JohnD]

After watching this, I can honestly say that we were all (my family) disappointed. My DW asked me if we'll have to stay during future trips to Epcot to watch this. We agreed that it felt random and disorganized. I've talked to a lot of people that feel the same way and it seems to be echoed here on WDWMagic.

It will be interesting to see how the lagoon area looks about a month from now, in that gap between Halloween and Thanksgiving. That'll be really telling.

If things like dessert parties and ADR's fall apart, it'll be interesting to see what they do. Improve the existing show? Bring back Reflections of Earth (still possible, I'd guess)? Bump up HarmoniUS? Just close Epcot without a show? I'm very curious.

Any major changes probably won't happen until January at the earliest, and the Candlelight Processional should prop Epcot up over the holidays. They'll really need to deliver on the holiday tag this year though.

An earlier post mentioned something about they couldn't run ROE while still developing HarmoniUS. But they can do EF as a stopgap. Someone with better knowledge about this can fill us in.

 

[wdwperry]

Just watched a video of last night's first show. Initial thoughts:

- The kites look really cool. Seriously well done.
- Fireworks are good. I enjoyed some of the variety, and coupled with the lasers they created some great visuals. I can't decide, however, if they are good because of quality or quantity, because a lot seem like they were included just to woo the "we love fireworks!" crowd.

That's about it for the good, sadly. Now...

- Music: I didn't really care for it, to be honest. I couldn't help but think - "This is an ADD nightmare". 3-5 second snippets of songs stitched together, jumping from one song/pavilion to the next. In fact, at one point there were 3 different song bites in the span of about 5 seconds, leading up to the "Cha-cha-cha". Nothing is allowed to breathe or build to anything but the next 3 second song snippet. And the re-recordings, IMHO, aren't all that great, and lack the soul of the originals, which seems to be par for the Iger/Chapek course. In fact, I'm kind of surprised they didn't brand these as "timeless re-recordings".
- Not a fan of the child narration. It feels out of place, almost pandering.
- Who is the "EPCOT Center fan" that they were trying to appeal to, exactly? It honestly felt like a bunch of executives who think they know what EPCOT Center was about decided to green-light a show, plus "give some tips" to the show designers about what to include, based on a PowerPoint presentation they saw one time about EPCOT Center.
- The Walt quotes felt insulting to me, like, "Hey, if we trot out some audio from that old dead guy we'll really win over those annoying old park fans!". "Always in a state of becoming" is translated into, "See? Even Walt supports what we're doing!". No. Just... no.
- The ending... Whiskey tango foxtrot. That felt like the tractor pushing the last pile of dirt onto the grave of what was a great theme park. I, sadly, have little optimism left about the future of Epcot.

I'd like to see it in person, and hopefully will next year, but my initial reaction is... this is not something I'd go out of my way to see more than once. I can't see how this is going to get any better than lukewarm reactions over the next year. I can't and won't say it's a disaster, because there are parts which are genuinely well done, like the kites. But 'hot garbage' isn't out of the realm of possibility right now.

Not sure what they were really aiming for with the show honestly. It seemed so simple to create this show. Make it a best hits of Epcot, focus on one song/pavilion at a time and create a proper ending. Doesn't need to be grand or have a deep meaning since it wont be running too long and isn't meant to be permanent. But based on what I'm seeing on Twitter, the responses are very mixed. Either you love it or hate it.

 

[Spash007]

I was thinking about this as well. For me (and I'm sure many others), a big reason for spending an evening at Epcot was because you knew the night was going to end with Reflections of Earth. Don't get me wrong - World Showcase is a great place to be in the evening on its own, but RoE just elevated it so much. And it was the sum of everything, from the pre-show through the show itself to the post-show, that created an atmosphere that was just sublime.

Epcot Forever doesn't come close to matching the ambiance, the grandeur of RoE. It really was the cherry on top of a total experience that made an evening at Epcot so special. I would go out of my way to end a Disney day at Epcot because of RoE; I'm not sure I would do the same with Epcot Forever. TBD if other guests react in the same way.

I really hope they at least keep the extensive pre-show music somewhat similar. That music when walking through WS for the hour or so prior to RoE really made the park something special.

 

[stitchcastle]

to the people talking about how RoE was long, convoluted and hard to understand. Have fun watching projection slideshows of different iterations of "Friend Like Me" at every park every night. This is what happens when the company just rests their laurels on whatever intellectual property is the most popular and profitable at the time, they stop being ambitious and creative and the audience just accepts it.

 

[flynnibus]

Disney often competes in the American Pyrotechnic Association events, where various companies do one-off shows for demonstrations. To me, this felt very much like one of those. Now those events are fine for one-offs, and are impressive in that context. But for a show that will play nightly for months, if not a year, I feel they could have done much better. Fingers crossed for HarmonioUS. Hopefully drones and new set pieces can save the lagoon show.

Yup.. the show felt more like a generic Fireworks show that had music and some special effects. Maybe this would have been Disney level in the 80s... but not now. This is several generations back.

Its good they incorporated the lights, lasers, and spots.. and the new kites were cool.. but only the kites really felt purpose. There are maybe 1-2 spots where other effects were impactful vs just 'present and accounted for!'

It reminded me very much of 'going to see a fireworks show...' instead of 'going to see a disney nighttime spectacular'.

Wonder who had the woodie for One Little Spark? I hope some people go 'oh, whats that song?' and learn.. but I think rubbing it in people's faces will just continue to boost the noise level about the horrid state of the pavilion.

 

[FigmentJedi]

Wonder who had the woodie for One Little Spark? I hope some people go 'oh, whats that song?' and learn.. but I think rubbing it in people's faces will just continue to boost the noise level about the horrid state of the pavilion.

