DHS Mickey and Minnie's Runaway Railway confirmed

No Name

No Name

Well-Known Member
TJJohn12 said:
I was vaguely with you until your last paragraph. The “problem” as you’re describing it is not IP persay, but the execution of the IP’s use and it’s underlying message.

All the examples you explicitly listed are IP based. Heck, the park itself when it opened was IP branded - it had the MGM Lion in its logo.

I think the shift you’re feeling from MGM to DHS is one of thematic consistency that started much further back than you peg it. You’re right in that the original theme of the park could have been phrased, “respect and honor of the craft of filmmaking.” But I actually think that theme started to break down when they added ToT. It’s the first fully realized environment in the park. They never roll the styrofoam boulder back up the track. You never see the steel girders behind the false flats. You *are* stepping into the Twilight Zone, not the set of a TZ episode in production.

The ToT’s theme is not “respect for filmmaking,” in that it doesn’t acknowledge it’s a false environment. Its theme is more akin to “the fantastic and impossible is possible.” And almost every addition to the park since then has trended more toward this line (with the exception of LAM).

MMRR feels thematically consistent with the newer theme of DHS, which is really that the fantasy lands of film and entertainment can be real. Here, the world of Mickey’s cartoons is a real place you get sucked into.

I don’t think that people are chafing at “no theme,” I think they’re chafing at a theme they don’t like and that is more fantasy based than grounded in “reality.”
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“The fantasy lands of film and entertainment can be real.” In that case, what makes Cars Land, Pandora, etc. not fit in DHS though? Heck, does every attraction Disney has built stateside since 2006 inherently fit in DHS?

I think Star Tours and TSMM are better examples of how the shift started further back. The ToT is not exactly the same because you’re ironically shown and told exactly what’s about to happen on the ride before you are directly invited to experience it for yourself. On the ride, everything happens just as you were told, with narration too. What other ride does that? Guests are actively and consciously stepping into the lost episode. Here’s the difference... Galaxy’s Edge avoids the Star Wars logo because it doesn’t make thematic sense, whereas ToT incorporates the Twilight Zone intro and logo in the story of the attraction. The former is ignoring the fact that it’s a media franchise, the latter is incorporating the fact that it’s a media franchise.

Explicitly acknowledging the false environment as you mention with the girders and whatnot sometimes has the adverse effect of pulling you out of the story rather than pulling you into it. That was one of the problems with the original park. But the ToT is well-executed, in my opinion, and I think that’s a widely-shared opinion. It is fantasy-based and that’s central to the story.

MMRR sounds like it’s in the same vein as the ToT, GMR, or even RnRC which I think has proven most compelling among guests. I’m excited for that.
 
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TJJohn12

TJJohn12

Well-Known Member
egg said:
“The fantasy lands of film and entertainment can be real.” In that case, what makes Cars Land, Pandora, etc. not fit in DHS though? Heck, does every attraction Disney has built stateside since 2006 inherently fit in DHS?

I think Star Tours and TSMM are better examples of how the shift started further back. The ToT is not exactly the same because you’re ironically shown and told exactly what’s about to happen on the ride before you are directly invited to experience it for yourself. On the ride, everything happens just as you were told, with narration too. What other ride does that? Guests are actively and consciously stepping into the lost episode. Here’s the difference... Galaxy’s Edge avoids the Star Wars logo because it doesn’t make thematic sense, whereas ToT incorporates the Twilight Zone intro and logo in the story of the attraction. The former is ignoring the fact that it’s a media franchise, the latter is incorporating the fact that it’s a media franchise.

Explicitly acknowledging the false environment as you mention with the girders and whatnot sometimes has the adverse effect of pulling you out of the story rather than pulling you into it. That was one of the problems with the original park. But the ToT is well-executed, in my opinion, and I think that’s a widely-shared opinion. It is fantasy-based and that’s central to the story.

MMRR sounds like it’s in the same vein as the ToT, GMR, or even RnRC which I think has proven most compelling among guests. I’m excited for that.
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Again, I'm buying most of what you're selling. I think ToT is the entering wedge, and TSMM walked in through the door it began opening. I don't quite see Star Tours as the same thing, in so much as the AT-AT and Ewok village have exposed girders ala Streets of New York, and Tatooine Traders has had (until recently) rigging, flats, and lighting equipment. I can't find interior shots of Endor Vendors, so I'm not sure what was there in '89. For me, that's still a "Hot Set" style theme, versus a fully realized environment.

I personally appreciate the newer theming over the old school exposed girders precisely for the reason you state - it was an immersion in an inherently false place.

As for whether Carsland or Pandora would fit in DHS - I think you're right. They would. And I think you're spot on that almost anything they've built lately stateside (at least from scratch) likely would as well. But I wager that's an artifact of the competition changing the game and broader public expectations. Because Universal's claim-to-fame is "ride the movies" and that bends towards immersion, then what's built to compete in the same markets will bend likewise. Pandora is an immersive film-fantasy-come-to-life environment because Hogsmeade and Diagon Alley are.

