The Super Mario Bros. Movie not doing that great...

[MrPromey]

When it comes to the MCU I don't think D+ has anything to do with declining box office. The real reason is fatigue. There is so much Marvel with characters that aren't interesting and doesn't seem to be building to anything. People aren't interested anymore. The cow has been milked way too much. The whole thing needs to slow down.

Have to agree - I don't think it's D+ as a main driver.

I've continued to see everything post End Game in theaters and the only standouts for me were Black Widow and No Way Home.

Every single other one has felt more like a chore I need to sit through to make sure I still understand what's going on in the "universe" than something I've enjoyed and would have any desire to sit through again.

... and I think Black Widow was more of just it being one last time with that character and them fundamentally not screwing it up, than anything else.

Without going into too much detail (and believe me, I could), it all feels like required preamble to what I keep hoping will be better but if I had to watch nearly 20 movies full of what felt like rushed world building and character development to get to Infinity War and End Game the first time around, I'd have bailed on the franchise after the first two or three of them.

A part of me hopes that Eternals doing so bad means they'll just cut that whole thread loose and I won't need to sit through any of that ever again but a part of me would also be angry I sat through that one to not have it lead to anything, either.

I'm just afraid it would only lead to... more of that.

I don't think that's how going to a movie should feel but it's similar to how I've felt about almost everything they've put into theaters, post End Game.

For what it's worth, I feel differently about the shows. They haven't all been great but most have at least been more interesting to me.

 

[Phroobar]

If Quantumania was a chore, then The Marvels will be torcher. It will only be fun if they spend the entire movie making fun of Captain Marvel.

 

[celluloid]

Bold prediction. I don't think we see Marvel films (obviously love for Spidey and such) of this phase break 400 million domestically very often if at all. I think those days are done.

 

[Phroobar]

Bold prediction. I don't think we see Marvel films (obviously love for Spidey and such) of this phase break 400 million domestically very often if at all. I think those days are done.

Yup, I serious doubt The Marvels will break 400 million domestically. It will lose money like the Eternals did. I'm surprised it isn't direct to Disney+ since that is what the trailer feels like.

 

[Phroobar]

Getting back on topic. What if there were a Nintendo Cinematic Universe? I'd love to see an Metroid or Zelda movie.

 

[MrPromey]

If Quantumania was a chore, then The Marvels will be torcher. It will only be fun if they spend the entire movie making fun of Captain Marvel.

I didn't really like the first Capt. Marvel. It felt way too late in the course of the MCU to be introducing a character like that who had allegedly been there all along but who Fury didn't call upon day-one of the invasion of New York in Avengers who was suddenly being brought up because they needed a superman figure for the big finale coming up.

Funny enough, I saw all this stuff about people bashing the trailer for The Marvels and when I watched it I thought "this actually looks fun to me" but then I remembered, I thought the same thing about the Quantumania trailer. :/

 

[MrPromey]

You know, it just dawned on me - I wonder if any of this could at all be related to Chapek's restructuring with the DMED.*

It feels like all of these newer things coming out of Disney I've been underwhelmed by between animation and live action stuff would had to have at least been in development prior to that change but maybe that still had an impact on the final products?

It's something I know creative executives in the company were very upset about and this was after Lasater's departure so, at least for animation, there really was no strong voice on the creative side to stand up to Kareem Daniel who had been bizarrely promoted by Chapek from within consumer products to essentially, the tzar of their media empire.

I know it's fun to blame Chapek** for everything and it's probably wishful thinking but maybe, possibly, they're already working to correct things... if that was part of the problem.


*Disney Media and Entertainment Distribution

** I hear the kickstarter campaign for the unaffiliated board game #blameChapek has been doing gangbusters in the final week - should'a gotten in on the earlybird pricing when I had the chance.

 

[Ghost93]

Bold prediction. I don't think we see Marvel films (obviously love for Spidey and such) of this phase break 400 million domestically very often if at all. I think those days are done.

I think you are right. The only one that **might** is the upcoming Deadpool/Wolverine Crossover movie.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

It's something I know creative executives in the company were very upset about and this was after Lasater's departure so, at least for animation, there really was no strong voice on the creative side to stand up to Kareem Daniel who had been bizarrely promoted by Chapek from within consumer products to essentially, the tzar of their media empire.

