What would you want to see out of a 5th WDW park? (If there's going to be one)

[Skippy's Pal]

I for one would like to see Port Disney. Which would be like Disney Sea/Disney America Cross breed park incorporating the majority of attractions and new ones to the park and bring BraviSEAmo as the nightime show.

Leaving aside the fact that the 4 existing parks need various degrees of love, what Disney excels at is "placemaking" (old time Main Street, the Hollywood That Never Was, etc.). The idea of a DisneySea-type attraction with all the various "places" that could replicate, and immersive attractions based on those, would be great.

 

[Disday]

Disney has more than enough money to both expand/improve the existing parks and build a 5th park.

 

[SeaBase86]

I would like yo see an Islands Of Adventure theme park. Why can't Disney build more themed thrill rides? Yes I have a six flags but they can't combine stories and thrills like Disney can. And I think that's were people miss the poit on Disney investing more in thrill rides. Yes there are six flags across the country but no one can do a thrill ride like Disney in my opinion and I would like to see more of these once in a lifetime thrills at WDW.

 

[Krack]

First of all, we're not getting a 5th park (I actually believe it will never happen) and I don't even want a 5th park (the other parks are completely neglected as it is and I wouldn't even describe AK as a completed park).

But ... if there was going to be a 5th park, Disney would be foolish to build it modeled on anything but the Magic Kingdom. And what I mean by that is:

1. A "castle" in the center
2. Classic wheel and spokes design
3. 5 large lands
4. 1 land entirely devoted to childrens' stories and rides

Personally, I always thought the "villains" concept was the smartest way to go, with a focus on more "thrill" rides for teenagers. But I wouldn't deviate far at all from the MK template. Disney has shown it is only going to market it's DL/MK parks and focus on children; building anything but this style of park is pretty much a waste going forward. If I could built it anywhere, I'd put it where the TTC stands right now.

 

[Disday]

A 5th park is coming (like it or not). Well, I guess that depends on whether Disney wants to spend its big bucks on its domestic parks or if they would rather say marry Time/Warner (that's a guesstimation, not a rumor).

 

[mrg1106]

(the other parks are completely neglected as it is and I wouldn't even describe AK as a completed park).

How are the other parks neglected? Magic Kingdom is getting revamped with a Fantasyland expansion and Hollywood Studios just got Star Tours 2. Ill give you the benefit of the doubt for AK but I dont see how you can say Disney doesnt care about Hollywood Studios or Magic Kingdom for that matter. Thats just blasphemy :brick:

 

[Krack]

How are the other parks neglected? Magic Kingdom is getting revamped with a Fantasyland expansion and Hollywood Studios just got Star Tours 2. Ill give you the benefit of the doubt for AK but I dont see how you can say Disney doesnt care about Hollywood Studios or Magic Kingdom for that matter. Thats just blasphemy :brick:

My opinion is that:

1. AK is barely built. It's single star attraction has been broke for years (plural). It's centerpiece land sits in a concept art folder in a filing cabinet in WDI.

2. DHS is being allowed to fall apart (Backlot Tour basically dismantled - GMR needs refurb/update - needs C-Ticket dark rides badly - Indy Stunt Show hasn't changed in 20 years - if you are primarily interested in rides, you only have 4 and 3 of them are arguably "not for all ages")

3. Epcot has no direction, particularly in Future World. Compare 20 years ago to today - JII wrecked, no Imageworks, UoE falling apart, WoL shuttered, SpaceShip Earth no longer has a theme, Edutainment concept barely hanging on (Living Seas, Horizons, WoM) - it's a mess.

4. Granted, MK is in far better shape than the other 3, but it is still in decline. Main Street has turned into one single WalMart. Attraction and Land specific merchandise are disappearing. The maintenance issues have been discussed on WDWMagic ad nauseum. Adventureland became a mess (thematically) when the spinner was installed. Refurbs are hit or miss (HM 2007 = great, PotC = good, HM 2011 = meh, SM = huh?). Money is being poured into concepts that can't work (NextGen Queues - anything you invite someone to touch, especially children, is going to break quickly). The best thing to happen to the park in a decade was the Tiki Room catching on fire. The FLE is a welcome addition, but it only really added M&Gs and a restaurant (the new rides are more or less replacements for 20k Leagues and SWSA). Fails in comparison to its sister park in Anaheim.

 

[unkadug]

A 5th park is coming (like it or not). Well, I guess that depends on whether Disney wants to spend its big bucks on its domestic parks or if they would rather say marry Time/Warner (that's a guesstimation, not a rumor).

That makes absolutely NO sense.

 

[mrg1106]

My opinion is that:

1. AK is barely built. It's single star attraction has been broke for years (plural). It's centerpiece land sits in a concept art folder in a filing cabinet in WDI.

