Universal's Potential Growth (2014-2024)

seascape

Well-Known Member
USF is at 7.0 million for 2013. No way it adds 2.5 million in a single year. 1.5 million is more reasonable and equal to how many Hogsmeade added.
But all the Universal fans keep saying the Universal parks will pass DHS this year, next year at the latest. Many of them have said to expect a minimum of 15 to per cent 20 more. 15 percent would bring the combined numbers to 18 million and 20 percent to almost 19 million. Who am I to doubt the Universal experts?

On the other hand I can agree that the original number in tbis thread are much more likely with neither park breaking 12 million until 2021 when all the crowds come in for Disney's 50th.
 

mahnamahna101

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Well my problem here is this. IOA has 4 coasters while USF has 2. (Don't consider WWPNHC a thrill of any kind)
If you take away Dueling Dragons, then IOA has 2 Coasters . Harry Potter is the land that currently has 3 coasters. Why must one land have so many coasters? My arguments for JP getting a coaster or Suess even.
JP family suspended coaster
Grinch E ticket family coaster
Mt. Doom E ticket thrill coaster

Problem solved! I just don't think more steel track flying over IOA would help it against its detractors. Universal ought to try putting the Disney mountains to shame in terms of coaster theming.

But Potter has 3 coasters already (2 sides for DC, Hippogriff). Potter would only have 2 (Hippogriff and the mountain one)
 
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mahnamahna101

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
But all the Universal fans keep saying the Universal parks will pass DHS this year, next year at the latest. Many of them have said to expect a minimum of 15 to per cent 20 more. 15 percent would bring the combined numbers to 18 million and 20 percent to almost 19 million. Who am I to doubt the Universal experts?

On the other hand I can agree that the original number in tbis thread are much more likely with neither park breaking 12 million until 2021 when all the crowds come in for Disney's 50th.
MK added 600,000 from 17.9 million with just an Omnimover and restaurant.

USF can add 1.5 million from 7 million with a immersive, game changing new land. And if you seriously think DHS is increasing in attendance without any new E ticket until 2020... wow.

You said AK would add 5 million guests in 2017. You said Star Wars would bring 5 million to DHS. You said Epcot would bring 8 million in some convoluted way via festivals! And that MK will get 25 million without a new E ticket or really any major expansion or actual additions. And Universal fans are just crazy, huh? You can't deny you said all of those. You posted them. Not attacking, just pointing the hypocrisy in your troll attack.

By 2017, Hollywood Studios will be 6th - nothing else to it. While AK and Epcot may be near 12 million, that doesn't make them untouchable.
 

seascape

Well-Known Member
MK added 600,000 from 17.9 million with just an Omnimover and restaurant.

USF can add 1.5 million from 7 million with a immersive, game changing new land. And if you seriously think DHS is increasing in attendance without any new E ticket until 2020... wow.

You said AK would add 5 million guests in 2017. You said Star Wars would bring 5 million to DHS. You said Epcot would bring 8 million in some convoluted way via festivals! And that MK will get 25 million without a new E ticket or really any major expansion or actual additions. And Universal fans are just crazy, huh? You can't deny you said all of those. You posted them. Not attacking, just pointing the hypocrisy in your troll attack.

By 2017, Hollywood Studios will be 6th - nothing else to it. While AK and Epcot may be near 12 million, that doesn't make them untouchable.
I did say AK will get 15 million in 2017. That is not without additions. Pandora, Rivers of Light and the night time safari will all be running by then. As for DHS the star wars addition will draw so many more customers than HP2. They still sell 10 million light sabers a year. That is before the new star wars movies come out. Yes DHS will draw 15 million a year. As for Epcot I said they need some upgrades in both world.show case and future world but yes they can and will draw 20 million in 2021. I don't believe I said it would be in 2017 and if I did I apologize. The same goes true for the Magic Kingdom, the 25 million will be in 2021. Do you really doubt that on their 50th anniversary they will not draw 7 million more than in 2013? You seem to think that Pandora and the rest of AK expansion will be canceled and nothing else will be built between now and 2021. If you really believe that you are alone.
 

IAmFloridaBorn

Well-Known Member
I did say AK will get 15 million in 2017. That is not without additions. Pandora, Rivers of Light and the night time safari will all be running by then. As for DHS the star wars addition will draw so many more customers than HP2. They still sell 10 million light sabers a year. That is before the new star wars movies come out. Yes DHS will draw 15 million a year. As for Epcot I said they need some upgrades in both world.show case and future world but yes they can and will draw 20 million in 2021. I don't believe I said it would be in 2017 and if I did I apologize. The same goes true for the Magic Kingdom, the 25 million will be in 2021. Do you really doubt that on their 50th anniversary they will not draw 7 million more than in 2013? You seem to think that Pandora and the rest of AK expansion will be canceled and nothing else will be built between now and 2021. If you really believe that you are alone.
I cant say he/she is alone.
 

