Star Wars Land announced for Disney's Hollywood Studios

monothingie

Nakatomi Plaza Christmas Eve 1988. Never Forget.
Premium Member
A very, very wise decision from WDI at this point would be to get rid of this convoluted name (Millenium Falcon: Smuggler's Run), and just rename the ride "Kessel Run". Have the story be that you've been hired to try to beat the original run in the Falcon. Pay whatever it takes to get Harrison Ford to record a video giving you tips and reminiscing about when he and Chewy did it originally. Fix the Engineer and Gunner positions so that they're meaningful and intuitive... enough so that guests aren't pulling their eyes from the screen to the buttons.



This is really the big story inside Disney that many people are missing. They were expecting at least 4 hour waits for MFSR at Disneyland for months, and they were ready for Boarding Pass throughout the summer. But regardless if that didn't materialize, what has them all deeply concerned is that the hotel bookings for the fall at WDW are not good. And what that means is that something is going on with this Star Wars expansion that may be a harbinger for some real course corrections. From Disney's perspective, a property that had seen its moment in the sun dissipate (Avatar) managed to pull in huge crowds for an incredible land that served up the best fast service in any park, gave the best ride in any park, and was incredibly immersive. And here's one of their absolute biggest properties they own not pulling in anybody to DLR after a larger budget was blown and some of the most valuable acreage on the planet was devoted to it. Add to that it looks like that narrative is continuing on to WDW and you've got a major problem that spans a lot of departments within the company. Maybe even moreso than Marvel, Star Wars is not a property that Disney can afford to fail; there is way too much invested in it.

They had more hype and longer lines for Frozen Ever After at Epcot, which was a reskin of Maelstrom and cost them a fraction of a fraction of SWGE. They're concerned and getting more concerned by the day. They're actively cutting seasonal employee hours, they're cutting back Monorail operation, they're cutting back vehicles on rides... they're literally doing everything at this point to save money.



There may be some repercussions within WDI, but they're a bit safe right now coming off of so many excellent executions of prior expansions. WDI is absolutely going to point their fingers at Lucasfilm and say "they pigeonholed us" with the requirement all the eggs be placed in a trilogy that had yet to even debut when plans were made.

What they have right now is the equivalent of Universal dropping 1.5 billion on a Harry Potter land, but instead of basing it on Harry Potter or the similar characters/settings, the park was forced to make a land for Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them. It's still Harry Potter, but you'd be in big trouble basing a land on that part of the fiction.

I know I keep using this visual, but it's important because we're talking about numbers so big people don't understand (and then consequentially they think Disney's just fine if crowds stay the same or are even a little lower):

Disney Parks spent down the equivalent of 14 Mount Everests on the most valuable 14 acres they own. Disney Parks put down 11 Mount Everests on Hollywood Studios, basically locking in the park's ability to expand for the next decade. They built ONE Mount Everest to transform Animal Kingdom and draw crowds to the park, and it was wildly successful. They've invested about 25 Mount Everests, and incurred huge annual operating costs on Galaxy's Edge, and as of now there is no discernible Return on Investment.



Star Wars movies, park expansions, and streaming productions need at least tens of millions of consumers. Conventions and "SW Celebration" need thousands. But conventions and "Celebration" do not keep the franchise afloat... movies do. Toys do. Park expansions do. When you have Hasbro losing 11% of their stock value in the same year as TLJ and Solo because toy sales were far below projections, when you have Solo losing hundreds of millions of dollars, and when you have a billion dollar + expansion thus far not showing any signs of ROI, it's time to admit something serious is going on. You may believe Rise of Skywalker is tracking "very high", but Sony has one crown jewel left in their crown, and it's Jumanji. And they're putting it head-to-head against Rise of Skywalker. They wouldn't be doing that unless they smell blood in the water.

Everything is confusing and requires obtuse explanations until you drop the cognitive dissonance and accept that the narrative you held might not be the most accurate.

Psssst hey Disney I can fix your problem for you. Now don’t tell anyone, but all you have to do is roll back those price increases, stop nickel and diming the guests, and demonstrate that you can offer visitors some value. (Basically do the opposite of what you’re doing now.)
 

