Universal Epic Universe (South Expansion Complex) - Now Open!

[flynnibus]

You made the comparison by claiming Vegas copied Disney. I merely followed your lead.

No - Vegas was mentioned, and you wondered why... It's because both built immersive resort experiences and Vegas is what it is now because they learned from Disney and took it further.

I don't know why you think Orlando is some gutter and that everyone should lower their expectations. There are plenty of very nice hotels in Orlando that aren't Holiday Inns charging W prices.

If "a hotel is a hotel," what are we even discussing? You continue to conflate different types of destinations and what they typically offer. Orlando isn't as flashy as Vegas and it probably never will be, because they cater to different audiences with different expectations. No, just because there are adults in a family, it doesn't make them the same audience as Vegas's target demographic. You're trying to make this much more complicated than it actually is.

And you seem to get single tracked on your own interpretation and refuse to think about anything else. We're talking hotels here. We could substitute NYC... or any other major destination and have the same conversation. Heck, my last NYC hotel say which was just a side street LES hotel picked for price for more than anything had a nicer room and styling than Helios. Many of just the convention hotels right in Orlando offer a better baseline. Heck, just look at the Gaylord just down the road... You are so hung up on Vegas as sin city you can't stop to realize the point never hung on Vegas - the point was just other actual quality hotel properties... not some crappy "it's better then POR!" standard.

 

[celluloid]

Majority of guests? No - will it still be busy? I think so.. same way all the other properties still have crowds.. for the same reason you are looking to get away. And why I said, lets see how your stay goes...


I think you need a refresher of what was already said.



I already acknowledged the proximity and why it's significant. What I commented on was the hotel itself and what they are charging for.. and what you even describe as 'boutique'.

Even if you feel the price is justified due to the location - it doesn't change the hotel amenities and their weakness compared to other premium experiences.

They are tracking the prices of this hotel right with the other lowes premium hotels at USO... without the express pass, and even without a lot of the amenities compared to the other lowes properties. Trade express pass for access? maybe.. Trade the hotel experience itself AND express pass and try to still pass it off as a 'grand hotel'?? Nah.. I'm calling that as I see it. Overpriced.

You think I need a refresher... I think the location and convenience IS a premium experience.

Clearly for you, that is the case. Others liking it should not challenge you, for the sake of your mental health. The hote rates raised for a reason. Demand vs supply.

 

[flynnibus]

You need a refresher. I think the location and convenience IS a premium experience.

So you'd consider the Candy Cane Inn at Disneyland a 'premium experience' because it's close to the park? You confuse a perk with the actual hotel product.

Clearly for you, that is the case. Others liking it should not challenge you, for the sake of your mental health.

Dude... I just gave my thoughts on the property, and you are the one who challenged me as if I were incorrect.. simply because YOU justified the price for yourself. Get off your horse simply because I didn't go "oh wow.. I agree with you now!"

 

[AidenRodriguez731]

You and @AidenRodriguez731, @UNCgolf just stop. I keep getting told the Mouse and Universal are different. Regardless of the COST., EPIC was never meant to be the Mouse level. It is a clear upgrade to IOA which is Universals best park.

It's not there fault you want Disney lite or rides that don't move

Uh oh. I was told to stop by Universal Creative. It’s a discussion form mate. If you can’t handle a little criticism being thrown to a multi billion dollar company, maybe it’s time to log off for a bit

 

[AidenRodriguez731]

So you'd consider the Candy Cane Inn at Disneyland a 'premium experience' because it's close to the park? You confuse a perk with the actual hotel product.

Dude... I just gave my thoughts on the property, and you are the one who challenged me as if I were incorrect.. simply because YOU justified the price for yourself. Get off your horse simply because I didn't go "oh wow.. I agree with you now!"

I believe its a heck of a jump to compare a non related hotel near Disneyland that Disney partnered up with to a purpose built icon hotel built at the back of the park, dominating the skyline and built by the actual company itself.

 

[flynnibus]

The videos this week have me more excited for lands than I thought I would be. I also like the intensity level they seemed to have targeted.. along with what looks like less sim+screens... tho I don't know how much Monsters will be like hogwarts. I'm too old to do much of that stuff anymore and even trying to do BTTF would get to me towards the end.

I'm only disappointed that the park is opening at the end of the month instead of end of this month.. as I'll be in Central Florida in early May. Would have been niced to double dip.. or made this part of the kids graduation gift. Now I gotta find a good time period to try to dodge the crowds. I can't imagine Epic will change the overall visiting seasons..

 

[flynnibus]

I believe its a heck of a jump to compare a non related hotel near Disneyland that Disney partnered up with to a purpose built icon hotel built at the back of the park, dominating the skyline and built by the actual company itself.

It's not a jump - it's pointing out that location alone doesn't define the hotel experience... so if one wants to look at that and close their eyes to everything else... well, they are buying the location, not the experience.

