Hurricane Irma

[halltd]

It's been 3 days for south Florida residents. And a lot of them are being told 1 week or more from now by FPL.

I always lived in a downtown area, or high tourist/business area. I was lucky that my power was restored faster than most.. and even then it was longer than it should have been.
I know that FPL is not taking their time intentionally and that they are working incredibly hard.. I have a ton of respect for everyone out there. I just think expectations were higher this time, because they were pitched as such. My heart's breaking for those who are not only stuck outside of their county without knowing when they can return, and also dealing with power outages at the places they are stuck... relying on other people to keep them up to date on their hometown. I hope it ends soon.

I was without power, water, and cell service for two weeks after Wilma. I'd say two days getting power back and never losing cell service or water is a good thing.

 

[danlb_2000]

The problem last time was the power everywhere- gas stations, traffic lights, homes.. and so many without water. Worst case for power restoration in homes was nearly a month in some areas, and that was a major hurricane with the previous poles and lines etc, coming on the back of many other hurricanes in a year's time.. FPL has, as I said, spent $2billion dollars on improvements since, because of what happened in that year.

So it sounds like things are better this time despite the fact that this storm did very wide spread damage. Earlier you said...

"I'll add that it does not appear to be a total repeat of the mid 2000s from what I'm hearing.. more gas stations are open, power is being restored in many places- all of that is a huge positive."

Last time was a month, and this time they are saying two weeks. Looks like money on improvements was well spent.

 

[Dubman]

A friend sent this to me and he knows how huge of a Disney fan we are. Told him that would have been helpful over a week ago.

 

[DisAl]

I'll say this again, I understand why people who are being told "2 weeks" are upset. The new improvements should have made this easier, even with the widespread outages. This isn't equipment that has been beat down by 7 consecutive landfall hurricanes as it was in those 2 years.. the equipment is mostly "new and improved", almost all of it.

Anything is easy if you don't know what it takes to do it.... I do not mean this to be a personal attack, but you don't have a clue.
No matter how robust the line construction is, the power is still going to go out when storm debris is blown into the power line.
No matter how modern the substation is, it is still going to be damaged if it is flooded.
Nobody wants their trees trimmed when the weather is good, but blame the utility for not doing it when the weather is bad.
And somebody is going to be first, and somebody is going to be last.
One other thing most people don't think about is that underground electric cables have a finite lifetime and must be replaced more often than overhead facilities.
Disclaimer - No, I do not and never have worked for FPL, but did work with another utility in another state for 40 years.

 

[danlb_2000]

The problem last time was the power everywhere- gas stations, traffic lights, homes.. and so many without water. Worst case for power restoration in homes was nearly a month in some areas, and that was a major hurricane with the previous poles and lines etc, coming on the back of many other hurricanes in a year's time.. FPL has, as I said, spent $2billion dollars on improvements since, because of what happened in that year.

ETA.. wanted to respond to your above comment, That's exactly why people are angry.. if it would have been longer "if improvements hadn't been made" then wth is going to happen when another major hurricane does hit that highly populated area? It's the highest populated in the state, thankfully no one had to find out the answer this time.. but there will be a 'next' at some point.

Not sure what you are getting at in your last statement. You can't make a power system that is 100% reliable (well you probably could if you put out obscene amounts of money), so it's a matter of continuing to make things more resilient. Maybe the next major storm it will only be one week to get all the power restored.

 

[flynnibus]

good lord... I know there is at least one area I wish we could get some improvements.

Stop going round and round here!!

 

[Nubs70]

How long before WDW begins to market hurricane packages?

 

[21stamps]

Anything is easy if you don't know what it takes to do it.... I do not mean this to be a personal attack, but you don't have a clue.
No matter how robust the line construction is, the power is still going to go out when storm debris is blown into the power line.
No matter how modern the substation is, it is still going to be damaged if it is flooded.
Nobody wants their trees trimmed when the weather is good, but blame the utility for not doing it when the weather is bad.
And somebody is going to be first, and somebody is going to be last.
One other thing most people don't think about is that underground electric cables have a finite lifetime and must be replaced more often than overhead facilities.
Disclaimer - No, I do not and never have worked for FPL, but did work with another utility in another state for 40 years.

That was part of the "improvements", the tree trimming etc. It is proven time and time again in SoFla that underground lines are best (these are things you pay attention to when buying a home there, or after experiencing a prolonged outage in your home and community, even without having the knowledge of an electrician). Many areas have them, many communities have them, cities have voted for them...but they are only as good as the system outside of them.

This is where FPL should focus more on improvements imo. Get more people underground. Get all of SoFla underground. This way when a Major Hurricane does actually hit the area again, and if it is a strong Cat 3 or higher, you aren't dealing with even worse scenarios than the past. It's been 12 years.. I can't imagine that the area will be lucky enough to see 12 more without a major hurricane.

 

[JohnD]

How long before WDW begins to market hurricane packages?

True. When else do you get to interact and dance with characters for free (i.e. Not another cost beyond your resort stay) instead of standing in line or paying for a character meal.

 

[Nubs70]

True. When else do you get to interact and dance with characters for free (i.e. Not another cost beyond your resort stay) instead of standing in line or paying for a character meal.

Like years ago with free.roaming characters and not being funneled into meet n gropes.

 

[21stamps]

Not sure what you are getting at in your last statement. You can't make a power system that is 100% reliable (well you probably could if you put out obscene amounts of money), so it's a matter of continuing to make things more resilient. Maybe the next major storm it will only be one week to get all the power restored.

