News Zootopia and Moana Blue Sky concepts for Disney's Animal Kingdom

[MagicHappens1971]

2019 - 2024 is about five years according to my math.

TBA wasn’t officially announced until 2020, during the pandemic. The actual turn around time on the attraction will be between 18-24 months

 

[lazyboy97o]

TBA wasn’t officially announced until 2020, during the pandemic. The actual turn around time on the attraction will be between 18-24 months

It was announced stating it had already been in development. This though right here is the problem with all of these arguments about timelines, you're not comparing the same things. TRON was announced before the vast majority of its design work was done, and was also able to utilize elements of fast track project delivery to have construction ork start before design work was complete.

 

[Casper Gutman]

Periodic reminder that Tron was supposed to be completed before the pandemic ever hit. The pandemic only became an issue because of previous delays. Please stop using an incredible global tragedy as an excuse.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Periodic reminder that Tron was supposed to be completed before the pandemic ever hit. The pandemic only became an issue because of previous delays. Please stop using an incredible global tragedy as an excuse.

TRON was never going to be ready before the pandemic.

 

[Casper Gutman]

TRON was never going to be ready before the pandemic.

My understanding was that Tron was one of a group of rides intended to open BEFORE the 50th, with another, never announced slate intended to open during the event.

 

[ToTBellHop]

2019 - 2024 is about five years according to my math.

A bit disingenuous when the ride it replaces was open until last month. Shall we count the present toward Zootopia’s construction timeline if it’s replacing Dino even though Dino is open?

 

[Incomudro]

Avatar is the weirdest darn franchise. It consistently makes astronomical amounts of money while seeming to have almost no larger cultural footprint. I can’t think of many comparable IPs in Hollywood history.

Yeah, it's like one of those bands that sells a tremendous amount of recordings - yet you can't find anyone who will admit they like them.
Like Nickelback.

 

[lazyboy97o]

A bit disingenuous when the ride it replaces was open until last month. Shall we count the present toward Zootopia’s construction timeline if it’s replacing Dino even though Dino is open?

It’s not disingenuous. The time people complain about with TRON included design time.

 

[MagicHappens1971]

It’s not disingenuous. The time people complain about with TRON included design time.

Design time for what? They basically picked it up and plopped it down in MK. I’m sure there were some changes that had to be made As well as converting measurements, but let’s not pretend that’s what took so long.

 

[SplashJacket]

Avatar is the weirdest darn franchise. It consistently makes astronomical amounts of money while seeming to have almost no larger cultural footprint. I can’t think of many comparable IPs in Hollywood history.

Yeah, it's like one of those bands that sells a tremendous amount of recordings - yet you can't find anyone who will admit they like them.
Like Nickelback.

I have no earthly idea why this myth continues. Avatar absolutely does have cultural relevance. I’ve been at UFC watch parties where the fight starts getting ignored because people start debating the strengths and faults of Avatar.

Every quantitative piece of data demonstrates it’s cultural relevancy (ticket sales, theme park attendance boost, etc), and only qualitative data describes otherwise. Personally, I’ve never been involved in an conversation regarding the strengths and fault of LotR, despite the fact that it has a book series, 6 movies, filming locations as tourist attractions, and an extremely high budget, highly advertised TV series.

That doesn’t mean it’s culturally insignificant, because whether something is or isn’t culturally significant is entirely arbitrary. For whatever reason, people just conclude that Avatar lacks cultural relevance without evidence.

 

[MagicHappens1971]

I have no earthly idea why this myth continues. Avatar absolutely does have cultural relevance. I’ve been at UFC watch parties where the fight starts getting ignored because people start debating the strengths and faults of Avatar.

Every quantitative piece of data demonstrates it’s cultural relevancy (ticket sales, theme park attendance boost, etc), and only qualitative data describes otherwise. Personally, I’ve never been involved in an conversation regarding the strengths and fault of LotR, despite the fact that it has a book series, 6 movies, filming locations as tourist attractions, and an extremely high budget, highly advertised TV series.

That doesn’t mean it’s culturally insignificant, because whether something is or isn’t culturally significant is entirely arbitrary. For whatever reason, people just conclude that Avatar lacks cultural relevance without evidence.

It’s not really a myth. If you polled guests at Pandora and then at Galaxy’s Edge, I’d say less than 50% of all of guests have seen an Avatar film, while I’d say 80% or more have seen a Star Wars film. Avatar has a following but not a culturally significant one. It doesn’t hold much weight in the world of pop culture

 

[lazyboy97o]

Design time for what? They basically picked it up and plopped it down in MK. I’m sure there were some changes that had to be made As well as converting measurements, but let’s not pretend that’s what took so long.

I’m not pretending. Redrawing hundreds of sheets takes time and is much more than just converting measurements.

 

[MagicHappens1971]

I’m not pretending. Redrawing hundreds of sheets takes time and is much more than just converting measurements.

The attraction was announced in August of 2017 of construction broke ground in February of 2018. Disney was slow walking the attraction since before the pandemic. This most likely could’ve opened before the end of 2019 if they wanted it to

 

[lazyboy97o]

The attraction was announced in August of 2017 of construction broke ground in February of 2018. Disney was slow walking the attraction since before the pandemic. This most likely could’ve opened before the end of 2019 if they wanted it to

Disney often utilizes elements of fast track project delivery where work is phased to allow for construction to begin while design continues. Site work does not require the building to be fully designed in order to start, especially if you know the footprint is not going to change in any significant way.

 

[Tha Realest]

TRON was announced before the vast majority of its design work was done, and was also able to utilize elements of fast track project delivery to have construction ork start before design work was complete.

