The Miscellaneous Thought Thread

[Figments Friend]

The words ‘rain’ and ‘Los Angeles’……go together…?

The Apocolypse must be upon us and the world must be ending.
Those two words never appear in the same sentence…!



-

 

[mickEblu]

The words ‘rain’ and ‘Los Angeles’……go together…?

The Apocolypse must be upon us and the world must be ending.
Those two words never appear in the same sentence…!

Lol. It actually ended up being a pretty nice day. The storm cleared in the morning. Was pretty wild as we drove to the park it was raining the whole way under a dark gray blanket. Then we got there and this….

 

[Stitchon]

Was at Disneyland this past week for the first time since 2022, and man. Show quality is abysmal. Runaway Railway's load area is a complete mess, the floor is worn to the bare concrete and all of the posts to the stanchions are badly chipped. Really egregious amounts of peeling paint all over the parks. All of the Fantasyland dark rides were missing some notable effect, but Alice was in really bad shape. Very few attractions were running 100% in terms of effects. I think Big Thunder was the only attraction I rode that was working completely, and it just came out of refurbishment. Tiki Room was particularly sad, most of the singing flowers weren't working, a big chunk of the totems were barely functioning, and it was very click-clacky. Tom Sawyer Island was looking ROUGH, everything except the barrel bridge was closed or broken, even the caves were blocked off. Every major e-ticket seemed to have some downtime during the trip, but the Matterhorn in particular seemed to be struggling. Runaway Railway itself was fun, but I can't imagine waiting in a 45 minute+ line for it. Likewise with Web Slingers. I didn't get on Tiana's Bayou Adventure because it was far too cold and rainy, but I am not a fan of how obscured the Disneyland Railroad look-through is.

I was really disappointed with the new Toontown, where it seemed like almost every interactive effect was broken, and none of the portholes on Donald's Boat had any bubble effects. Walt Disney: A Magical Life was down for much of my trip, so I never wound up seeing it, but it was good to see Mr. Lincoln again. Seeing the empty HISTA theater and the dreadfully underused Carousel building while the parks are jam-packed felt almost insulting.

And then I got to visit DCA for the first time since 2017 (pre Mission: Breakout) and the loss of the Red Car really hurts. Buena Vista Street feels so stagnant without it and without the Citizens, or any entertainment besides Five & Dime. Mission: Breakout was completely bewildering, fun, but I had zero idea what was going on. Incredicoaster had no soundtrack running the day I was at DCA, not sure what that's about, but the less said about Pixar Pier the better. World of Color: Happiness was certainly a show, but I am not a fan of the sound-a-likes for the assorted emotions. Anger didn't sound even close to Lewis Black, whereas the others were off just enough to raise my eyebrows. The Muppet preshow was fun and did seem to get a great reaction. I did have two very fun skippers on the Jungle Cruise, including one that seemed to have an 80/20 ratio of his own jokes to the script.

 

[waltography]

Buena Vista Street feels so stagnant without it and without the Citizens, or any entertainment besides Five & Dime.

When did you walk through BVS? I'm surprised you ran into no citizens during your trip, I see at least one of them almost every visit.

I miss the News Boys show with the trolley and Minnie's Fly Girls over in Grizzly Peak Airfield; I know the News Boys weren't many people's favorite, but they just needed new instrumentation to work instead of the poor man's electro swing they were given.

 

[Phroobar]

Is there still a menorah in the main street window?

 

[Distorian]

I was not expecting the AI takeover to be carried out by snowman robots.

 

[mickEblu]

Mini Trip report 11/21

Overall we had a great time. Weather was cool/ crisp but not cold. Sun was out off an on. Didn't plan on hopping to DCA 3 times but it was all good. I know Friday mornings are typically lighter but I think the fear of rain also thinned out some of the herd. Which was great because it only rained around 3pm for about 20 minutes so we got all the benefit and it didn't cost us anything. It was great getting on rides like Guardians, Incredicoaster, Soarin, ROTR and Indy which I haven't done in a while. Was really a day of the creme de la creme (mostly) of DLR E tickets:

Pirates of the Caribbean: (standby 5 minutes) 10am

Big Thunder Mountain Railroad: (standby 10 minutes) 10:30am

Rise of the Resistance: (standby 25 minutes to Rey room) 10:50am thanks @PiratesMansion

Space Mountain: LL 11:30am

Birria Tacos

Incredicoaster: (standby a long 40 minutes) 1:30pm

Tiana's Bayou Adventure: (standby 15 minutes) 3:30pm

Mad Tea Party: (standby 10 minutes) 5pm

Goofy's Sky School: Instant LL 6pm

Mission Breakout: LL 6:45pm (we still ended up waiting 25+ minutes as Alpha went down and we were moved to Bravo.)

