Rumors. Musings. Casual.

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Don’t you know everyone is an expert on everything.

I know who spends their time pledging obedience to companies that actually don’t like them for it…

We’ll do an awards show…best of luck to all the nominees

 

[WoundedDreamer]

I'll give Yacht and Beach Club as an example to illustrate my concern.

It's a popular hotel in a prime location, that's beautifully executed and has a number of highly regarded amenities, of which the pool complex immediately comes to mind. People choose to stay there and pay a premium for all those things. The hotel sells itself and can stand on its own because of the quality of the experience it provides, that is recognized and valued by the customers who chose to stay there.

But the Disney of today would never build Disney's Yacht and Beach Club Resort for all the reasons I've outlined. It's not IP, does not promote another division of the company, is not obviously "Disney" in its imagery and the theme that gives its whole appeal would be seen as dated for not tying in with a current, trendy concept. They might build another deluxe hotel with a fancy pool, but it wouldn't be as timeless or tasteful in a way that appeals to a broad audience.

I think that's a problem that's limiting the parks and resorts and shows a misunderstanding of what gives them their appeal.

This is so true. Disney Parks were specifically designed to be a place where the entire family could have a good time. This means that the attractions would be appropriate for young children, but they would also be tasteful for parents. A kid could have a good time on a carousel, while the parents were able to soak in the ambiance of a European castle. It was that balance between visceral fun for children and the tasteful storytelling for adults that made Disneyland so successful. Timeless storytelling across age demographics.

Now Disney is aiming for only those with the lowest of expectations. Instead of a place where adults and children can have a good time, it's increasingly a place for kids. Parents and adults have to tolerate having every penny extracted while enduring garish and low-quality worlds. An example of this is the Ratatouille expansion. While most (including me) welcome the addition of a new attraction, the expansion was of a distinctly lower quality than the rest of the French Pavilion. Many of the facades cannot be explored and are cheaply painted on. What was originally a loving ode to French Architecture, was expanded with a cartoonish caricature.

Kids are also less likely to notice defects in props and show quality. The reason Disney show needed to be so exquisitely high was for the adults who visited. They're the ones who notice stuff like that. I grew up going to Walt Disney World, and one of the things I loved is that I could appreciate many of the details more as I grew up. I could see the intricacies of the stories and spaces that were created. Now, I commonly hear people say, "this isn't as good as I remember" or "maybe it was just the eyes of a child that missed the imperfections." They're attempting to explain why something they remember positively as a child is so bad now. It's not because it was never good. It's because Walt Disney World has lost its way.

The hotels are the ultimate example of this. While Walt Disney World has not yet seen the full-scale IP hotel invasion, I bet we'll have that in the next few years. Instead of loving spaces dedicated to different time periods and artistic styles, we'll get various iterations of the Pixar Pier Hotel. It's a fine hotel, but it's not aimed at adults.

Walt Disney World was never a "kids park." It was a family resort.

I felt that there should be something built … some kind of amusement enterprise built ... where the parents and the children could have fun together. So that’s how Disneyland started. Well, it took many years … it was a … oh, a period of maybe 15 years developing. I started with many ideas, threw them away, started all over again. And eventually, it evolved into what you see today at Disneyland. But it all started from a daddy with two daughters wondering where he could take them where he could have a little fun with them too.”

Walt Disney

Walt Celebrates Disneyland 1965

www.mouseplanet.com

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

An example of this is the Ratatouille expansion. While most (including me) welcome the addition of a new attraction, the expansion was of a distinctly lower quality than the rest of the French Pavilion. Many of the facades cannot be explored and are cheaply painted on. What was originally a loving ode to French Architecture, was expanded with a cartoonish caricature.

I’m not sure I agree with this. Everything is very well done in this section. They should have themed the buildings for the sight lines from the skyway but everything else was done to a pretty good quality. I mean the little crepe stand at world showcase was not master design.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I’m not sure I agree with this. Everything is very well done in this section. They should have themed the buildings for the sight lines from the skyway but everything else was done to a pretty good quality. I mean the little crepe stand at world showcase was not master design.

