Rumor Version of MaxPass coming to WDW in May?

Sirwalterraleigh

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
Purduevian said:
This is Disney, have you seen what it takes to get a boarding group? Complication is the name of the game. Also 3 systems is the same as USO: Free, Express, and Unlimited
Cedar Point also has Free, Fast lane, and Fastlane Plus
Six Flags has 4: Free, Flash Pass Regular, Gold, and Platinum

I'm suggesting for Disney: Free, Packaged Group, and Unlimited.
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None of those “examples” get the daily volume of Disney parks...most are regional/seasonal...which means pass dependent and different expectations.

Boarding groups aren’t being done by design...it’s a bandaid. It was designed to use FP+...which has failed.
 
Sirwalterraleigh

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
doctornick said:
Right. And that's where decision like cancelling the Main Street Theater or replacing rides (like SWSA, GMR or UoE) rather than building new really has hurt. Especially in WDW where they have the "blessing of size" and virtually no real reason to ever have to replace instead of add.

At least Tron and Ratatouille are legit expansions, but much more is needed.
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Touchdown!! 🏈
 
H

havoc315

Well-Known Member
doctornick said:
Right. And that's where decision like cancelling the Main Street Theater or replacing rides (like SWSA, GMR or UoE) rather than building new really has hurt. Especially in WDW where they have the "blessing of size" and virtually no real reason to ever have to replace instead of add.

At least Tron and Ratatouille are legit expansions, but much more is needed.
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THIS, I agree with. In many cases, the replacements have been clear upgrades in terms of quality. But many of these replacements have lower capacity than their predecessors. For example, the DHS Studio Backlot Tour and Stunt Show were both very high capacity attractions.

Meanwhile, ROTR might be a great ride, but it has pitiful hourly capacity.

Every single park at Disney could use multiple additional attractions to meet demand.
 
UNCgolf

UNCgolf

Well-Known Member
havoc315 said:
In many cases, the replacements have been clear upgrades in terms of quality.
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Have they, though? Pandora was definitely an upgrade over what was there before, but that's the only one that's a clear upgrade off the top of my head. I may be forgetting something.

Like, TSL is probably better than what was there immediately before TSL was built, but it's not better than the original Studio Backlot Tour. Same thing with Guardians; it will almost certainly be better than the rotting corpse of UoE, but I doubt it will be any better than an actually updated UoE could have been (or as impressive as the original version was in its time). I don't think MMRR is better than GMR was right before it closed (MMRR is at least a good ride, unlike TSL), but it definitely isn't better than the original GMR.

Even if you go back to New Fantasyland -- while 20k was already gone and obviously wasn't coming back (and would have needed a significant overhaul even if it did still exist), it was a much more interesting and expansive ride than Little Mermaid or 7 Dwarfs.
 
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havoc315

Well-Known Member
UNCgolf said:
Have they, though? Pandora was definitely an upgrade over what was there before, but that's the only one that's a clear upgrade off the top of my head. I may be forgetting something.

Like, TSL is probably better than what was there immediately before TSL was built, but it's not better than the original Studio Backlot Tour. Same thing with Guardians; it will almost certainly be better than the rotting corpse of UoE, but I doubt it will be any better than an actually updated UoE could have been (or as impressive as the original version was in its time). I don't think MMRR is better than GMR was right before it closed (MMRR is at least a good ride, unlike TSL), but it definitely isn't better than the original GMR.

Even if you go back to New Fantasyland -- while 20k was already gone and obviously wasn't coming back (and would have needed a significant overhaul even if it did still exist), it was a much more interesting and expansive ride than Little Mermaid or 7 Dwarfs.
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While I enjoyed the Backlot tour, most guests would view Toy Story Land as an upgrade. I don't recall seeing daily 90 minute lines for the Backlot tour.
And yes, an updated UoE may have been great. But not talking about possible or planned attractions. Talking about new attractions versus the ones that actually existed before.

MMRR vs GMR.... I haven't done MMRR yet, so I don't know. I really liked Great Movie Ride, but it was becoming really dated --- No movie scenes past the early 80's... the early scenes were before the lifetimes of almost every guest. I'm guessing MMRR is more popular with today's guests than GMR.
 
mikejs78

mikejs78

Premium Member
UNCgolf said:
Have they, though? Pandora was definitely an upgrade over what was there before, but that's the only one that's a clear upgrade off the top of my head. I may be forgetting something.

