Theme parks' emergency response questioned

speck76

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Theme parks' emergency response questioned
By Henry Pierson Curtis and Jerry W. Jackson | Sentinel Staff Writers
Posted July 2, 2005


Walt Disney World and Central Florida's other major theme parks say they are prepared for medical emergencies, with hundreds of paramedics and thousands of other workers trained in cardiopulmonary resuscitation and the use of automated heart defibrillators.

But as the recent death of a 4-year-old boy who rode on Epcot's Mission: Space ride illustrates, reality can overwhelm training and preparation in the critical first minutes after an emergency.

It took more than two minutes and the prompting of a 911 dispatcher before two Disney workers, identified in sheriff's records as CPR certified, put their training into action when Daudi Bamuwamye collapsed on the thrill ride, according to a tape of the 911 call.

National training standards call for CPR-certified rescuers to check an unresponsive person for signs of life and immediately begin CPR if a victim isn't breathing.

No one has said swifter action would have saved the boy, and Disney officials said they "believe the response to the incident was handled appropriately."

But the tragedy has focused attention on what theme parks have done to increase their safety in recent years. It also has revived concern on some fronts over why Disney and other large parks are exempt from state ride inspections and do not face government standards for the presence of rescue workers.

"Perhaps this is something we could look at," said state Rep. Sheri McInvale, D-Orlando, who is vice chair of the House tourism committee and a former Disney employee. While she said she is confident that "safety is a top priority for Disney," she and others don't know exactly what the parks do to prepare for emergencies.

Safety awareness

Industry experts say Disney's use of CPR-certified workers and paramedics stationed just minutes away reflects a heightened attention to safety and training at amusement parks nationwide.

"Most of the parks have increased their safety awareness and redoubled efforts in training and staffing in recent years," said James O. Barber, a consultant who spent 30 years as a ride safety inspector in New York.

Disney's theme parks underwent a massive, ongoing safety campaign three years ago.

Analysts say the June 2002 campaign countered negative publicity over the company's handling of a fatal accident in 1998 at Disneyland in California and another serious accident there in 2000.

A Disney World representative said the Orlando resort has more than 500 automated external defibrillators "located strategically throughout Walt Disney World Resort," and more than 3,000 current Disney employees are trained by the company as "designated responders" in the use of heart defibrillators and CPR.

Disney World is now designated as an American Heart Association corporate training center to teach CPR and how to use automatic defibrillators, Disney spokeswoman Kim Prunty said.

Safety experts said Florida's big parks are concerned about safety because of the impact an accident can have on the company's financial bottom line -- from negative publicity about accidents to lawsuits.

"The major amusement parks [in Florida] are doing their best every single day, I can say that," said John Dodson, a state ride inspector in Ohio, and president of the National Association of Amusement Ride Safety Officials.

Universal Orlando's two parks, for example, have 91automated external defibrillators on site, many located within easy reach of park guests, company spokesman Tom Schroder said. Some are near the Spider-Man attraction, the Beetlejuice show, the Jaws attraction and in many restaurants.

Universal Studios, Islands of Adventure and CityWalk entertainment district are served by 130 state certified paramedics and registered nurses, Schroder said, as the most highly trained on-site emergency responders.

"All our security officers, all our boat and bus operators are CPR certified," he said, and must be as part of their employment.

"In addition to that more than half our ride supervisors are CPR certified," voluntarily, along with "hundreds of other park employees -- from ride operators to actors -- are certified. This means there is always someone close by who is trained in CPR."

The company tracks the certification and automatically notifies workers when renewal is required.

SeaWorld also requires all of its security staff and supervisory personnel to be CPR certified, said Van Rice, vice president of park operations and assistant general manager.

"For all of our rides and attraction areas, we make sure we have at least several people CPR certified at all times the parks are open," Rice said. The Discovery Cove swimming attraction has more than 50 lifeguards, also CPR certified.

At least four people were resuscitated with automated defibrillators at SeaWorld in the past five years, Rice said, and the easy-to-use devices are routinely applied to people who pass out.

"It's automatic. When you apply it and monitor the heart rate, it determines if the person is required to be shocked," Rice said.

Training vs. real emergency

But training does not guarantee how people will react when an emergency occurs, according to health-care experts.

"When we teach CPR to bystanders, we tell them to initiate CPR as soon as they recognize that there is an emergency and somebody needs help," said Barbara Caracci of the National Safety Council. "Until you're in a situation, you don't how you're going to respond."

