A gratuity is a volunteering gift to show appreciation for good service. The way we've allowed out system to play out is a sham. It's moved from showing appreciation to doing it out of guilt. We feel bad because it's hard work and they don't make much. Well, there are a lot of people of work really hard and don't make as much as they should. Lot's of people who provide a service that many never even think of tipping. Ever tipped the guy cleaning your carpets? Or the DJ you hired for your company's Christmas party? Or the lady who took your fantastic family photos? I'm guessing no. Most don't think about it, but we're wrapped up in tipping servers because they make so little. The problem is, that's not my fault. I was a server and thought, "Wow, this is hard and I don't make enough to show for it. I should find something else to do that has a better work/wage ratio." Aside from that, I do believe that you should tip on the entire experience of the restaurant. The server's where I worked had to share their tips with bussers, bar tenders, runners, etc. Everybody got a cut because every facet was important. If the food's bad or your drinks are wrong, it's OK for the tip to reflect. Besides, how else can you really illustrate their shortcomings other than with your wallet? Call and complain all you want, but as long as you're paying and tipping big, you're approving of the food and service provided. And, I'm with the previous poster that talked about tipped a higher percentage on lower bills and lower on higher bills. The $1.50 on my $10 bill seems like too little, while no server could ever do enough to deserve 15% of the bill for one of my family's trips to a character breakfast buffet.
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Yes, another tipping question
- Thread starter cbleigh
- Start date
mom2of2
Active Member
ok, coming out of the shadows to post and clear up some of the misunderstandings of a WDW server. I work in a restaurant in WDW, it is not a buffet or a character meal nor is it a signature restaurant. It's a regular table service and that's what I'm basing my post on.
We get $4.34 an hour. We pay taxes on all our charge tips and grats (TIW, CM, DVC, AP discounts) We have to claim our cash tips. From our tips we tip out based on our SALES, our bartender and food runners. They EACH get 10% of our SALES, not our tips. This means if the server is tipped at 15% they are tipping 20% out of food sales and 10% of drink sales. That doesn't really leave much for the server from that table. If you tip less then that, it basically cost me money to wait on your table. Non-US residents aren't used to our tipping practices and many tip very low (less then 10%) or not all all. I still have to tip out on my sales. If I have 2 or 3 of those tables in a shift...well it adds up quickly.
We also have to pay union dues, which is $8.00 a week as well as insurance. Pay checks are generally under $100 for a week. Most servers are now part time which means they get less then 24 hours a week, some weeks only getting 8 or 16 hours.
Most of the servers that I work with also have 2nd jobs, myself included. We work very hard, don't get breaks or lunch, much less time to get a drink or use the restroom. Imagine going to work for a minimum of 8 hours and you literally run from the moment you clock in until you leave.
We have tired, hungry, annoyed, excited,overwhelmed, wet, sweaty, cold and hot guests everyday. We have usually an hour to feed you, hydrate you, start your day, end your day and sometimes entertain you. We are the information booth, talking about parks, transportation, dining plans, resorts, shows, parades, fireworks, characters etc etc etc.
I'm not saying we are all perfect, because obviously we aren't, but we approach every table with a positive additude and hope for happy guests...most of the time that's what I find at my table....some of the time it's quite the opposite.
We get $4.34 an hour. We pay taxes on all our charge tips and grats (TIW, CM, DVC, AP discounts) We have to claim our cash tips. From our tips we tip out based on our SALES, our bartender and food runners. They EACH get 10% of our SALES, not our tips. This means if the server is tipped at 15% they are tipping 20% out of food sales and 10% of drink sales. That doesn't really leave much for the server from that table. If you tip less then that, it basically cost me money to wait on your table. Non-US residents aren't used to our tipping practices and many tip very low (less then 10%) or not all all. I still have to tip out on my sales. If I have 2 or 3 of those tables in a shift...well it adds up quickly.
We also have to pay union dues, which is $8.00 a week as well as insurance. Pay checks are generally under $100 for a week. Most servers are now part time which means they get less then 24 hours a week, some weeks only getting 8 or 16 hours.