It's kind of like this, but in reverse.

It's actually the creatives who needed to be stood up to. With the creation of DMED, the creatives were no longer responsible for the financial performance of their products. So they didn't actually have to make things that would be profitable, they just got to make whatever they want.

Kareem didn't care, because he wasn't evaluated on profitability either. All he cared about was subscriber growth on D+.

 

[MrPromey]

It's kind of like this, but in reverse.

It's actually the creatives who needed to be stood up to. With the creation of DMED, the creatives were no longer responsible for the financial performance of their products. So they didn't actually have to make things that would be profitable, they just got to make whatever they want.

Kareem didn't care, because he wasn't evaluated on profitability either. All he cared about was subscriber growth on D+.

But if they were given so much freedom by this, why were there so many speaking poorly of it off the record and others leaving the company over it?

 

[CaptainAmerica]

But if they were given so much freedom by this, why were there so many speaking poorly of it off the record and others leaving the company over it?

They had the freedom to create but they were mad that they had no input over distribution. The biggest complaint was about the movies that went direct to streaming and never got a theatrical release.

 

[MrPromey]

Getting back on topic. What if there were a Nintendo Cinematic Universe? I'd love to see an Metroid or Zelda movie.

While I think a Zelda movie could be great and that Metroid and StarFox both probably have better bones for a story that could be made into a movie than Mario*, I have no desire to see Nintendo/Illumination/Universal try to tie them all into a unified grand story or Universe.

Bringing everyone together for a Smash Bros. movie sounds fun but then I remember Street Fighter and various attempts at Mortal Combat and a weird chill runs up my spine like someone I know has just passed.

*Easier to adapt to a movie structure than Mario probably was but also smaller built-in audiences... Zelda probably hits a sweet spot, there.

 

[Ghost93]

While I think a Zelda movie could be great and that Metroid and StarFox both probably have better bones for a story that could be made into a movie than Mario*, I have no desire to see Nintendo/Illumination/Universal try to tie them all into a unified grand story or Universe.

Bringing everyone together for a Smash Bros. movie sounds fun but then I remember Street Fighter and various attempts at Mortal Combat and a weird chill runs up my spine like someone I know has just passed.

*Easier to adapt to a movie structure than Mario probably was but also smaller built-in audiences... Zelda probably hits a sweet spot, there.

I feel like Studio Ghibli would be more appropriate for a Legend of Zelda adaptation. I don't think Illumination will strike the right tone for it.

 

[Disney Irish]

Bold prediction. I don't think we see Marvel films (obviously love for Spidey and such) of this phase break 400 million domestically very often if at all. I think those days are done.

Blade has real potential, so does Thunderbolts and CA:NWO. And GotG:Vol3 may end up actually doing better than the other two, they were both in the 300s with Vol2 hitting $388M domestic, just based on the fans of those characters alone. The Marvels really seems like the real unknown right now.

So I wouldn't count out Phase 5 domestically just yet, check back in early 2024 to see where its at.

 

[Ghost93]

Blade has real potential, so does Thunderbolts and CA:NWO. And GotG:Vol3 may end up actually doing better than the other two, they were both in the 300s with Vol2 hitting $388M domestic, just based on the fans of those characters alone. The Marvels really seems like the real unknown right now.

So I wouldn't count out Phase 5 domestically just yet, check back in early 2024 to see where its at.

Blade could be a great movie, but its darker tone and vampire theme might make it less appropriate for younger audiences.

 

[Disney Irish]

Blade could be a great movie, but its darker tone and vampire theme might make it less appropriate for younger audiences.

Yes, its likely to have a similar audience to Deadpool and Logan but with the draw of the MCU. So has a real potential to do well at the BO.

 

[MrPromey]

I feel like Studio Ghibli would be more appropriate for a Legend of Zelda adaptation. I don't think Illumination will strike the right tone for it.

I believe this illustrates the chasm between you and most of the other people in this discussion about Disney movies.

What you're talking about is all well and fine if it's anime targeted for a Japanese audience and then a limited release in the US largely consisting of adults where only 800-1,000 or so screens get it and it sells more tickets for the subtitle version than the dubbed.

