Why do you think Disneyland preserves their classic attractions better than WDW?

[Walt Disney1955]

It obviously has been a complaint lately with a couple of old favourites going the way of the dodo bird. So it gets me thinking why does a park with unlimited space replace old rides more often than a park with restricted space. Look, Disneyland isn't going to all of the sudden blossom, it is too built up around them but they utilize their space much better than WDW. They don't have the blessing of size but they still keep their old classics around. What is the casualty of the new Star Wars Land? Big Thunder Ranch, that's it.

There are 13 attractions still there from opening day at Disneyland in 1955. Then throw in things like Casey Jr. which came two weeks later and Dumbo a month later. You may as well call them originals. Then stuff like Alice in Wonderland (1958), Matterhorn (1959), Disney Monorail (1959), and things when Walt was still alive in the 1960s such as Tiki Birds, Mr. Lincoln and Small World. The point is, to this day the core of their attractions have still been there for 50 years. Throw in Pirates as it was Walt's last project but opened just after he died.

I am not even going to touch the other three parks at WDW as in some cases there is basically nothing left from opening day at DHS. But I'll use Magic Kingdom as a comparison. In 1971 there is still much of the original core there, or shortly afterwards (Pirates opened in 1973).

Here is my theory. Is it because there is a higher percentage of locals at Disneyland who put more pressure on the company to keep their favourites around? Where as at WDW there is more of a tourist trap from all parts of the globe. I find there are less people from Florida at WDW than there are at Disneyland who are from California. Just my two cents and sort of my guess.

 

[Surfin' Tuna]

As much as it pained me to see GMR go, it was time. I cannot imagine that sticking around being viable in 2050. Other than the Dinosaurs in Energy Adventure it was time to close that as well, especially considering it no longer fit the dumbed down theming at Epcot. I can, however, imagine the core attractions at DL and MK viable and enjoyable in 2050. The Tiki birds might seem a bit more campy, but I think people would still be able to enjoy the diversion a bit. Gene Kelly singing in the rain...not so much. They are doing what they have to do or what the think they have to do to stay viable. The core will remain the same at both of those parks for a long time I think and hope.

The real issue is the upkeep between the two parks. They are under the same corporate leadership and thus the same profit and budget constraints (I would imagine), yet I feel as if they keep things looking better in California.

 

[PaisleyMF]

A good amount of Disneyland attractions are not the originals, Small World now has characters, Moments with Mr. Lincoln had it's animatronic changed, Pirates have been changed too, to include Jack Sparrow. It is the sad side of the business, But is a necessity.

 

[Mickey5150]

Size is probably the reason WDW does close rides like GMR. Disneyland doesn't have the luxury to spread it's guests out over 40 square miles so it's very difficult to shut down attractions in the middle of their parks for years. All of DLR resort expansion/changes are on the outer edge of it's parks, Star Wars, Carsland, GotG. It sucks to close rides but in the end everything costs money, plan and simple.

 

[Mickey5150]

As much as it pained me to see GMR go, it was time. I cannot imagine that sticking around being viable in 2050. Other than the Dinosaurs in Energy Adventure it was time to close that as well, especially considering it no longer fit the dumbed down theming at Epcot. I can, however, imagine the core attractions at DL and MK viable and enjoyable in 2050. The Tiki birds might seem a bit more campy, but I think people would still be able to enjoy the diversion a bit. Gene Kelly singing in the rain...not so much. They are doing what they have to do or what the think they have to do to stay viable. The core will remain the same at both of those parks for a long time I think and hope.

The real issue is the upkeep between the two parks. They are under the same corporate leadership and thus the same profit and budget constraints (I would imagine), yet I feel as if they keep things looking better in California.

The rotting corpse of the people movers/rocket rods proves things can look much worse in California.

 

[drizgirl]

The rotting corpse of the people movers/rocket rods proves things can look much worse in California.

I was about to post in agreement with the OP, but you make a compelling argument here.

 

[grnflash]

The rotting corpse of the people movers/rocket rods proves things can look much worse in California.

The old PM tracks are a huge eyesore, and frankly I'd throw Tomorrowland overall into the eyesore category. Nonetheless, as a park, DL is much better maintained than MK, at least for the last 15 years or so.

