When will WDW go over the cliff?

[ariel90]

Well I wouldn't say Disney is falling off a cliff but its not living up to its full potential either. I went in 2012 stayed on property, I had excellent service and everything was so clean. Although I can't wait to see the new fantasy land (I'm going back this year)I hope that any rumored overhauls can put things in place for those people who are not kids. Maybe even teens, I know many people on here would like to argue that they don't matter but honestly they do. I don't want to discuss politics or anything but when you ignore a demographic things don't turn out too well.

 

[menamechris]

WDW will go over a cliff when the cutbacks, lack of maintenance and attention to safety hurts a guest in a very real way. With rock work, branches, light fixtures, etc. falling out of the sky...this is a signal that something is not right. Disney not addressing these issues and not dealing with them properly (and I don't mean putting up nets and tarps)...could mean very real consequences if something devastating happens and families do not feel safe at WDW anymore.

 

[Goofyernmost]

WDW will go over a cliff when the cutbacks, lack of maintenance and attention to safety hurts a guest in a very real way. With rock work, branches, light fixtures, etc. falling out of the sky...this is a signal that something is not right. Disney not addressing these issues and not dealing with them properly (and I don't mean putting up nets and tarps)...could mean very real consequences if something devastating happens and families do not feel safe at WDW anymore.

To some degree I would agree with you. However, to think that any organization can necessarily know ahead of time that some oddity will happen is pretty unfair, in my opinion. It's sometimes hard to fix something until it's broken. Could they have been able, for example, to know that the limb was going to fall on that day after all those years of no problem? If so, how? The piece that fell on Splash, was that predictable? How? Are you saying that they need to completely rebuilt every attraction from the ground up periodically? Some of that stuff has been out there in the harsh Florida weather for many years. Sometimes a problem arises, but for every one limb that fell from the Tree of Life, hundreds didn't!

 

[CommyHolly]

Some things bother some people more than others,,,,,,I'm ridiculously easygoing (NOT a good thing sometimes!) and I rarely notice small stuff like that,,,,,,The only thing that bugs me is the number of nights in December that the MK closes early for the Very Merry Christmas Party,,,,,,,eh, I get over it pretty fast I suck it up and go to Epcot.

However, I can understand that people who only get to go once or twice a year might be more bothered by those things that someone who gets to go 2 or 3 times a month or more. In my case, I just don't stress about them,,,,

 

[menamechris]

To some degree I would agree with you. However, to think that any organization can necessarily know ahead of time that some oddity will happen is pretty unfair, in my opinion. It's sometimes hard to fix something until it's broken. Could they have been able, for example, to know that the limb was going to fall on that day after all those years of no problem? If so, how? The piece that fell on Splash, was that predictable? How? Are you saying that they need to completely rebuilt every attraction from the ground up periodically? Some of that stuff has been out there in the harsh Florida weather for many years. Sometimes a problem arises, but for every one limb that fell from the Tree of Life, hundreds didn't!

I don't think our court system agrees with that. That is why people win lawsuits over incidents like this. DIsney is responsible for every single thing they create. Maybe Tree of Life should have been inspected once or twice by engineers over it's 20 year lifetime? Maybe the rock work should have been looked at once or twice since 1992? Probably. Should Splash still be run while there is a massive leak from the roof over the lift hill? I guess nothing will happen before January, right? While I agree with some of your statement - DIsney holds the responsibility of ensuring safety for its guests - and correcting safety issues - again, which is not done by putting up tarps and nets. Get people in there to see why a tree is falling apart or why pieces of a building are falling from the sky. Right now, these things are being ignored, and a safety band-aid put in place...Just sayin...

 

[CommyHolly]

I don't think our court system agrees with that. That is why people win lawsuits over incidents like this. DIsney is responsible for every single thing they create. Maybe Tree of Life should have been expected once or twice by engineers over it's 20 year lifetime? Maybe the rock work should have been looked at once or twice since 1992? Probably. Should Splash still be run while there is a massive leak from the roof over the lift hill? I guess nothing will happen before January, right? While I agree with some of your statement - DIsney holds the responsibility of ensuring safety for its guests - and correcting safety issues - again, which is not done by putting up tarps and nets. Get people in there to see why a tree is falling apart or why pieces of a building are falling from the sky. Right now, these things are being ignored, and a safety band-aid put in place...Just sayin...

I do agree with some of what you say,,,,,,but I've seen far worse. Wet floors at Walmart, Black Friday disasters at other stores,,,,,,,,the list goes on. For the most part, I think Disney does a phenomenal job keeping people safe,,,,,,,it's rare to hear about injuries that were caused by Disney. I know a man was killed a year or so back,,,,

doing what? walking the monorail rails,,,,,,,electrocuted.

seriously??? I mean, don't we have a certain responsibility to keep our own selves safe?