It sounds like a disastrous choice if Universal is planning to build a new addition in Orlando/Hollywood around it and if they and Nintendo would like to see it make a billion dollars and push it as a future franchise, though.

Just a reminder, Mario has already made nearly three quarters of a billion dollars in less than three weeks and still has over a week until it opens in Japan.

I agree it would need to fall more on the serious adventure and less on the comedy/absurd adventure side of things than Illumination is known for but I think that could be managed with the right director/producer combo.

I also understand you wanting it to be made as art but there are a ton of economic reasons, starting with Nintendo and ending with Walmart for why that would probably never happen.

Remember, even Disney had the US distribution rights to Ghibli work at one time and they (foolishly IMHO) let that slip as a financial choice, Illustrated by the fact that they continue to maintain them for home viewing in Japan.

 

[Ghost93]

I believe this illustrates the chasm between you and most of the other people in this discussion about Disney movies.

What you're talking about is all well and fine if it's anime targeted for a Japanese audience and then a limited release in the US largely consisting of adults where only 1,000 or so screens get it and it sells more tickets for the subtitle version than the dubbed.

It sounds like a disastrous choice if Universal is planning to build a new addition in Orlando/Hollywood around it and if they and Nintendo would like to see it make a billion dollars and push it as a future franchise, though.

Just a reminder, Mario has already made nearly three quarters of a billion dollars in less than three weeks and still has over a week until iy opens in Japan.

I agree it would need to fall more on the serious adventure and less on the comedy/absurd adventure side of things than Illumination is known for but I think that could be managed with the right director/producer combo.

I also understand you wanting it to be made as art but there are a ton of economic reasons, starting with Nintendo and ending at Walmart for why that would probably never happen.

Remember, even Disney had the US distribution rights to Ghibli work at one time and they (foolishly IMHO) let that slip as a financial choice.

Oh I was 100% talking about it from an artistic standpoint, not a financial one. I just feel the IP is more in the spirit of what Studio Ghibli does than what Illumination does.

But if they were aiming for more broad appeal in the United States, I'd have much more faith that Dreamworks could do The Legend of Zelda justice than Illumination. The How to Train Your Dragon movies, I think, have the right balance for being serious enough to serve the story without alienating young children.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

Bold emphasis mine, I suspect Universal will be pushing Nintendo in their film slate and parks even more now:

"llumination/Universal’s The Super Mario Bros Movie stayed on course with its third weekend estimate notching an $58.2M, which is the best third weekend for an animated movie ever, beating the $46.4M earned by Pixar/Disney’s The Incredibles 2 during June 29-July 1, 2018 which was a pre-Independence Day weekend.

As we told you, the Nintendo pic crossed the $400 million mark stateside yesterday in its 18th day, the second-fastest animated pic to that point after The Incredibles 2, which hit the four-century mark in 15 days. By EOD Super Mario Bros Movie will be the third highest-grossing Universal title of all time at the domestic box office with $434.3M, behind 2015’s Jurassic World ($653.4M) and the lifetime total of 1982’s E.T. The Extraterrestrial ($437.1M)."

‘Super Mario Bros’ & ‘Evil Dead Rise’ Weekend Box Office Higher As CinemaCon Kicks Off – Monday AM Update

Box Office: 'The Super Mario Bros' Movie' is topping $400M in the U.S. and will win its third straight weekend as 'Evil Dead Rise' exhumes $20M in its debut.

deadline.com

The movie is sitting at $871 million worldwide now. Could hit $1 billion by next Sunday.

 

[MrPromey]

Blade has real potential, so does Thunderbolts and CA:NWO. And GotG:Vol3 may end up actually doing better than the other two, they were both in the 300s with Vol2 hitting $388M domestic, just based on the fans of those characters alone. The Marvels really seems like the real unknown right now.

So I wouldn't count out Phase 5 domestically just yet, check back in early 2024 to see where its at.

Blade could be a great movie, but its darker tone and vampire theme might make it less appropriate for younger audiences.

Early reviews for G3 have been enthusiastically positive.

Good sign for that one.

Unfortunate sign for Disney and Marvel, of course, since this is the last outing for these characters in this form and for the director credited for the magic of these movies.

Still, I'm excited for this one.

Sounds like it isn't going to be a repeat of AM3.