Peter Pan Queue

[MerlinTheGoat]

So will the ride close for any of the queue project? I'd imagine it would have too.

Not necessarily. Winnie the Pooh remained open I believe throughout the entire construction period for its new queue and facade in 2010 (I visited while it was completely covered in walls and tarps, but the ride was still open). Odds are something similar is being planned out for whatever they're doing for Peter Pan. They also now have extra space granted from the vacant bathrooms to work with, so they could potentially maintain better queue capacity than was possible with Pooh. I can easily see the ride remaining open while whatever work is being done to the queue and/or facade.

Besides, we really don't know what sort of change this "project" entails. The permits are too vague to tell what exactly is happening and to what extent, it just says it's queue work for Peter Pan's Flight and that's about it. And as far as I know, no insiders have spoken up about what's actually changing either. Hopefully this does end up being a rather substantial and major change. While i've felt somewhat let down with the new attractions for the Fantasyland overhaul during the past 5 years, the theming has generally been very good. And as it stands it would probably be rather difficult to make Peter Pan's facade and queue any worse than it is now.

I wish the ride WOULD close for an extended overhaul. WDW's Peter Pan has been hobbling along for numerous decades now while looking the same it always did (which I'd argue is outdated even by 1971 standards) and needs a good solid rennovation to at least bring it up to the standards set by the superior versions at Disneyland and Disneyland Paris. It's far from just the facades that are better at those parks, the ride itself is much better as well (i'm curious to see what Shanghai's version will be like too). With Disneyland's already better version getting even more ride enhancements for the 60th anniversary, WDW's is going to look ever more absurdly outdated than it already is. And if other queues are any indication, that's yet another drop in the barrel which will further accentuate the ride's shortcomings (it has become increasingly far too common for queues to overshadow and surpass the rides themselves in quality).

 

[xstech25]

The only thing I noticed that was different about Disneyland Paris' version is the queue: most noticeably the fact that there was graffiti all over it.

 

[Californian Elitist]

The only thing I noticed that was different about Disneyland Paris' version is the queue: most noticeably the fact that there was graffiti all over it.

The star field is arguably the biggest and most major difference between the DL and MK rides.

 

[MerlinTheGoat]

The only thing I noticed that was different about Disneyland Paris' version is the queue: most noticeably the fact that there was graffiti all over it.

I can't speak for the condition it's in because I haven't visited DLP since the mid 90's when it was brand spanking new, but the rides are vastly different. DLP's is very similar to Disneyland, and both are superior to WDW's.

DLP starts out in a very similar manner to WDW's with the nursery and overhead of London (I would perhaps give WDW's a little credit for its London scene for feeling more 3-dimensional here but that's where WDW's advantages begin and end). It changes drastically as soon as you get to the flight over Neverland island scene. Here you get an entire room dedicated to just flying around a lovely island sculpture of neverland, traveling around the perimeter. Not to mention the neat looking and well lit star field surrounding it (I'm assuming it's fiber optics or something). Afterwards you get a really nice starry tunnel acting as a transition and from there on the scenes play out quite differently. The set pieces are still based on the same characters and scenes from the movie, but each scene is larger and more detailed than WDW's with better looking and better moving figures. They're better separated into specific scenes as well. I realize that for WDW's they were trying to be creative and make it seem like a gradual transition as if you were coming in for a landing from far above (which is why the figures are small and there's a kind of forced perspective at work), but the result is IMHO a bit awkward and everything feels like a cramped mishmash (seeing a forced perspective scene at the angles you do also completely ruins the desired effect). I'll take the versions at Disneyland/DLP with their more segmented scenes and transitions. The size of sets and characters does increase once you get to the skull rock scene, but the scenes are still far behind in detail and technology compared to the ones at DL/DLP.

I'll also mention that there are numerous newer fiber optic effects that are missing at WDW's but present at DLP. An example of WDW's outdated tech. The Mermaid Lagoon scene is one such example. Disneyland Paris has an advantage over even Disneyland in this regard, the part where Tinkerbell sprinkles the pirate ship with pixie dust is covered with a large curtain of fiber optic lighting (I wonder if the upcoming refurb for DL's 60th will finally add in the fiber optic effects, or perhaps digital mapping or something).