Matterhorn: LL 7:30pm

Indiana Jones: MEP 8pm (went down during our return time. Got an MEP. Didn't they used to give the MEP in addition to keeping your LL?)

Incredicoaster 2: LL (Late to a 7:20-8:20 LL that they honored ) 9pm

Radiator Springs Racers: (standby 25 minutes) 9:20pm. I knew they were BS'ing about that posted 55 minute wait time.

Soarin: LL 9:59pm. Sprinted from RSR on very achy feet and bad knees. And here's the best part. At the very end of the ride got stuck up there for 20 minutes at the very top. (We were in row 1) Thats gotta be what, 40 feet up in the air? My daughter was on the verge of a panic attack so thats wasn't fun. My wife and I had our arms criss crossed in front of her waist in case God forbid the seat belts were undone. Has to be the worst ride to get stuck on. You just start thinking the only way done is if they get this thing working and who knows how long that may take. They just kept repeating the same annoucement over and over every two minutes until we got down.


One of my (American) cousins made this remark about the awful Madam Leotas shop sign: "It looks like they themed it after Eddie's Haunted Mansion." Lol. I thought that was on point.

Tianas Bayou Adventure: "It wasn't as bad as I thought it was going to be." My translation of that would be... it still has AA's, music and drops. The only positive they had to say was they liked all the greenery on the mountain. One of them said he had no idea what was going on. The story wasn't clear to them in the slightest.

LL functionality on the app isn't great. It's ok. Got the hang of it as the day went on but could be much better. Definitely don't use the "Modify" feature. Had Indy LL's for all of us for 7pm. Saw 3:30 pm and immediately snatched it only to see that now my LL's were for an 8:30 pm return time. Even later. Why give me a time I didn't select? If someone snatched it before me the system should just tell me I missed out. Not give me a different time. Anyway, one of the CM's at the umbrellas was nice and fixed it for me. Also, I wouldn't recommend anyone with a large party use the "modify" feature to begin with. I get the sense the system isn't smart enough. If a party of 2 cancel their Indy LL's for example it's not going to give them to the party of 9 and yet the time slot still shows up there on the app as if I have a chance. I'm not 100% sure but thats my hunch. Lastly, still hate how much you have to have your head buried in your phone to enjoy at day at DL.

I've been to the park so many times with so many different groups from first timers from out of the country to diehards that have been going to Disneyland since the 60's. Groups that want to do nothing but thrill rides to groups where can have the best time just riding Peter Pan, Alice and the Disneyland Railroad to everything in between. I quickly realized with our family from Italy that attractions were all being viewed through the prism of how thrilling they were. I mean they appreciated the likes of Pirates or BTMRR but I didnt get the sense they were blown away. Im paraphrasing here but BMTRR was more like "cool/cute." Indy "was a not very thrilling but still very good. If I would have known it was this bad I would have taken him to Magic Mountain and saved a lot of money. I kid, sort of. It was interesting to me that as we walked through the FL courtyard there was zero curiosity of what was behind those facades with Pinocchio, Snow White etc. Almost as if it had all been sort of subconsciously written off as kid stuff.

Birria Taco's: Always a crowd pleaser. Reminded of how good they are. Hadn't had them in a couple years.

Mexican Hot Chocolate from Ghirardelli was very nice. Only had a sip of my cousins and but will have go get my own next week.

Incredicoaster: Could barely hear the soundtrack and thats a good thing! No "Jack Jaaaacks" the whole time. Guardians, Incredicoaster and Space Mountain were their favorite rides. In that order. And to think we weren't going to park hop originally haha.

ROTR: cannons aren't working again

BTMRR, RSR, and Indy were all in pretty good shape except that it seemed like the boulder stalled for a sec or two.

Soarin: the images were very dim and low res. How has this happened already?

Best part of the trip... my daughter has finally hit 40 inches with no inserts!