Most of the servers that I work with also have 2nd jobs, myself included. We work very hard, don't get breaks or lunch, much less time to get a drink or use the restroom. Imagine going to work for a minimum of 8 hours and you literally run from the moment you clock in until you leave.
We have tired, hungry, annoyed, excited,overwhelmed, wet, sweaty, cold and hot guests everyday. We have usually an hour to feed you, hydrate you, start your day, end your day and sometimes entertain you. We are the information booth, talking about parks, transportation, dining plans, resorts, shows, parades, fireworks, characters etc etc etc.
I'm not saying we are all perfect, because obviously we aren't, but we approach every table with a positive additude and hope for happy guests...most of the time that's what I find at my table....some of the time it's quite the opposite.
Phonedave
Well-Known Member
Sometimes.
As a rule, wait staff tips out a percentage to service bartenders. They sometimes, but not all the time tip out to the back of the house. Runners, bussers, service bartenders, hostesses - they get a cut. Most of the time the kitchen does not. So if your food is off, complaining is what has to be done
-dave
CleveRocks
Active Member
I don't know how things work in Canada, but your comments regarding wait staff in the USA totally ignore the reality of the situation.
Whether it's a good system or a bad system, whether it's unfair or not, whether it should be that way or not, the fact is that we as diners ARE expected to pay part of a food server's salary. By FEDERAL LAW, food servers are permitted to be paid lower than the federal minimum wage. This is because it is expected that tips will bring their income up to at least the minimum wage.
It's not like a waiter can just go to another restaurant that will pay him more ... they don't exist. They all do it the same way.
I'm not saying it's a good system, I'm just saying that the reality of the situation as it stands today is that waiters and waitresses are permitted by law to be paid less than would otherwise be permitted by law. It is expected that they will make up the difference by the tips they earn.
If you don't like it, it doesn't change the reality of the situation.
In America, there is an implied social contract: if you eat at a table-service restaurant, you will give an average tip to a server who performs a satisfactory job ... less money for a less-than-satisfactory job, and perhaps more money for a really stellar job. After knowing it, deciding that the social contract doesn't apply to you is, for lack of a better word, rude.
I agree with you that the law is the problem. The fact that our society has allowed this law is shameful. However, you call it Social Contract, I call it guilt. We rarely tip because of gratitude, but more likely because we feel bad. Not to mention that tipping in the food service industry is out of control. Typically food prices are on the rise, making my 15% tip also grow. Yet more and more, I hear the the 15% standard has risen to 18% and then 20%. Getting the taken for more money from both ends is off-putting. Additionally, every quick-service restaurant like Panera Bread seems to seek tips as well. Plus the barista at the coffee place has a tip jar too. When does it end? I'm not sure of every wage and every federal law, but at some point I just want employees to do the job their getting paid to do. The garbage man works really hard, does a job that few want to do and provides me with a hugely valuable service. Where is his tip jar?
cymbaldiva
Active Member
A social contract....hmmmmm. Can I get that in writing somewhere? What I think is rude is being expected to give a 20% tip to someone for merely doing their job and more if they actually do it well.... :shrug:
The reality of the situation is when I go to a table service restaurant, I am there to sit down and have my order taken, my food prepared and my order being brought to me. This are all services that a table service restaurant provides, that is why I am there. My food and beverages cost more because I am there. Being that I am already being charged more for what I actually ordered because I am in a table service establishment, it really bothers me to be brow-beaten over what I should tip. I mean really, haven't I already paid?
Federal law is really not my problem here; nor is it my concern on how wait staff is made to split their gratuities. The kicker for me is.....? When I ask my friends who wait or have waited tables why they didn't/don't get a flat rate per hour job? Their 100% consistent answer is because they make alot more money waiting tables.
Tip what you think is fair....please don't be concerned over a "social contract"
Alison1975
Well-Known Member
When i waited tables in a sit down I raked in the dough.. I made well above min wage..WELL.. think sometimes $50-60 an hour.. I never ever went into a table expecting a tip though. I worked for it, and was glad when i got it.