I do like the ratatouille area…but I don’t know if it’s because it’s well done…or I expect so little of late?

They either miss with detail (toy sorry land)…or miss on draw/appeal (Abrams land)

For every avatar…we get a meh like NFL or the frozen meet and greet house that no one wants (couldn’t see that one coming )

 

[Sectorkeeper71]

Wait, you can’t control the AC at WDW Disney resorts?

When I was on my honeymoon in November, there was a certain point you couldn’t lower the AC past without maintenance coming and overriding it. Wanna say the lowest you could set it was 68 or 67 but I might be misremembering

 

[UNCgolf]

I’m not sure I agree with this. Everything is very well done in this section. They should have themed the buildings for the sight lines from the skyway but everything else was done to a pretty good quality. I mean the little crepe stand at world showcase was not master design.

The interior of the creperie is pretty bad.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

When I was on my honeymoon in November, there was a certain point you couldn’t lower the AC past without maintenance coming and overriding it. Wanna say the lowest you could set it was 68 or 67 but I might be misremembering

They have turned them down to a very limited range…and they all are intuitive to conserve power when you’re not there

 

[Sectorkeeper71]

They have turned them down to a very limited range…and they all are intuitive to conserve power when you’re not there

Hey when I’m not there, go for it. I’m not storing vats of ice cream on the counter so I could care less. But when I’m in the room? Let me set that sucker to a meat locker. Considering how much they charge for the rooms to begin with

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

The interior of the creperie is pretty bad.

Probably because they’ve dethemed/cafeteriaized to an increasing degree for years and people kept paying for it…

like the glorified sizzler known as “be our guest”

 

[Sectorkeeper71]

I think Disney has a bad "E-Ticket only" mentality and they cut everything else and don't open other types of attractions.

it’s especially bad in studios. There’s zero relief to the crazy big waits to the rides because the park is the size of a postage stamp and only has E tickets for the most part. You need some basic Omnimover rides there to take those people out of lines and pathways and occupied elsewhere

 

[JoeCamel]

Hey when I’m not there, go for it. I’m not storing vats of ice cream on the counter so I could care less. But when I’m in the room? Let me set that sucker to a meat locker. Considering how much they chargers for the rooms to begin with

Cool thing is they also own Reedy Creek Energy Services which supplies the electricity they use to run the AC, seems like they might want to sell more power as the Toy Story guy would say........

 

[networkpro]

Walt Disney World was never a "kids park." It was a family resort.

I felt that there should be something built … some kind of amusement enterprise built ... where the parents and the children could have fun together. So that’s how Disneyland started. Well, it took many years … it was a … oh, a period of maybe 15 years developing. I started with many ideas, threw them away, started all over again. And eventually, it evolved into what you see today at Disneyland. But it all started from a daddy with two daughters wondering where he could take them where he could have a little fun with them too.”

Walt Disney

Walt Celebrates Disneyland 1965

www.mouseplanet.com

Walt or his family hasn't had control of the company for decades. These are the folks that are really calling the shots and sweater man dances to their tune.

Shareholder	Number of Shares
State Street Corporation	50 million
Vanguard Group	45 million
BlackRock	40 million
Berkshire Hathaway	35 million
Capital Research	30 million

 

[Sectorkeeper71]

And the former site in VA they were going to build it on is all subdivisions...

One of the most ludicrous claims of that backlash (which did have legitimate criticisms to it mind you) was that the park was somehow on “sacred ground” because it wasn’t super far from manassas

Nothing says “honor the fallen” like urban sprawl instead…

 

[monothingie]

The hotels are the ultimate example of this. While Walt Disney World has not yet seen the full-scale IP hotel invasion, I bet we'll have that in the next few years. Instead of loving spaces dedicated to different time periods and artistic styles, we'll get various iterations of the Pixar Pier Hotel. It's a fine hotel, but it's not aimed at adults.