Having said that,,,,,,,,falling branches from the TOL does seem like something they could (and should) manage.

I can only imagine what their liability insurance costs.

 

[Goofyernmost]

OK, but I don't think it is possible to be able to anticipate every problem that might come up. If they could, I would think it was a little scary. Many things are not broken until they break. I used to be in the busing business and although our equipment was meticulously maintained, things broke. Things we didn't expect to break, broke. Things we might have looked at two hours before that were fine and working, would break. There is only so much that preventive maintenance can cover. And to repeat one of my favorite quotes from my Father..."If it ain't broke, don't fix it. You'll go broke trying!"

 

[menamechris]

OK, but I don't think it is possible to be able to anticipate every problem that might come up. If they could, I would think it was a little scary. Many things are not broken until they break. I used to be in the busing business and although our equipment was meticulously maintained, things broke. Things we didn't expect to break, broke. Things we might have looked at two hours before that were fine and working, would break. There is only so much that preventive maintenance can cover. And to repeat one of my favorite quotes from my Father..."If it ain't broke, don't fix it. You'll go broke trying!"

No.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I'll be sure to tell the aircraft maintenance crew to go with that philosophy before your next flight.

I can assure you that they do. But again we are not talking about a plane falling out of the sky, let's get serious. An aircraft will have certain things that will be replaced even while still working because there are not to many places to pull one of those things over and wait for a mechanic. Even new parts can fail and it is not foreseeable.

We are talking about a Theme Park attraction here. You don't go around rebuilding everything constantly. And things like the Tree or Splash have very few air miles on them. It's a stationary building. Things can happen that cannot be anticipated.

OK, but I don't think it is possible to be able to anticipate every problem that might come up. If they could, I would think it was a little scary. Many things are not broken until they break. I used to be in the busing business and although our equipment was meticulously maintained, things broke. Things we didn't expect to break, broke. Things we might have looked at two hours before that were fine and working, would break. There is only so much that preventive maintenance can cover. And to repeat one of my favorite quotes from my Father..."If it ain't broke, don't fix it. You'll go broke trying!"

No.

Well, I guess you told me!

 

[Lightyear999]

When ticket prices reach $100 before tax.

 

[menamechris]

Well, I guess you told me!

Well, I guess so. From my point of view - what's the point in the discussing the topic with someone who thinks accidents should happen before action is taken. The point is that WDW has cut back so far on, not just preventative maintenance, but all maintenance. No one is saying things should be rebuilt from the ground up (not sure where that idea came from....) but regular routine refurbishments and inspections need to be done. Instead they are constantly postponed or ignored altogether - or safety issues are given quick fixes or band-aids so that they can push maintenance or repair out even further. If you find this acceptable, that is your prerogative. I, however, do not.

 

[mousehockey37]

I don't think many can argue that WDW has been in decline for the past decade.From the loss of quality in attractions, food, and general upkeep,along with the overbuilding of hotels,lack of new quality rides, overbranding to the 3-10 market, and major unneeded price hikes has made it foreseeable that WDW will soon go over a cliff where it could take many years to regain it's reputation,income,and attendance. I feel this cliff will occur if the lack of what I stated above continues and next gen takes full hold and stays in effect for a large duration of time. Which I believe would be very devastating to the point that UOR parks would overtake ether AK or DHS (or both!) in attendance. Along with a decent loss of attendance to the other two parks.

So, when do you believe that Disney will go over the cliff? (If you believe it will at all)

Well, if it goes over a cliff and no one goes anymore, it'll sure make it easier for me to go!

 

[CommyHolly]

am I the only one that literally doesn't see anything falling apart and who is seeing constant maintenance????

they just redid Pecos Bills,,,,,,the Ice Cream shop on MS,,,,,,,

Pirates of the Caribbean just got an overhaul,,,,,,,we know the Dumbos got redone,,,,,,

they just did the tree house leaves not that long ago too,,,,,,,

The Country Bear Jamboree was closed a few weeks ago for a refab,,,,,,,,the Runaway Mine train was closed forever while they completely redid that,,,,,,

they just completely repainted the inside of It's a Small World (although I think they're still working on fixing up some of the dolls and moving parts)

and that's just off the top of my head,,,,,and I'm sure I didn't see everything,,,,,,,,

I mean, I just don't SEE that much falling apart,,,,,,,,

 

[Pumbas Nakasak]

Im pleased that some are so excited and champion as a success what most businesses do as a routine and practice to maximise the longevity of their infrastructure, guess it must be the magical way Disney do theirs, when they eventually do it.

