What do you have to do to get a fastpass?

[DryerLintFan]

I am surprised that they are not accused more often of an ADA violation then. I know this weeds out a lot of the liars, but will also give some people who genuinely are protected under the ADA a legitimate case. The ADA says a person with a disability is afforded reasonable accomodations and Disney's CMs are NOT trained adequately to determine that IMHO. I bet if the person pushes for a supervisor that the sups are trained to adhere to the guest's request rather than risked being accused of an ADA violation. Most people who do not truly need it will not take the effort to fight for it. I didn't want any issues and brought my paperwork just in case and I will not be forced to rent an ECV when that is not a reasonable accomodation for my issue even though mine is mobility-related. At my job, my reasonable accomodation that I agreed upon with them is the use of the elevator instead of using the stairs. My accomodation request with Disney regarding DAS was not to use stairs, but they are not set up to individualize, but rather have the all-or-nothing approach I guess.

Lawsuit Over Disability Access Policy Decided in Disney’s Favor | DIS

There are folks who agree with you, especially because the previous system allowed people the ability to reride an attraction repeatedly, which for some disabilities seems necessary. Now the same guest has to exit the ride, get another return time, and walk through the queue again at that time.

But the judge sided with Disney.

Here's a good link to further understand some nuances for DAS:

DAS - Guide to Disney World's Disability Access Service System

DAS - Guide to the Disney World Disability Access System for those with Special Needs, Handicaps and Disabilities. All you need to know.

diz-abled.com

 

[DryerLintFan]

Not true

Also, they cannot require someone to use a scooter (for a fee) as a reasonable accomodation.

I'm not going to link Reddit and DIS boards, but all you have to do is google "Disney denied das" and you'll find hundreds of examples of people who were denied DAS for exactly this reason. Surprisingly also for people who have bladder issues, which surprised me. I can't imagine being told that I can just wear a diaper.

I'm not defending the system or promoting it. I just mentioned a known reason that many DAS passed are denied. Their miles may vary, but it's 100% a thing for a lot of people.

 

[DryerLintFan]

A large percentage of people in the alternative access/FastPass lines at the moment are rider swap and guest recovery single passes. They and DAS use the same line for the time being.

This. Child swap uses the alternate access line.

 

[nickys]

Given that VIP tours are booking out at 60 days I’d bet they also account for a significant number.

 

[Dumbomom]

I used it once when on chemo meds. I look normal, but after a little while I get exhausted and overheated and if I felt really sick, I could use a washroom while waiting. Never was faster than a regular line, it just allowed me to sit down in between if needed.

 

[DryerLintFan]

I forgot to add that most people will not hear about the complaints regarding the denial of reasonable accomodations as they do not go through the court system, but are handled by the Justice department. DAS would most likely be considered a reasonable accomodation and disabled people do have the right to file a complaint if they are denied it. I know you are from the UK and get what you are saying that you are not fully informed about the topic.

None of us ever claimed to be an expert on the topic. People can absolutely speak from personal experience.

 

[DryerLintFan]

I had to self-educate myself because of a violation that happened at my job. I only shared what I was told by my local ADA violation investigator regarding what businesses and employers have to provide people with disabilities. This is a forum and there are a bunch of so-called experts on here. Some take what they say as gospel--others take it just under consideration and move on. I wasn't attacking him or anything, but I don't think he was speaking based on personal experience, just conjecture, but who knows. I rarely post on here as people are too sensitive when their POV is challenged.

Your input is valued!

Ultimately I think the point about it being a case by case basis depending on what CM you get is the most likely.

 

[nickys]

As I said to the other guy

Me or someone else? I’m a girl lol!

 

[DryerLintFan]

Probably. My husband made me ask for a DAS after my last fall in July 2020. I fell outside of RnR and mangled up my right knee and left arm. When my knee goes, it goes without warning and sometimes I am lucky enough to grab onto something to prevent a fall. There was nothing but pavement, so I fell. I just overtaxed it and needed to take precautions. During my last trip using DAS, I felt much better and was able to make it through the entire trip without a fall or what I call a knee slip. It might have been due to the DAS--might have just been a coincidence.

I didn't want to get mine either maybe the DAS should be like the Sorcerer's Stone and only go to those who don't actually want it

I know, I know, wrong park.

