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Daveeeeed
Well-Known Member
The outside architecture would never work for Epcot to stay in theme with the overall atmosphere. As a complete ride, including exterior, there is no other place in the entire WDW where it would fit better, as it was designed to go there.
CastleBound
Well-Known Member
Yea the current architecture wouldn't work at all there. Neither would the Disneyland version. Yea I don't necessarily think it would fit better anywhere else. People mentioned Epcot, but it would need to change a bit on the outside and find the right spot. Fantasyland is the most perfect, yet not at all spot for the ride.
Goofyernmost
Well-Known Member
All that anyone has to do is understand the history of IASW to know that it is where it belongs. It was a Pavilion in the 64 Worlds Fair sponsored by Pepsi dedicated to UNICEF. It was built to help support good things for children. It belongs in Fantasyland and nowhere else. I can't even understand how moving it would benefit anything at all.
FigmentJedi
Well-Known Member
Epcot's also rooted in the World's Fair and could be a bridge between Future World and World Showcase. Carousel of Progress could also be sent to Epcot as part of this "nod to the roots" thing. Also by relocating It's a Small World, you can expand Fantasyland further, perhaps giving Tangled something besides bathrooms.
Goofyernmost
Well-Known Member
OK, but, you and I both know that the chances of them moving IASW are practically the same as my sprouting wings and flying around WDW. So, I guess it wouldn't hurt to dream, just not sure that anything like Tangled would be any better then what is there now. Just me, I guess!
Just for the sake of discussion here, even though World Showcase is likened to a Worlds Fair, it is that only in someones imagination. Small World, on the other hand has a direct connection to that and it's purpose was to support children. I don't see how that fits in Epcot, bridge or no bridge.
dstrawn9889
Well-Known Member
no others at WDW... World of motion was based off of the old ford pavilion (chevy didnt want to be outdone)... and Great moments with Mr Lincoln at DL
Adam N
Well-Known Member
I don't want to derail this any further buttttt I will. If IASW is ever moved (which it won't) the only place I hope it goes is the Tommorowland Speedway spot to bridge the gap between TLand and Fantasyland. It's all about coming together for a better and brighter future which is in theory what Tomorrowland is kind of about.
Wikkler
Well-Known Member
The other attractions were Magic Skyway and Mr. Lincoln.
Brian Swan
Well-Known Member
I went to the NYWF when I was 6 and remember them all well. COP is the only "original" from the NYWF - however the final scene has been changed from the original one in '64. The CA iasw is the same one (lengthened by at least 50%) that was at the Fair; the MK version is a poor "copy". The dinosaurs that were in the Ford pavilion were moved to a diorama that can be seen from the DL RR. Many of the dinos in Ellen appear to be "clones" of the original NY ones. The ride system used in the Ford pavilion is essentially the same that was used in both the DL and MK peoplemovers (DL's now, sadly, no longer running). When HOP first opened, the Lincoln AA who spoke at the end was essentially a clone of the original one from the Fair. I believe that both Lincolns have since been replaced with higher tech AAs. Disney also did a Circle-Vision for the Canadian pavilion at Expo 67 in Montreal. Based on my memories as an 8 year old, the original film in Canada in EP was very close to - if not the same as - the one at the Expo.
Goofyernmost
Well-Known Member
Parts of the film in Canada, were either the original or, like you said, very close to the same thing. Many aspects were missing, like it seems like we were going down the street in a firetruck or something like that, that didn't make it to the Canadian Pavilion in EPCOT. I too, also thought they were similar when I first saw it. I was 19 in 1967, but, I had spent some time in the German Pavilion absorbing the culture via pitchers of beer. My memory may not be all that clear.
RSoxNo1
Well-Known Member
So no omnimovers but yes to a time travel ride? Both of which have been frequently used story elements in Disney rides for decades? I'm not saying repeat everything but omnimovers are great and efficient for bringing guests into the story.
dstrawn9889
Well-Known Member
not only that, it can maximize the showbuilding... instead of giant sweeping panoramas like PoTC, you have smaller sets spaced out and have the omnimover 'point' to them and occlude the parts of the ride /stage/ mechanicals/ roof you dont want seen...
prberk
Well-Known Member
The Hall of Presidents is an expansion of Great Moments with Mr. Lincoln.
Daveeeeed
Well-Known Member
I see what you are saying about capacity, but Pirates can hold even more, and EMV's like dinasaur can support nearly as many people. Time travel is only used in two attractions worth mentioning as the entire ride uses it: Dinasaur & Spaceship Earth, but they are both BEYOND different types of rides. One with Dinos, and the other human past (with the exception of the screens when th go down). A future time travel ride would be an incredibly epic fit for Tomorrowland. Would you rather go on an omnimover instead of a KUKA Arm for Harry Potter & the forbidden journey? I can answer that for you and for that reason along with the fact that there are already 3 omnimovers already, with buzz and hm suiting their rides very well (not so much for Ariel) we don't need another at MK ever, kne at Epcot, and preferably not AK or HWS too. We need some better different technology rides before we put any shape or form an omnimover at another one of the parks. We need another simulator, coaster, maybe a KUKA arm, whatever Star Wars land is doing, coaster, Lps trackless ride system, and something else WDI can, or cooking up.