Like, TSL is probably better than what was there immediately before TSL was built, but it's not better than the original Studio Backlot Tour. Same thing with Guardians; it will almost certainly be better than the rotting corpse of UoE, but I doubt it will be any better than an actually updated UoE could have been (or as impressive as the original version was in its time). I don't think MMRR is better than GMR was right before it closed (MMRR is at least a good ride, unlike TSL), but it definitely isn't better than the original GMR.

Even if you go back to New Fantasyland -- while 20k was already gone and obviously wasn't coming back (and would have needed a significant overhaul even if it did still exist), it was a much more interesting and expansive ride than Little Mermaid or 7 Dwarfs.
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TSL was my family's favorite area of the park on our last visit (pre MMRR and Galaxy's Edge) and Slinky was one of my son's favorite rides. Just because you may not consider TSL good, doesn't mean there aren't many others who disagree. I happen to love TSL and am excited to see Galaxy's Edge and MMRR on my next trip in February 2022.
 
ChrisM

ChrisM

Well-Known Member
havoc315 said:
While I enjoyed the Backlot tour, most guests would view Toy Story Land as an upgrade. I don't recall seeing daily 90 minute lines for the Backlot tour.
And yes, an updated UoE may have been great. But not talking about possible or planned attractions. Talking about new attractions versus the ones that actually existed before.

MMRR vs GMR.... I haven't done MMRR yet, so I don't know. I really liked Great Movie Ride, but it was becoming really dated --- No movie scenes past the early 80's... the early scenes were before the lifetimes of almost every guest. I'm guessing MMRR is more popular with today's guests than GMR.
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I, too, have fond memories of the GMR but the last time I rode it (in 2014) it was almost embarrassingly dated.

The Tarzan scene was absolutely brutal. Like something out of local mechanical museum of creepy oddities.

But back to the topic at hand: my presumption of a hard shift to a paid FP scheme isn't predicated solely on it being an easy profit stream to tap, but that Disney appears to have been trying to shift over the past years from appealing to down-market masses to a more exlusive up-market segment. And have found themselves in the strange limbo (to them) of annoying the down-market segment they targeted so heavily for so many years, and turning off the up-market segment who believes their product isn't up-market enough for their tastes.

You can certainly covet the big spend luxury vacationers potentially represent, and price yourself accordingly, but your product needs to offer what they expect. And planning to the hour their entire vacation 6 and 3 months in advance - often requiring being up at midnight or 5am or whatever for the privilege - isn't going to draw their dollars.

Meanwhile, the market segment you devoted yourselves to courting for the last 15-20 years feels priced out and betrayed.
 
M

MurphyJoe

Well-Known Member
Purduevian said:
This is Disney, have you seen what it takes to get a boarding group? Complication is the name of the game. Also 3 systems is the same as USO: Free, Express, and Unlimited
Cedar Point also has Free, Fast lane, and Fastlane Plus
Six Flags has 4: Free, Flash Pass Regular, Gold, and Platinum

I'm suggesting for Disney: Free, Packaged Group, and Unlimited.
Click to expand...
With capacity limitations for certain attractions, if Disney offered an unlimited pass they would probably either limit the attractions its valid for or only allow one entrance for select attractions to control lines. An unrestricted unlimited has the potential to wreck havoc on wait times at things like Rise. Along those lines, I wonder if Disney wouldn't run an unlimited like Universal and only offer the tier validity after a certain time. Or offer up a dining package including a table service meal and unlimited FP after 5 pm (or some such).
 
UNCgolf

UNCgolf

Well-Known Member
havoc315 said:
While I enjoyed the Backlot tour, most guests would view Toy Story Land as an upgrade. I don't recall seeing daily 90 minute lines for the Backlot tour.
And yes, an updated UoE may have been great. But not talking about possible or planned attractions. Talking about new attractions versus the ones that actually existed before.

MMRR vs GMR.... I haven't done MMRR yet, so I don't know. I really liked Great Movie Ride, but it was becoming really dated --- No movie scenes past the early 80's... the early scenes were before the lifetimes of almost every guest. I'm guessing MMRR is more popular with today's guests than GMR.
Click to expand...

Oh sure, GMR needed an update.