 

[nickys]

sorry, I am old school school regarding grammar and just use the masculine pronoun when I didn't verify the gender with the person. Now I will use female pronouns and will edit my posts. Sorry about that.

No worries, just wasn’t sure if you were talking about me.

I do know people who have got one and some who were advised to use a wheelchair so they could rest up in lines if they needed to. They didn’t complain and weren’t upset by that. But then over here we have to prove a disability to get any kind of dispensation.

 

[lazyboy97o]

People need to know their rights under ADA. As I said to the other person: I forgot to add that most people will not hear about the complaints regarding the denial of reasonable accomodations as they do not go through the court system, but are handled by the Justice department. DAS would most likely be considered a reasonable accomodation and disabled people do have the right to file a complaint if they are denied it. The Justice department will decide whether there was a violation or not and also act accordingly if there was one. They do not necessarily make their findings public. People have up to 300 days after the violation to file: https://www.ada.gov/filing_complaint.htm

ADA violations do go through the court system. You as an individual can bring a suit against an entity. If you file a complaint with the Department of Justice and they decide to pursue the matter they do so through the courts.

Not providing a wheelchair as a reasonable accommodation is not a violation as businesses are not required to provide personal devices. This is why parks are able to rent wheelchairs and scooters and many do refuse access passes for those with relevant mobility issues.

Redirecting…

www.ada.gov

 

[ElvisMickey]

I don’t know if anyone will get the reference, but the title of this thread reminded me of a line in the song, “The King Of Broadway” from The Producers

 

[crawale]

Good to know.

If you are on a scooter you are not standing in line.

 

[lazyboy97o]

On the ADA website it does say this: "When denying a requested accommodation, the agency must consider available alternative accommodations that would be reasonable and effective and would not constitute an undue hardship or direct threat." Making someone rent a wheelchair to receive an accomodation might be considered "undue hardship" for that person or it might not. I guess we will have to wait and see if someone files a complaint or sues Disney and see if they are victorious.

Requiring a person to provide their own personal device is not an undue hardship. If a person’s issue is one that would best be accommodated by a wheelchair (not saying this applies to all mobility issues and have visited with persons for whom a wheelchair or ECV would not work) then the accommodation of accessible routes is already offered. A business does not have to offer alternative accommodations because a person dislikes the available accommodation.

The reason I mention rental devices is because offering a free wheelchair would be an alternative accommodation. It would also be how Disney would provide access to the park itself for those with mobility issues that present with distances. Disney provides an accessible path from the entrance of Epcot to The American Adventure but those who cannot make such a walk do not have to be offered free transportation or an assistive device to get to the attraction.

The policy of denying an access pass for guests who are best accommodated with a wheelchair or ECV is not new or unique to Disney. There was pushback when parks started to make this change as their queue become predominantly wheelchair accessible. I don’t know if a specific case or ruling but given that this is not new and more of an industry standard I would be surprised to learn that it has not been challenged.

 

[nickys]

Um, did I say anything much different than you? I said I was unsure if a person would have success filing an ADA violation claim against Disney if they feel being made to rent or get a personal device as an accomodation and being denied a free alternative like DAS. I don't now the answer to this nor was that my experience as the CM I initially dealt with didn't give me any issues. I cannot speak for anyone else as no one has commented on this thread shared an actual instance of being denied. I still stick by what I said in the last post: If you don't truly need a DAS, don't ask for one or expect to get one. For instance, my oldest son is Autistic and my youngest is going through the diagnostic process. Both do not have a problem standing in line and waiting their turn, so we never pursued a DAS (or its former incarnation) in past years.

Again, I only needed the DAS for stairs and long periods of standing in one place to limit further damage to my knee as standing in one place and using stairs are some of the biggest agitators. My knees are getting progressively worse so I have gotten to the point that one is needed. Sitting in a wheelchair will just make me even more inmobile, so a wheelchair at this time is not a reasonable accomodation for me since I have genetic osteoarthritis, which is only going to get worse until replacement surgery. My doctor agrees and has put this is writing if Disney or my employer ever decides to give me an issue regarding my condition. Unlike the picture below, I do not have much cartilage left in my knee and am slowly wearing my bones away. The orthopedic surgeon says my knees have the wear and tear of an 80-year-old, but will not replace until I am older because I guess that one can only have two knee replacements in their lifetime and apparently the insurance will not approve it because of my age as well.