Along with that, the soundtrack at WDW's is a singular slow instrumental loop of the "You Can Fly" song. It's dreamy and not unpleasant, but it can't compare to the diverse and better paced/choreographed soundtrack used for Disneyland/DLP's. There's an actual buildup to the "You Can Fly" song as you first take flight just like the movie, and the song changes dramatically throughout the ride (they also mix in "Pirates Life is a Wonderful Life" for more diversity). The pace of the song used at DL/DLP in the beginning captures the thrill of flying far better than the slow and dreamlike feel of WDW's. WDW's dreamy version of the song is better suited for either the queue or nursery. Though i'd be in favor of mixing in my favorite song in the movie for a new queue, Second Star to the Right.

Here's the soundtrack used for the Disneyland and DLP version-


WDW's soundtrack is largely composed of a loop of the first 25 seconds with minor variations in the percussion and instruments depending on the scene (the tempo of the music doesn't really change at all). Past that point you can hear where the music becomes far more diverse and better paced to the events of the ride than WDW.

Also, while not necessarily an advantage, WDW's version uses a somewhat different type of ride system. It continually loads very much like an omnimover. DL/DLP stops whenever it loads or unloads more like a traditional dark ride. I'm unsure whether time has changed this, DLP's used to feel faster and a bit more thrilling, as if it were being allowed to run at variable speeds throughout the ride. Given that it wasn't a continuous loader, I would imagine there's some truth to this and i'd give it another advantage there. While I don't know if changing WDW's ride system to match the ones from DL/DLP would help capacity any, I would imagine altering the vehicles to support DLP's two-row seating WOULD help things considerably.

 

[Mike S]

I can't speak for the condition it's in because I haven't visited DLP since the mid 90's when it was brand spanking new, but the rides are vastly different. DLP's is very similar to Disneyland, and both are superior to WDW's.

DLP starts out in a very similar manner to WDW's with the nursery and overhead of London (I would perhaps give WDW's a little credit for its London scene for feeling more 3-dimensional here but that's where WDW's advantages begin and end). It changes drastically as soon as you get to the flight over Neverland island scene. Here you get an entire room dedicated to just flying around a lovely island sculpture of neverland, traveling around the perimeter. Not to mention the neat looking and well lit star field surrounding it (I'm assuming it's fiber optics or something). Afterwards you get a really nice starry tunnel acting as a transition and from there on the scenes play out quite differently. The set pieces are still based on the same characters and scenes from the movie, but each scene is larger and more detailed than WDW's with better looking and better moving figures. They're better separated into specific scenes as well. I realize that for WDW's they were trying to be creative and make it seem like a gradual transition as if you were coming in for a landing from far above (which is why the figures are small and there's a kind of forced perspective at work), but the result is IMHO a bit awkward and everything feels like a cramped mishmash (seeing a forced perspective scene at the angles you do also completely ruins the desired effect). I'll take the versions at Disneyland/DLP with their more segmented scenes and transitions. The size of sets and characters does increase once you get to the skull rock scene, but the scenes are still far behind in detail and technology compared to the ones at DL/DLP.

I'll also mention that there are numerous newer fiber optic effects that are missing at WDW's but present at DLP. An example of WDW's outdated tech. The Mermaid Lagoon scene is one such example. Disneyland Paris has an advantage over even Disneyland in this regard, the part where Tinkerbell sprinkles the pirate ship with pixie dust is covered with a large curtain of fiber optic lighting (I wonder if the upcoming refurb for DL's 60th will finally add in the fiber optic effects, or perhaps digital mapping or something).