 

[waltography]

Birria Tacos

Love that this was called out as its own E-ticket.

LL functionality on the app isn't great. It's ok. Got the hang of it as the day went on but could be much better. Definitely don't use the "Modify" feature. Had Indy LL's for all of us for 7pm. Saw 3:30 pm and immediately snatched it only to see that now my LL's were for an 8:30 pm return time. Even later. Why give me a time I didn't select?

I really like the Modify feature, but it'll bait and switch you if you're not careful. They really should add a grace step to it (similar task flow to when something's sold out before you hit check out).

 

[mickEblu]

I really like the Modify feature, but it'll bait and switch you if you're not careful. They really should add a grace step to it (similar task flow to when something's sold out before you hit check out).

Exactly. I won’t ever use it again with a large party for the reason I mentioned. Might try it again with a smaller party and will be a little more careful. But the fact that what happened to me is possible just isn’t worth it just to get a slightly better time. At least not when 9 people’s days were riding on me. Might work better with other less in demand attractions.

 

[mickEblu]

They made the sign look like an early 2000’s DVD cover. lol. They made something that should look like it fits in the Antebellum South look like promo material.

 

[Disney Irish]

Indiana Jones: MEP 8pm (went down during our return time. Got an MEP. Didn't they used to give the MEP in addition to keeping your LL?)

As far as I remember going all the way back to even MaxPass, when a ride goes down you lose your LL/FP and its replaced by a Multiple Experience Pass (MEP).

I've been to the park so many times with so many different groups from first timers from out of there country to diehards that have been going to Disneyland since the 60's. Groups that want to do nothing but thrill rides to groups where can have the best time just riding Peter Pan, Alice and the Disneyland Railroad to everything in between. I quickly realized with our family from Italy that attractions were all being viewed through the prism of how thrilling they were. I mean they appreciated the likes of Pirates or BTMRR but I didnt get the sense they were blown away. Im paraphrasing here but BMTRR was more like "cool/cute." Indy "was a not very thrilling but still very good. If I would have known it was this bad I would have taken him to Magic Mountain and saved a lot of money. I kid, sort of. It was interesting to me that as we walked through the FL courtyard there was zero curiosity of what was behind those facades with Pinocchio, Snow White etc. Almost as if it had all been sort of subconsciously written off as kid stuff.

This is unfortunately how I think many in the public view a Disney Park, especially the younger generations. What we view as older classics are seen as old/outdated/quaint. That its got to be thrilling and in your face rather than whimsical and subdued.

 

[mickEblu]

This is unfortunately how I think many in the public view a Disney Park, especially the younger generations. What we view as older classics are seen as old/outdated/quaint. That its got to be thrilling and in your face rather than whimsical and subdued.

Yeah I agree and it’s unfortunate. The attention spans and the rate at which we consume content all but guarantees we’ll never see anything like the original POTC again. Also had me thinking about the whole IP vs original debate. Not that this isn’t obvious, but u could see with the newbies on limited time that the attractions that created the most interest were the properties they knew. Guardians, Indy, Star Wars etc. Of course from there the quality of the attraction (and in their case - the thrill) is really what creates the staying power.

 

[Disney Irish]

Yeah I agree and it’s unfortunate. The attention spans and the rate at which we consume content all but guarantees we’ll never see anything like the original POTC again. Also had me thinking about the whole IP vs original debate. Not that this isn’t obvious, but u could see with the newbies on limited time that the attractions that created the most interest were the properties they knew. Guardians, Indy, Star Wars etc. Of course from there the quality of the attraction (and in their case - the thrill) is really what creates the staying power.

Agreed, so as much as fans scream and cry for originals the GP is what drives Disney's decisions and why we get IP based stuff everywhere, it sells the experience and the merch.

 

[PiratesMansion]

Yeah I agree and it’s unfortunate. The attention spans and the rate at which we consume content all but guarantees we’ll never see anything like the original POTC again. Also had me thinking about the whole IP vs original debate. Not that this isn’t obvious, but u could see with the newbies on limited time that the attractions that created the most interest were the properties they knew. Guardians, Indy, Star Wars etc. Of course from there the quality of the attraction (and in their case - the thrill) is really what creates the staying power.