As for the tip jars at every coffee,panera ,heck gas station..um NO.. I do not add even a penny.. ever.. not every job is a tip job, people need to get the heck over that.. it's rude and just unreal.
As for the tip jars at every coffee,panera ,heck gas station..um NO.. I do not add even a penny.. ever.. not every job is a tip job, people need to get the heck over that.. it's rude and just unreal.
Prince-1
Well-Known Member
Simply try this....everyone stop tipping at restaurants and see what type of service you get. Guarantee the wallets start opening up then.
I also can't stand those that say, "Why should I pay the salaries of the wait staff, that's the job of the restaurant." It's simple, we tip because that is the way that it is done. Don't like it, eat at home.
Have a nice day. :xmas:
I also can't stand those that say, "Why should I pay the salaries of the wait staff, that's the job of the restaurant." It's simple, we tip because that is the way that it is done. Don't like it, eat at home.
Have a nice day. :xmas:
RonAnnArbor
Well-Known Member
I don't have much to add except to go back to the Original Post....
It is improper tipping manners to tip based on the discounted meal. The proper tip is always on the full cost of the meal without the discount applied. That goes across the board at all restaurants, and throughout the service industry. That holds true at WDW as it does anywhere else.
If you get a coupon for 5 dollars off a 10 dollar haircut, you don't tip 75 cents for your 5 dollar haircut -- you still tip 1.50 to 2.00 for your haircut.
The same holds true at a restaurant. If your meal comes to 10 dollars, and you get a half-off coupon, you don't tip .75 for the meal -- you still tip 1.50 to 2.00 for the meal.
It is improper tipping manners to tip based on the discounted meal. The proper tip is always on the full cost of the meal without the discount applied. That goes across the board at all restaurants, and throughout the service industry. That holds true at WDW as it does anywhere else.
If you get a coupon for 5 dollars off a 10 dollar haircut, you don't tip 75 cents for your 5 dollar haircut -- you still tip 1.50 to 2.00 for your haircut.
The same holds true at a restaurant. If your meal comes to 10 dollars, and you get a half-off coupon, you don't tip .75 for the meal -- you still tip 1.50 to 2.00 for the meal.
unkadug
Follower of "Saget"The Cult
If everyone quit tipping, restaurants would be forced to pay their personnel more money because nobody would take a job waiting for the money they get paid now.
Phonedave
Well-Known Member
It is simple.
If EVERYONE stopped tipping restaurants would have to start paying their wait staff a competitive wage. The owners are not going to eat that increase, they are going to add it on to the prices on the menu.
So, nobody will tip, prices on the menu will go up 20%, and wait staff will not hustle to try and get a good tip and everyone who used to complain about tipping will now complain about how high the menu prices are and how lousy the service is.
-dave
Phonedave
Well-Known Member
Some people tip the garbage man (and the mail man, and the UPS man, etc)
I used to work with a guy who would moonlight (or early morning light) as a garbage man.
Around the holidays, each of the three guys on the truck could walk away with an extra $500 in cash.
-dave
CleveRocks
Active Member
Let's go back to the law. The barista is paid at least minimum wage. The garbage man is paid more than minimum wage. I don't tip someone who is already paid a normal and legal wage. A garbage man doesn't expect to get tips as part of his pay; if it happens, it's a rare lucky bonus. Same with a barista. But a waiter/waitress earns less than minimum wage for a reason, because the federal government expects that the patrons will make up the rest.
I hate tip jars. They water down the whole meaning of tips.
Knowing the very very basics of the federal law would help you understand where I'm coming from. Because it's EXACTLY what I base these opinions on.
CleveRocks
Active Member
Why so hung up over the term I used , "social contract." Do you prefer "social custom," "societal norm," "common sense"?
I've never in my life worked in a tipped position. No one in my family has, as a matter of fact. So I'm not coming from a selfish place when I talk about tipping.
