Would you discontinue FastPass?

[DVC4bestvacations]

JUst returned home from a week in WDW. Never realized how much I hate fastpass. I would love to know the formula disney uses to determine the number given out. Also weather the number changes by the time of day.

 

[George Lucas on a Bench]

Advantages of no Fastpass:

- both sides of Space Mountain would be open
- Fastpass-exclusive sections of queue lines would be experienced by all
- lines would move more smoothly
- less Fastpass clogging of the parks while people await Fastpass times or blow off queueing because they can just Fastpass it
- no Fastpass congestion at attraction entrances where people now queue up to get Fastpasses or wait for their return time

 

[wdwfan4ver]

Only rides that should have FastPass are:

Space Mountain
Big Thunder Mountain
Dumbo
Tomorrowland Speedway
Tower of Terror
Star Tours
Mission Space
Primeval Whirl
Dinosaur (?)

And that is it. The reason being that all these rides either have two tracks or two different load entrances.

I disagree of not having Toy Story Midway Mania not having fastpass. The problem is the line would have been insane either way. The fact is Toy Story Midway Mania is very popular due to the fact there isn't a lot rides at DHS besides the fact Star Tours: The adventure Continues, TOT, and Rock 'n' Roller Coaster are not ride that everyone can get on including some adults. I mentioned some adult because a person with known medical issues in the past wouldn't go an attraction that would cause the health problem like a bad back, or someone who had a heart problems.

DHS has other attractions that aren't rides such as Lights, Motor, Action!. The problem is how many guests would want to see every show DHS has during the day or go to One Man's dream. DHS is a park some people do considered as a half day park.

The only way Toy Story Midway Mania shouldn't have fast pass is if DHS does get the rumored Pixar Place Expansion because there would more rides and it would spread the crowds out more.

 

[George Lucas on a Bench]

Another problem is issuing too many Fastpasses and lower capacity in Fastpass attractions to begin with. Toy Story has lower capacity, doesn't it? Adding Fastpass seems to contribute to a recipe for catastrophic operational failure. Just look at a more basic example in Peter Pan. It has lower capacity, loads slowly, draws crowds to both queues and ends up being one of the longest waits in all the parks.

That's part of why I think they've been going about this interactive queue and Fastpass+ the wrong way. Obviously, overhauling attractions to increase capacity is more expensive than adding playlands and additional charge Fastpass for resort guests to further disrupt operation. It's a big mess.

 

[cba]

Heck no! The only reason I would want to stop the current Fastpass is for the new Fastpass!

 

[erasure fan1]

3. Even if you do get a Fastpass next time, great, now what? The lines for everything else you want to ride are also inflated drastically because of Fastpass, but now you can't get another Fastpass for some time.

I completely agree. It really is just a wash.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I love using fast passes. For example Toy Story, we can get in 3 rides on it in a day. Without it we wouldn'nt be able to.

If you didn't have a fastpass then you couldn't ride it 3 times, maybe once, maybe twice but that would open up the line for someone else if you were not able to ride it all those time. You take up a space every time you ride it. They don't add possible openings every time you take a FP. You are filling in one of the available spots, leaving someone else out.

I'm not saying that you are doing anything wrong. You are doing what the system allows you to do. I just don't understand how anyone can think that they, as individuals, do not affect the lines waiting. They certainly do. To get the big picture you have to add all the individuals to the scenario.

 

[Tom Morrow]

JUst returned home from a week in WDW. Never realized how much I hate fastpass. I would love to know the formula disney uses to determine the number given out. Also weather the number changes by the time of day.

The number does vary a bit, but the goal is to distribute for a maximum of 80% of a ride's hourly capacity, but also to allow room for rider switches, guest assistance cards, and other things, so the number of Fastpass tickets issued is closer to 2/3rd's the ride's hourly capacity.

This is why, on a really busy day, the return window being distributed can be several hours away.

In an ideal, perfect scenario, the number of guests using the Fastpass queue would be constant, never requiring the 4:1/80% ratio to be adjusted to 6:1 or higher. Meaning the maximum intake from the Fastpass queue would be 80% or less. (If there happens to be no one in the Fastpass queue, the standby queue intake jumps from 20% to 100% temporarily.)

However, that is not the case. People return in packs, not evenly, so the Fastpass queue demand fluctuates. The ride's capacity, while expected to be operating at 100%, may be decreased.

