Would it be better with no standby lines?

NickMaio

Well-Known Member
Imagine getting 6 or 7 FP per day in advance in exchange for no standby line options. Everything had to be booked at least 30 days in advance (so it can be adequately staffed per 100% known demand). No same day guests anymore. Your entire day appointment-only, rides, food, shows, etc. A specific number of allotted tickets per ride, per day, and once they were booked up then that ride closes off to any additional guests that day. Spontaneity only seems to add frustration in massive wait times, unknown crowd levels by the day, confusion once inside the park and 'what ride should we do next?'-type arguments. So lets get rid of all that. From the moment you walk into the park until the minute you leave there is zero confusion, nothing to consider, perfectly staffed rides so lower wait times, lower crowds getting rid of same-day guests. You could still aimlessly wander around soaking it in but there wouldn't be a random ride at the end of the wandering. Disney would love to have the elimination of all spontaneity so they can manage everything optimally. I thing this would A TON of the current issues and challenges facing the theme parks.
This sounds like a nightmare - - - - - even more than the nightmare we already have.
NO - - - keep the standby lines.
With a two year old we do lots of things, "off the cuff and on the fly".
 

Trackmaster

Well-Known Member
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I agree that booking every minute is no vacation, but I always caution people that a Disney trip is NOT a vacation. At least it's not in my opinion of what a vacation is. It's a wonderful trip, a magical time, a ton of fun, but not a relaxing vacation. With that expectation, I'm hardly ever disappointed.
I for one think that the idea of a vacation is stupid and pointless. Don't get me wrong, I'm an avid traveler and travel all the time. But I would never call it a vacation. If I want to relax by the pool and drink pina coladas, why would I need to get in a plane and go somewhere else for that? When you travel and are far from home, you've spent enough money and burned enough PTO that every minute is valuable. You're better off relaxing during evenings after work or on weekends. You don't need to do that crap in different state than you live.
 

JustAFan

Well-Known Member
I for one think that the idea of a vacation is stupid and pointless. Don't get me wrong, I'm an avid traveler and travel all the time. But I would never call it a vacation. If I want to relax by the pool and drink pina coladas, why would I need to get in a plane and go somewhere else for that? When you travel and are far from home, you've spent enough money and burned enough PTO that every minute is valuable. You're better off relaxing during evenings after work or on weekends. You don't need to do that crap in different state than you live.
 

Trackmaster

Well-Known Member
Lol I can't believe anyone would even remotely consider this.

Sorry, the answer is to abolish Fastpass. Unfortunately, it will never happen.
I think that the Fast Pass helps on extremely crowded days. I think that when its slightly below average to dead, standby only would be superior. Everything in between is debatable.

I wouldn't mind a system where they turned FP+ off for days that were expected to be pretty slow. I think that this is the mentality for EMH and hard ticket events too. They're not expecting crazy crowds, so FP+ just gets in the way.

My anecdotes about it:

During the hurricane season last year, when WDW was absolutely dead I saw firsthand how FP+ screwed things up. Almost every ride was dead and there wasn't enough people in the park to even fill the lines up. But the major competitive FP+'s were still filled up and still make those rides have some lines even when the park was dead. In theory, with no FP+, they would have been no more than 15 minutes or so if they were using all of the capacity on stand-by.

If you go to a popular hard ticket event, you'll see lines that fill up the entire queue, but they can eaten though in 20 minutes or less because FP+ isn't stealing the capacity.
 

Tom Morrow

Well-Known Member
We don't touch standby unless it's less than 15-20 minutes anyway.
Waiting in longer lines is easier than ever now with smartphones. If you're a local, I get it, but if you're on vacation, I couldn't imagine letting a 45 minute wait stop you from riding something you want to ride.
I think that the Fast Pass helps on extremely crowded days. I think that when its slightly below average to dead, standby only would be superior. Everything in between is debatable.

I wouldn't mind a system where they turned FP+ off for days that were expected to be pretty slow. I think that this is the mentality for EMH and hard ticket events too. They're not expecting crazy crowds, so FP+ just gets in the way.

My anecdotes about it:

During the hurricane season last year, when WDW was absolutely dead I saw firsthand how FP+ screwed things up. Almost every ride was dead and there wasn't enough people in the park to even fill the lines up. But the major competitive FP+'s were still filled up and still make those rides have some lines even when the park was dead. In theory, with no FP+, they would have been no more than 15 minutes or so if they were using all of the capacity on stand-by.

