SAV
Well-Known Member
Desi Ponderosa video:
http://www.cbs.com/shows/survivor/v...or-heroes-vs-healers-vs-hustlers-ponderosa-1/
http://www.cbs.com/shows/survivor/v...or-heroes-vs-healers-vs-hustlers-ponderosa-1/
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Survivor: Heroes vs Healers vs Hustlers
- Thread starter RMichael21
- Start date
sunsetblvd26
Well-Known Member
Wendy Pleakley
Well-Known Member
At the end of the day, the slogan doesn't matter. You win Survivor by making it to the end and convincing a majority of the jury to vote for you.
Russell is an example of someone who outplayed everyone, from a very disadvantageous position, and making it to the final was legendary game play.
But what can you do? This isn't a legal jury where they're expected to make a decision based on rules and evidence. The game is what it is, and Russell deserved to lose because he didn't play the social game well.
I really liked the open format. The problem with the individual questions is that jury members direct questions to specific people, leaving others out. Gives a feeling that minds are largely made up. At the very least I'd like a mix of the two formats. Perhaps a rule that each jury member gets to ask one question, but each finalist must be allowed to answer.
surfsupdon
Well-Known Member
In the original vote, all Desi had to do was vote for Joe instead of Lauren. She should have known he would be getting a majority of votes. Sometimes, to save yourself, you need to sacrifice your tribemate/alliance. That always makes for a good game move too, for when you make it to the end.
The reward challenge was great. And the reward. Very well done by producers!!
35 seasons in and Survivor is still my favorite show. And the ONLY show I watch on vacation in Disney
The reward challenge was great. And the reward. Very well done by producers!!
35 seasons in and Survivor is still my favorite show. And the ONLY show I watch on vacation in Disney
sunsetblvd26
Well-Known Member
I think the best thing about this season is the cast. Now that we’ve lost Desi, the only person who isn’t really interesting and hasn’t delivered much is JP. Other than that this is a pretty well rounded and developed group of people, which is likely what will make the end game really exciting and with lots of rooting interest like Jeff hinted at.
Lauren is definitely my favorite still, she’s the right mix of smart enough to know how to play well yet has her own distinct personality and archetype, not just a gamebot. Dr. Mike, Joe and Ryan I still really enjoy, and I’m starting to warm up to Cole more (even though he probably has no shot at winning).
Overall very fun episode. Looking forward to next week, with Ryan potentially getting himself into trouble with the idol. Messy gameplay is always fun to watch
Lauren is definitely my favorite still, she’s the right mix of smart enough to know how to play well yet has her own distinct personality and archetype, not just a gamebot. Dr. Mike, Joe and Ryan I still really enjoy, and I’m starting to warm up to Cole more (even though he probably has no shot at winning).
Overall very fun episode. Looking forward to next week, with Ryan potentially getting himself into trouble with the idol. Messy gameplay is always fun to watch
PUSH
Well-Known Member
Not sure what Mike's angle was there. He seemed so confident, but logically, they weren't going to give him the majority of the votes. You know Ben is in charge, and you know he dislikes both Cole and Joe. The chances of you going home aren't the best.
As far as Ben goes, he's clearly the kingpin in the alliance of 7, but his power is making him too confident. I think Ashley and Chrissy could flip on him eventually.
Ryan made some mistakes, but I don't think his mistakes were as severe as Devon made them out to be. I didn't picture Devon to be one to turn on Ryan so easily, but I guess he did make Devon feel like they were unbreakable.
This vote, and last vote, I would have done Joe. Physical threats, especially one who annoys people like Cole, aren't going to win over someone with a strong strategic and social game. Cole's game is purely physical. A poor man's Colby. And even if he wins a couple in a row, the likelihood of him winning out is next to none.
I'm going to start up my power rankings again, the highest being the least likely to go home next week, the lowest being most likely.
1. JP
2. Devon
3. Lauren
4. Chrissy
5. Ben
6. Ashley
7. Ryan
8. Mike
9. Joe
Also, when I was typing out these power rankings, it took me a long time to figure out who I was missing. That's because it was JP.
As far as Ben goes, he's clearly the kingpin in the alliance of 7, but his power is making him too confident. I think Ashley and Chrissy could flip on him eventually.
