Why do people always use "Walt theoreticals" to protest changes?

[Bob Saget]

Why is it that everyone likes to use "Walt theoreticals" to object to any change they don't like, no matter how slight? Are we really THAT fanatical?

Because normally I would say: What would Jesus do?
But I won't because a). That crosses the border into religious topic which is inappropriate for the boards, and b). I know for a fact that Jesus is unhappy with WDW's current condition (especially the Adventurer's Club closure)...so why ask? :shrug:

So we resort to using Walt as a reference.

 

[Epcotian]

Because Walt acted upon some ideals that I wish still guided the company today:

a. His standards: A desire to be second to none in quality of product, whatever it may cost.

b. His motives: A desire to create something that is WORTH creating, meaning something that uplifts the human condition in some small way (his priority on attractions that the entire family will experience together, etc).

c. His idealism/utopianism: A desire to celebrate human progress and possibilities and to try and provide answers to very basic problems (EPCOT).

What would Walt do in any given situation? I have no idea. But, I guess the bottom line is that, given his track record, I believe he would have come up with better solutions than those who are currently making the decisions, because he was guided by a larger principle than maximizing profits; not to mention the fact that Walt seemed to love his theme parks.

 

[mharrington]

I agree with what Leonard Maltin said in his book "The Disney Films" (this is mostly about films, but on a different plane, it could be equally applicable to the parks):

For many years, the answer to any question at the studio was, "What would Walt have done?" Critics of the company cited this as evidence that Disney's successors lacked the guts and imagination to serve as real leaders.

But Walt Disney was no ordinary executive. He and the company were one in the same. He was the brains, the heart, the backbone of the outfit. And he was touched with genius.

What's more, his timing was right. Disney was a child of the twentieth century. He and the movies grew up at the same time. When he'd conquered that medium, there were others awaiting him. He never looked back.

It isn't fair to criticize anyone for not being able to fill Walt Disney's shoes. No one could fill them but Walt.

I think that's where many of the criticisms come from, that people running the company must fill Walt's shoes.

 

[HumblePirate]

Why is it that everyone likes to use "Walt theoreticals" to object to any change they don't like, no matter how slight? Are we really THAT fanatical?

Yes, there are many people who are that fanatical! You read a couple books on Walt and you think you know what he would want or how he would feel about a certain attraction or a change. The truth is (uh oh, I need to tread lightly here, so I don't put words into Walt's mouth) his thoughts changed over time, otherwise we wouldn't have the matterhorn and we would still have stagecoaches and other attractions that changed (prior to Walt's death).

I don't know what Walt would do if he was alive today - maybe he would love the parks, maybe he would hate the parks. For all I know, some of our most beloved attractions could be despised by him because they use cardboard cutouts!

People also seem to always claim that he was obsessed with details, so that gives them the right to complain that Walt would be disappointed when the font on a sign changes. I was never around to see Disneyland in the early days, but I'm guessing that I would be able to find a few things to nitpick if I went there.

Thank God they didn't have the internet and forums back in Walt's heyday because I'm guessing it wouldn't be any different than it is in the present day!

Disclaimer: All of this is just my opinion and in no way am I trying to indicate that Walt Disney would approve of my opinion over anyone else's opinion

 

[CThaddeus]

I find myself even more annoyed by Disney Imagineers who, when interviewed about the latest attraction they're working on, say, "Walt would have loved this." This, to me, seems more like they're telling me I'd better like it, or I'm not a true Disney fan. Worse still, they're usually talking about something that turns out to be on the lame side. For example, I heard an Imagineer say that in an interview about World of Color, a show I found to be incredibly subpar and dull when stacked up against its 20-year old neighbor across the way, Fantasmic! So, it's not just the fans who use the phrase.
And, for the record, I still think adding the Disney characters to It's a Small World was one of the worst things they've done at Disneyland. They're mostly cheap-looking and tacky dolls, and they're obnoxiously highlighted so that you can't miss them. When an attraction about world peace and coexistence is turned into a way of advertising/selling Disney characters, you've ruined something truly decent.
These are all the opinions of C. Thaddeus, and in no way reflect the opinions of Walt Disney or the Walt Disney Company. All rights reserved. No animals were harmed in the writing of this post. When in California, visit Disneyland.

 

[Walt Disney1955]

I feel I can speak a little bit on behalf of what Walt would have thought. I am sure I am not the only one who has poured over his quotes, watched his documentaries, etc. You have to at least get a bit of an idea. For instance, he specifically said Disneyland would never be a place that would "sink your money" like a carnival. Or we do now that Walt would go through an attraction and purposely look for what is wrong with it rather than enjoy the good parts. From a business perspective, that is a very good thing to do because you are always striving for perfection.

Also, there is one thing for sure we do know about Walt, in fact, we have evidence of it. While Walt liked progress and the future, he also liked nostalgia and keeping one foot in the past. We see this with Main Street USA. Not to mention we have an 11 year window (1955-'66) where we know Walt preserved his classic attractions. He didn't get bored in 1958 and replace Mr. Toad, Peter Pan, Snow White or Dumbo, etc. He knew these were his treasures if not his core. So evidence points that he would have built around these classics just like Disneyland is doing today. He would be happy Pirates was still there I believe. And would be happy Country Bear Jamboree is still kicking at WDW (which is arguably his last project).