Magenta Panther

Well-Known Member
Well, with Diagon Alley appearing to be a smash success in the making, Universal Orlando is in the spotlight... more importantly, at a turning point.
How much more can the parks grow?
Will they add a 3rd gate?
What would be a good theme for a 3rd gate?
Will they keep Wet n' Wild or close it for their new waterpark?
How many hotels will they add?

As someone who considers themselves a fan of both Universal and Disney, I tend to criticize both (Disney World the most - but it's out of love!).

Bravo! That's the reason most of us here criticize Disney, I daresay...we just want the parks to live up to Walt's vision of quality, immersiveness, innovation and imagination. The amazing new attractions Universal has built PROVES that it's NOT too much to ask for...

As what I'd like to see in Universal in the future...well, since Universal's parks are largely made up of outside-studio IPs, I think a Ghostbusters attraction would be awesome. The Universal techs could recreate the Ghostbusters building from the movies, and build a terrific interactive dark ride inside it. I think I read that Columbia Pictures is planning to reboot the franchise, and is re-releasing the original movie to theaters to test interest. (I plan to attend that screening). Frankly, I'm surprised no non-Disney theme park hasn't already built such an attraction. I hope Universal will be the one to build it, after seeing the amazing stuff it's built for Potter.
 
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JT3000

Well-Known Member
Bravo! That's the reason most of us here criticize Disney, I daresay...we just want the parks to live up to Walt's vision of quality, immersiveness, innovation and imagination. The amazing new attractions Universal has built PROVES that it's NOT too much to ask for...

As what I'd like to see in Universal in the future...well, since Universal's parks are largely made up of outside-studio IPs, I think a Ghostbusters attraction would be awesome. The Universal techs could recreate the Ghostbusters building from the movies, and build a terrific interactive dark ride inside it. I think I read that Columbia Pictures is planning to reboot the franchise, and is re-releasing the original movie to theaters to test interest. (I plan to attend that screening). Frankly, I'm surprised no non-Disney theme park hasn't already built such an attraction. I hope Universal will be the one to build it, after seeing the amazing stuff it's built for Potter.

They've already done Ghostbusters, I doubt it gets revisited. I don't see a reboot working either.
 

mahnamahna101

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
I did say AK will get 15 million in 2017. That is not without additions. Pandora, Rivers of Light and the night time safari will all be running by then. As for DHS the star wars addition will draw so many more customers than HP2. They still sell 10 million light sabers a year. That is before the new star wars movies come out. Yes DHS will draw 15 million a year. As for Epcot I said they need some upgrades in both world.show case and future world but yes they can and will draw 20 million in 2021. I don't believe I said it would be in 2017 and if I did I apologize. The same goes true for the Magic Kingdom, the 25 million will be in 2021. Do you really doubt that on their 50th anniversary they will not draw 7 million more than in 2013? You seem to think that Pandora and the rest of AK expansion will be canceled and nothing else will be built between now and 2021. If you really believe that you are alone.

You do realize all of those additions to AK only bring 2 attractions to the table? Animal Kingdom is at 10 million right now.. I'm expecting it to stay even for the next 3 years... so 10-10.5 million by 2017. It's not possible for a low-hype IP like Avatar to bring in 5 million guests. River of Lights and nighttime safari will help, but not 5 million guests... do you know how awful the lines at AK would be if 5 million guests were added to the attendance each year? a 45 minute wait would almost be a walkon :rolleyes: 12 million-12.5 million is feasible by 2021. But compared to Potter and Star Wars, Avatar just isn't gonna turn the stiles.

Star Wars will only draw more customers if Disney does it right... a spinner, M&G, restaurant and Omnimover won't get DHS to 15 million. DHS can't even hold 10 million without the park feeling unnecessarily packed. Toy Story Mania shouldn't ever have a line about 45 minutes, yet it gets 3 hr waits regularly. ToT gets 90-120 minute waits, same with RnRC. Even Star Tours gets 30-40 minute waits and it's a people-eater.