But in our society, there are some things almost all of us do because it's the RIGHT thing to do. There's no law commanding us to do it, there are no negative repercussions for us if we don't do it, we just do it because it's right. Holding a door for a frail elderly person and delaying ourselves by 10 seconds. Having a cart brimming full of groceries but letting a parent and cranky child with 2 items go ahead of us at the supermarket check-out.
I guess it's just called being nice, being a cooperative member of society. The opposite of selfish and arrogant.
jikobean
Member
The wait staff doesn't get paid by what you have paid for your dining plan. We just were lucky to get free dining and always tipped based on the total price the meal would have been. All the money you make as a waiter/waitress basically comes from tips, but you have to share that with bussers and the bar if your party orders drinks. Please be considerate to them!
cymbaldiva
Active Member
I thought I was clear in my first post - the examples you bring up in this one are completely irrelevant to the subject at hand.
When dining at a sit down restaurant, part of the service one is paying for as a customer of the establishment is to have your food brought to you. Simple - done deal. We've been over that. A tip is a gratuity for good service. If it is provided, great - tip away, and well. If it's not....why am I paying that 20 % again?
Addressing your other examples....really? Those are all good manners...not even great manners, just good ~ irrelevant for this discussion, but good manners. I having a hard time following how you made this leap of logic though ~ opening the door for people; check. Courtesy to patrons with fewer items in check out lanes; check. These are things to do out of courtesy: random acts of kindness. To automatically pay 20% of your bill for a service that you recieve of as a part of a dining experience is not. That is why the extra money that you chose to leave - or not to leave - as an appreciation for good service is a gratuity. If it were required to leave that money it would would be called a surcharge.
Please don't misunderstand me, because apparently you do. When I dine at a table service establishment I tip, and when the service warrants it quite well. I do not like, however, being told it is a social contract to do so; nor do I appreciate it being implied that I am either selfish or arrogant.
Scroll up and read some of the earlier posts ~ the waitstaff you are browbeating me for not tipping well enough are doing just fine. If you have a problem with the law...? Contact your congressman; in the meantime please do not judge me for how I choose to tip.
ddbowdoin
Well-Known Member
not to sound like a jerk... but other posters have said it... if you arent earning the type of wage you need in life then you have to take the necessary steps in life to move in another direction. we live in a free society, with a free market.. NO one is forcing anyone to work in that restaurant.
s8film40
Well-Known Member
One thing I have noticed is tipping is a two way street. Having known many people in tipped positions, they do "work for tips" that is their primary focus and what motivates them. With every decision they make in their job it all comes down to "how will this affect my tip". Many experienced people in tipped positions know very well who is likely to tip well and who is not. If your from a country or fit the characteristics of someone who is typically known to not tip well, most tipped employees will put you at the bottom of their list of priorities. I've also seen employees go way above and beyond in either direction depending on how someone tips. I've seen tipped employees go out of their way to get a good deal or something special for their big tippers, and also go way out of their way to make sure the low tippers receive as little as possible.
I'm aware of the very basics of the federal law. I don't know every detail, but I know the basics and you still don't make much sense. The garbage man makes minimum wage and so does the barista, carpet cleaner, and bagger at the grocery store. It's the food servers that don't. You're saying that we should throw money at them because they make less. We need to make up the difference. That's my point. That's the shameful part of this situation. As a society, we allow these people to be paid $2.13 an hour. It's ridculous. You, yourself mention tipping those who don't make minimum wage and expect tips. People don't tip because they appreciate the service; they tip because they feel like they have to. We're guilted into it. Tips shouldn't be expected. Every tip should feel like a bonus for doing a great job.
Some will argue that prices would rise if servers made an actual wage. I'm ok with that. Some will argue that service will plummet because there's no incentive. At what point will people just want to do their job? I done a lot of things in my life and pride was a factor. Whether I was serving food, coaching cross country, or doing a radio morning show, I just wanted to do a good job. If we're coddling a bunch of people who need added incentive to do their job, then we have even bigger problems.