Just dont mention that there are fewer attractions and much less street entertainment in the MK and Epcot than when I first went nearly 20 years ago, that's just not sporting.

 

[harveyt0206]

For me, I'm similar to Monty in that when I am at Disney, I'm so happy to be at a place that brings me so much joy that I must not notice the things that are "broken". Everyone keeps mentioning the water leaking from the drop on Splash. We rode Splash three times in September and I honestly didn't notice it. I'm not saying its not happening, I'm simply saying that it didn't register with me at any time during my rides. The only "problem" I have with Disney right now is that the price of a doing a Disney trip the way that I want to is prohibitive and I don't get to go as often as I want. But I don't see that as Disney's problem. It's mine. Are things perfect? No. Is WDW still an amazing place to take your vacation? In my opinion, yes.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Well, I guess so. From my point of view - what's the point in the discussing the topic with someone who thinks accidents should happen before action is taken. The point is that WDW has cut back so far on, not just preventative maintenance, but all maintenance. No one is saying things should be rebuilt from the ground up (not sure where that idea came from....) but regular routine refurbishments and inspections need to be done. Instead they are constantly postponed or ignored altogether - or safety issues are given quick fixes or band-aids so that they can push maintenance or repair out even further. If you find this acceptable, that is your prerogative. I, however, do not.

OK, give me a convincing system that would prevent accidents from happening. Tell me how you see into the future and know what's an accident waiting to happen in all instances. Tell me how you know that the problem came from lack of maintenance, and lack of concern over safety. If you could do that then there would be no accidents, everything would be intentional. Crap happens! One can point or attempt to point an accusing finger at whomever or whatever one wants, but unless you can show me how every possible scenario can be anticipated and prevented I will continue to say that unexpected, impossible to forecast things happen constantly. Could this be a preventable thing? I suppose it's possible, however, to expect preventive maintenance on something that isn't expected to happen is going to be a pretty exhausting if not impossible task.

 

[menamechris]

OK, give me a convincing system that would prevent accidents from happening. Tell me how you see into the future and know what's an accident waiting to happen in all instances. Tell me how you know that the problem came from lack of maintenance, and lack of concern over safety. If you could do that then there would be no accidents, everything would be intentional. Crap happens! One can point or attempt to point an accusing finger at whomever or whatever one wants, but unless you can show me how every possible scenario can be anticipated and prevented I will continue to say that unexpected, impossible to forecast things happen constantly. Could this be a preventable thing? I suppose it's possible, however, to expect preventive maintenance on something that isn't expected to happen is going to be a pretty exhausting if not impossible task.

Like I said - there really is no discussion points that can be made when one side's philosophy is "Crap happens." That can be said about any and all bad things that happen - and releases responsibility completely from anyone. Bottom line - maintenance (not painting and cleaning) was cut YEARS ago - and it has never gotten back to the proper level for the parks. I have a relative that is close to the situation. It is just as frustrating to them, but the suits will win and continue to cut back on attention to detail and safety until something happens. Hopefully, it never does, and they can coast along like this without incident ever. But if we can use Disneyland as an example...it's just a matter of time...

 

[CP_alum08]

If its so terrible there is really only one solution, stop complaining and just stop going.

And overbuilding hotels...please. They still fill to capacity so they must still be doing something right.

 

[ParentsOf4]

And overbuilding hotels...please. They still fill to capacity so they must still be doing something right.

In the most recent annual report, Disney's domestic hotel occupancy rate is down another 3% to 78%, excluding the post-9/11 era, an all-time low. Only a few years ago it was about 90%.

 

[Monty]

In the most recent annual report, Disney's domestic hotel occupancy rate is down another 3% to 78%, excluding the post-9/11 era, an all-time low. Only a few years ago it was about 90%.

If they've built more capacity and the percentage usage is down, that doesn't mean there are less people coming. The ROI on the hotels across property is a more critical factor. If you have 10,000 rooms with a 90% occupancy rate and build an additional 10,000 rooms your occupancy rate dropping to 78% means you have 6,600 more people staying than you did before. 10,000 @ 90% = 9,000 rooms occupied, 20,000 @78% = 15,600 rooms occupied.

Occupancy rates in absence of changes to total capacity numbers are meaningless. What matters is whether the added uptake of the total capacity is sufficient to pay for the overall costs of adding the capacity, plus factoring in the ancillary increases in merchandise, food and ticket sales.