I think that there was a realization with the negative reaction to the Incredibilization of the Contemporary Resort, that there is a limit to the forceful insertion of IP. In more recent renovations at the GF, Boardwalk, Yacht, Saratoga, OKW, you’ve seen the IP intrusion much more subdued and more tactfully done.

I think it was lesson learned that you don’t make a $800+/night room have all the feel and quality of a room at AOA. (Not that Disney Deluxe Hotels even deserve to be categorized at that level of “luxury”.)

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

One of the most ludicrous claims of that backlash (which did have legitimate criticisms to it mind you) was that the park was somehow on “sacred ground” because it wasn’t super far from manassas

Nothing says “honor the fallen” like urban sprawl instead…

Or a struggle over forced lifelong servitude

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

I think that there was a realization with the negative reaction to the Incredibilization of the Contemporary Resort, that there is a limit to the forceful insertion of IP. In more recent renovations at the GF, Boardwalk, Yacht, Saratoga, OKW, you’ve seen the IP intrusion much more subdued and more tactfully done.

I think it was lesson learned that you don’t make a $800+/night room have all the feel and quality of a room at AOA. (Not that Disney Deluxe Hotels even deserve to be categorized at that level of “luxury”.)

I was pleasantly surprised with how nice the Riverside renovation went. A few princess and the frog elements on the curtains but they left the herb Ryman painting and the over all feel of the room is still on theme and doesn’t feel cartoon or value resort level.

 

[Sectorkeeper71]

Or a struggle over forced lifelong servitude

Yeah some of the stuff the proposed was bonkers and very out of touch. Saying “we want you to know what it was like to be a slave” is….something to say. I’m sure they meant the way that historical sites around the country educate you on that sort of thing, but you gotta choose your words carefully.

And I think the idea of the park would’ve become more of an inflection point in a time where politics has gotten even more polarizing. But the locals can be happy now that they have their suburbia and golf courses on that sacred ground instead of a theme park

 

[pheneix]

Lots of commentary on here about Simpsons….

Rumormongering from Disney side: there’s a huge push from the CEO’s office over Simpsons. The show’s reruns are a draw on D+. Apparently a big one. I think the CEO straight up enjoys the show too.

I think in a perfect world for Disney, they’re gonna want these characters on stage repping their parks at D23.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Yeah some of the stuff the proposed was bonkers and very out of touch. Saying “we want you to know what it was like to be a slave” is….something to say. I’m sure they meant the way that historical sites around the country educate you on that sort of thing, but you gotta choose your words carefully.

And I think the idea of the park would’ve become more of an inflection point in a time where politics has gotten even more polarizing. But the locals can be happy now that they have their suburbia and golf courses on that sacred ground instead of a theme park

You can NEVER have enough McMansions for defense contractors

 

[WoundedDreamer]

Lots of commentary on here about Simpsons….

Rumormongering from Disney side: there’s a huge push from the CEO’s office over Simpsons. The show’s reruns are a draw on D+. Apparently a big one. I think the CEO straight up enjoys the show too.

I think in a perfect world for Disney, they’re gonna want these characters on stage repping their parks at D23.

Honestly, this is not too surprising. One of the primary reasons Disney justified the Fox acquisition was the ability to use Fox to drive synergy. There's only one problem with that. Apart from National Geographic on Disney+, Disney's not really done anything to leverage the Fox assets. Not even the X-Men or Fantastic 4 have yet appeared in the MCU. The handful of films and brands that are Fox in origin on Disney+ are not driving significant viewership (with the exception of Avatar). Unlike Iger's acquisitions of Star Wars and Marvel, investors are scratching their heads wondering why he spent so much on these assets. There's been almost no tangible benefit.

Pushing Simpsons is a face-saving maneuver. Iger needs to push the Simpsons so he has proof of the Fox buyout's value.