Daveeeeed
Well-Known Member
Splash Mohntain successfully accomplishes that, along with Tower of Tertor, Figment, and Dinasaur, while they may not be facing on side they still do not have large show scenes like pirates. Harry Potter & The Forbidden Journey is also probably the perfect example, along with Transformers. Capacity can be solved too. Omnimovers are feat capacity solvers, but pirates does it better, and most coasters nearly equal them, while giving a far better experience. Haunted Mansion is able to use an omnimover it its at vantage though by making it a slow tour. And Buzz it doesn't really matter as all you are doing is shooting, but TSMM has much better vehicles, but again it is a different ride. One is slow while one spins or is stationary. But for sure there should never be another omnimover at MK. That is not to say that there won't, but Therr shouldn't ever be another one, and personally I think that Disney realizes that too.
Daveeeeed
Well-Known Member
How is time travel a big issue to you? As buzz and hm the omnimover works for the type of ride, but not as much for Ariel, there still should not be another omnimover as that'll be three IN ONE PARK. Time travel is spread across 2 parks, and MK would be the third if they add one which would also be the third ride. One relating to Dinasaurs, kne relating to ancient history, and a new one possibly at MK relating to a lab in the future. How on Earth would that not work???? They got rid of 20k Leagues under the sea, but when they added the nemo ride to Epcot did people say, oh no we can't have that because it involves the ocean?
RSoxNo1
Well-Known Member
Look, I want to see a 4th Dimension coaster and trackless rides in Orlando more than anyone, but I refuse to simply dismiss the omnimover system, it is very effective.
Also, Pirates has a time travel component to it (although more so in Disneyland).
Daveeeeed
Well-Known Member
*Whoever reads any responses to this message or thinks that what I am saying makes no sense, PLEASE read my whole reply as I really want everyone to understand what I am saying, and not that I am posting stuff for no reason as my point is very valid*
I see what you are saying, but
1 omnimovers are not cheap, and quite literally cost a lot, but obviously aren't as expensive as a KUKA ARM system
2 you could argue there's time travel for Tom Sawyer Island, Star Tours, Rio Del Tiempo (when it still existed), etc. but honestly that is kind of pushing it.
The only time travel themed rides are Spaceship Earth, and Dinasaur, which both are completely different rides, with different themes, different parks, and different ride systems. One is human's past, while the other is dinosaurs past.
We are at two time travel rides. This can be compared to The Haunted Mansion & Spaceship Earth on omnimovers as both use the same base type, are completely different, but at the same time, suits the ride very well.
Time travel to the future, which has yet to be done (as tomorrowland is in the future) would work wonders as a ride there.
A non-ip future (while SE & D are past) attraction that could easily use a system not used before, but possibly along the lines of Escape from Gringotts. Don't get me wrong, omnimovers are an epic system and can really plow down people, and can even be used very effectively to tell a story like Spaceship Earth, or to give a tour, like The Haunted Mansion, but we already have 5 in WDW. We don't need a 4th in MK no matter your perspective, as it still costs a lot, and there are other alternatives to people eaters, whether above or below, there is no current need for another one in MK. Plus rides like Ariel and Nemo feel in a way awkward by using the omnimover ride system.
There is no real purpose, or benefit from it, other than allowing sets to be cheaper by limiting the view, and effectively allowing people to ride it, and have short lines. The thing is though, rides like Harry Potter & The Forbidden Journey give you a very limited view, with small sets on top of it all, doing exactly what an omnimover does. With the exception of nemo, all the other ones have ride scenes surrounding you entirely, something That the forbidden journey never did once, thus allowing that ride's cost to be minimal compared to what it could be based on the scale of the ride (Ex. E-ticket).
Sure KUKA arms cost more than an omnimover, and while they do have a high capacity, but aren't as fast loading as an omnimover, they do allow for cheaper sets, small IMAX segments to further increase the length of the ride allows for vehicles to take it slower throughout some parts of the ride and give a more custom & well built experience & KUKA Arms can also focus more attention on something, and allow for a sensational flying experience so grand any ride using it could be considered one of the best in the world. All of this and especially the fact that there are already 5! Omnimover ride systems in WDW and 3! in MK. There is not a single reason why they would use another one again at MK.
Ariel had 20 minute waits when I went to MK on the 2nd of January this year. Reason being: too much capacity for a decent ride, that is not a must do. Lower wait times are always a plus, and I am so happy they made Ariel, but going forward now, they need to focus on lowering wait times for the mountains, and maybe add one more family friendly dark ride, to not let the current wait times for those types of rides increase.
While a ride that would use a KUKA Arm would automatically add 10 or more minutes to the wait time compared to an omnimover for a medium-high crowd day, but the ride would probably have waits more along 60-70 minutes on "Spring Break" period after the first year of operation, because people want to ride it, and people might go there just to ride that ride. Which would also effectively slightly lower wait times across other attractions in certain parts of the park, and the ride in that category ex. Thrill rides.