Sometimes people freeze or forget, she said

"People take this training in good faith or because their employer says you're going to take it and they really want to help," Caracci said. "But who knows how you're going to respond in an emergency?"

Disney workers thought Daudi Bamuwamye had fainted on Mission: Space when his mother carried the 4-year-old's limp body off the thrill ride on June 13, according to a recording of the 911 call for medical help.

"It's a young boy. He passed out, apparently in the capsule at Mission: Space," a ride supervisor told the 911 dispatcher.

The Disney workers, Alejandro Barroso, 20, and Scott Clark, 33, started CPR after being instructed to begin by an unidentified 911 dispatcher who took the telephone call. Barroso and Clark declined to comment through their families when contacted by the Orlando Sentinel.

Paramedics from the Reedy Creek Fire Department, Disney's municipal entity, arrived 41/2 minutes after the 3:38 p.m. call for help, records show.

Daudi was pronounced dead shortly before 5 p.m. at Celebration Hospital. Disney security reported his death to the Sheriff's Office at 5:43 p.m., records show.

The cause of the youngster's death has not been determined. The determination awaits the results of autopsy tests that may not be ready until September, according to the Orange-Osceola Medical Examiner's Office.

Henry Pierson Curtis can be reached at 407-420-5257 or hcurtis@orlandosentinel.com.Jerry W. Jackson can be reached at 407-420-5721 or jwjackson@orlandosentinel.com. Willoughby Mariano of the Sentinel staff contributed to this report.
 

WDWScottieBoy

Well-Known Member
Not a bad article, but nothing really new. One thing I was taught during my CPR classes, is to call 911 first and then start CPR. Also, a lot of people fear having to give CPR, even though they aer certified, because of lawsuits these days. If you do one thing wrong during CPR, you could be sued for it. And we all know how sue-happy the world is these days.

I personally let my CPR license expire, although I hope to get certified again. There just always lies that fear of getting sued for trying to save a life.

Just my $.02 on it.
 

wedway71

Well-Known Member
WDWScottieBoy said:
Not a bad article, but nothing really new. One thing I was taught during my CPR classes, is to call 911 first and then start CPR. Also, a lot of people fear having to give CPR, even though they aer certified, because of lawsuits these days. If you do one thing wrong during CPR, you could be sued for it. And we all know how sue-happy the world is these days.

I personally let my CPR license expire, although I hope to get certified again. There just always lies that fear of getting sued for trying to save a life.

Just my $.02 on it.

i may be wrong(and alot of times i am) but isnt there a law that states that if you attempt to do cpr on someone they can not sue you if something happens?-i could have sworn when i was getting certified way back in high school that was a big question was about people sueing you if something happens.ive only done cpr once to a girl who drowned at a local pool -luckily it was the only time i had to in my life.
 

tigsmom

Well-Known Member
wedway71 said:
i may be wrong(and alot of times i am) but isnt there a law that states that if you attempt to do cpr on someone they can not sue you if something happens?-i could have sworn when i was getting certified way back in high school that was a big question was about people sueing you if something happens.ive only done cpr once to a girl who drowned at a local pool -luckily it was the only time i had to in my life.

Most states have some sort of Good Samaritan Laws to protect you. As long as you do the best you can within your scope of knowledge, you are protected. You do not need to have a current certification in place, nobody has ever asked to see my card before I've done CPR. Maybe its just my training, but if you have the knowledge to help somebody and you make no attempt you are wrong (IMHO).
If more than one person is present then one person calls 911 and the other makes the assessment of the victim & begins rescue efforts- you do not need permission from the 911 operator, but they will walk you thru the procedures if you need them. While I realize 2 minutes seems like a long time it really isn't. And a 4 1/2 minute response from the paramedics was a very decent response (and below the national average). They are not stationed within the park. In our local FD we try to have somebody at the scene within 3 minutes (but that is not a rescue truck with all the medical equipment) to assess and start rescue.

As was stated in the article even with detailed training you never know how somebody will react until they are put to the test. The more you use that knowledge the easier it becomes. Some people react better in a crisis situation than others.
 

wdwmagic

Administrator
Moderator
Premium Member
Do these writers think that if someone enters a Disney park they are going to be in some kind of protective forcefield, and nothing can ever be allowed to happen to a guest. They need to live in reality, in many cases there is nothing that can be done, whether at Disney or not.