DHS has less capacity than USF and IOA... yet you act like it can add 5 million guests over a single year (2019 is the earliest any Star Wars expansion would open considering how slow TDO is with construction). 6 rides... 5 shows. 2 of which could very well be closed during Star Wars construction. 11 attractions, yet you think it has more capacity than USF and IOA which have 50 between them? :coldfeet:

You know what? Epcot COULD get to 20 million if TDO actually bothered to overhaul Future World, add original E-tickets and add stuff to World Showcase you can ride/watch. But you know what? TDO shows ZERO interest in that. There's 11 empty expansion pads at Epcot waiting for additions. And one empty pavillion used for corporate meetings. TDO has not shown they want Epcot to get to 20 million. If they did, they would have taken the $2 billion from MM+ and invested into fixing the park. Again, 13-13.5 million is more reasonable since the only things Epcot may be getting (Imagination revamp, extra Soarin' theater, Energy upgrade) just is far too little, far too late. I love Epcot, but sadly 20 million isn't happening until every last expansion pad is full and the Wonders of Life pavillion is occupied with attractions again.

MK isn't adding 7 million guests over 7 years... MAYBE 2-2.5 million over 7, but nowhere near 7 million. SDMT is the last major addition the park is getting until 2021 at the earliest (Tomorrowland redo or Frontierland expansion - and that's not even close to certain). Do you know how unbearable the park would be with 25 million guests? The lines and paths are already packed to the brim - imagine 7 million extra people. Unless the entire backstage area is reworked to allow construction beyond the railroad berm, that's not happening.

You clearly haven't looked up the attendance trends for WDW for the last 10 years. Go look up the TEA numbers - though, guest spending and other factors are more important than attendance. MK has dipped and risen by less than 5% except for when New Fantasyland opened.

Have you bothered to look at what Universal Orlando has planned? Do you think we're just saying it'll have large increases for our health? Kong + Diagon Alley + KidZone replacement... and that doesn't include CityWalk 2.0, hotel 5, the waterpark, and other additions. Universal is giving the guest what they want.

Honestly, I'm tired of arguing like this. It's petty. You've clearly succumbed to pixie dust - and there's no turning back for you. As a fan of Disney and Universal alike, I criticize and praise when the situation warrants it. Dragon Challenge's lack of theming on the ride itself and the FJ show-building are two fatal flaws in Hogsmeade I want Universal to fix. Likewise, TDO should aim to fix up Epcot, DHS and AK before the 50th. I get that Pandora is going to be a nice addition - but there's no excitement when the big E-ticket is a 3D version of Soarin'. I'm exciting for the indoor boat ride! That's something AK needs desperately - and I appreciate TDO for adding it.

Universal is also smaller at the moment... with 15.1 million combined attendance. IOA is getting an increase just because of Hogwarts Express. USF gets the huge boost because of Diagon Alley. Also, you have to consider that Transformers and Springfield will still be driving attendance slightly as well since this is their first full year.

8.5 million for each would only be 17 million combined. Surely not as ludicrous as you claiming that Pandora will add 5 million in a year or that just Star Wars Land will get DHS past 15 million (you even said the park can't hold more than 12 million - SWL would only add another million in capacity... you'd have to do a Pixar Place expansion using Backlot Tour and LMA in order to get to 15 million)

Again, you obviously aren't going to change your mind, so I'll let you retire to WDW: where stagnant parks MAGICALLY add 5 million to 7 million guests in one year.
 

JT3000

Well-Known Member
Oh, I didn't know that. Universal had a Ghostbusters ride? I guessed I missed it. Was it any good?

It was a show, where Twister is now, which basically recreated the finale of the first movie. I believe you entered from the firehouse Rockit now busts out of. I don't really remember the attraction. Maybe someone else has a video.

They also did some sort of Ghostbusters street show in front of the library facade in later years, but I never stopped to watch it.
 

Magenta Panther

Well-Known Member
It was a show, where Twister is now, which basically recreated the finale of the first movie. I believe you entered from the firehouse Rockit now busts out of. I don't really remember the attraction. Maybe someone else has a video.

Thanks! Maybe I'll search Youtube and see if anyone posted a GB ride video there...
 

mahnamahna101

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
You actually believe Disney is going to cancel Pandora and do no other improvements to any of their Orlando parks? What are you smoking? You may not be happy that they haven't built faster but to believe they will do nothing over the next 7 years is just crazy.

SDMT, Disney Springs and Pandora... that's all we're getting until the 50th (River of Light and nighttime safari aren't major additions - both of them should have been done a long time ago). Maybe a pavillion at Epcot will get a cartoon overlay. Hooray! Some Olaf bathrooms might accompany the Frozen show at DHS! Yip-yip!