2. DHS is being allowed to fall apart (Backlot Tour basically dismantled - GMR needs refurb/update - needs C-Ticket dark rides badly - Indy Stunt Show hasn't changed in 20 years - if you are primarily interested in rides, you only have 4 and 3 of them are arguably "not for all ages")

3. Epcot has no direction, particularly in Future World. Compare 20 years ago to today - JII wrecked, no Imageworks, UoE falling apart, WoL shuttered, SpaceShip Earth no longer has a theme, Edutainment concept barely hanging on (Living Seas, Horizons, WoM) - it's a mess.

4. Granted, MK is in far better shape than the other 3, but it is still in decline. Main Street has turned into one single WalMart. Attraction and Land specific merchandise are disappearing. The maintenance issues have been discussed on WDWMagic ad nauseum. Adventureland became a mess (thematically) when the spinner was installed. Refurbs are hit or miss (HM 2007 = great, PotC = good, HM 2011 = meh, SM = huh?). Money is being poured into concepts that can't work (NextGen Queues - anything you invite someone to touch, especially children, is going to break quickly). The best thing to happen to the park in a decade was the Tiki Room catching on fire. The FLE is a welcome addition, but it only really added M&Gs and a restaurant (the new rides are more or less replacements for 20k Leagues and SWSA). Fails in comparison to its sister park in Anaheim.

1. AK Ive already agreed with; they need another big attraction or another big show. That park needs to be focused on, I agree.

2. Backlot Tour really hasnt changed that much. (or I havent seen any big changes) Great Movie Ride could probably use a little bit of an update and maybe get rid of a scene or two in the ride; however, that being said, I think the ride is fine how it is but thats just my opinion. And what more do you want from the Indy Stunt Show? I would say maybe add the Indiana Jones ride to DHS but I think the stunt show is fine how it is as well.

3. JIYI does need to go retro and it needs a refurb to bring Dreamcatcher back in. Universe of Energy, imo, should just be taken out of EPCOT so that a new ride can take its place; if its falling apart, than they mind as well get rid of it. Same thing with Wonders of Life. Spaceship Earth has a theme but maybe you dont think that bc of the refurb; I honestly think that the ride is pretty much the same and its even improved imo.

4. Main Street has turned into a Wal-Mart? What are you talking about with that thought? The shops havent changed in years and Main Street is still as great as it ever was. Its always crowded, that doesnt mean its a new Wal-Mart though. Land and Attraction merchandise isnt slipping at all; when you come out of every ride you get dropped into a gift shop. When I went last week, to argue your point, I saw Space Mountain merch in the Space Mountain gift shop. I saw merchandise for Splash Mountain when I got off that. I saw merchandise for Pirates of the Caribbean when I got off that. I dont see what more you want bc I also saw Magic Kingdom merch on Main Street along with other Disney park merchandise in Main Street. Whats wrong with a refurb? Space Mountain hasnt been refurbished since it had opened and the refurb is amazing. The Haunted Mansion in 2011 updated their line for an interactive queue; I dont see where the problem is about that. Interactive queues are great when you're waiting in line; Space Mountains queue specifically is a great idea bc the only other thing I did when I waited in line was play around on my smartphone. I dont think MK in WDW is playing second fiddle to DL at all; if anything theyre equal.

Thats just my thoughts on your points though

 

[G00fyDad]

Where did you read about the rumored 5th gate?? I'm just curious....

I remember first seeing the rumors flying across the boards back in 2005 after our trip. We saw construction going on that seemed to be making way for a large easement into an area of property large enough for a park. Don't ask me where this was because I didn't think too much of it at the time and can't recall where I saw it. But other saw it too and the rumor went nuts.

...it would be hard to imagine them using thrill rides as a tool. Disney doesn't rely on that too much....

They need to. If they fixed what they have right now then worked on a new park they ought to use the idea I thought of back when this rumor was in full wing. A hero/villian park. A park that was clearly divided right down the middle with a lighter color scheme on one side and a darker one on the other. Hero themed rides on the light side and villian themed rides on the other. And right smack in the middle of the park they could have a dueling coaster ride that crosses over each side of the park.

 

[Disday]

The most frequent rumor that I tend to believe is for the Dark Kingdom park. It's just a matter of when they decide to go forward on it. However, I'd also love a DisneySea clone.

 

[MerlinTheGoat]

The most frequent rumor that I tend to believe is for the Dark Kingdom park. It's just a matter of when they decide to go forward on it. However, I'd also love a DisneySea clone.

Our resident insiders such as Lee have confirmed that Disney has no plans whatsoever to build another WDW park. They've got enough on their plate as it is. I also recall him saying they scrapped the Dark Kingdom plans a rather long time ago, before they stopped thinking about new parks altogether. So no, 5th gate isn't at all in the cards.