Along with that, the soundtrack at WDW's is a singular slow instrumental loop of the "You Can Fly" song. It's dreamy and not unpleasant, but it can't compare to the diverse and better paced/choreographed soundtrack used for Disneyland/DLP's. There's an actual buildup to the "You Can Fly" song as you first take flight just like the movie, and the song changes dramatically throughout the ride (they also mix in "Pirates Life is a Wonderful Life" for more diversity). The pace of the song used at DL/DLP in the beginning captures the thrill of flying far better than the slow and dreamlike feel of WDW's. WDW's dreamy version of the song is better suited for either the queue or nursery. Though i'd be in favor of mixing in my favorite song in the movie for a new queue, Second Star to the Right.

Here's the soundtrack used for the Disneyland and DLP version-


WDW's soundtrack is largely composed of a loop of the first 25 seconds with minor variations in the percussion and instruments depending on the scene (the tempo of the music doesn't really change at all). Past that point you can hear where the music becomes far more diverse and better paced to the events of the ride than WDW.

Also, while not necessarily an advantage, WDW's version uses a somewhat different type of ride system. It continually loads very much like an omnimover. DL/DLP stops whenever it loads or unloads more like a traditional dark ride. I'm unsure whether time has changed this, DLP's used to feel faster and a bit more thrilling, as if it were being allowed to run at variable speeds throughout the ride. Given that it wasn't a continuous loader, I would imagine there's some truth to this and i'd give it another advantage there. While I don't know if changing WDW's ride system to match the ones from DL/DLP would help capacity any, I would imagine altering the vehicles to support DLP's two-row seating WOULD help things considerably.

Great analysis and while I agree the other versions are superior because of their effects and improvements one thing I like about ours is the fly through Neverland rather than above and around in the other versions. I don't know, just my preference.

 

[MerlinTheGoat]

I get what the designers were going for when it comes to the flight through Neverland at WDW, a transition to make it seem like you're changing altitudes as scenery props and characters change sizes. The problem I have is that the scenes feel way too crammed together for my tastes and the forced perspective doesn't work very well with the angles you're able to see things. It's something that felt off to me even as a child and baffled me for several years until I rode another version. When I was little I didn't even understand that the scene was laid out with varying sizes of sets and figures to indicate a gradually shifting altitude. It just looked weird and off.

Upon my visit to Disneyland Paris right around the mid 90's and experiencing what I consider a far superior version of the ride, I was finally able to understand what they were going for with WDW's and articulate just why it didn't work for me. At Paris (and Disneyland's which is almost identical besides some minor effects) you're given an overhead of Neverland that is clearly intended to be seen from far above. The transition that happens is more abrupt, but it's handled in a way that isn't confusing and doesn't have any flawed forced perspective effects at work. And the result IMHO is a more cohesive and less visually flawed experience. WDW's transition was a creative idea, but the execution is very flawed and just doesn't work for me IMO.

 

[Jose]

So they are working on the facade and the queue? when?

 

[MerlinTheGoat]

So they are working on the facade and the queue? when?

I wish we knew, I don't think anyone knows much if anything more than when this topic began. All we have to go on is a phrase in the permit posted here- MK PP Queue Phase 1. As far as I can tell, there has only been speculation as to what will happen or when. I wonder whether they'll even go through with this. Are there any insiders who can provide any details on this? Such as @marni1971 or @Lee for example?

The thing is that Lee mentioned some time ago that Disney decided to cease installing interactive elements in queues in the future. Mine Train he mentioned having been approved before such a decision was made and was the last of those. So the question is what sort of queue enhancements would be made to Peter Pan if not interactive. All of us suspected that a Pan queue overhaul was inevitable in the near future with the relocation of the bathrooms to the old skyway area. Unless they've since gone back and decided to continue interactive elements again, I would imagine the queue changes are only going to be thematic in nature and not hands-on (which is fine by me, I find the interactive elements generally obnoxious noise though enjoy having appropriate things to look at while waiting).

The problem with redoing PP's facade is that there are still going to be a lot of leftover relics from the old Fantasyland in the immediate area to further clash with the new stuff. I highly dislike the old tent facades and fully support any proposals to redo them to something similar to DL or DLP, but the changes need to encompass all the buildings. Peter Pan is nestled between both Philharmagic and Small World, and both of those still utilize the old tent style facades. They need to adapt as well or else the entire area is going to suffer from a thematic cluster**** of epic failed proportions... And as I mentioned, the outdated nature of the ride itself is also going to clash rather terribly with a potential quality queue and facade as well and also begs to be updated.