No, I believe all of those additions are coming to AK in 2016/2017... and DA is going to prevent any substantial growth since it and DHS are Disney's two half-day parks. A nighttime show and alternate version of an existing attraction aren't going to drive attendance up by the 4 million needed for AK to get 15 million by 2017. World of Color only added 0.9 million to DCA and that also had Little Mermaid and Sky School helping it... not to mention DCA was at 6.2 million just like a certain park in 2012 ;), it also increased to 7.1 million just like the one down the highway from WDW. And it got over 8.5 million last year. Certainly possible for USF and IOA - both of which are leaps and bounds above DCA.

from 2008-2012, they added American Idol Experience. Star Tours II was an 10 years overdue upgrade... doesn't count. From 2012-2014, nothing (M&Gs/parades aren't attractions). And they're going 3 years without anything between SDMT and Pandora. 2020-2022 is a reasonable timeframe for another new attraction based on TDO's pace under Iger. Eisner at least bothered to add attractions and even E-tickets to the parks (Everest and Mission - SPACE aren't as bad as people make them out to be - Everest just needs the yeti fixed... and Gary Sinise elevates SPACE :D). You also don't seem to get TDO just wasted $2 billion on Magic Bands and Fastpass+. They aren't going to be building these E-tickets it would take to add the supposed 5 million you're coming up with. Whereas Universal will just be getting to $1 billion spent in Orlando (maybe a little over) once Kong opens. That includes Transformers, Springfield, Diagon Alley, Cabana Bay, Citywalk 2.0 and Kong.
 
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mahnamahna101

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
It was a show, where Twister is now, which basically recreated the finale of the first movie. I believe you entered from the firehouse Rockit now busts out of. I don't really remember the attraction. Maybe someone else has a video.

They also did some sort of Ghostbusters street show in front of the library facade in later years, but I never stopped to watch it.
Considering Universal brought back Kong, the reboot, the re-release this August, and the fact that they had a Ghostbusters themed version of MIB planned for Universal Dubai, anything's possible :) personally, I'd like to see them return to their rightful firehouse in New York.
 

mahnamahna101

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Bravo! That's the reason most of us here criticize Disney, I daresay...we just want the parks to live up to Walt's vision of quality, immersiveness, innovation and imagination. The amazing new attractions Universal has built PROVES that it's NOT too much to ask for...

As what I'd like to see in Universal in the future...well, since Universal's parks are largely made up of outside-studio IPs, I think a Ghostbusters attraction would be awesome. The Universal techs could recreate the Ghostbusters building from the movies, and build a terrific interactive dark ride inside it. I think I read that Columbia Pictures is planning to reboot the franchise, and is re-releasing the original movie to theaters to test interest. (I plan to attend that screening). Frankly, I'm surprised no non-Disney theme park hasn't already built such an attraction. I hope Universal will be the one to build it, after seeing the amazing stuff it's built for Potter.

Exactly! Walt's vision doesn't apply to just Disney - it applies to any theme park willing to strive for those ideals. With Hogsmeade, Jurassic Park, Lost Continent, Seuss Landing, Springfield, and Diagon Alley, I'd say Universal has definitely built themselves into a premiere theme park resort. And it's only the beginning :)

Ghostbusters is part of USF's history and I'd love to see them and BTTF come back. Frankly, it could make a good replacement for MIB if they rethemed the area. Or even as a show where Fear Factor is. Twister replacement would be poetic justice, though ;)
 

JT3000

Well-Known Member
Considering Universal brought back Kong, the reboot, the re-release this August, and the fact that they had a Ghostbusters themed version of MIB planned for Universal Dubai, anything's possible :) personally, I'd like to see them return to their rightful firehouse in New York.

Anything is possible, but I think Kong is much more of a cross-generational thing, which has already had a very successful reboot. I believe it would be more difficult to update Ghostbusters for new audiences without doing a disservice to the original.

A new version of MIB could be cool, but the fact that we already have MIB makes that problematic, and I'd rather not see it replaced.
 

mahnamahna101

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Anything is possible, but I think Kong is much more of a cross-generational thing, which has already had a very successful reboot. I believe it would be more difficult to update Ghostbusters for new audiences without doing a disservice to the original.

A new version of MIB could be cool, but the fact that we already have MIB makes that problematic, and I'd rather not see it replaced.
Ghostbusters 3 is coming out in 2016 apparently (November/December? Summer looks a little crowded). But I understand. I'd still like to see some ghost-busting again, and it'd bring back the 80s charm to New York (Bill Paxton can only add so much to Twister :D)
 

IAmFloridaBorn

Well-Known Member
You actually believe Disney is going to cancel Pandora and do no other improvements to any of their Orlando parks? What are you smoking? You may not be happy that they haven't built faster but to believe they will do nothing over the next 7 years is just crazy.
I don't think they are going to fast track to do anything and I highly doubt anything gets done without budget cuts. Half-Assed projects yes. Sure.
 

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