I think so much of this comes from theme parks of all stripes increasingly being dominated by thrill rides and roller coasters consequently being seen as the "real" reason to go to parks, with everything else just filler. At one point, in the wake of Disneyland, parks really did try and appeal to families first and foremost, now seemingly everyone else has given up with that idea and even Disney is feeling/has felt the heat to add more thrill rides.

I've talked to multiple people whose impressions of Disney parks was that it would be basically Six Flags with Disney characters instead of Looney Tunes. It took long, frequent conversations to the effect of "some attractions involve you sitting and doing nothing while watching a bird show" to convince my grandparents to go to WDW.

In a way it's fascinating (if not at times depressing) the way that Disney parks according to people who have never been are either parks for five year olds or die hard thrill seekers with nothing in between, with very few people seeing them as being for everyone. I'd blame Disney for it if I didn't know from many, many years of experience how utterly unwilling most people are to research what a park actually offers before they buy a ticket.

 

[Rich T]

I think so much of this comes from theme parks of all stripes increasingly being dominated by thrill rides and roller coasters consequently being seen as the "real" reason to go to parks, with everything else just filler. At one point, in the wake of Disneyland, parks really did try and appeal to families first and foremost, now seemingly everyone else has given up with that idea and even Disney is feeling/has felt the heat to add more thrill rides.

I've talked to multiple people whose impressions of Disney parks was that it would be basically Six Flags with Disney characters instead of Looney Tunes. It took long, frequent conversations to the effect of "some attractions involve you sitting and doing nothing while watching a bird show" to convince my grandparents to go to WDW.

In a way it's fascinating (if not at times depressing) the way that Disney parks according to people who have never been are either parks for five year olds or die hard thrill seekers with nothing in between, with very few people seeing them as being for everyone. I'd blame Disney for it if I didn't know from many, many years of experience how utterly unwilling most people are to research what a park actually offers before they buy a ticket.

I know I’ve got what’s been called “recency bias,” but this is one of the major aspects of Epic Universe that gives me hope that things can get better in the theme park industry as a whole: Epic is a park aimed—in an admirably balanced way—at appealing to families, thrill seekers, kids and senior citizens alike in a cohesive total picture that I sure hope Universal sticks with as the park grows.

Only one ride there (Stardust) is thrillseeker-only level, and it’s so good that I think it can fill that niche for the park for a long time to come. I’m encouraged by the way all the speculation and rumors about upcoming new attractions for Epic involve family-friendly ride concepts. The public, in this case, is not clamoring for another thrill coaster; guests seem to really be enjoying the themes and story elements of the new park, and want to see more of that.

For me, the take-away is: If you give the GP family-friendly, story-driven adventures that are genuinely GREAT and INTERESTING (Monsters, Ministry and Hiccup’s) people appreciate that (even the thrill seekers) and are likely to return.

Epic might still have capacity issues to work out, but I love the balance the opening-day attraction mix has achieved in appealing to just about everyone.

Regarding Disney and people who don’t do the research before a trip… All I can say is: I’m a lifelong DL/theme park/Walt-era Disney fan… and even *I* am turned off by the ridiculous hoop-jumping, upcharging, planning, tethering oneself to an app and EXPENSE of a Disney trip these days. I can’t imagine what the experience must be like for someone who’s never been.

 

[Rich T]

Yeah I agree and it’s unfortunate. The attention spans and the rate at which we consume content all but guarantees we’ll never see anything like the original POTC again. Also had me thinking about the whole IP vs original debate. Not that this isn’t obvious, but u could see with the newbies on limited time that the attractions that created the most interest were the properties they knew. Guardians, Indy, Star Wars etc. Of course from there the quality of the attraction (and in their case - the thrill) is really what creates the staying power.

We’d never see anything like original PoC one way or the other: That was lightning in a bottle created by geniuses working for a guy named Walt Disney.

A lot of people say the public isn’t interested in anything original these days… but then something new and fresh makes a billion dollars and.. waddaya know, people love original ideas when the end result is genuinely GOOD.

There’s a slow-moving, non-IP cosmic carousel in Epic Universe right now blowing people’s minds. It’s exactly the kind of thing Disney used to be so good at (and could be good at again if they’d just take some more creative leaps of faith).

 

[Rich T]

…This is unfortunately how I think many in the public view a Disney Park, especially the younger generations. What we view as older classics are seen as old/outdated/quaint. That its got to be thrilling and in your face rather than whimsical and subdued.