I have listened to the tape and I dont agree with this writers interpretation. The CM on the phone was not doing CPR, but there were other CMs on scene who were with the guest doing so.

I think the response of having full paramedics on site within 3 minutes is pretty exceptional. It's certainly better than one could hope for if you were at home. Seems to me the press are are still trying to chip at Disney (as usual).

I would also add that all of these articles seem to paint the picture that CPR would always make a difference. I am not medical expert, but I do know that in many cases CPR is totally ineffective. This has recently been a big issue here in the UK, with the portrail of CPR on TV shows giving people the impression that CPR can save anyone and is always successful
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4633905.stm
 
Their response time was excellent, considering how few cast members are trained in CPR to have someone working on the boy withing two minutes is outstanding.

And a 4 1/2 minute response from the paramedics was a very decent response (and below the national average). They are not stationed within the park.

Actually each WDW themepark and Downtown Disney have a quick response team of medics and emts that would respond.
 

speck76

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
wdwmagic said:
Do these writers think that if someone enters a Disney park they are going to be in some kind of protective forcefield, and nothing can ever be allowed to happen to a guest. They need to live in reality, in many cases there is nothing that can be done, whether at Disney or not.

Steve.....this IS America......reality is not a concept the general public is fond of....neither is personal responsibility.....
 

MagliteL13

Active Member
OnWithTheShow said:
Their response time was excellent, considering how few cast members are trained in CPR to have someone working on the boy withing two minutes is outstanding.



Actually each WDW themepark and Downtown Disney have a quick response team of medics and emts that would respond.

Last November, I was helping a guy who was having a heart attack out front of Pecos (on the corner, by splash). I'll be honest and say that I am CPR certified, but it took me a second to sort things out as I'm not used to dealing with the situation on a daily basis. I radioed to my leaders who called an Alpha Unit while I stayed with the guy. Alpha Unit showed up through the plan B exit by splash (where the parade steps on and off) in about 2 minutes after I radioed. I guess what I'm saying is there is that initial hesitation where you think "Okay, what do I do?" even if you're trained.
 

Craig & Lisa

Active Member
I recently passed the Red Cross training for CPR and AED machine, the one thing that was told to us, unless your a regular EMT, when push comes to shove the first time your training is called upon, you are as scared as everyone around you. You will forget things that you should do, small that they are but you will, you cannot knock the people that are responding to the emergency, if they never had to use their traing before. For all I know I may recertifiy 5 times over and never have to use what I've learned, please don't take this the wrong way but, I hope I never have to use it. I hope you can understand this. And, if I ever have to do CPR I hope that I can save a life. As it is now I do that every 3 months when I donate blood, and because I'm O+ they really hound me when it's time, I think I'm up over 7 gals. now. Basically you can have the top trained people anywhere, but if they've never used what they learned, don't knock them. Perhaps they should have regular EMT's in charge but how often have their talents been called upon.
 

tigsmom

Well-Known Member
OnWithTheShow said:
Their response time was excellent, considering how few cast members are trained in CPR to have someone working on the boy withing two minutes is outstanding.



Actually each WDW themepark and Downtown Disney have a quick response team of medics and emts that would respond.

Had no idea, thanks! :wave:
 

no2apprentice

Well-Known Member
"No one has said swifter action would have saved the boy, "

This part says it all. Once again, the Sentinel is trying to sensationalize a tragic circumstance just to sell papers. A sad comment on their journalistic standards.
 

tigsmom

Well-Known Member
no2apprentice said:
"No one has said swifter action would have saved the boy, "

This part says it all. Once again, the Sentinel is trying to sensationalize a tragic circumstance just to sell papers. A sad comment on their journalistic standards.

I have to agree. Even if life saving measures were taken within seconds, there is no guarantee the boy would have survived.
 

goofy for fire

New Member
A Paramedic/Firefighter Point of View

Hi there folks,

Let me first say that these kind of articles really get me going because of the position I'm in. Everyone calls us heroes but in cases like these no reporter knows how we really feel afterwards. We're the hero if we save 'em and the scapegoat if we don't. This is not "ER" or "Emergency" where everyone comes back to life after the first shock. What most people don't realize is that fewer than 10% of cardiac arrest victims are actually saved regardless of how long it takes us to get there. Do you think for one moment that we like working on a family member of someone only to have them die? No and this is even more so with children!!!! Any paramedic, firefighter, or police officer will tell you that the calls we dread the most are ones that involve children. We will do EVERYTHING in our power to save a child because most of us see our own child in that victim's face. In fact, many departments will mandate a Critical Incident Stress Debriefing for those members that have just worked on a child. These CM's did the best that they could and should feel proud of the training that they have and the ability to use it. I commend Disney on the lengths they go to. I also commend the Reedy Creek FPD for the sensational response time.

