DAK 'Encanto' and 'Indiana Jones'-themed experiences at Animal Kingdom

[TomboyJanet]

It’s not about today versus yesteryear. There are plenty of modern marvels. It’s about being an established company that has to balance tradition, innovation, and a changing audience versus being a novel and nimble upstart that can turn on a dime.

I see this trend everywhere. People are quantizing things and looking through spreadsheet eyes. They take no risks like they used to. Im not even that old, but in the 90s we were always looking to go beyond what we had, beyond ip for disney they would find a theme that relates to the world and then they would make it Disney and it would be the ip itself. I just hope that when the 90s nostalgia people get in control the ones who saw imagination ride go from amazing to nothing they will seek to correct that

 

[Brer Panther]

I'm really starting to loathe this thread...

You were just complaining the ride will focus on Antonio, now you're complaining the ride will focus on animals, which is it

I'm not complaining about either of those. It's everyone else who's insisting that the ride will focus on Antonio and animals. Unless we see solid proof (Disney's claim that it'll take place on the day Antonio got his gift - so, the first half of the movie - does not count), I'm not going to immediately assume that and claim the movie belongs in Animal Kingdom.

Heck you can make it so it fits with the exact moment of the movie where the magic fades and so when Antonio is riding his jaguar friend it somewhat acts wildly again and dashes off into the house somewhere.

So basically some sort of The Lion King 1 1/2 thing? What Antonio was up to while Mirabel was dealing with everyone else's problems?

So you don’t believe that Disney can create two attractions that respect their IP but also simultaneously fit into AK ?

Remember how some users on here were thinking that Disney would make the Frozen and Guardians of the Galaxy attractions fit in EPCOT? Yeah, I'm not exactly filled with confidence.

 

[Gremlin Gus]

I'm really starting to loathe this thread...

No offense and please don't take this the wrong way but nobody is forcing you to be in this thread or reply to other people's comments, if you're starting to dislike this thread, just leave and come back in a few days if that makes you feel better since the subject will probably change by then.

 

[BlakeW39]

So you don’t believe that Disney can create two attractions that respect their IP but also simultaneously fit into AK ?

At the risk of sounding like a broken record: you could obviously make an Indy ride that explores the themes of Animal Kingdom. You can stretch any IP to talk about anything you want it to. You could stretch BatB to have Belle give a lecture on natural history. What determines whether the IP "fits," is if you have to stretch it to begin with. You would definitely have to stretch the Indy IP to make it about conservation.

You seem to be ignoring all the work they are putting into TA as a whole to make sure the whole land is as authentic as possible and fits into the parks existing fabric.

I'm not ignoring the work they're putting into the ride. Actually, my concern is that whenever I've seen them talk about the ride, they only really talk about exploring human culture, but not nearly so much about exploring themes of nature and conservation. I never had any doubt the ride would have in-depth exploration of human culture. That's what Indy is about. But it makes me worried that the ride and the land will be overly anthropocentric.

 

[TomboyJanet]

I'm really starting to loathe this thread...

I'm not complaining about either of those. It's everyone else who's insisting that the ride will focus on Antonio and animals. Unless we see solid proof (Disney's claim that it'll take place on the day Antonio got his gift - so, the first half of the movie - does not count), I'm not going to immediately assume that and claim the movie belongs in Animal Kingdom.

So basically some sort of The Lion King 1 1/2 thing? What Antonio was up to while Mirabel was dealing with everyone else's problems?

Remember how some users on here were thinking that Disney would make the Frozen and Guardians of the Galaxy attractions fit in EPCOT? Yeah, I'm not exactly filled with confidence.

I still cant get over Their bizarre choice of storyline for Frozen

Bonus if you get the Futurama Reference

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I see this trend everywhere. People are quantizing things and looking through spreadsheet eyes. They take no risks like they used to. Im not even that old, but in the 90s we were always looking to go beyond what we had, beyond ip for disney they would find a theme that relates to the world and then they would make it Disney and it would be the ip itself. I just hope that when the 90s nostalgia people get in control the ones who saw imagination ride go from amazing to nothing they will seek to correct that

They still take some big risks - they just don't often work out (so maybe there is more an issue with the risks they seem worthy?)