Though the thrill-seeker thing wasn’t a factor until the 70’s, various attractions at DL have always been dismissed as childish or quaint by some guests. And that’s ok. Not everything has to be for everyone.

Thank goodness not everyone wants to ride Mr. Toad or Peter Pan, or the lines would be six hours long. What I hate is the thought of destroying the little things that make DL unique in the pursuit of attracting as many people as possible to every square inch to spend as much money as possible to please the stockholders… ‘cause that’s how the golden goose kicks the bucket.

Variety and history are so incredibly important to DL’s soul. I don’t know what the future holds for the park, but I’m grateful I got to see the version that got so much so right for so long.

 

[mickEblu]

We’d never see anything like original PoC one way or the other: That was lightning in a bottle created by geniuses working for a guy named Walt Disney.

A lot of people say the public isn’t interested in anything original these days… but then something new and fresh makes a billion dollars and.. waddaya know, people love original ideas when the end result is genuinely GOOD.

There’s a slow-moving, non-IP cosmic carousel in Epic Universe right now blowing people’s minds. It’s exactly the kind of thing Disney used to be so good at (and could be good at again if they’d just take some more creative leaps of faith).

For sure. I was more referring to the combination of it being original, its ride time and passiveness. Not necessarily the overall quality although all of the above mentioned factors certainly contribute to that.

IP may be easier to market and are a bigger draw for folks but ultimately it’s the quality of the attraction that matters. We’re at a point where there is pretty much nothing new under the sun. For every attraction concept an imagineer can conceive Disney probably owns a concept that fits it that already has a built in following or fan base. Not that the process usually goes that way (they start with the IP) but I can understand why they would go with the IP version for said concept when they own half of the content in the world.

 

[Rich T]

For sure. I was more referring to the combination of it being original, its ride time and passiveness. Not necessarily the overall quality although all of the above mentioned factors certainly contribute to that.

IP may be easier to market and are a bigger draw for folks but ultimately it’s the quality of the attraction that matters. We’re at a point where there is pretty much nothing new under the sun. For every attraction concept an imagineer can conceive Disney probably owns a concept that fits it that already has a built in following or fan base. Not that the process usually goes that way but I can understand why they would go with the IP version for said concept when they own half of the content in the world.

My problem with the all-IP-all-the-time approach is that it can lead to a feeling of staleness. DL is DL because of its unique blend of originality, history, IPs, nostalgia and futurism. If it loses that—If it just becomes “Hey everyone—Come ride your Disney-aquired-IP movie collection!” I’m out. Taxi!

MK has possibly gotten too close to that line for me. I just renewed my cheap local lots-o-blockouts AP at WDW because Epcot and AK still have enough that interest me. Plus the discount at the Disney Springs Lego Store. But I spend 90% of my Florida park time at Universal.

 

[mickEblu]

My problem with the all-IP-all-the-time approach is that it can lead to a feeling of staleness. DL is DL because of its unique blend of originality, history, IPs, nostalgia and futurism. If it loses that—If it just becomes “Hey everyone—Come ride your Disney-aquired-IP movie collection!” I’m out. Taxi!

MK has possibly gotten too close to that line for me. I just renewed my cheap local lots-o-blockouts AP at WDW because Epcot and AK still have enough that interest me. Plus the discount at the Disney Springs Lego Store. But I spend 90% of my Florida park time at Universal.

I get that. My issue is that if you were to ask me if I’d want an original Adventurer, original Space adventure or original Haunted Hotel attraction (without the Twilight zone theming) over Indy, Star Tours/ ROTR and TOT I’d pass on all of them. As a father, if you asked me if I wanted an original Snow Queen ride or a Frozen ride come to DL I’d go with the latter as it’s fun to live through your kids eyes and see them get excited about characters and movies they love come to life. There are probably few scenarios where I’d pick the non IP version of a concept over the IP version in 2025. Perhaps it’s an impossible exercise and we’ll always choose the version of an attraction we know and love vs the unknown but for example how can you not go with Indy and Star Wars for those themes?

With that said, I’d love to see fewer single IP lands and for parks to go back to more broadly themed lands.

I think the most important thing is not if it’s IP or original but how the attraction is executed. For an IP attraction, is it a boring, passive, linear book report or are they just giving us some of the broad strokes and having us live out the adventures from the film in an attraction that still feels like an original experience?