So, right there, are two flaws with the system - tickets are distributed under the assumption that people will return evenly spread out, and it distributes under the assumption that the ride will remain operating at 100% capacity.

Of course, when a ride *does* lose capacity, the number of Fastpass tickets that will be distributed is lowered to match the ride's decreased capacity. But it's too late, as all previous tickets were already distributed assuming 100% capacity.

 

[Tom Morrow]

I love using fast passes. For example Toy Story, we can get in 3 rides on it in a day. Without it we wouldn'nt be able to.

Yes you would. Without it, the wait time would likely be 30-40 minutes max, like at DCA. The difference is, you'd be standing in line vs. elsewhere in the park waiting for your Fastpass ticket return window.

 

[Tom Morrow]

The equalizer is that (unless things have changed) a person can't get more than one fast pass in a 4 hour window. So while those 7000 people couldn't FP for this ride, they can hold a FP for another ride while waiting on line for this one... And the 3000 who got the FP are in the reverse situation.

That is not correct - the time which you can get a new Fastpass will be when the Fastpass you just got becomes valid. If this time is over 2 hours away, you'll be able to get another FP in 2 hours - except at DAK, where the limit is only 1 hour for some reason.

Because of this aspect of the system, the FP system is theoretically fair.

I agree that it's fair, in that everyone has equal opportunity to get a Fastpass. Because of this, you basically can't complain when you're standing forever in a standby line. HOWEVER, it does make the standby line frustratingly slow.

And for anyone thinking that "down time" was not considered in Disney's fast pass design, and how guests might have to use this time to waste money on snacks and doodads is naive. Disney is a master at experience management and marketing.

Oh, absolutely. Bottom line - that is THE reason Fastpass was created in the first place. Why else would it be free?

 

[Ginzuishou]

I would first get rid of the term "Stand By" line, just call it the "Regular Line" or something. Stand By makes it sound like we are just filler for when there is space.

 

[Tom Morrow]

I would first get rid of the term "Stand By" line, just call it the "Regular Line" or something. Stand By makes it sound like we are just filler for when there is space.

But, under the current Fastpass system, that's exactly what it is. If anything, the Fastpass line is the "regular line", since it moves at 80% the speed that a "regular line" would move, only you have to make a "reservation" to enter it. Or scam Disney. *cough*

 

[Innovention]

Tom: I didn't realize you could get a new pass as soon your time came up. Thought the 4 hour window was always in effect.

After reading these posts, I am realizing that I understand less about Fast Pass than I thought I did... Again, I rarely use FP because there just aren't so many attractions that I try to fit into one day that I need to squeeze them all in. As such, I don't see the time savings...

If I get a FP and the return time is more than an hour later- if I don't have anything else to do, what is the difference whether I kill an hour walking around or kill that hour waiting on a line? Furthermore, what Susan mentioned about riding Toy Story 3x in one day thanks to FP, I ask the same question: is there really a time savings in spreading 3 rides out over a whole day (FP) vs. just getting on the line 3 times?

Lastly, if I am waiting on line for, say, 40 minutes and during that time 200 people ( hypothetical number) get on ahead of me via the Fast Pass line, is there really a difference between that and if FP didn't exist and those 200 people were simply on line ahead of me??

As I said before, though it always looks like FPers have the advantage as they walk past us stand-byers (or the euphoria you feel as you run past everyone else when you have a FP, ha ha), I never really felt it altered the wait time because without it, more people would just be online... Am I wrong?

I always thought it was more or less a placebo to make for happier guests.

 

[Goofyernmost]

As I said before, though it always looks like FPers have the advantage as they walk past us stand-byers (or the euphoria you feel as you run past everyone else when you have a FP, ha ha), I never really felt it altered the wait time because without it, more people would just be online... Am I wrong?

I always thought it was more or less a placebo to make for happier guests.

Theoretically, you are correct, but that is assuming that all FPer's are ahead of you if they didn't have FP. There is an equal chance that they could be behind you in a regular queue. In that case you would get on sooner without FP then when others have one and can come in to the attraction without ever being there. You are standing in line, patiently waiting your turn, they are out doing god knows what and then legally cut in front of you.