AEfx

Well-Known Member
We are talking about different markets. You are talking about the collectable market, which represents a very small subset of the overall merchandise market. I'm talking about the general purpose retail markets which appeals to 99% of fans.

Thy aren’t buying stuff there, either. Mass retail in Star Wars is a joke right now. Walk into a mass retail store and look at the foot or two of shelf space Star Wars is getting right now - less than it was getting before the ST even began. They are constantly shrinking. Because those “mass market” fans aren’t buying.

Aside from that, you apparently have no concept of scale or perspective.

The “99% of fans” who might spend a few bucks a year in aggregate are far less than the huge number who spend THOUSANDS a year. The ones that overran the Studios for years for Star Wars Weekends which were largely merchandise driven events. The collector market is where the money has always been all these years and why Star Wars products have been constantly on the shelves since the mid-90’s resurgence.

The entire point was that it was expected that the mass audiences for these products would return with the new films. It hasn’t. The general public just are not nearly as interested in buying ST product as was anticipated. And the backbone who has spent all the money all these years keeping the franchise afloat in merchandise isn’t caring, either.

Star Wars is in fact one of the many reasons TRU went under. They spent so much money on securing exclusives and devoting shelf space to ST products that just never sold. They banked on it being the 1980’s again in terms of sales and it backfired hugely.

Go find a list of the top Halloween costumes last year. Find any Star Wars characters on it? Nope. Not even Kylo Ren or Rey. In a year with not one but TWO Star Wars films!

The evidence is everywhere you look. The ST characters have just proven to have had little resonance with the general public or the hard core collector.
 

doctornick

Well-Known Member
So to bring this back to the actual land: can someone with knowledge of it talk about what kinds of entertainment is going on at GE in DLR. There was some shows on the second floors when the land opened, but was that only for opening? What kind of roving characters exist? Is there any set M&Gs?

And more specific for this thread, does anyone with inside knowledge have an idea as to what are the plans for DHS' version? In general, it seems like WDW tends to get the shorter end of the entertainment funding compared to similar circumstance at DLR, so it is worrisome for me. But conversely, might they beef up entertainment at DHS in a response to the lower crowds at DL?

At the very least, it sounded like some version of the March of the First Order is going into DHS, right?
 

RobWDW1971

Well-Known Member
So to bring this back to the actual land: can someone with knowledge of it talk about what kinds of entertainment is going on at GE in DLR. There was some shows on the second floors when the land opened, but was that only for opening? What kind of roving characters exist? Is there any set M&Gs?

And more specific for this thread, does anyone with inside knowledge have an idea as to what are the plans for DHS' version? In general, it seems like WDW tends to get the shorter end of the entertainment funding compared to similar circumstance at DLR, so it is worrisome for me. But conversely, might they beef up entertainment at DHS in a response to the lower crowds at DL?

At the very least, it sounded like some version of the March of the First Order is going into DHS, right?

What I've seen so far is a sad little "show" with Kylo and a couple of stormtroopers in front of the shuttle, Rey and Chewie roaming, two stormtroopers roaming like they did in TL, and I once saw R2 in the droid shop, which was the highlight of the entire land.

From the tepid at best response at DL, I would have to assume more atmosphere at DHS. I have seen reports the March they did before at DHS is moving to SWGE which would instantly be more impressive than anything at DL so I hope that is true.
 
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So to bring this back to the actual land: can someone with knowledge of it talk about what kinds of entertainment is going on at GE in DLR. There was some shows on the second floors when the land opened, but was that only for opening? What kind of roving characters exist? Is there any set M&Gs?

And more specific for this thread, does anyone with inside knowledge have an idea as to what are the plans for DHS' version? In general, it seems like WDW tends to get the shorter end of the entertainment funding compared to similar circumstance at DLR, so it is worrisome for me. But conversely, might they beef up entertainment at DHS in a response to the lower crowds at DL?

At the very least, it sounded like some version of the March of the First Order is going into DHS, right?
One of the articles I read in The Orange County Register talked about how interactive everything was with cast members and the app they have. I was at DLR when SWGE was open but didn't have a reservation to get in. People who I talked to who had gone in loved it even though Rise of Resistance wasn't open yet.
 