While there are valid complaints about the local DL AP base and things are not perfect at DL, as a whole the parks are treated with respect which carries over to a respect for what the classic attractions bring to the park (something that extends well past the ride experience.) The tourist base at WDW as a whole simply does not have the same respect for the parks on either a day-to-day level or a historical level. Management has responded to the customer base on both coasts. As this pertains to attractions this seems like a solid course of management imo, as it pertains to park upkeep not so much.

 

[Chef Mickey]

The bottom line is DL makes better use of space because they have less. I think WDW has gotten spoiled with endless land and take what rides it has for granted because "we can always expand later."

Later never really came. Even D23 is a lot of replacement versus expansion...besides Tron.

That said, DL's Tomorrowland is a disaster compared to WDW. No PeopleMover or Carousel of Progress make it far inferior to WDW. Its overall look is also better at WDW.

 

[grnflash]

That said, DL's Tomorrowland is a disaster compared to WDW. No PeopleMover or Carousel of Progress make it far inferior to WDW. Its overall look is also better at WDW.

I agree DL's Tomorrowland is a visual disaster. But are you saying you're happy with MK's? Because it's better than DL's? Frankly it's also bad, just not as bad as DL's. It's like comparing the Pooh rides. One is worse than the other (DL's is worse), but come on, they're both bad. MK would benefit from guests expecting things to be good/great/better in their own right, regardless of comparisons to another park. If I get a C at school and you get a D, it doesn't make me a good student because I got the better grade.

 

[Movielover]

A good amount of Disneyland attractions are not the originals, Small World now has characters, Moments with Mr. Lincoln had it's animatronic changed, Pirates have been changed too, to include Jack Sparrow. It is the sad side of the business, But is a necessity.

Not to mention that they completely rebuilt their Fantasyland, including the rides, from scratch. It's really quite simple, when a attraction has run it's course it's time to movie on. Nothing can last forever.

 

[Chef Mickey]

I agree DL's Tomorrowland is a visual disaster. But are you saying you're happy with MK's? Because it's better than DL's? Frankly it's also bad, just not as bad as DL's. It's like comparing the Pooh rides. One is worse than the other (DL's is worse), but come on, they're both bad. MK would benefit from guests expecting things to be good/great/better in their own right, regardless of comparisons to another park. If I get a C at school and you get a D, it doesn't make me a good student because I got the better grade.

I love WDW's Tomorrowland, but WDW is like my family.

Stitch, Speedway, and Monster's Laugh Floor need to be replaced yesterday. Buzz needs a massive overhaul or even complete replacement.

Space Mountain, PeopleMover, and COP make Tomorrowland timeless for me.

 

[grnflash]

Not to mention that they completely rebuilt their Fantasyland, including the rides, from scratch. It's really quite simple, when a attraction has run it's course it's time to movie on. Nothing can last forever.

What are you talking about? Nothing was rebuilt from scratch. Toad would come closest as a new, longer track was laid and scenes added.

Otherwise, existing rides were moved (dumbo, carousel, tea cups) or improved (most notably Snow added to Snow White, many animatronics added to PP) but nothing other than Toad was rebuilt

The new layout of the land and greatly enhanced exteriors and land theming were the most significant improvements to the land.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

It is the sad side of the business, But is a necessity.

I don't think it's sad at all. I don't share the belief that "older" means "better" when it comes to themed entertainment.

 

[Movielover]

What are you talking about

A lot of things in the Fantasyland rebuild were made from scratch, Dumbo was a completely new build, the main show buildings were all gutted. About the only thing that wasn't altered in some significant way was Casey Jr and Storybook, but they also received upgrades.

 

[thomas998]

It obviously has been a complaint lately with a couple of old favourites going the way of the dodo bird. So it gets me thinking why does a park with unlimited space replace old rides more often than a park with restricted space. Look, Disneyland isn't going to all of the sudden blossom, it is too built up around them but they utilize their space much better than WDW. They don't have the blessing of size but they still keep their old classics around. What is the casualty of the new Star Wars Land? Big Thunder Ranch, that's it.

There are 13 attractions still there from opening day at Disneyland in 1955. Then throw in things like Casey Jr. which came two weeks later and Dumbo a month later. You may as well call them originals. Then stuff like Alice in Wonderland (1958), Matterhorn (1959), Disney Monorail (1959), and things when Walt was still alive in the 1960s such as Tiki Birds, Mr. Lincoln and Small World. The point is, to this day the core of their attractions have still been there for 50 years. Throw in Pirates as it was Walt's last project but opened just after he died.