View attachment 559678

The CMs will not look at any documentation, letters etc that you may have. You could take 10 people with exactly the same condition and they will have different needs. And the CMs are not trained to look at medical notes.

What you need to do is to explain calmly why waiting in line is not possible for you. That’s all. Explain that standing or sitting still and using stairs aggravates your condition and causes your knees to seize up (if that’s the right term). If they suggest a wheelchair, calmly reiterate that sitting in the same position causes pain and inflammation.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Um, did I say anything much different than you? I said I was unsure if a person would have success filing an ADA violation claim against Disney if they feel being made to rent or get a personal device as an accomodation and being denied a free alternative like DAS. I don't now the answer to this nor was that my experience as the CM I initially dealt with didn't give me any issues. I cannot speak for anyone else as no one has commented on this thread shared an actual instance of being denied. I still stick by what I said in the last post: If you don't truly need a DAS, don't ask for one or expect to get one. For instance, my oldest son is Autistic and my youngest is going through the diagnostic process. Both do not have a problem standing in line and waiting their turn, so we never pursued a DAS (or its former incarnation) in past years.

Again, I only needed the DAS for stairs and long periods of standing in one place to limit further damage to my knee as standing in one place and using stairs are some of the biggest agitators. My knees are getting progressively worse so I have gotten to the point that one is needed. Sitting in a wheelchair will just make me even more inmobile, so a wheelchair at this time is not a reasonable accomodation for me since I have genetic osteoarthritis, which is only going to get worse until replacement surgery. My doctor agrees and has put this is writing if Disney or my employer ever decides to give me an issue regarding my condition. Unlike the picture below, I do not have much cartilage left in my knee and am slowly wearing my bones away. The orthopedic surgeon says my knees have the wear and tear of an 80-year-old, but will not replace until I am older because I guess that one can only have two knee replacements in their lifetime and apparently the insurance will not approve it because of my age as well.

View attachment 559678

I don’t care why you need a pass. I never questioned your need for a pass. I only questioned your claim that requiring people to provide for their own personal device was a potential violation.

Disney denying a DAS because a person does not want to rent a wheelchair is not a violation. Disney denying a DAS because a wheelchair does not properly address a person’s needs is a violation. The case of the woman who sued Disneyland for not allowing her to use a Segway was dismissed because it was a case of her not wanting to use an ECV. She claimed she could not but had sued other businesses over their restrooms not accommodating her ECV.

 

[Cado603]

for $48,000, Disney will give you legit fastpasses you can use even now. Club33@waltdisneyworld.com

 

[Trackmaster]

It would be illegal to require proof.
What you have to do is explain why you cannot wait in the regular line and they determine if it truly is something that the regular line cannot accommodate.
But this is no skip the line pass of GAC days so I think you should read up on it.

I wouldn't call it "illegal." I would just say that Disney's legal counsel has advised them that at the time being its probably just easier to go with it than to try to fight it. Its all about the political climate at the time, and its all about the judge that you get. Clearly, Disney's high priced lawyers could make a pretty solid argument that its unfair to give advantages to people based off claims that they refuse to substantiate. Disney's gone to bat and won landmark cases that have taken a lot of the teeth out of the ADA passes, if people push back and make things even more ridiculous they'll have to push back more.

Remember, privacy can be waived by the patient or the individual. Its not unreasonable for Disney to ask somebody to waive their right to privacy if they're claiming that a fact exists that's easily proven or disproven that would given them rights to an advantage over someone else.

 

[Trackmaster]

Going off what I was saying before, I think at this point, Disney's philosophy is just that if people can't handle the standby lines, just let them come back later. Its not necessarily because there's a medical condition that anybody has, but people just have different ways of experiencing the park. As long as the guest isn't "double dipping" by using the standby line between comeback times, they're in theory not really making the line longer for anybody else. And they might even use that time to spend money at Disney, so its kind of a win-win. They just need to work on getting a full virtual system in place to replace Fast Pass, and get it more organized and streamlined.

 

[TKTC]

The FP+ entrances are also used for Guest Recovery, Rider Switch, Golden Oak owners and Club 33 members.

Golden Oak owners still don't have FP+ back yet.