And you're probably right re: Toy Story Land, even though I personally think it's among the worst things Disney has ever built at WDW. It's also hard to compare the wait times for that with something like SDD, both because attendance was much lower then and I assume the Backlot Tour had a much higher capacity than SDD (it also lasted 2+ hours originally).

It's hard for me to give Disney credit for replacing a ride with something better when the replaced ride was only lesser because they chose to let it rot rather than spend money on updating it. That's compounded by the fact there's so much available land to add without replacing -- which you mentioned. That's why Pandora is the major exception for me. There was something in that spot, but not anything of value.
 
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Demarke

Demarke

Have I told you lately that I 👍 you?
Premium Member
havoc315 said:
THIS, I agree with. In many cases, the replacements have been clear upgrades in terms of quality. But many of these replacements have lower capacity than their predecessors. For example, the DHS Studio Backlot Tour and Stunt Show were both very high capacity attractions.

Meanwhile, ROTR might be a great ride, but it has pitiful hourly capacity.

Every single park at Disney could use multiple additional attractions to meet demand.
Click to expand...
Exactly this! It’s like the folks that point out that Horizons barely had much of a line compared to Mission:Space typically having a bit of one now, but ignoring that Horizons also could accommodate like 1000 more people per hour. It seems that most replacements have done the same thing, so there was actually a significant reduction despite the current total number of rides remaining roughly the same, which was only magnified by the introduction of fastpass which essentially allows people to stand in two lines at once!
 
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flutas

Well-Known Member
Purduevian said:
This is Disney, have you seen what it takes to get a boarding group? Complication is the name of the game. Also 3 systems is the same as USO: Free, Express, and Unlimited
Cedar Point also has Free, Fast lane, and Fastlane Plus
Six Flags has 4: Free, Flash Pass Regular, Gold, and Platinum

I'm suggesting for Disney: Free, Packaged Group, and Unlimited.
Click to expand...

I'm expecting 4 main categories (lots more internally, but that's for CMs to know)

  • Free
  • Genie
  • DVC
  • Purchased (Ultimate plan included here)
 
CaptainAmerica

CaptainAmerica

Well-Known Member
Purduevian said:
My prediction on all of this: Fastpass+ returns for all guests, but is now limited to 2 advanced reservations (plus the current rolling unlimited). On Site guests still get a time advantage for booking these.

Without a ton on advertising outside of Delux resorts and near park entrances, Disney starts selling Fastpass+ Unlimited and Fastpass+Packages.

Fastpass+Unlimited works just the same as Universal express pass Unlimited. Packages give you FP access to a group of rides only once for a smaller price than the Unlimited. Think a MK classics package with Pan, small world and HM,. Fatansy Land special with 7D, Pooh, and Dumbo.

From Disney's side they now divide the current FP+ Availability as they see fit to meet the current FP+ distribution(~75% per ride), but now it is split into 3 buckets of general population (100% controlled), Packages (100% controlled), and leaving a certain allocation for the unlimited. As they learn where the unlimited go, they can tweak these %s as they please and can even do it day of by dropping extra general population passes.

Advantages:
  • General population doesn't feel like they lost too much (still get my 2 FPs!) even though the inventory for all attractions is significantly reduced.
  • General population has no idea how many people are actually cutting by paying vs using the free system
  • Packages tier allows revenue for those that wouldn't spring for unlimited
  • Packages can also drive people toward smaller attractions by tiering it with other rides
  • An unlimited pass for those willing to drop the big $$, without wanting to have a plaid CM
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Did you just make this up or is it based on anything at all?
 
J

JakeAZ

Active Member
Purduevian said:
My prediction on all of this: Fastpass+ returns for all guests, but is now limited to 2 advanced reservations (plus the current rolling unlimited). On Site guests still get a time advantage for booking these.
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If they give everyone 2 AND still allow for unlimited bookings after, there are going to be some very unhappy people who buy into the program.

Seems to me this would result in the same number of FP (or more) out there on any given day. Standby lines would still be mind numbingly slow and FP lines could see an increase in wait times. It was hard to complain about 20-30 min FP lines when it was "included" but now if people start paying (most likely very high prices)...

IMO the whole purpose of monetizing FP would be so less people use it. This would make the standby lines move faster and the people who pay for FP would see shorter waits, thus making them feel their purchase was valid.
 
F

flutas

Well-Known Member
nickys said:
I don’t see why DVC would have a different category. They don’t for anything else.
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I just go based off what I see from Disney.

Types
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