Other than that we can just speculate with things. Quality is one thing that Walt coveted. He would want the place to still be clean, fixed and kept up to date. But let's face facts here, Walt might not have even cared for the "mountains" in the parks. He originally didn't like the idea of the Matterhorn being put in back in 1959 because he didn't want any roller coasters. Obviously he loved it so who knows, he might have accepted the others eventually. But we do know that all three mountains were added long after his death. He didn't want it to turn into a rollercoaster park, which it obviously hasn't, it is just merely sprinkled with a minor thrill ride.

But in my honest opinion, I think he would like the theming of the mountains. Heck, you got to think he would love an attraction based on "Song of the South" (Splash).

 

[Californian Elitist]

But let's face facts here, Walt might not have even cared for the "mountains" in the parks. He originally didn't like the idea of the Matterhorn being put in back in 1959 because he didn't want any roller coasters.

Where did you hear that? The Matterhorn was Walt Disney's idea.

 

[mharrington]

Where did you hear that? The Matterhorn was Walt Disney's idea.

Yes, he had initially not wanted any roller coasters in the park, but his co-workers managed to convince him that it's roller coasters people want, so they made the Matterhorn. When Walt learned that the Matterhorn was a success, his early resistance to roller coasters was worn down and he got together with John Hench in the mid-1960s to try and create Space Mountain, but for various reasons, it didn't get off the ground until the 1970s, not at Disneyland, but at WDW.

You can read up on this in the book "Disney Mountains" by Jason Surrell, a very good book by the way.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Yes, he had initially not wanted any roller coasters in the park, but his co-workers managed to convince him that it's roller coasters people want, so they made the Matterhorn. When Walt learned that the Matterhorn was a success, his early resistance to roller coasters was worn down and he got together with John Hench in the mid-1960s to try and create Space Mountain, but for various reasons, it didn't get off the ground until the 1970s, not at Disneyland, but at WDW.

You can read up on this in the book "Disney Mountains" by Jason Surrell, a very good book by the way.

Thanks for the suggestion!

 

[The Empress Lilly]

I too liked the 'Disney Mountains' book. I imagine it's great for both the casual and hardcore Disney parks fan. Great illustrations and cool stories a-plenty.

 

[Bob Saget]

Probably the only aspect of DisneyParks that I know for certain Walt would've disliked completely would be Paradise Pier at DCA. Having read various novels on the life of Walt Disney, one thing is consistant: His disapproval of carnival-style, games of skill, boardwalk types of amusement parks. That genre was hated by Walt so much that it prompted him to create Disneyland.

Yet now we sit decades later with Paradise Pier, which represents everything Walt disliked about carnivals/amusement parks of his day... only steps away from his original creation. :shrug:

Sequels in film was another thing Walt didn't seem to care for.

 

[Jimmy Thick]

Walt would want you to go to his parks and spend money. Thats what the man always wanted even if some like to believe differently.


Jimmy Thick-He wasn't in the poor house when he died.

 

[erasure fan1]

Did Walt want to make money? Yes. But scholars generally agree money was secondary. First and foremost Walt was an artist who believed if he created the best product possible people would buy it.

This is how I see it as well. Of course I can only go by what Ive read and the documentaries I have seen... but I truly believe Walt wouldnt have accepted the mediocrity that we see in the parks today (i.e. the broken yeti). Walt set the standard and most people (I think) expect that his high standard is upheld.

 

[Clever Name]

This is how I see it as well. Of course I can only go by what Ive read and the documentaries I have seen... but I truly believe Walt wouldnt have accepted the mediocrity that we see in the parks today (i.e. the broken yeti). Walt set the standard and most people (I think) expect that his high standard is upheld.

I agree. He most likely would have bulldozed DL after WDW was built. :wave:

 

[menamechris]

Probably the only aspect of DisneyParks that I know for certain Walt would've disliked completely would be Paradise Pier at DCA. Having read various novels on the life of Walt Disney, one thing is consistant: His disapproval of carnival-style, games of skill, boardwalk types of amusement parks. That genre was hated by Walt so much that it prompted him to create Disneyland.

Yet now we sit decades later with Paradise Pier, which represents everything Walt disliked about carnivals/amusement parks of his day... only steps away from his original creation. :shrug:

Can we add DinoLand to that?

 

[ParentsOf4]

Why is it that everyone likes to use "Walt theoreticals" to object to any change they don't like, no matter how slight? Are we really THAT fanatical?

Now I finally get what the OP was driving at! (OK, I'm slow.) It's when people invoke Walt to attack specific changes, not to critic the general direction of WDW and DL.

Walt was more interested in DL (and "the Florida project") than current senior executive management at corporate Disney. In other words, Walt was much more involved in what was happening at DL and the future WDW. Walt was much more concerned about DL's condition and maintenance. Walt was much more interested in what rides were in DL. I assume this interest would have extended to all Disney theme parks. However, I have no idea if Walt would have liked or disliked a particular attraction that was built after his death.

 

[HM Spectre]

Now I finally get what the OP was driving at! (OK, I'm slow.) It's when people invoke Walt to attack specific changes, not to critic the general direction of WDW and DL.

People who look to Walt to nitpick tiny changes are really stretching it. People who look to Walt about the general direction/quality of the parks and company in general are doing what current management should be doing (and unfortunately isn't).

 

[wayneway]

Why is it that everyone likes to use "Walt theoreticals" to object to any change they don't like, no matter how slight? Are we really THAT fanatical?

I guess it's because the people that are running his Company seem to not use his theoreticals in places where they still can.