Like the Starcruiser was a huge risk - it wasn't for me but I wanted it to succeed just so they didn't get scared of trying something on that scale again

Harmonious was a pretty big risk and they were willing to course correct, so I think they have it in them - they just haven't taken risks that align with what many on this board would like to see if late, doesn't mean they don't take risks though

 

[TomboyJanet]

They still take some big risks - they just don't often work out (so maybe there is more an issue with the risks they seem worthy?)

Like the Starcruiser was a huge risk - it wasn't for me but I wanted it to succeed just so they didn't get scared of trying something on that scale again

Harmonious was a pretty big risk and they were willing to course correct, so I think they have it in them - they just haven't taken risks that align with what many on this board would like to see if late, doesn't mean they don't take risks though

The risks they took were that catering to only wealthy people could sustain them....it clearly cannot

 

[James Alucobond]

Unless we see solid proof (Disney's claim that it'll take place on the day Antonio got his gift - so, the first half of the movie - does not count)

So ... you're going to ignore the only thing that we actually know about this ride in order to continue complaining in such a way that potentially perpetuates misinformation. Cool, I guess. I still maintain that there's plenty for you to bite your nails over without suggesting that the very few things they've said about the content of the ride are untrue, but whatevs.

 

[MisterPenguin]

At the risk of sounding like a broken record:

Too late for that.

 

[HMF]

Harmonious was a pretty big risk and they were willing to course correct, so I think they have it in them

They replaced the greatest show ever done with a steaming pile of crap and then replaced the steaming pile of crap with a mediocre show that tries (and fails) to live up to the greatest show ever done.

 

[Incomudro]

They still take some big risks - they just don't often work out (so maybe there is more an issue with the risks they seem worthy?)

Like the Starcruiser was a huge risk - it wasn't for me but I wanted it to succeed just so they didn't get scared of trying something on that scale again

Harmonious was a pretty big risk and they were willing to course correct, so I think they have it in them - they just haven't taken risks that align with what many on this board would like to see if late, doesn't mean they don't take risks though

Well, they've taken BAD risks.
Risks that mere laymen like ourselves could have told them would fail.

 

[James Alucobond]

Well, they've taken BAD risks.
Risks that mere laymen like ourselves could have told them would fail.

To be fair, people on this board say just about everything will fail, so they'll naturally always be right on the occasion that it does happen.

 

[Disgruntled Walt]

Indy never seeks any of the things he has stumbled upon. He has never set out to find the spirits of the Ark, or to deal directly with god, or meet aliens. But the nature of his work has brought him there.

Again, all of those things are incidental to who he is. The "why" of his being in this temple is important, and THAT'S what makes it a poor fit. By Disney's OWN admission, Indy's reason for being there is to SEE the mythical creature for himself. That's never been his character. And this is what the official Parks Blog says. I screenshot it several pages ago in this thread.

His adventures always have a material purpose—retrieval of some item for safekeeping and study in a museum. It doesn't always work out for him, but that's the main reason he starts out on whatever he's doing. Based on what Disney has said, he is suddenly a mythical animal enthusiast who somehow got approval from Marcus Brody to go on a wild Quetzalcoatl chase while on leave from his teaching.

Entering a temple and encountering a mythical animal isn't anathema to Animal Kingdom, and isn't a bad fit for the park; it's fine. It's the fact that it's INDIANA JONES, a character whose motivations are fully defined and fleshed out in several films (and they are openly stating his mythical animal-motivations). This is the problem.

 

[BrianLo]

Honestly, at the point I don’t particularly care about thematic cohesion. That ship has sailed. I want a good ride that represents the IP well. There’s a lot of signs we’re going to get another Tiana - a strong franchise forced into the wrong situation that loses all the charm of the IP.

I see what you are saying, but I’m not sure we run that risk here. The ride is still taking place during a portion of the film.

Honestly, even if this wasn’t going in Animal Kingdom, the two very clear entry points into the Casita are when the village is invited for his door day or if they throw a house warming once its rebuilt. I think the link of the door day happening to coincide with the character with magical animal speech powers created a situation of convenience.