@mrg1106

From what you're saying, i doubt you've been on many of the attractions you're listing before they were redone considerably.

- Backlot Tour at one point used to have a more extensive look at the costume department IIRC as well as went through a small town of house facades used in TV shows and other stuff. It's heavily stripped down. Not sure when this stripping down happened, but it was far superior in the mid 90's. It has changed rather drastically.
- Spaceship Earth lost its communications theme in favor of just "history of man" basically. They also dissected and removed what little we had of an ending descent sequence and replaced the props with dark tarps (adding in that corny and badly done cartoon thing).
- Universe of Energy just needs to be redone completely with the same theme of energy. But it needs to be modernized and given the proper respect. I'd bring back that awesome song as well.
- The Indy stunt show is just old and needs updating or replacing. Assuming they can do something better than the original and not make it worse. A version of the Indy ride from CA would be great.
- Space Mountain was a terrible refurb. Whilst Disneyland's got a really loving refurb which completely replaced the entire track and made numerous changes to the sound system among many other things, almost nothing was changed about WDW's ride (very little of the track was replaced at all). The interactive queue is just tacked on terribly (unlike Pooh's, which is amazing in comparison).

Interactive queues are hit or miss. Good idea in concept, but they're destined to fail when uncontrollable and ill-disciplined kids are involved. In terms of concept, there's even a good and bad way to do it. The way it's done in Pooh and (IMO at least) Haunted Mansion are the right way to do it. The way it's done in Space Mountain and Soarin' with basic video monitors tacked on in a quick and cheap way is not the right way. Krack does have a very valid point though about interactivity being something that can't be maintained- building something that kids touch (or rather, beat up on) all the time is just asking to have it broken. It's an even bigger disaster when coupled with WDW's notoriously terrible management.

WDW and Disneyland are definitely not equal.

 

[mrg1106]

Our resident insiders such as Lee have confirmed that Disney has no plans whatsoever to build another WDW park. They've got enough on their plate as it is. I also recall him saying they scrapped the Dark Kingdom plans a rather long time ago, before they stopped thinking about new parks altogether. So no, 5th gate isn't at all in the cards.

@mrg1106

From what you're saying, i doubt you've been on many of the attractions you're listing before they were redone considerably.

- Backlot Tour at one point used to have a more extensive look at the costume department IIRC as well as went through a small town of house facades used in TV shows and other stuff. It's heavily stripped down. Not sure when this stripping down happened, but it was far superior in the mid 90's. It has changed rather drastically.
- Spaceship Earth lost its communications theme in favor of just "history of man" basically. They also dissected and removed what little we had of an ending descent sequence and replaced the props with dark tarps (adding in that corny and badly done cartoon thing).
- Universe of Energy just needs to be redone completely with the same theme of energy. But it needs to be modernized and given the proper respect. I'd bring back that awesome song as well.
- The Indy stunt show is just old and needs updating or replacing. Assuming they can do something better than the original and not make it worse. A version of the Indy ride from CA would be great.
- Space Mountain was a terrible refurb. Whilst Disneyland's got a really loving refurb which completely replaced the entire track and made numerous changes to the sound system among many other things, almost nothing was changed about WDW's ride (very little of the track was replaced at all). The interactive queue is just tacked on terribly (unlike Pooh's, which is amazing in comparison).

Interactive queues are hit or miss. Good idea in concept, but they're destined to fail when uncontrollable and ill-disciplined kids are involved. In terms of concept, there's even a good and bad way to do it. The way it's done in Pooh and (IMO at least) Haunted Mansion are the right way to do it. The way it's done in Space Mountain and Soarin' with basic video monitors tacked on in a quick and cheap way is not the right way. Krack does have a very valid point though about interactivity being something that can't be maintained- building something that kids touch (or rather, beat up on) all the time is just asking to have it broken. It's an even bigger disaster when coupled with WDW's notoriously terrible management.

WDW and Disneyland are definitely not equal.

- Again, I will give you another +1 for the Backlot Tour. I actually havent rode it since 2007/2008 so idk if anything really changed in terms of the actual ride or the after-show stuff like the Pirates of the Caribbean props.
- I agree with Spaceship Earth. The ending was fine how it was and I saw no reason to change it; they couldve refurbished the ending a bit to make it look better bc I was always a big fan of the original ending of Spaceship Earth (even though I dont hate the "Creating your future" thing.)
- I think there needs to be a replacement ride for UoE. Thats just my opinion bc almost every time I have gone to WDW, I skip the ride.
- I think the Indy show could use an extra scene for the show; I dont mind the show bc its worked for what it is for this long. I think if they added in the Indiana Jones ride though, that that would be a great addition to DHS.
- I thought that Space Mountain needed a refurb and I support it completely. I dont care too much for the interactive queue bc I wasnt that impressed, but I did like how they refurbished the actual ride part of the attraction.