Ryan made some mistakes, but I don't think his mistakes were as severe as Devon made them out to be. I didn't picture Devon to be one to turn on Ryan so easily, but I guess he did make Devon feel like they were unbreakable.
This vote, and last vote, I would have done Joe. Physical threats, especially one who annoys people like Cole, aren't going to win over someone with a strong strategic and social game. Cole's game is purely physical. A poor man's Colby. And even if he wins a couple in a row, the likelihood of him winning out is next to none.
I'm going to start up my power rankings again, the highest being the least likely to go home next week, the lowest being most likely.
1. JP
2. Devon
3. Lauren
4. Chrissy
5. Ben
6. Ashley
7. Ryan
8. Mike
9. Joe
Also, when I was typing out these power rankings, it took me a long time to figure out who I was missing. That's because it was JP.
PUSH
Well-Known Member
Cole talks about the missing vote in his Ponderosa video, so people were thinking about it. Sounds like it just didn't turn into anything. Although someone should have mentioned something to the tribe because it turned out to be a tie vote, which means they should have read every vote.
sunsetblvd26
Well-Known Member
Who?
GenerationX
Well-Known Member
Another new and good immunity challenge. It was clear from the start you did not want to get in a true squatting position. No way, unless you are a Catcher, are you going to hold that position for a long time.
Voting Cole was as dumb as Cole is. You need to vote actual strategy threats out as soon as you can. As a viewer, though, I like still having Dr. Mike and Joe in the game. More opportunities for big moves.
Seriously, Ben, granny style shots?
Voting Cole was as dumb as Cole is. You need to vote actual strategy threats out as soon as you can. As a viewer, though, I like still having Dr. Mike and Joe in the game. More opportunities for big moves.
Seriously, Ben, granny style shots?
PUSH
Well-Known Member
Apparently Andrea got trampled by some horses while home in Wisconsin for Thanksgiving. She said they got spooked by something. She broke her nose, lots of blood everywhere. Her cheeks and nose are swollen, and she needs surgery on her gums. She said hopefully everything visible on her face will just heal. If you want to see what she looks like, you can see on her Instagram story. She has red marks on her nose and above her lips. Luckily she's okay.
krause
Well-Known Member
Ah I didn’t get any alerts that there were any comments on this thread after this weeks episode! I totally agree though with what everyone has said, not much to add.
Mike’s move was super duper weird. Like I see what he was trying for but zero chance it was going to work. I feel like he just got ants in his pants and felt the need to play the idol and thought this would be a “cool” way to do it? He went down a few notches in my book after this weirdo move.
I can’t believe we were down to 10 people and we still don’t ever see JP. I see him as a top 3 though still I think someone is going to bring him along.
I saw that Ponderosa where they kind of mentioned the missing vote - but they still seem to think Jeff just didn’t read it but it was a tie so that doesn’t really make sense anyways. But I guess it was the first time they’ve done this advantage so they wouldn’t even think of it as a possibility? It’s an interesting twist..
I think everyone’s jumping on the Lauren train now
Mike’s move was super duper weird. Like I see what he was trying for but zero chance it was going to work. I feel like he just got ants in his pants and felt the need to play the idol and thought this would be a “cool” way to do it? He went down a few notches in my book after this weirdo move.
I can’t believe we were down to 10 people and we still don’t ever see JP. I see him as a top 3 though still I think someone is going to bring him along.
I saw that Ponderosa where they kind of mentioned the missing vote - but they still seem to think Jeff just didn’t read it but it was a tie so that doesn’t really make sense anyways. But I guess it was the first time they’ve done this advantage so they wouldn’t even think of it as a possibility? It’s an interesting twist..
I think everyone’s jumping on the Lauren train now
PUSH
Well-Known Member
Mike tried to get votes on him, but did it at the wrong time. People rarely change their votes at TC. This season has not been one of "live votes". Mike should have tried to do that at camp if he was going to do it, but he shouldn't have done it either way. If he saved his idol for next week, or even the vote after that, it would have been much more effective.
sunsetblvd26
Well-Known Member
I really like Dr. Mike, but it was such a bad move. I mean, technically I guess he succeeded in what he was going for, but it was pretty much just solving a problem he created himself. The way I understand it- his end goal was to make sure it was he and Joe who stayed around instead of "Coal", so they voted coal, and then he did that whole thing to pull split votes onto himself over Joe and then played the idol. But unless I'm missing something, if they're voting Coal, then would have to go and not need an idol.
Another theory I saw online was that Mike was basically just trying to wipe the slate and send make a showing to send his game to the bottom to make people more willing to want to use them to make a move, but that seems a little too 4D chess for them
And always.... YOU CAN'T DIMMER THE RIMMER!
Another theory I saw online was that Mike was basically just trying to wipe the slate and send make a showing to send his game to the bottom to make people more willing to want to use them to make a move, but that seems a little too 4D chess for them
And always.... YOU CAN'T DIMMER THE RIMMER!
PUSH
Well-Known Member
Here is my ranking of who should win if they got to the end:
1. Ben: He's controlling the entire game, and if he can make it to the end with the target that's been put on him already, that's worthy of a win.
2. Lauren: She's been almost and equal part in the alliance with Ben, and she has been pretty good in challenges. Her social game is pretty strong, too.
3. Chrissy: Strategically, she's very good. Socially, I get the sense that's she's not well liked. Desi said that in her exit interview, too.
4. Joe: He would be a Russell/Tony type in the end. Played a wild and erratic game (I'd say more on the Russell side than Tony), but he makes moves to intentionally make people angry, which is what doomed Russell. Tony more did it to advance himself. I see a blend of Russell and Tony in Joe. Socially, I don't think he has a winning argument.
5. Ryan: He's been hyped a lot, but has he really done anything since he blindsided Ali? Pre-merge moves don't win you the game. He needs something more to get the votes. Right now he has the reputation of a gamer, just because of the way he looks and his super fandom.
6. Devon: Devon has played arguably the best social game out of anyone out there. Everyone is coming to him with secrets. We will see if or what he does with those secrets to advance his game. My guess is he's a better strategic player than what we'll see this season.
7. Mike: He's been on the bottom the whole game, but if he gets close to the end, people like him, which will cause others to vote him off, even if he hasn't done much to affect the game. He has strategic potential, but you can't do a lot with that if you don't have the numbers. So far he's reminding me of Bret from Millennials vs Gen X: very likable, but hasn't made many moves.
8. Ashley: She was my winner pick, and I regret it. She's been a dud, and could be taken to the end as a goat. She's comfortable in the majority, and won't rock the boat much until someone takes her out first.
9. JP: Physical competitors don't win based solely on challenge ability. Look at any other season in Survivor history: Colby, Ozzy, Ken, Brad. The more strategic and social threat has won in each of those seasons. JP has done nothing in this game other than perform well at challenges.
Looking ahead to the final TC... Jeff has said it will be a difficult choice, and it's one to remember. It might be because there are three candidates with solid arguments. I can see this cast voting out the lesser threats (because they haven't made the best strategic votes with Desi and Cole), leaving some combination of Ben, Lauren, Chrissy, Joe, Ryan or Devon in the final TC. I think there is somewhat of an argument for all of those players. Devon might be a stretch, but he could take the Michele Fitzgerald approach. Ryan I would struggle voting for at this point, too. He's done a lot of talking, but not many actions since pre-merge.
1. Ben: He's controlling the entire game, and if he can make it to the end with the target that's been put on him already, that's worthy of a win.
2. Lauren: She's been almost and equal part in the alliance with Ben, and she has been pretty good in challenges. Her social game is pretty strong, too.
3. Chrissy: Strategically, she's very good. Socially, I get the sense that's she's not well liked. Desi said that in her exit interview, too.
4. Joe: He would be a Russell/Tony type in the end. Played a wild and erratic game (I'd say more on the Russell side than Tony), but he makes moves to intentionally make people angry, which is what doomed Russell. Tony more did it to advance himself. I see a blend of Russell and Tony in Joe. Socially, I don't think he has a winning argument.
5. Ryan: He's been hyped a lot, but has he really done anything since he blindsided Ali? Pre-merge moves don't win you the game. He needs something more to get the votes. Right now he has the reputation of a gamer, just because of the way he looks and his super fandom.
6. Devon: Devon has played arguably the best social game out of anyone out there. Everyone is coming to him with secrets. We will see if or what he does with those secrets to advance his game. My guess is he's a better strategic player than what we'll see this season.
7. Mike: He's been on the bottom the whole game, but if he gets close to the end, people like him, which will cause others to vote him off, even if he hasn't done much to affect the game. He has strategic potential, but you can't do a lot with that if you don't have the numbers. So far he's reminding me of Bret from Millennials vs Gen X: very likable, but hasn't made many moves.
8. Ashley: She was my winner pick, and I regret it. She's been a dud, and could be taken to the end as a goat. She's comfortable in the majority, and won't rock the boat much until someone takes her out first.
9. JP: Physical competitors don't win based solely on challenge ability. Look at any other season in Survivor history: Colby, Ozzy, Ken, Brad. The more strategic and social threat has won in each of those seasons. JP has done nothing in this game other than perform well at challenges.
Looking ahead to the final TC... Jeff has said it will be a difficult choice, and it's one to remember. It might be because there are three candidates with solid arguments. I can see this cast voting out the lesser threats (because they haven't made the best strategic votes with Desi and Cole), leaving some combination of Ben, Lauren, Chrissy, Joe, Ryan or Devon in the final TC. I think there is somewhat of an argument for all of those players. Devon might be a stretch, but he could take the Michele Fitzgerald approach. Ryan I would struggle voting for at this point, too. He's done a lot of talking, but not many actions since pre-merge.
krause
Well-Known Member
I really like Dr. Mike, but it was such a bad move. I mean, technically I guess he succeeded in what he was going for, but it was pretty much just solving a problem he created himself. The way I understand it- his end goal was to make sure it was he and Joe who stayed around instead of "Coal", so they voted coal, and then he did that whole thing to pull split votes onto himself over Joe and then played the idol. But unless I'm missing something, if they're voting Coal, then would have to go and not need an idol.
Another theory I saw online was that Mike was basically just trying to wipe the slate and send make a showing to send his game to the bottom to make people more willing to want to use them to make a move, but that seems a little too 4D chess for them
And always.... YOU CAN'T DIMMER THE RIMMER!
Yeah I read that that the goal was to make sure he and joe stay but if they’re going to vote for cole anyways they should be safe.
I also thought of the “wiping the slate” and being able to say “I have nothing I’m not a threat” theory but no one knew about his idol so that doesn’t really seem necessary.
krause
Well-Known Member
I feel like Joe has zero chance of winning if he makes it to the end. Even if he miraculously makes it there I feel like anyone could beat him - which would open the door for a Devon or a JP to win.
Yeah Ryan and Chrissy were kind of down played the last 2 episodes so I guess we’ll see if they pick it up again or if they were just the only people doing anything pre-merge.
SAV
Well-Known Member
krause
Well-Known Member
“Ahhhhh” - me, drinking the refreshing glass of water that is Lauren.
Wow. 2 great episodes. Lauren owned it in the first episode. “The group of 7 is crap”. I love it haha. So refreshing to not have them just take the easy way.
How lucky for Ashley that she was in the right place at the right time to be included in that group of 4.
Don’t really understand the JP vote out over Ryan (although I’m sure they weren’t expectjng Chrissy to win the next immunity so there’s that).
Glad to see some creativity in Devon’s plans. And glad to see them all actually go through with it. Usually these fun plans get pushed aside for the easy vote but this was so much fun to watch!
Not quite sure where it will go from here but I do like this foursome and I’m hoping they don’t turn on Ben too soon.
Wow. 2 great episodes. Lauren owned it in the first episode. “The group of 7 is crap”. I love it haha. So refreshing to not have them just take the easy way.
How lucky for Ashley that she was in the right place at the right time to be included in that group of 4.
Don’t really understand the JP vote out over Ryan (although I’m sure they weren’t expectjng Chrissy to win the next immunity so there’s that).
Glad to see some creativity in Devon’s plans. And glad to see them all actually go through with it. Usually these fun plans get pushed aside for the easy vote but this was so much fun to watch!
Not quite sure where it will go from here but I do like this foursome and I’m hoping they don’t turn on Ben too soon.
krause
Well-Known Member
PUSH
Well-Known Member
Finally was able to watch this week's episode! And what a great one it was!