I'm stoked for MMRR because it fits the newer theme of DHS like a glove, as well as the theme of the area it's set in (Hollywood Blvd. and the Grauman's is a perfect setting for a grand premiere conceit). It's a perfect "the door opens to a fantasy world for you" experience. And being inside one of the park's icons is icing on the cake.
 
mikejs78

mikejs78

Well-Known Member
egg said:
The Tower of Terror isn’t just a ride set in the universe of the Twilight Zone, guests are shown old footage of a lost episode until they ironically choose to experience the horrors for themselves. On RnRC riders are just looking at the recoding studio until they feel the thrill of being whisked to backstage of a concert. On the Great Movie Ride guests are passive viewers until their tour becomes part of the movies. The Indiana Jones stunt show displays impressive stunts before highlighting the production as guests join the performance itself. Animation building, backlot tour, streets of Hollywood, etc.
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The problem is here, that what you state here is a plot device, not a theme. Now, normally I wouldn't care about such technical minutae, but you are the one who has been pushing the idea that modern DHS has no proper theme. And when pressed, you don't seem to be able to come up with anything for old MGM that fits the definition of theme.

Regarding things fitting in multiple parks - sure, but that's always been the case. Small World, Carousel of Progress, PeopleMover could all easily fit into Epcot. Jungle Cruise into DAK. That's not really an argument.
 
No Name

No Name

Well-Known Member
I find it concerning when folks argue that because something was never strong there’s no reason to expect or push for it to be strong in the future. It goes against the whole idea of progress and society’s longterm history of it.

mikejs78 said:
The problem is here, that what you state here is a plot device, not a theme. Now, normally I wouldn't care about such technical minutae, but you are the one who has been pushing the idea that modern DHS has no proper theme. And when pressed, you don't seem to be able to come up with anything for old MGM that fits the definition of theme.

Regarding things fitting in multiple parks - sure, but that's always been the case. Small World, Carousel of Progress, PeopleMover could all easily fit into Epcot. Jungle Cruise into DAK. That's not really an argument.
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I thought I explained it fairly well, but in the words you specifically quoted, yes there are a lot of plot devices present. And that’s my fault. For what it’s worth I’m actually impressed you were able to identify that. Some people don’t even know what setting is.

To your second paragraph, the difference is that every major attraction Disney’s opened stateside in the last 12 years would supposedly fit in this one park. That’s never remotely been the case. If Bob Iger and his successors were to continue this trend forever, and I don’t see an end particularly soon, would all of the parks have the same base “theme” as DHS, just with additional primary themes of their own?

MisterPenguin said:
This is where the rub is, when I point out the inconsistencies they don't think they have.
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The problem is that, when you point out inconsistencies, it helps to have a base level understanding of what you’re taking about. Conversations like this unfortunately reveal more inconsistencies in your own understanding of the subject. Or quips like this simply ignore pages of criticism. Sometimes your posts are well-informed and well-written (even if I disagree), but I just wish that were the case more often. I think I’m finished here, carry on.
 
Smooth

Smooth

Well-Known Member
390402
 
TJJohn12

TJJohn12

Well-Known Member
mikejs78 said:
Not a theme by the literary definition that @egg us using.
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I’ll give @egg some play in their tighter definition though - good constructive themes for experience planning (in the broader interpretive world) usually have an emotion or human universal somewhere inside (love, joy, exploration, loss, heartbreak...).

“The Hollywood that never was and always will be...” is still just a topic, not a theme persay.

That said, most themes that are useful for complex planning don’t show up in the title or headline of a project. “Frontierland” isn’t a theme, it’s a topic and timeframe like DHS’s “Hollywood...” line is. But Walt’s dedication speech pushed to the true thematic elements: faith, courage, and ingenuity.
 
mikejs78

mikejs78

Well-Known Member
TJJohn12 said:
I’ll give @egg some play in their tighter definition though - good constructive themes for experience planning (in the broader interpretive world) usually have an emotion or human universal somewhere inside (love, joy, exploration, loss, heartbreak...).

“The Hollywood that never was and always will be...” is still just a topic, not a theme persay.

That said, most themes that are useful for complex planning don’t show up in the title or headline of a project. “Frontierland” isn’t a theme, it’s a topic and timeframe like DHS’s “Hollywood...” line is. But Walt’s dedication speech pushed to the true thematic elements: faith, courage, and ingenuity.
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Ok, now since no one else can come up with it, I'd argue that DHS's theme for both the old and new incarnations is human creativity, wonder, and inagination. In old MGM, it was about the creative process in regards to film, TV, music, etc. In new DHS, it's about the incredible worlds that are imagined and brought to life through these media.

So DHS theme has not or is not changing; rather its topic is changing, and both incarnations are equally thematic.
 
Cmdr_Crimson

Cmdr_Crimson

Well-Known Member
Surferboy567 said:
Such sad news, she’s been Minnie for my entire life. I’d imagine they recorded runaway railway very far in advance...would they make this her last time as Minnie, or maybe they have lots more shorts not aired yet. Such an amazing talent.
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There are probably a few more shorts that were done and also the new Minnie's holiday Firework show at MK will have her voice being used I'm sure.
 
Magenta Panther

Magenta Panther

Well-Known Member
brb1006 said:
After the news of Russi Taylor's passing, Elyse Willis shared this photo of Russi during a recording session for Runaway Railway.


The latest Mickey Mouse short "Carried Away" also marked the last short that aired while she was still alive.


Bob Iger's statement on Russi's passing
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That's one of the most charming of the new Mickey cartoons. (But whoa, that poor mouse. He's giving a certain coyote a run for his money...).

Very sad to read about Russi Taylor. What a great voice actress, and what a phenomenal career. She and her Wayne are singing a Silly Symphony in heaven right now. Rest well, Russi. :cry:
 

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