Sorry, wish I would have seen this on my last.. final post on the subject, just wanted to answer.. and the post of yours prior.
The last time (Wilma) was a major hurricane, Irma was not, not in that area.
No one is expecting 100% power at all times in SoFla, that's unreasonable. They are expecting to be able to live there without experiencing weeks of power outages. That's all. Not arguing or even debating, just explaining what was told to everyone after the mid 2000s.
This storm could have been so much worse on that area, and I think the whole country, but especially SoFla is grateful that it wasn't what was predicted there. Make no mistake, I'm sure every PBC/Miami/Broward resident will happily take their power situation over trading places with any resident of the Keys.

 

[danlb_2000]

That was part of the "improvements", the tree trimming etc. It is proven time and time again in SoFla that underground lines are best (these are things you pay attention to when buying a home there, or after experiencing a prolonged outage in your home and community, even without having the knowledge of an electrician). Many areas have them, many communities have them, cities have voted for them...but they are only as good as the system outside of them.

This is where FPL should focus more on improvements imo. Get more people underground. Get all of SoFla underground. This way when a Major Hurricane does actually hit the area again, and if it is a strong Cat 3 or higher, you aren't dealing with even worse scenarios than the past. It's been 12 years.. I can't imagine that the area will be lucky enough to see 12 more without a major hurricane.

I don't think you understand the magnitude of the project that would be required to move a large amount of wiring underground....

"North Carolina's Utility Commission looked into burying power lines after more than 2 million homes were left without electricity in the storms of 2002. Th commission found that the project would cost $41 billion, take 25 years to complete, and would require that customers' electricity rates nearly double to pay for it — leading the commission to conclude that it would be "prohibitively expensive.""

https://www.mnn.com/earth-matters/climate-weather/stories/why-doesnt-america-bury-its-power-lines

 

[21stamps]

I don't think you understand the magnitude of the project that would be required to move a large amount of wiring underground....

"North Carolina's Utility Commission looked into burying power lines after more than 2 million homes were left without electricity in the storms of 2002. Th commission found that the project would cost $41 billion, take 25 years to complete, and would require that customers' electricity rates nearly double to pay for it — leading the commission to conclude that it would be "prohibitively expensive.""

https://www.mnn.com/earth-matters/climate-weather/stories/why-doesnt-america-bury-its-power-lines

I can't post links right now. But you can look it up.. many areas in SoFla already have it.. and many who weren't built with it have made the conversion. It is costly. Most people are willing to pay more for it. That's why the conversions have been done.

Take the math on the areas who don't have it and subtract the amount that is spent after each hurricane.. in the long run it's better.

 

[danlb_2000]

I can't post links right now. But you can look it up.. many areas in SoFla already have it.. and many who weren't built with it have made the conversion. It is costly. Most people are willing to pay more for it. That's why the conversions have been done.

Take the math and subtract the amount that is spent after each hurricane.. in the long run it's better.

Looking at how many power outages there were in southern Florida, maybe underground wires weren't the answer.

 

[21stamps]

Looking at how many power outages there were in southern Florida, maybe underground wires weren't the answer.

The underground areas still come back faster than the others, at least they always have in the past. I don't know all of the answers, but something has to be better than now.

 

[peter11435]

Take the math on the areas who don't have it and subtract the amount that is spent after each hurricane.. in the long run it's better.

If that was truly the case it would be done

 

[21stamps]

If that was truly the case it would be done

It's what should have been done from the beginning and then the costs would have been spread out over a longer period of time. Can't change the past, but in recent years they should have spent more money on going underground instead of their new poles and wires..just look at the restoration and lack of common outages that the underground communities experience. My opinion anyway...which in the grand scheme doesn't matter much.lol. I hope to see more areas making the switch over time though. At some point they will get another direct hit, this time they got lucky.

 

[danlb_2000]

The underground areas still come back faster than the others, at least they always have in the past. I don't know all of the answers, but something has to be better than now.

Yes, things can always be better, but it all still comes down to what people are willing to pay, and despite what you might think, there are limits to how much increase in their utility bills people will accept. Hopefully over the next few months we will see an assessment of the recovery effort during this storm compared to previous storms.

 

[21stamps]

I was without power, water, and cell service for two weeks after Wilma. I'd say two days getting power back and never losing cell service or water is a good thing.

I would too! I'm talking about the people being told "weeks". Not days.. a few days is completely understandable. Irma was not Wilma in SoFla.. it shouldn't be the same timeframe. And remember, many of those people in SoFla right now are Keys refugees. Yes, I want them to have power sooner than later.

Where did you live that you didn't have cell service for 2 weeks? I was out for 5 days and it was excruciating. Can't even imaging that much longer!

 

[DisAl]

OK folks, first let me admit (and apologize) that I have been as much a part of the problem as anyone else in derailing this thread. It has degraded into a debate on storm restoration and utilities. It in no way resembles its original purpose: to help people who were at or planning to go to WDW make intelligent decisions about what to do about Irma. I suspect that Mom would have rightly called our hand on this if she was online. (Hope she is OK and back soon if not already.)
I resolve to not come back to this thread and go back to other threads that have the purpose of helping others with their WDW related questions and needed information. And I usually learn quite a bit along the way too.
Goodbye, Irma. You were an unwelcome visitor.