It's almost like One Little Spark is the only one of the classic Epcot songs that's still in regular use.

 

[Lowtide_Lou]

I have now watched it twice on YouTube and I have to say I am pleasantly surprised, although reading the comments above I am in the minority here.
I thought it started of slow and agree with the majority of comments on the use of the children's voices - not to my taste either, but about a third of the way in it improved massively IMO.
I am from the UK and visit annually if possible, however I am not old enough to know all the music, which I think is the reason I found the start a bit slow. I really like the kite idea, they look good and are something different. I was really worried we were going to get more water screens like RoL and Fantasmic! (love Fantasmic! but leave the screens there), so the kites were a pleasant surprise and reminded me of a puppet parade we used to wait ages for when I was much younger at EPCOT - cannot remember any more about this other than the wind and weather being a huge issue.
Anyway, I was a bit confused with the Aladdin connection to begin with, and not hugely keen, but A Whole New World makes sense once I'd thought about it and it wasn't really tooooo much.
I thought there were quite a lot of fireworks, and overall from having only seen it online I was rather impressed for a temporary show.

Did miss the fountains …..Not so much the floating globe rest part.

 

[tirian]

Yup.. the show felt more like a generic Fireworks show that had music and some special effects. Maybe this would have been Disney level in the 80s... but not now. This is several generations back.

Its good they incorporated the lights, lasers, and spots.. and the new kites were cool.. but only the kites really felt purpose. There are maybe 1-2 spots where other effects were impactful vs just 'present and accounted for!'

It reminded me very much of 'going to see a fireworks show...' instead of 'going to see a disney nighttime spectacular'.

Wonder who had the woodie for One Little Spark? I hope some people go 'oh, whats that song?' and learn.. but I think rubbing it in people's faces will just continue to boost the noise level about the horrid state of the pavilion.

Epcot has never before had a random show. The lasers, pyro, and props were always related to something, even if it was as simple as a tour around the world.

The MK’s classic Fantasy in the Sky is a random collection of fireworks set to music, but the musical selections have been orchestrated into a cohesive presentation. That aspect is glaringly lacking from the latest nighttime shows.

But we can look at the bright side: if DL lived through Light Magic, Epcot can make it through this.

 

[flynnibus]

The MK’s classic Fantasy in the Sky is a random collection of fireworks set to music, but the musical selections have been orchestrated into a cohesive presentation. That aspect is glaringly lacking from the latest nighttime shows.

Yup... its like they said... HEY, remember used clips and tours... let's do that! and like every show since has to fight the urge to just be this collage of pieces glued together.

At least HEA pulls it off respectively with some manipulation of pacing and emotion. This and the DHS shows have been mash-ups at best.

ETA: The MK shows pre-wishes were more 'pure fireworks' like this.. but like I said, that time is past...

 

[TTA94]

HarmonioUS is being produced by Steve Davison, so I hope you like yet another World of Color clone with reused segments and arrangements from other Davison-produced shows.

I don’t think Harmonius will be like WoC. I’m thinking more like Tokyo’s F! as far as barges.

 

[Figments Friend]

A few more thoughts to add to my prior comments here -

I liked the laser effects in this Show.
They were one of the positives.
If you like those upgraded lasers, I thought they did a good job 'showing them off'.
Some cool patterns.
Probably the most laser work I've seen at Epcot to date.

Another aspect I feel a need to comment on is the good looking 'Epcot Forever' shirts and other related merch released yesterday.
I saw many people wearing the shirts in the Park before that evenings debut of the Show.
Some friends also brought me over to the International Gateway gift shop to view the florescent colored 'One Little Spark / Epcot Forever' window displays.
These items looked nice, have the 'retro' stylings, and feature Figment front and center.

Although the merchandise held appeal, in hindsight it was a bit of a misleading presentation.
Looking at the merch gives Epcot fans the impression that Figment is IN the Show.
I feel bad for all the folks who bought the merch and now, having seen the show, feel 'duped'.
Obviously, Figment is only on there to motivate merch sales which Marketing knows will sell regardless of how mediocre the dragon's current Attraction is and his total lack of involvement in 'Epcot Forever'.

Can I also say that as a hardcore long time fan of the Original Imagination Attraction, it was very jarring to hear a quote from the current version of the ride in what is supposed to be a nostalgia show?
Instead of 'Imagination works the best when it's set free!', it would have made a far better impact if they quoted the Original -

"Imagination is something that belongs to all of us."
"It's your key to unlock the hidden wonders of our world"

Far more appropriate.

-

 

[MaximumEd]

Will be seeing this show live next spring, but couldn’t resist and just watched the Disney Parks Blog stream. Let me preface this by saying that I’m a lifelong Epcot fan since I first visited in 1986, and ROE is my all time favorite Disney nighttime show. Epcot Forever just didn’t do it for me. I know it’s supposed to be temporary, but it just seemed like a disjointed clip show. The fireworks, kites, and lasers were all really good, but it lacked the emotional impact that ROE had in spades. ROE always hit me in the feels and brought a sense of hope and togetherness in a way that nothing else I’ve seen at WDW ever came close to. This show had none of that intangible “feel”. Quite disappointing for me. The kid singers and narration also gets a thumbs down, and the Walt quote sounded like it was thrown in as an excuse to finish demolishing everything that made Epcot the most unique and inspiring park in the world.

 

[mightynine]

This may have been said somewhere - are they offering FP+ for Epcot Forever like they did for Illuminations?

Because man, I feel bad for someone who uses one of their initial 3 on that show. (But then, it never made sense to use it for Illuminations either.)