Your comparison to a placebo is absolutely right on. In my opinion, it is all smoke and mirrors. It was illustrated by someone giving an example of how you might save an hour by using FP. Do you really? First you have to go to the attraction to obtain your FP. Let's say that took 10 minutes (remember time doesn't stand still during that process), then you go someplace else, eventually ending up on the other side of the park when your window opens. You trek back across the park (15 minutes??? Depending on the crowds). You then spend an average of 10 minutes in the FP queue and after you have ridden the attraction, you will want to go back to your previous location or next FP area. (another 15 minutes). The total time used to cash in on the FP is conservatively 50 minutes, saving a whopping 10 minutes and racking up a lot of brisk walking time. Even then that remaining 10 minutes might easily be made up if FP didn't exist and the regular line kept moving without interruptions.

 

[Florida_is_hot]

Here is the thing about FastPass, Everybody can get them.
I go to Soaring get a FastPass then come back to you think I worry about what the people in standby line think?

I would never stand 1 1/2 hours in a standby line, no FastPass they can count me out.

 

[StarWarsGirl]

I so rarely go to other parks besides Disney that when I do, it's awkward without the Fastpasses. There are certain rides that will be a longer wait no matter what. I don't think that having Fastpasses makes the standby wait longer since the people who get Fastpasses would then have to stand in line instead. Same number of people riding it, same wait time. Fastpass saves so much time if you know how to use the system. It's very worth it. I would never get rid of it. Not sure how I feel about the planned Fastpass through My Disney Experience, though. There should be a certain element of these trips left to surprise.

 

[StarWarsGirl]

I would never stand 1 1/2 hours in a standby line, no FastPass they can count me out.

1 1/2 hours? Ha! I'd never stand in line for longer than 40 mins, and even that would have to be for Rock n' Roller Coaster or Star Tours or Everest. My family and I waited 50 mins when Star Tours first reopened, and even that seemed too long. My parents joke that they needed the new Dumbo and its Fastpasses when I was 3.

 

[StarWarsGirl]

Yes definitely get rid of it. Was stood in the regular line for Peter Pan and they were letting in like 25 Fastpass people in per every 4 regular people. Just went on and on..

It also depends on the Cast Member that you get. Most do it pretty evenly unless there was a breakdown earlier and they are making up Fastpasses. Some Cast members let in a bunch of stand-by people, some a bunch of Fastpass people. It all just depends.

 

[flynnibus]

Tom: I didn't realize you could get a new pass as soon your time came up. Thought the 4 hour window was always in effect.

The 4hr thing was part of the initial FP rollout - but was later changed. Now it's '2hrs, or your current return time.. which ever is sooner'. This equates to typically being able to get a new FP 1-2hrs after your first one.. normally more towards the 2hr one for popular rides.

If I get a FP and the return time is more than an hour later- if I don't have anything else to do, what is the difference whether I kill an hour walking around or kill that hour waiting on a line?

Well if it's more than an hour away.. you'll likely get in another ride's line. So the classic 'complaint' is.. Over at Ride #1, someone will be held back when you return.. and by waiting in Ride #2's line.. you've held someone up in Ride #2's line.. that if you were over in Ride #1 to start.. you wouldn't have held them back.

If you didn't have the FP, you wouldn't have impacted two lines.. but only one. Additionally, by not being in Ride #1's line the whole time.. you've added to congestion around the park as you move from place to place rather than being tied up in a queue.. off the pathways.

So the operational people complain FP adds to crowding in the parks by moving people out of lines.. and the 'me me me' crowd complains about FP people walking past them as they stand still in lines.. and the 'cant face my selfishness crowd' complain that you are holding up two lines by using FP

As I said before, though it always looks like FPers have the advantage as they walk past us stand-byers (or the euphoria you feel as you run past everyone else when you have a FP, ha ha), I never really felt it altered the wait time because without it, more people would just be online... Am I wrong?

In the purist sense.. it shouldn't. But in real world, it would because Disney didn't enforce return times. This meant the intended FP 'impact' would be exaggerated at times when more people would use the FP return in a short period of time. With proper return times, the estimated wait time posted should be more accurate so people getting in line expecting a '45min wait' should experience a 45min wait or close to it. There is always the problem that people wished for the 'old way' when the line moved differently... but if the posted wait is the actual wait.. it shouldn't be a problem.

 

[DfromATX]

No, I think fastpass is a great idea. I just hate it when the rides have such long lines and they are not giving out anymore passes!