I am not even going to touch the other three parks at WDW as in some cases there is basically nothing left from opening day at DHS. But I'll use Magic Kingdom as a comparison. In 1971 there is still much of the original core there, or shortly afterwards (Pirates opened in 1973).

Here is my theory. Is it because there is a higher percentage of locals at Disneyland who put more pressure on the company to keep their favourites around? Where as at WDW there is more of a tourist trap from all parts of the globe. I find there are less people from Florida at WDW than there are at Disneyland who are from California. Just my two cents and sort of my guess.

Actually the expectation would be the opposite for a park that was geared to locals and one geared as a tourist trap. A tourist trap like WDW would never need to change their rides because they wouldn't be trying to entice locals to continually come and visit only trying to pull in from a never ending population of outsiders.... where as a local park like DL would be expected to need continual change to maintain the draw of locals that would be bored by the ride after a couple of years.... So I'm not buying your theory.

My theory is that building codes have changed so much over time and law have changed so much and then add in the California laws being much worse than Florida laws and you'll probably have some exceedingly expensive new attractions if you replace one where as it is much cheaper to just keep refurbishing the existing ride and using the fact that it is grandfathered in under any of the new more restrictive regulations. I seriously doubt that any of the original rides at DL would look anything like they currently do or cost as little if they were to be recreated today and abide by the current regulations. And these aren't just regulation for the disabilities act they are also going to be other regulations as far as building codes that have change dramatically over the years... such as new regulations for earthquakes...

 

[ppete1975]

Capacity is part of it. Close a major ride in DL you hurt all the other rides and make the parks more crowded... Disney World people are much more spread out over 4 parks. Even though I think Disney land has more rides that all 4 parks (I could be wrong) although some of these like hedge mazes are not exactly people eaters and toon town is cheap. Also we complain about history and stuff, Disneyland to a point is a museum to Walt... he actually did touch these things and oversaw them, Disney world he was already dead. So MR toad and its plywood was an easy decision at the world, while at Disneyland the history and memories made it stay. It would be much harder to replace an original ride there.
But they got rid of the people mover,,, so honestly Disney land automatically loses any argument

 

[EOD K9]

Because Walt wanted it that way. He specifically told his imagineers this when he returned from personally visiting Walt Disney World. He was aware of the blessing of size. He told his crew to make changes as needed. He was very specific to instruct them to keep their annual pass holders in California happy. He very well understood the concept of "tourists...what do they know" in Florida. It would be very easy to rook them on that so called "other coast". This tidbit has been passed down in my family. This was also the same family member who gave me a very nice sash who received it from her majesty, the Queen of America.

 

[POLY LOVER]

The maintenance part just baffles me, I don't understand why things that break on the rides are not repaired. If they were repaired the rides would maintain fan interest. But as things stop working and are let go the rides become boring. WDW seems to do the minimum to keep the ride going then trash it. The GMR did not have to close, Ellen did not have to close, upgrade to the rides could have kept it fresh. Like one person said they have tons of room to add rides without closing down older rides. I really don't like seeing a steady decline then a rush to get some new things in place. They should never have been in this position where every park needs to be under construction at the same time. Maybe because Disneyland is the original they just care more about it, or maybe they just have better management and imagineers. I don't know but I can see and feel the difference.

 

[MickeyMomV]

With WDW you have people coming down and spending big $$$ to be there for up to 2 weeks at a time and they want these people to come back every couple of years. In order to achieve this they need to make sure they have new and fresh rides and attractions to make people want to come back.

It seems that with DL people will visit while in the area on Vacation but people don't plan a vacation with being at DL for every day of the vacation. With that in mind they don't have the need to keep changing things to make people want to come back every year or two. It also seems that a big part of the guest base for DL is locals. I know that WDW has locals but I think DL's % of overall guests is much higher.

 

[ppete1975]

Locals in California like the nostalgia and showing their kids what they saw when they were kids and remembering their childhoods. WDW is more vacationers who have to justify spending tons of money to fly there and then pay all of the other costs. And with universal and other completion in the world (since its easier to travel abroad than ever before) they have to update more often to keep relevant.