Interactive queues are hit or miss but I dont think they are a bad idea. I think its obvious that its bound to break especially with the amount of kids; its going to happen eventually, you cant really avoid it unless you take the interactive queue away. (which I wouldnt care if they did or didnt) Whats with all this busting on the management lately? I just dont get it.

I know WDW and Disneyland arent equal, thats why WDW is WDW and Disneyland is Disneyland. WDW has to manage 4 parks plus the water parks plus Downtown Disney. Disneyland only has to manage 2 parks. In terms of quality and lasting appeal though, WDW is the way to go.

 

[Disday]

I'm not going to start any arguments, but yes a 5th park is on the way. But, people are free to believe what they want.

 

[G00fyDad]

I'm not going to start any arguments, but yes a 5th park is on the way. But, people are free to believe what they want.

And you have what to show for proof? Disney execs have all but confirmed that they are concentrating more on the current parks than trying to build more. I would love to see a new park but they need to maintain what they have first.

Besides, look at it like this. The more parks they build in WDW means there is more for the guests to have to stretch their time over. Right now they have enough park space to entertain the guests they have and then some. If they add a new park then that may, just may, stretch the crowds a little too thin and the money that Disney puts out to operate a 5th park would not be cost effective for the amount of ticket sales that they are currently taking in.

 

[Walt Disney1955]

I like what Disney does as well bc they dont necessarily need thrill rides. I had heard a rumor about there being a theme park dedicated to Disney Villians that consisted of a lot of thrill rides. I thought that sounded like a pretty cool idea; WDW doesnt need to go all Hersheypark on us but I dont think a couple more thrill rides would hurt. I bet WDW has something up their sleeve concerning a 5th park though considering they truly never stop imagineering.

Imagine a dark ride with even something as seemingly tame as the Queen in Snow White. We all know how Snow White's Scary Adventures scared us as kids.

I'm not going to start any arguments, but yes a 5th park is on the way. But, people are free to believe what they want.

Can you back up your claims? And if so, what is the idea and WHERE is the location going to be?

 

[Ricky008]

in my opinion, i think since the park sales are down so much that disney has to add some newness to the parks just to keep people, not just us addicts, coming. in turn i bet ticket prices will not climb due to the rise in the overall attendance and profits. i would love to see some new coasters at hs for sure!

 

[menamechris]

Thats just my thoughts on your points though

The problem is that WDW is playing catch up. Many things have gotten to a point where they have NO CHOICE but to fix them, because the average, casual guest is noticing. And HS has been open over 2 decades now. AK going on 15 soon. There is no reason why there were not a long-term plans for both parks for expansion to bring both parks to their full potential. And if there were plans, they should have been executed much better than they have been. As far as merchandise - this has long been a pet peeve with the fanbase community ever since the Disneyland/WDW generic branding. Does it make financial sense for the company? Sure. Does it look cheap and far from charming? You bet.

 

[menamechris]

in my opinion, i think since the park sales are down so much that disney has to add some newness to the parks just to keep people, not just us addicts, coming. in turn i bet ticket prices will not climb due to the rise in the overall attendance and profits. i would love to see some new coasters at hs for sure!

Park sales? They are still raking in a profit from the parks. As much as they would like it to be? No. And ticket prices were just raised in June.

 

[cheezbat]

I'm not going to start any arguments, but yes a 5th park is on the way. But, people are free to believe what they want.

Will there be a fifth park? Probably someday...though most likely not in the next decade or so.
What would I like to see in a fifth park? Right now that's really tough, because I - like many others on this board want to see the four other parks brought up to their full potential. As things stand, we have the crappy Stitch attraction which needs to be replaced soon, an old noisy and smelly Speedway, and a lack of a new E-ticket at the Magic Kingdom...in Epcot we also have a dated Universe of Energy, a completely vacant pavillion in WOL, the Odyssey restaurant sitting vacant, and an Imagination pavillion that needs a massive overhall. Don't even get me started on Hollywood Studios...where we have an aging Great Movie ride that needs some new life, a Backlot tour which is barely even a shell of it's former self, an animation tour which is just a laugh compared to what it once was, Sounds Dangerous...which is terrible, yet still being used, Narnia(seriously?) and a handful of very old stage shows. Then there's Animal Kingdom. This place needs a good number of new rides attractions and lands.

Do we NEED a fifth gate right now? Not at all.

Of course, there's nothing with WANTING one...or dreaming about what could be someday. :animwink: