Thoughts on whether Disney will add a 3rd theme park in the US (perhaps Midwest/east coast?)

[Miru]

Texas is the other megastate—California (1st) and Florida (3rd) being the others.

Houston lacks a theme park.

Maybe somewhere in the Houston area, towards Austin but not too far from Houston's airport.

Houston is about 1,000 miles from WDW.

Houston is about 1,500 miles from Disneyland.

It's still pretty cheap and easy to build big in Texas. NIMBYism isn't the norm in the Houston area yet.

Galveston is a major cruise port. It's 51 miles from Houston.

Port Canaveral is 60 miles from WDW.

You could have a WDW-Port Canaveral arrangement for DCL.

I have no idea what kind of park they'd build, however. Probably not another castle park.

Maybe a resort with an "IP portals" park like Epic Universe, a water park, resort hotels, shopping, golf, etc. Maybe another park if it's a hit.

The IP portals idea is pretty sound and allows Iger to fully have his way without damaging classics, possibly even opening up an avenue for their return.

 

[Haymarket]

The IP portals idea is pretty sound and allows Iger to fully have his way without damaging classics, possibly even opening up an avenue for their return.

Yeah, I figure the "IP portals" concept is this era's studio park. It's becoming what's widely expected by the public from the latest generation of parks.

I think Disney will eventually build one somewhere.

 

[Miru]

Yeah, I figure the "IP portals" concept is this era's studio park. It's becoming what's widely expected by the public from the latest generation of parks.

I think Disney will eventually build one somewhere.

Especially how they’re converting Disney Studios Paris into an IP portals park in Disney Adventure World.

 

[JIMINYCR]

As a New England east coaster, I would 100% with the idea of not thinking of Florida as east coast.


As to the question of the park you don’t really have anywhere on the East Coast that is far enough south to be able to run the park year round, and far enough away from Orlando that it makes sense to build out new infrastructure for a new park. Besides Disney’s business model isn’t based on going to A park. They aren’t and don’t want to be a regional/seasonal day trip park. They want people coming for a week or more, going to multiple parks, on multiple days.

People forget that Walt explored the possible spots for a park all throughout the country. They took primarily into account weather, population and workforce. Geographically population has increased in areas but getting workers to work can be a huge issue especially at the salaries they determine must be paid to keep working budgets viable. Stable weather patterns as an overall need to operate a year round park hasnt changed all that much. You can tout climate change and increase tornados/ hurricanes, heat index but nothing has been altered enough for what what Walt saw as a region to put roots down.
The biggest impediment to another park is the massive expenses to build a big enough multi park site which would be needed and Dis isnt going to risk a huge outlay of cash to do it. They are in a big enough spot now trying to keep up with Unis build by inserting mini projects and at the same time keep up with all their multi national projects.

 

[Miru]

Another idea for a new park/resort in the U.S. to make it not too similar to ODL/WDW, on top of the things like “IP Portals”… just not explicitly brand it as Disney and target the thing to adults; make it a “Hulu” park; still included in Disney-related packages but delineated from Disney nonetheless, sort of like how Hulu is slightly more embraced as part of Disney compared to how the likes of Touchstone were. This would also open up a more diverse selection of brands as a true rival to Universal.

 

[DW Aficionado]

Disney needs to add a 5th theme pard to WDW. They have been expanding the resort hotels, and now need another park to bring the crowds down to a managable level.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Disney needs to add a 5th theme pard to WDW. They have been expanding the resort hotels, and now need another park to bring the crowds down to a managable level.

Crowds are in decline

They are no where close to “capacity”

I’m NOT talking about rides…that’s not capacity

Adding a 5th park to wdw will just pull people away from the other 4 each day and Disneys costs go up. They lose in that deal.

 

[DW Aficionado]

Crowds are in decline

They are no where close to “capacity”

I’m NOT talking about rides…that’s not capacity

Adding a 5th park to wdw will just pull people away from the other 4 each day and Disneys costs go up. They lose in that deal.

Let's define capacity.... back 10 years ago, the Christmas Party kept attendance reduced. Last party I went to I would say they don't do that anymore.

Nowadays non-maximum capacity means, moving guest out to the front of the MK via service areas, and packing main street for fireworks. We literally walked past dumpsters, pickup trucks behind the Emporium.

So to me the word capacity doesn't hold any value

 

[JMcMahonEsq]

Let's define capacity.... back 10 years ago, the Christmas Party kept attendance reduced. Last party I went to I would say they don't do that anymore.

Nowadays non-maximum capacity means, moving guest out to the front of the MK via service areas, and packing main street for fireworks. We literally walked past dumpsters, pickup trucks behind the Emporium.

So to me the word capacity doesn't hold any value

And all of that means absolutely nothing as to the idea of a 5th park. What evidence is there to think that a 5th park is going to attract new guest to a sufficient degree that it would make all the extra overhead, infrastructure, and building costs worth it, as opposed to expanding the existing parks, and not needing to spend so much on new infrastructure

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

And all of that means absolutely nothing as to the idea of a 5th park. What evidence is there to think that a 5th park is going to attract new guest to a sufficient degree that it would make all the extra overhead, infrastructure, and building costs worth it, as opposed to expanding the existing parks, and not needing to spend so much on new infrastructure

They’ve had all the evidence to the contrary - that it’s NOT worth it - since 1999

Which is why everytime someone starts this “new park” discussion…Lucy will pull the football away

 

[lewisc]

They’ve had all the evidence to the contrary - that it’s NOT worth it - since 1999

Which is why everytime someone starts this “new park” discussion…Lucy will pull the football away

Lucy walks away and we discovere there isn't even a football to pull away.

 

[Miru]

And even if modern Disney made a new 5th gate, it would be a “Florida Adventure” at best and more likely an “IP Portals” type park, anyway. (Worst case scenario is something like Six Flags-Cedar Fair but with Disney IP slapped on, which is at least possible at this point) Nothing like DisneySea, the music park, or such.

 

[JMcMahonEsq]

And even if modern Disney made a new 5th gate, it would be a “Florida Adventure” at best and more likely an “IP Portals” type park, anyway. (Worst case scenario is something like Six Flags-Cedar Fair but with Disney IP slapped on, which is at least possible at this point) Nothing like DisneySea, the music park, or such.

Something like Florida adventure or Disney Six flags might be one of the only scenarios where I could see there be an arguement for a 5th gate. That type of park with larger thrill rides would arguably attract an entirely NEW market segment. That type of park would arguably not canabalize current attendance to make it financially attractive. It’s still probably not worth it, but that’s the closest case I think you can make for a 5th gate

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Something like Florida adventure or Disney Six flags might be one of the only scenarios where I could see there be an arguement for a 5th gate. That type of park with larger thrill rides would arguably attract an entirely NEW market segment. That type of park would arguably not canabalize current attendance to make it financially attractive. It’s still probably not worth it, but that’s the closest case I think you can make for a 5th gate

Regional parks work mostly because they don’t encounter a minimum $10,000 and a weeks vacation. That won’t be the case in Orlando.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Let's define capacity.... back 10 years ago, the Christmas Party kept attendance reduced. Last party I went to I would say they don't do that anymore.

Nowadays non-maximum capacity means, moving guest out to the front of the MK via service areas, and packing main street for fireworks. We literally walked past dumpsters, pickup trucks behind the Emporium.

So to me the word capacity doesn't hold any value

That still isn’t capacity

They upsell things under a block pricing model and people pay $175 for it.

That doesn’t indicate a capacity issue…at all. It’s a different phenomena…

They also have reduced in park means to move people around effectively through a variety of costs cutting moves to “increase the mob” notably a near standard paywall for rides. Which is just ridiculous if you think about it.

But skipping all that…and I assure you it’s correct…you haven’t covered how Disney makes money on a 5th park? The dynamics there are simple.

 

[JMcMahonEsq]

Regional parks work mostly because they don’t encounter a minimum $10,000 and a weeks vacation. That won’t be the case in Orlando.

True but regional parks also operate on their own, without the draw of 4 other parks. I still don’t think the 5th gate math works, but building a 5th park, offering something that the other 4 don’t, and catering to an older more intense ride crowd such that you might attract new customers, as opposed to just further spreading out your existing customer base is probably the best argument for it

 

[KaliSplash]

No. No. No.

Texas would be the only workable location, but no.

 

[Miru]

No. No. No.

Texas would be the only workable location, but no.

IMO we need more Aulani-type standalone resorts as opposed to full sets with parks and hotels; I did have an idea for an indoor Disney theme park at some point though, the “castle” could serve as the resort’s full enclosure.

 

[Haymarket]

IMO we need more Aulani-type standalone resorts as opposed to full sets with parks and hotels; I did have an idea for an indoor Disney theme park at some point though, the “castle” could serve as the resort’s full enclosure.

Perhaps a park with walls of DVC properties functioning as something similar to berms would do well. Like the Hotel Miracosta, the Disneyland Hotel in Paris, or Epic Universe's Helios Grand Hotel—hotels bordering the parks, but as DVCs.

Just a wall of them around most of the park, in segments compatible with the theming of each area.

It could help fund a new park.

 

[Beacon Joe]

It was Virginia…

And the answer is “no”

Sorry for taking this a little off topic, but that whole situation still sort of amuses me in a dark way. At the time, it seemed like everybody was up in arms and in a large part due to concern over how the park's presence would impact I-66 and ruin rural landscapes, creating sprawl and congestion in Fauquier and Loudon Counties, with Haymarket (which was a very small, very wealthy town back then) residents particularly upset... Then you take a look at those areas now and it's a soul-crushing suburban landscape indistinguishable from the rest of the region. Most of the original site's acreage is wall to wall pavement and tract homes, minus the chunk they donated to the BSA as a tax write-off and a subtle poke in the eye to certain local land developers who promoted a lot of the protests. And I-66? Oof.

IMO we need more Aulani-type standalone resorts as opposed to full sets with parks and hotels; I did have an idea for an indoor Disney theme park at some point though, the “castle” could serve as the resort’s full enclosure.

They did purchase a large chunk of land >20 years ago on the SE side of the National Harbor, MD, development. IIRC, it was to be a large destination resort akin to Aulani. But they backed out of that plan relatively quickly. I don't remember why.