For the first half... they have been making some questionable calls on votes. Why on earth would you vote JP over Ryan or Chrissy? That just doesn't make sense. They've been so concerned about physical challenge beasts, but let's be honest... if Cole or JP won out, they would never win over a jury.
Second half... a plan perfectly finished with the Joe vote. I half thought they were going to go for Ben, and they did a good job hiding who is was going to be. The first half it was clear they were going to make a move, but they never showed any conversations about who, which is why JP was a surprise.
This has to be one of the best executed moves in Survivor history. I said to myself that this was too complicated to pull off, but this group of 4 did it. I think Lauren is an extremely good player, and so it Ben. Ashley and Devon are not dumb, but they aren't going to be the power house players that Lauren and Ben are. I did like how Devon came up with the secret agent plan for Ben, though.
I really loved the challenges this week (except for the building with the feet... I remember it from Cagayan when Spencer won, but I didn't care for it then, either). They've been pretty innovative with challenge ideas. Recycling old components, but still adding new twists. And actually, a second Cagayan challenge took place here, too, with the balancing on the triangle.
Going forward, I don't think Ben is in Lauren's plans for the end of the game. She's playing almost the Sarah Lacina role from Game Changers, where everybody thinks she's on their side, but she's playing her own game. I think Lauren is better TV, though, and that's why people seem to like her more than Sarah.
My final 3 prediction is Lauren, Chrissy, Ashley. I think Lauren is playing a phenomenal game and is being overlooked by the rest of the cast. Ashley will be taken as more of a "goat", although she's showed glimpses of strategic chops this episode. And I just feel like Chrissy is getting to the end. I don't care for her, and she talked about how her former alliance was being snarky to her, but she's been equally as snarky to them behind closed doors. I just think she's getting a winner's edit. She was viewed as one of the bottom two for the first vote (although she was never really with Katrina as the edit made it seem), she had that special moment with Ryan, now she's on the bottom and wins immunity when she needs to, which they seemed to glorify more than when others have done that. I don't know if she'll win, but I think she could get to the end.
Power rankings for next week:
1. Devon
2. Lauren
3. Ashley
4. Mike
5. Chrissy
6. Ben
7. Ryan
For the first half... they have been making some questionable calls on votes. Why on earth would you vote JP over Ryan or Chrissy? That just doesn't make sense. They've been so concerned about physical challenge beasts, but let's be honest... if Cole or JP won out, they would never win over a jury.
Second half... a plan perfectly finished with the Joe vote. I half thought they were going to go for Ben, and they did a good job hiding who is was going to be. The first half it was clear they were going to make a move, but they never showed any conversations about who, which is why JP was a surprise.
This has to be one of the best executed moves in Survivor history. I said to myself that this was too complicated to pull off, but this group of 4 did it. I think Lauren is an extremely good player, and so it Ben. Ashley and Devon are not dumb, but they aren't going to be the power house players that Lauren and Ben are. I did like how Devon came up with the secret agent plan for Ben, though.
I really loved the challenges this week (except for the building with the feet... I remember it from Cagayan when Spencer won, but I didn't care for it then, either). They've been pretty innovative with challenge ideas. Recycling old components, but still adding new twists. And actually, a second Cagayan challenge took place here, too, with the balancing on the triangle.
Going forward, I don't think Ben is in Lauren's plans for the end of the game. She's playing almost the Sarah Lacina role from Game Changers, where everybody thinks she's on their side, but she's playing her own game. I think Lauren is better TV, though, and that's why people seem to like her more than Sarah.
My final 3 prediction is Lauren, Chrissy, Ashley. I think Lauren is playing a phenomenal game and is being overlooked by the rest of the cast. Ashley will be taken as more of a "goat", although she's showed glimpses of strategic chops this episode. And I just feel like Chrissy is getting to the end. I don't care for her, and she talked about how her former alliance was being snarky to her, but she's been equally as snarky to them behind closed doors. I just think she's getting a winner's edit. She was viewed as one of the bottom two for the first vote (although she was never really with Katrina as the edit made it seem), she had that special moment with Ryan, now she's on the bottom and wins immunity when she needs to, which they seemed to glorify more than when others have done that. I don't know if she'll win, but I think she could get to the end.
Power rankings for next week:
1. Devon
2. Lauren
3. Ashley
4. Mike
5. Chrissy
6. Ben
7. Ryan