And lastly, again I will say that omnimovers are great ride systems, and if executed properly can sometimes be the best choice for a ride, but because MK has 3, and because there are 5 throughout Disney World, some being the best option, and others that were not the best choice, but still worked. We have enough all around that it would be almost ludicrous to add another one to MK particularly. The ride system by itself, I don't know if it could even fit in AK at all without it coming across as forced. And HWS could be fine if in a beyond unlikely case they relocate buzz to there. Epcot already has two, and the other FW pavilions with the exception of a roller coaster are the most viable places for a new ride the current show buildings wouldn't work out very well for an omnimover, and most of the themes wouldn't work well slow paced. Remember, they removed one omnimover in that park back in the 90's. And if the Figment show building gets destroyed, so a new more lavish ride could be put in, I seriously doubt they would go through all that work to put in an omnimover. So MK is truly the only park where another one could go, but there is already three, so for at least well into the next decade, there is no place for another omnimover in the entire WDW. Thanks for reading!
I see what you are saying, but
1 omnimovers are not cheap, and quite literally cost a lot, but obviously aren't as expensive as a KUKA ARM system
2 you could argue there's time travel for Tom Sawyer Island, Star Tours, Rio Del Tiempo (when it still existed), etc. but honestly that is kind of pushing it.
The only time travel themed rides are Spaceship Earth, and Dinasaur, which both are completely different rides, with different themes, different parks, and different ride systems. One is human's past, while the other is dinosaurs past.
We are at two time travel rides. This can be compared to The Haunted Mansion & Spaceship Earth on omnimovers as both use the same base type, are completely different, but at the same time, suits the ride very well.
Time travel to the future, which has yet to be done (as tomorrowland is in the future) would work wonders as a ride there.
A non-ip future (while SE & D are past) attraction that could easily use a system not used before, but possibly along the lines of Escape from Gringotts. Don't get me wrong, omnimovers are an epic system and can really plow down people, and can even be used very effectively to tell a story like Spaceship Earth, or to give a tour, like The Haunted Mansion, but we already have 5 in WDW. We don't need a 4th in MK no matter your perspective, as it still costs a lot, and there are other alternatives to people eaters, whether above or below, there is no current need for another one in MK. Plus rides like Ariel and Nemo feel in a way awkward by using the omnimover ride system.
There is no real purpose, or benefit from it, other than allowing sets to be cheaper by limiting the view, and effectively allowing people to ride it, and have short lines. The thing is though, rides like Harry Potter & The Forbidden Journey give you a very limited view, with small sets on top of it all, doing exactly what an omnimover does. With the exception of nemo, all the other ones have ride scenes surrounding you entirely, something That the forbidden journey never did once, thus allowing that ride's cost to be minimal compared to what it could be based on the scale of the ride (Ex. E-ticket).
Sure KUKA arms cost more than an omnimover, and while they do have a high capacity, but aren't as fast loading as an omnimover, they do allow for cheaper sets, small IMAX segments to further increase the length of the ride allows for vehicles to take it slower throughout some parts of the ride and give a more custom & well built experience & KUKA Arms can also focus more attention on something, and allow for a sensational flying experience so grand any ride using it could be considered one of the best in the world. All of this and especially the fact that there are already 5! Omnimover ride systems in WDW and 3! in MK. There is not a single reason why they would use another one again at MK.
Ariel had 20 minute waits when I went to MK on the 2nd of January this year. Reason being: too much capacity for a decent ride, that is not a must do. Lower wait times are always a plus, and I am so happy they made Ariel, but going forward now, they need to focus on lowering wait times for the mountains, and maybe add one more family friendly dark ride, to not let the current wait times for those types of rides increase.
While a ride that would use a KUKA Arm would automatically add 10 or more minutes to the wait time compared to an omnimover for a medium-high crowd day, but the ride would probably have waits more along 60-70 minutes on "Spring Break" period after the first year of operation, because people want to ride it, and people might go there just to ride that ride. Which would also effectively slightly lower wait times across other attractions in certain parts of the park, and the ride in that category ex. Thrill rides.
And lastly, again I will say that omnimovers are great ride systems, and if executed properly can sometimes be the best choice for a ride, but because MK has 3, and because there are 5 throughout Disney World, some being the best option, and others that were not the best choice, but still worked. We have enough all around that it would be almost ludicrous to add another one to MK particularly. The ride system by itself, I don't know if it could even fit in AK at all without it coming across as forced. And HWS could be fine if in a beyond unlikely case they relocate buzz to there. Epcot already has two, and the other FW pavilions with the exception of a roller coaster are the most viable places for a new ride the current show buildings wouldn't work out very well for an omnimover, and most of the themes wouldn't work well slow paced. Remember, they removed one omnimover in that park back in the 90's. And if the Figment show building gets destroyed, so a new more lavish ride could be put in, I seriously doubt they would go through all that work to put in an omnimover. So MK is truly the only park where another one could go, but there is already three, so for at least well into the next decade, there is no place for another omnimover in the entire WDW. Thanks for reading!
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