 

[Jrb1979]

Uh oh. I was told to stop by Universal Creative. It’s a discussion form mate. If you can’t handle a little criticism being thrown to a multi billion dollar company, maybe it’s time to log off for a bit

Criticism is fine. It feels that there is more nitpicking of the park then celebrating things like the Ministry ride and the Monsters ride.

It's the sightlines, the exposed steel, and the lack of things for non ride warriors to ride. I only bring it up cause I hear constantly how Universal isn't Disney. When Epic continues with a lot of things from IOA, many are upset cause it's not on the level of Disney.

 

[celluloid]

So you'd consider the Candy Cane Inn at Disneyland a 'premium experience' because it's close to the park? You confuse a perk with the actual hotel product.

Dude... I just gave my thoughts on the property, and you are the one who challenged me as if I were incorrect.. simply because YOU justified the price for yourself. Get off your horse simply because I didn't go "oh wow.. I agree with you now!"

I don't care if you agree with me or not. My reasons for staying are as valid as yours for not. That is how value works. Why is what I consider a premium experience not valid? That sounds more like high horse ridin' to me.

I don't know a lot about it but what I do know but I don't think Candy Cane inn compares nor am I in the market so I don't really care to a answer that. But it also reads a rhetorical high horse ridin'. To belittle an opinion of value counter to yours.

 

[AidenRodriguez731]

Criticism is fine. It feels that there is more nitpicking of the park then celebrating things like the Ministry ride and the Monsters ride.

It's the sightlines, the exposed steel, and the lack of things for non ride warriors to ride. I only bring it up cause I hear constantly how Universal isn't Disney. When Epic continues with a lot of things from IOA, many are upset cause it's not on the level of Disney.

Sightline issues are not a nitpick when its meant to be an immersive viking world and the whole park was advertised about being completely immersed in these worlds.

Plus, why would I celebrate the Ministry ride if I haven't even seen a POV of it or know almost anything about it other than it seemingly being a better Spiderman. You have to remember it opened up fairly recently to just media and no one was allowed to film on it so there isn't much discussion there.

For Monsters, overall it seems like a good ride but I do have some very slight gripes with it as well but again, until I get a better POV or ride it myself, I can't properly comment on it. What I can comment on is how many obvious sightline problems I see in POV of rides which have MAJOR problems.

So yeah, people aren't here to glaze something they haven't ever seen. And there is only so much to say about the other stuff without seeing good POVs. Honestly imo it would have been smarter for Universal to allow certain POVs of rides so that these issues wouldn't be all anyone is able to talk about.

 

[TalkToEthan]

This hotel's main sell it is the most convenient hotel park access ever built. Yes, even more than the amazing Mira Costa convienience

If by ‘convenience’ you mean proximity then, hmmmm????

Isn’t Helios adjacent(not inside) to Epic with its own park entry……as in Grand Californian style out in Anaheim?? ((If I got this part wrong then please disregard the below and I’ll issue a preemptive “sorry about that”))

The Mira Costa simultaneously serves as part of Disney Sea’s boundary and it has major sections that are **inside** the park.
I used the special hotel guest park entry whereby starting near the lobby I walked down stairs (I think there was an elevator option as well, too many years ago to remember) and once I reached the bottom I was inside the park.

I don’t see how another hotel can possibly beat that type of park entry convenience.

 

[celluloid]

If by ‘convenience’ you mean proximity then, hmmmm????

Isn’t Helios adjacent(not inside) to Epic with its own park entry……as in Grand Californian style out in Anaheim?? ((If I got this part wrong then please disregard the below and I’ll issue a preemptive “sorry about that”))

The Mira Costa simultaneously serves as part of Disney Sea’s boundary and it has major sections that are **inside** the park.
I used the special hotel guest park entry whereby starting near the lobby I walked down stairs (I think there was an elevator option as well, too many years ago to remember) and once I reached the bottom I was inside the park.

I don’t see how another hotel can possibly beat that type of park entry convenience.

Not only(I said main) but conjunction of the fringe perks I mentioned esrlier.
Grand Californian does not have its own security and turnstile for the park.

I would put Grand Cali more akin to Hard Rock Hotel Orlando Royal Pacific or Portofino. (Obviously those have walks so not a 1:1

And you were sharing that Cali lobby with day guests and more than 500 rooms.

I was at Mira Costa as well but the turnstile spot was smaller and you can only get a Happy Fifteen, not an hour. It was also a lot more than 600 USD a night for me and family and the perk was shared with far more than 499 other guest rooms for the Happy Fifteen. A lot of things add up.
And to my chill by comparison point, less than Half the capacity as Grand Cali and Day guests are nkt going to be a common entry to property.

This is amplified when I will have early and convenient access for my family of four with kids, and EPIC is our mission of the trip. A park that is new, sold out for our time and not DCA.

We need a hotel either way, we are doing a two day two night EPIC trip. The upgraded cost was a good value to us and only 600 because I chose to do the park view room.