“Before the vast majority of its design work was done” my dude it’s a carbon copy

 

[lazyboy97o]

“Before the vast majority of its design work was done” my dude it’s a carbon copy

That’s not how it works.

 

[SplashJacket]

It’s not really a myth. If you polled guests at Pandora and then at Galaxy’s Edge, I’d say less than 50% of all of guests have seen an Avatar film, while I’d say 80% or more have seen a Star Wars film. Avatar has a following but not a culturally significant one. It doesn’t hold much weight in the world of pop culture

Star Wars has 10 films, a Christmas special, dozens and dozens of tv-show series that target all audiences of all ages, dozens of games, hundreds of books, special cruises, theme park presence in 5 resorts around the world, and has existed for decades.

Of course, it isn't as culturally significant as Star Wars, it has 2 films, and very little outside of that because it's still a young franchise.

Avatar probably has more cultural significance than all but a few 2-movie franchises.

Eventually, as the franchise grows, so will its significance, but the assertion that avatar is currently culturally insignificant is wild.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Reposting this here. An explanation of what goes into cloning an attraction.

Design is far more than just what is seen as a guest. It includes how everything, literally everything, goes together.

Hypothetically, let’s just look at the bathrooms as an example. This won’t be specifically about the bathrooms in the TRON building but I know it does have Cast Member bathrooms and that Chinese and US regulations do not align. Bathrooms are an area with very specific regulations, especially when it comes to accessibility. The following are some of the specific regulations that a wheelchair accessible toilet must meet: height, distance from the wall, clear space around the toilet, location of grab bars and location of the toilet in relation to the stall door.

Let’s say the accessible toilet, which is in a corner, has to move to the other wall. That wall may not be big enough to hold the plumbing for the toilet, so it has to get bigger. If it is a wall mounted toilet then the wall may be getting even bigger still. How does “stuff” get out of the toilet? You have to move those pipes too and they have to maintain a certain slope which means they could be taking up more space. And what is on the other side of that wall that had to get bigger? What if there is other equipment that has certain to be in a certain sized room that just got smaller?

That’s just a few issues that could arise in moving a toilet. The structure needs to be redesigned, or maybe even changed completely, for the local soil and wind loads. The HVAC system needs to be redesigned for the local climate. The electrical systems need to be redesigned for the local power supply. The location of waterproofing on the exterior walls might change based on climate. The type or amount of insulation can change based on the climate and energy codes. Emergency exit doors have to studied to ensure they are in the right locations, maybe more are needed or the exit path needs to change. All of those changes can and do have ripple effects like the toilet example above.

That’s just the legal and due diligence changes. Then there are possible operational or creative changes, even if minor. Ratatouille has an upcoming closure to fix its floor, so it makes sense to not make that mistake twice.


Steel coasters do routinely go from idea to opening day in 18-24 months but they are also not a lot. Most stations are little more than a roof and the maintenance area is a rather simple shed. The coasters themselves are all fabricated offsite and then assembled on site.


When did fabrication of the rooms start?


You are way off.

Look at slide 6 of this presentation:
https://network.aia.org/HigherLogic...tFileKey=25eadd48-6fff-4a2f-ae26-cef8a77d4f6d

Disney very often announces projects shortly after the Feasibility phase. There are exceptions like the Skyliner but it’s quite common, even with TRON. The end of Schematic Design is usually considered to be around 20% completion of design. That’s a lot of design work left to be done after an announcement and even at least some sort of art release. “Working plans” are not done. This is also why a project site will sit untouched after an announcement.

Approvals and plans are not done before the first dirt is moved. For large projects Disney often makes some use of the fast-track process where design and construction are overlapped. You don’t need a finished design to start site work, you don’t even need a finalized building footprint. Look at some of the South Florida Water Management District permits and you will see some that are just based around a general area and not any specific buildings. Even parts of actual vertical construction can and are overlapped with design.

 

[Jrb1979]

That’s not how it works.

No. They do tend to spread construction out for financial reasons so the books look better

 

[Casper Gutman]

I have no earthly idea why this myth continues. Avatar absolutely does have cultural relevance. I’ve been at UFC watch parties where the fight starts getting ignored because people start debating the strengths and faults of Avatar.

Every quantitative piece of data demonstrates it’s cultural relevancy (ticket sales, theme park attendance boost, etc), and only qualitative data describes otherwise. Personally, I’ve never been involved in an conversation regarding the strengths and fault of LotR, despite the fact that it has a book series, 6 movies, filming locations as tourist attractions, and an extremely high budget, highly advertised TV series.

That doesn’t mean it’s culturally insignificant, because whether something is or isn’t culturally significant is entirely arbitrary. For whatever reason, people just conclude that Avatar lacks cultural relevance without evidence.

Lord of the Rings is a really odd counterexample here. College courses are taught just about those books. It shaped and solidified widespread popular conceptions of certain mythic creatures and stories the way Disney’s films did to classic fairy tales. Elements of the story and quotes from the films have entered the popular lexicon. Totally unrelated comic characters are named after figures from the story. The films launched several major acting careers. Lord of the Rings was heavily tied up in the 60s college counter-culture. Etc…

What is Avatar’s iconic scene? Where is Sam Worthington’s superstar career? Where are the passionate and omnipresent fan communities debating every minutiae of canon? I’m sure some MUST exist, but they’re nowhere near as ubiquitous as SW, Marvel, or even (shudder) DC fans.

It’s not something that can be quantified, but I find it very hard to argue Avatar has the kind of cultural coattails it’s box office suggests. When Star Wars or The Matrix or LotR or Avengers came out, you couldn’t escape their cultural influence. Avatar is just sort of… there.