It is a bit funny the gestalt seems to be a preference towards a return to book report rides though.

 

[BlakeW39]

I just genuinely cannot understand this take when a ride focused on man’s connection to the animal kingdom as reflected in their culture and spiritualism is a great fit for Indiana Jones. Just because a film version of Indy has not done anything based around that does not mean it cannot be done and wouldn’t work well.

Indiana Jones, as you said, is a studier of man. Man has a long, historic relationship with the animal kingdom. It has influenced their folklore, their art, their music, and their religion. These ideas are manifested in other attractions in the park already.

Why then is it such a stretch in your mind to have a character whose purpose is to study what remains of human culture stumble upon an ancient creature that is a fixture of that civilization’s culture?

He does not have to be seeking it. Indy never seeks any of the things he has stumbled upon. He has never set out to find the spirits of the Ark, or to deal directly with god, or meet aliens. But the nature of his work has brought him there.



Why would that not fit fine with DAK? Why is there such opposition to the idea that Indy can be just another way to explore mankind’s different connections to and observations of the animal world and how it is has and continues to influence our beliefs?

The reason Indy conflicts with the themes of DAK isn't because he can't explore man's relationship with nature. Actually, archaeologists study that kind of thing all the time. Man's relationship with nature isn't a theme though. It's a topic. Themes are how an author approaches a topic and what they have to say about it. Stuff like, nature has intrinsic value, and you should want to preserve it. That's the stuff an Indy ride needs to get right. Just being about man & nature won't make the ride fit in Animal Kingdom.

You've got to get the themes right and Indy simply does not care about any of DAK's themes. If Indy studies man's relationship to nature, it will be in a way that is purely anthropocentric, because he's an anthropologist, and he would only study animals for the extrinsic reasons of how they relate to humans, not for their own intrinsic worth. And if that's the case, then the ride will struggle to deliver a message of conservation, which again, is not really a message Indiana Jones lends itself to in any way.

 

[AidenRodriguez731]

Well, they've taken BAD risks.
Risks that mere laymen like ourselves could have told them would fail.

Welcome to survivorship bias, no one is going to vividly remember all the weird one offs and bad attractions from long enough ago because they didn't make that much of an impact or nostalgia blinded them completely.

 

[TomboyJanet]

They replaced the greatest show ever done with a steaming pile of crap and then replaced the steaming pile of crap with a mediocre show that tries (and fails) to live up to the greatest show ever done.

Figment can relate to that.....

 

[TomboyJanet]

The reason Indy conflicts with the themes of DAK isn't because he can't explore man's relationship with nature. Actually, archaeologists study that kind of thing all the time. Man's relationship with nature isn't a theme though. It's a topic. Themes are how an author approaches a topic and what they have to say about it. Stuff like, nature has intrinsic value, and you should want to preserve it. That's the stuff an Indy ride needs to get right. Just being about man & nature won't make the ride fit in Animal Kingdom.

You've got to get the themes right and Indy simply does not care about any of DAK's themes. If Indy studies man's relationship to nature, it will be in a way that is purely anthropocentric, because he's an anthropologist, and he would only study animals for the extrinsic reasons of how they relate to humans, not for their own intrinsic worth. And if that's the case, then the ride will struggle to deliver a message of conservation, which again, is not really a message Indiana Jones lends itself to in any way.

well as long as it's not snakes....

 

[TomboyJanet]

Welcome to survivorship bias, no one is going to vividly remember all the weird one offs and bad attractions from long enough ago because they didn't make that much of an impact or nostalgia blinded them completely.

I both agree and disagree. My problem still number one is that they can't generate park original ip anymore, which makes it look like they are so uncreative. Number two, is those screens....boring....and minimalism.....lame. Its all just corporate packages.

 

[Incomudro]

Welcome to survivorship bias, no one is going to vividly remember all the weird one offs and bad attractions from long enough ago because they didn't make that much of an impact or nostalgia blinded them completely.

Thing is - problem for Disney is - with the right mindset, with the right creative teams (key word creative) the Starcruiser could have been a spectacular success.
The expensive and hideous eyesore barges would have never been installed in the World Showcase Lagoon.
And, Tiana's would be one of the greatest rides in the park.