 

[TalkToEthan]

Grand Californian does not have its own security and turnstile for the park.

It doesn’t???
I was there in ‘15 for a short 3 dayer and I could have sworn it had its own park access into California Adventure. Maybe my memory is gone(or going!!!) but I seem to remember passing by the main pool and passing some huge fake tree stump prop and finding my way to a special entry point that was close to the Redwood kids challenge trail area inside DCA.

 

[celluloid]

Try this instead:

Won’t folk have to


It doesn’t???
I was there in ‘15 for a short 3 dayer and I could have sworn it had its own park access into California Adventure. Maybe my memory is gone(or going!!!) but I seem to remember passing by the main pool and passing some huge fake tree stump prop and finding my way to a special entry point that was close to the Redwood kids challenge trail area inside DCA.

Sorry, mistyped. I meant it shares it with a lot more people with 948 rooms and why I followed it with more akin to Uni's original three deluxe hotels, without the walk to their own gate and or short boat ride without their own security if they don't want the walk.


But that is also a different value for asking me as in terms personally don't habe a desire to go to DCA at this time. If DCA is your goal it would make sense as it does e ter right near that play area. Not as much chill as that Lobby is not as Grand as Fort Wilderness or others. And while it does not need to be or could be, it has day guests constantly so it is less chill.
So at worst, it is the same and makes sense for the value. I personally for now Helios has more for my needs. YMMV.

 

[wdwfan4ver]

I don't think that's how it works. A park should be at its weakest on opening day. Older parks are going to have an inherent advantage, especially since theme parks can evolve over time and aren't perpetually stuck in their original form.

I agree with you. What happened to Epcot in my view is due to management mismanaging the park or the choices by the imagineers and I have a feeling that Magic Kingdom is starting to be on the decline also for the same reason as Epcot. Rivers of America going away affects Liberty Square and Frontier Land's atmosphere in a bad way.

Epic on the other hand has a lot of Expansion plots inside that park and is going to be interesting in how that park is going mature in the next 10 to 20 years.

 

[flynnibus]

To belittle an opinion of value counter to yours.

It's not belittling. It's really simple... I'll break it down for you.

Location doesn't make a 2 star hotel a 4 star hotel. Or a 3 into a 5, or whatever.

Just like location doesn't make Helios into a premium hotel just by it's location. It makes it a better value for you.. yes.. but I never was talking about your preferences or opinion on worth. I was talking about the hotel product.

This isn't a matter of opinion or 'value' - It's an objective assessment based on industry norms. The rooms are undersized. The bathroom is small and lacks higher end features like dual vanities, separate vanity, shower heads, rainfall heads, don't see oversized towels, or included robes, etc. The rooms lack any automation or advanced functions. We did not see any bundled inclusions with the room (drinks, snacks, toiletries, etc). The hotel website doesn't describe any higher end services like turndown, etc (not suprising tho.. loewes websites have been bare bones - there maybe more they aren't listing)

They are literally on pair with a 2 or 3 star hotel except with a glass walk in shower. The rooms are small and basic. The biggest thing going for it is the park view rooms (which of course come at a upcharge) and the proximity to the park.. which also comes with the offset of being further from the rest of USO... including city walk which can be significant if they don't have late park hours.

 

[celluloid]

I agree with you. What happened to Epcot in my view is due to management mismanaging the park or the choices by the imagineers and I have a feeling that Magic Kingdom is starting to be on the decline also for the same reason as Epcot. Rivers of America going away affects Liberty Square and Frontier Land's atmosphere in a bad way.

Epic on the other hand has a lot of Expansion plots inside that park and is going to be interesting in how that park is going mature in the next 10 to 20 years.

Universal traditionally, has done well with its expansion plots. BTTF, T23D and MIB being strong early examples that many forget were expansion plot based in the first ten years. Hope that legacy continues.

 

[flynnibus]

speaking of which.. is there anything on operating hours yet? Are we going to be stuck with the classic early closings of USO? Or do we think they will keep epic open later.. like more like 11pm?

 

[celluloid]

It's not belittling. It's really simple... I'll break it down for you.

No thanks.
"It's not belittling" and "it is really simple" followed by elipses with "I'll break it down for you." was ironically funny and enough.

 

[flynnibus]

getaway hour in the park, with probably 45 min of it ahead of anyone bussing or driving over from other resorts

Also on this comment. Helios is early entry like the other hotels.. People line up long before the gates open. Transportation is going to be running early to enable those guests to reach the park to do so. Where is this head start you are expecting? At most I expect you'll have the advantage of less crowds so you won't have to get up AS early.. but you're not really going to have any advantage in the park unless they let your gate go early.

I expect to deal with the crowds they will have to do some sort of rope drop inside the park.. Can't have hundreds of hotel room guests crowding in the lobby waiting for the opening time.

And isn't early access only to Super Mario Land and the racers attraction?