Small World as i've said before needs a new facade very badly perhaps just as much as Peter Pan. But it will require a considerable amount of creativity to pull off properly, perhaps more than i'm willing to assume the executive bean counters will allow (duplicating Disneyland's is neither appropriate or reasonable within the limited space parameters, they already tried and failed miserably to attempt it on the inside). Philharmagic and the Princess meet and greet still use old tent facades as well. And considering the meet and greet is pretty much still brand new, I doubt it's going away or changing anytime soon...

 

[marni1971]

Still waiting....

STILL.....

 

[MerlinTheGoat]

Still waiting....

STILL.....

Waiting for information, or waiting for Disney to actually finally go through with this? Have you any idea what (if anything) has been on the table for this supposed "queue work"? I would at least take from your comment that just because a permit is filed, it doesn't mean something is absolutely going to happen until it actually does.

I'm worried about any potential projects going forward in the future at WDW. Whether they're big or small ones. From everything we've heard, the catastrophic financial mess they've gotten themselves into with next gen (who even knows what its pricetag has reached at this point now, well over 2 billion last we were told and that was many many months ago) seems to be causing them to further cannibalizing already sparse park budgets at ever increasing rates.

 

[MMlvr]

I like the ride itself as is. But the que is not so good, cramped and hot. It could really use an update . Some times we just pass by due to the packed line. If they could spread you out a little it would help, just so your not standing on top of each other.

 

[RSoxNo1]

I like the ride itself as is. But the que is not so good, cramped and hot. It could really use an update . Some times we just pass by due to the packed line. If they could spread you out a little it would help, just so your not standing on top of each other.

I think the ride needs a major update. I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but it looks like the animatronics have not been updated since 1971. Part of what makes Pooh's Hunny Hunt such a great attraction are the great animatronics in it. Currently, I regard Pan as the most overrated attraction in Walt Disney World. Great ride system, lousy show scenes. Upgrade the show and it will truly be a great attraction.

 

[cw1982]

I think the ride needs a major update. I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but it looks like the animatronics have not been updated since 1971. Part of what makes Pooh's Hunny Hunt such a great attraction are the great animatronics in it. Currently, I regard Pan as the most overrated attraction in Walt Disney World. Great ride system, lousy show scenes. Upgrade the show and it will truly be a great attraction.

I agree. It's a shame, though, that the ride isn't more up to date. Flying over Neverland seems like an endless source of opportunities for Imagineers to show their true skill.

Anyone care to make a bet on when a refurbishment for the actual ride that does it justice will happen? My wager is not optimistic, given that they're getting away with leaving it the way it is and seeing such long waits daily.

 

[Mike S]

I get what the designers were going for when it comes to the flight through Neverland at WDW, a transition to make it seem like you're changing altitudes as scenery props and characters change sizes. The problem I have is that the scenes feel way too crammed together for my tastes and the forced perspective doesn't work very well with the angles you're able to see things. It's something that felt off to me even as a child and baffled me for several years until I rode another version. When I was little I didn't even understand that the scene was laid out with varying sizes of sets and figures to indicate a gradually shifting altitude. It just looked weird and off.

Upon my visit to Disneyland Paris right around the mid 90's and experiencing what I consider a far superior version of the ride, I was finally able to understand what they were going for with WDW's and articulate just why it didn't work for me. At Paris (and Disneyland's which is almost identical besides some minor effects) you're given an overhead of Neverland that is clearly intended to be seen from far above. The transition that happens is more abrupt, but it's handled in a way that isn't confusing and doesn't have any flawed forced perspective effects at work. And the result IMHO is a more cohesive and less visually flawed experience. WDW's transition was a creative idea, but the execution is very flawed and just doesn't work for me IMO.

Perhaps that's something they could fix should they ever bother to update the ride.