I will tell you that AED's are wonderful tools. IF YOU KNOW HOW TO USE THEM AND DO SO ON A REGULAR BASIS!! I have a part time job in which I work for an MD who is ACLS (Adult Cardiac Life Support) certified, and I will tell you that because he does not regularly use the AED in our office, nor does he regularly use the drugs needed to work a cardiac arrest he has trouble sometimes remembering all the steps and dosages. This is just the nature of the beast and I'm sure there are hundreds, if not thousands, of CM's that would feel uncomfortable using an AED given the amount of times they've actually had to use one.

I know this isn't reality, but it sure would be nice if this family and reporter would just recognize that sometimes, no matter how hard we try, God is going to say, "It's time" and then say thank you to those that tried so hard to help.

Thanks for listening folks,
God Bless you all and Have a Safe and Happy 4th of July.
 

monothingie

Where the hell are we — Paris?
Premium Member
tigsmom said:
Most states have some sort of Good Samaritan Laws to protect you. As long as you do the best you can within your scope of knowledge, you are protected. You do not need to have a current certification in place, nobody has ever asked to see my card before I've done CPR. Maybe its just my training, but if you have the knowledge to help somebody and you make no attempt you are wrong (IMHO)......
....... While I realize 2 minutes seems like a long time it really isn't. And a 4 1/2 minute response from the paramedics was a very decent response (and below the national average). They are not stationed within the park. In our local FD we try to have somebody at the scene within 3 minutes (but that is not a rescue truck with all the medical equipment) to assess and start rescue.

I'm a first responder in Jersey (firefighter) Good Samaritan laws also apply to us provided that we do not respond to the emergency in a reckless manner (IE lack of training or incompetence, etc.)

It should be important to note that with AED's there are multiple types of pads available to use with different people. (goes on the basis of body weight) For example you can not use an adult sized pad on a child who weighs less than 90-100 lbs. (and visa-versa). For someone trained using an AED to do this could breach good Samaritan laws.

Finally, I would wish that everywhere I went a response time for BLS and ALS was under 5 minutes. Where I am from it could take a minute just to tone out and dispatch EMTs and medics. When you consider that Disney is 47 square miles, has a population during the day of hundreds of thousands of people, a response time of under 5 minutes is excellent. One final note, a good chunk of time in the response is often dedicated towards finding the victim. Getting an exact location of the problem can often be the most harrowing part of a response. Picture this as a first responder, the dispatcher radios you to respond to an unresponsive party at the mission space pavilion. Outside? Inside? Where? This is a problem that eats up response time and may have played a role in this incident. For the RCFD to maintain such good response time is commendable.
 

sheryl2007

New Member
Like it has been mentioned already, CPR is not a fail safe, life saving device, I have scene immediate response with full staff and all meds accessible to the docs and the person still dies, sometimes what we can do will never be enough to save some people, some things are out of our control. Most states do have Good Samaritan laws, ie, you can't be sued for trying to help in good faith, this law exists specifically so the bystander WILL help people , without the fear of lawsuits. I have been CPR ceritfied for more than 12 yrs and the only time I have had to use it is in the hospital setting, never as a bystander. I know how to respond, but in an unusual setting who knows how a person will react? God Bless all those who were involved with this incident and hopefully they will be left alone now.
 

tracyandalex

Well-Known Member
as a person who works in the medical field i find it hard to believe that journalisits would not be commending the cms for trying their best to help the boy. i certainly commend the cms for trying their best and even though the cms are certified in cpr, they are not medically trained professionals and in order to save the boy (if that was even possible) the cms would have had to preform well beyond their knowledge and training. so, to sum up - thanks you to call the cms to try to help and *&*^&&* to the media who tries to make them look bad!!
 

CAPTAIN HOOK

Well-Known Member
tigsmom said:
I have to agree. Even if life saving measures were taken within seconds, there is no guarantee the boy would have survived.
Disney + bad press + sensationalisation = lots more newspaper sales. :mad:
 

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