If you go to a popular hard ticket event, you'll see lines that fill up the entire queue, but they can eaten though in 20 minutes or less because FP+ isn't stealing the capacity.
Even on crowded days, Fastpass+ essentially forces you to schedule rides in advance in order to be able to ride the same amount that you would if Fastpass+ didn't exist. No matter how busy it is, it artificially inflates the standby lines. The legacy system wasn't as bad with this because guests couldn't schedule in advance. So if they show up and the lines were short, they'd just wait through them rather than getting a Fastpass. But when they already have one, they're of course going to use it.
 

larryz

Expert Thread Derailleur
Premium Member
Short answer, yes.


But only if they did away with FastPass+ at the same time.
 

Trackmaster

Well-Known Member
Waiting in longer lines is easier than ever now with smartphones. If you're a local, I get it, but if you're on vacation, I couldn't imagine letting a 45 minute wait stop you from riding something you want to ride.

Even on crowded days, Fastpass+ essentially forces you to schedule rides in advance in order to be able to ride the same amount that you would if Fastpass+ didn't exist. No matter how busy it is, it artificially inflates the standby lines. The legacy system wasn't as bad with this because guests couldn't schedule in advance. So if they show up and the lines were short, they'd just wait through them rather than getting a Fastpass. But when they already have one, they're of course going to use it.
In reality, that's not true at all. I used to book religiously at my 30 day window, but now I don't even bother booking until the morning of or later... and I'm an antsy planner who loves planning. You just won't have a crack at the top rides until people start cancelling them.

So in practice, FP+ benefits people who are patient and wait and are willing to roll the dice a little. Even if you stay on site, the you won't be getting FoP, Slinky, or 7DMT to pop up in the early days of your trip at the 62-63 day mark. You'd have to be booking pretty far out.
 

Trackmaster

Well-Known Member
Waiting in longer lines is easier than ever now with smartphones. If you're a local, I get it, but if you're on vacation, I couldn't imagine letting a 45 minute wait stop you from riding something you want to ride.
I think that the OP was saying that they just don't do stand-by. Now that they can't do 30 minute lines. They're probably like me and can just get a FP+ for whatever they want whenever they want.
 

Disstevefan1

Well-Known Member
This brings up an important point. What about super slow days where you can just about walk on many rides? Now I can't ride over and over because I have to wait for my reservation. Makes zero sense.
You saw a super slow day at WDW where you can just about walk on many rides? I have heard of that but never saw it.

I saw a Bigfoot, Unicorn and a UFO but I never saw a super slow day at WDW where you can just about walk on many rides. ;)
 

Pepper's Ghost

Well-Known Member
You saw a super slow day at WDW where you can just about walk on many rides? I have heard of that but never saw it.

I saw a Bigfoot, Unicorn and a UFO but I never saw a super slow day at WDW where you can just about walk on many rides. ;)
Well granted, I haven't been to the parks for 10 or 11 years, but pre-FP+ and during one of the slower seasons of the time, I recall many times there were 10 or 20 min standby lines. I still question whether attendance is way up, or if FP+ is the cause of constant 90+ min lines.
 

JustAFan

Well-Known Member
Well granted, I haven't been to the parks for 10 or 11 years, but pre-FP+ and during one of the slower seasons of the time, I recall many times there were 10 or 20 min standby lines. I still question whether attendance is way up, or if FP+ is the cause of constant 90+ min lines.
I suspect it's both. MK attendance totaled 15.4 million in 2000 and just under 21 million in 2018, an increase of over 25%. That's an extra 5 million people or an extra 15,000 per day. Now the park has expanded since then. There are attractions that eat crowds, but the walkways feel that impact. Classic attractions feel that impact.

Conversely, does FP+ have an impact? I'm sure Disney has stats that say one way or the other, but my personal experience, anecdotal as it may be, is that when Fast Pass is not available for whatever reason, standby lines move faster. Logically, it makes sense. If the CM doesn't have to juggle 2 lines and give preference to the Fast Pass line, the standby line would move faster.
 

Bluewaves

Well-Known Member
Fast Pass needs to go away, I could see with a validated admission you get your 3 Fast Passes when you get to the park in the morning but the planning my Fast Passes months in advance is ridiculous. Haven't been to Disney World in a while and don't plan on going back anytime soon, between the price increases, cut backs in everything and the level of planning that would overwhelm a team of generals trying to plan D-Day
 
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