 

[mharrington]

FYI there were some walls up around the queue yesterday that I had not noticed just three days earlier.

I thought that it was just for the removal of the Fastpass devices?

 

[flyerjab]

Is this still the original ride as when it opened in 1971?

 

[Lee]

I wish we knew, I don't think anyone knows much if anything more than when this topic began. All we have to go on is a phrase in the permit posted here- MK PP Queue Phase 1. As far as I can tell, there has only been speculation as to what will happen or when. I wonder whether they'll even go through with this. Are there any insiders who can provide any details on this? Such as @marni1971 or @Lee for example?

The thing is that Lee mentioned some time ago that Disney decided to cease installing interactive elements in queues in the future. Mine Train he mentioned having been approved before such a decision was made and was the last of those. So the question is what sort of queue enhancements would be made to Peter Pan if not interactive. All of us suspected that a Pan queue overhaul was inevitable in the near future with the relocation of the bathrooms to the old skyway area. Unless they've since gone back and decided to continue interactive elements again, I would imagine the queue changes are only going to be thematic in nature and not hands-on (which is fine by me, I find the interactive elements generally obnoxious noise though enjoy having appropriate things to look at while waiting).

The problem with redoing PP's facade is that there are still going to be a lot of leftover relics from the old Fantasyland in the immediate area to further clash with the new stuff. I highly dislike the old tent facades and fully support any proposals to redo them to something similar to DL or DLP, but the changes need to encompass all the buildings. Peter Pan is nestled between both Philharmagic and Small World, and both of those still utilize the old tent style facades. They need to adapt as well or else the entire area is going to suffer from a thematic cluster**** of epic failed proportions... And as I mentioned, the outdated nature of the ride itself is also going to clash rather terribly with a potential quality queue and facade as well and also begs to be updated.

Small World as i've said before needs a new facade very badly perhaps just as much as Peter Pan. But it will require a considerable amount of creativity to pull off properly, perhaps more than i'm willing to assume the executive bean counters will allow (duplicating Disneyland's is neither appropriate or reasonable within the limited space parameters, they already tried and failed miserably to attempt it on the inside). Philharmagic and the Princess meet and greet still use old tent facades as well. And considering the meet and greet is pretty much still brand new, I doubt it's going away or changing anytime soon...

It's been quite a while since I've heard anything about about Pan.
As far as I know, the queue remodel/expansion is still going to happen, but without the interactive elements that were originally planned.

The facade....I have no idea about.

 

[PeoplemoverTTA]

FYI there were some walls up around the queue yesterday that I had not noticed just three days earlier.

Yeah, my husband and I were at MK on Sunday, 7/20 and there were no walls there. Back in MK Monday morning, 7/21, and the front part of the queue was walled off (ride still operating). We left later that day, so I'm not sure if it was for anything special or not.

 

[Magenta Panther]

Peter Pan is a ride that deserves a major rebuild. The Imagineers could leave its storyline intact - the original Imagineers nailed it perfectly. But the use of new tech and new AAs, plus an expansion of the ride track, could change this little dark ride into something extraordinary.

On the other hand, TDO's idea of a rebuild would probably mean it'd rip out everything and replace it with screens.

Forget I said anything...

 

[Slowjack]

Peter Pan is a ride that deserves a major rebuild. The Imagineers could leave its storyline intact - the original Imagineers nailed it perfectly. But the use of new tech and new AAs, plus an expansion of the ride track, could change this little dark ride into something extraordinary.

On the other hand, TDO's idea of a rebuild would probably mean it'd rip out everything and replace it with screens.

Forget I said anything...

That more or less sums up my feelings as well. I would love to see an updated version of the original ride. There's some magic in this ride that, when combined with what what WDI has learned to do over the years, could make a oldie-but-goodie into a fantastic ride for today. But I fear any redo would be performed by people who don't get what people loved about the original.

Also, though, I can't forget that the ride already has a long and slow-moving line. I don't think it makes much sense to improve the ride without dramatically improving capacity as well. Using the two-row boats would help, but is that enough? And what else could they do?