MickeyMinnieMom

Well-Known Member
Fans hated the Prequels when they were released.
(still do!) ;)

In short, the land was impressively designed, obviously budgeted lavishly, and aesthetically a home run. But the Falcon ride was just sort of Star Tours 3.0, and the entire land felt dead and lifeless and devoid of soul and charm. They deserve to panic a bit.
My personal take having visited is that I agree with the bold above.

We were there on 6/22 (8a-12p reservation window) and 6/24 (1st day boarding groups were used). We had the mad rush getting in on 6/22, and having room to breathe once we were in there (and before the 11am group came in) was fantastic. We were able to really explore all the amazing details in the land. Getting in on 6/24 with boarding groups was much more pleasant, and slightly more people were walking around but still pleasant and able to see details. Oga's was packed the entire time.

I COMPLETELY disagree with the land feeling "devoid of soul and charm"!! It was EVERYWHERE in the details IMO. I think the land is nothing short of spectacular to walk around.

Now, I feel like it could use more ACTIVITY -- we had Rey and Chewie and a few stormtroopers walking around, but I think there should be more of that. Something more to make it feel more alive and bustling.

Falcon was kinda' meh IMO and needs some adjustments. And I don't understand why they chose the story they did.

I think between the AP blackouts, not having ROTR open, and scaring the living daylights out of people wrt what to expect crowd wise kept people away. I will be very interested to see what happens over time and how WDW compares. I expect it to be more crowded due to different demographics, but a lot depends on how they choose to -- or choose not to -- control entry.
 

EPCOTCenterLover

Well-Known Member
Easier fixes: Bring in the classic characters to roam the land ~ including Darth Vader, remove and reskin Hondo and add different AA and story to MF, and put Vader in ROTR instead of that whimpy whiney guy. Crowds will come.
 
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doctornick

Well-Known Member
A very, very wise decision from WDI at this point would be to get rid of this convoluted name (Millenium Falcon: Smuggler's Run), and just rename the ride "Kessel Run". Have the story be that you've been hired to try to beat the original run in the Falcon. Pay whatever it takes to get Harrison Ford to record a video giving you tips and reminiscing about when he and Chewy did it originally. Fix the Engineer and Gunner positions so that they're meaningful and intuitive... enough so that guests aren't pulling their eyes from the screen to the buttons.

I have not been on the ride and have actively been avoiding too much details about it, but the idea of making it specifically about the "Kessel Run" IMHO sounds dumb.

The Kessel Run was a nice little easter egg (not really the right term, but can't think of one better) from the OT where it was just some undefined thing that the Falcon did. It was made even more infamous by using a unit of distance instead of time. That worked well, as referring to the Kessel Run is a nice in joke for the franchise.

But as is often the case when brief backstory gets expanding upon canonically, the Kessel Run has become less interesting by actually showing it. As an amorphous concept, it was kinda cool. What we got in Solo was a reasonable treatment given the constrains of the details known, but... meh. It would have been more interesting left undescribed and nebulous.

Having the ride be about the Kessel Run would be compounding this. Now, it would have to be tied to the canon from Solo which was okay for a movie, but I don't see it as being a good material for a ride. And the whole idea of the Kessel Run and parsecs is that the doing it "better" involves making it a shorter distance. How do you portray that effectively in a ride?

From what I know about the ride, I don't think the mission used is much of a problem. Having Chewie more involved might be good. As would having some more (any?) references to Han in the queue or maybe mentioning him in the pre-show or such. But using the Falcon to steal and smuggle? Um, that's a good thing.

And any issues with the interactivity - to whatever extent they are a "problem" since it seems to be a mixed bag in terms of how it has been received ranging from dislike to enjoyment - doesn't revolve around the plot of the ride I don't think. And "fixing" them would be easier if the story developers have a blank slate over trying to force in a Kessel Run plot and being constrained by that.
 

Incomudro

Well-Known Member
Regarding the land itself (and not having gone there) I had read that cast members would be seen - say... working on the ships.
Milling about.
Now, I know and always believed that many of the claims were greatly exaggerated - but it seems that this application has been cut to a bare minimum.
The land, though fantastically detailed - is largely a static walkthrough.
Send a droid - send R2D2 across one of those bridges.
Send him across with C3PO.
Have some cast members futz around with fittings around the Falcon...
 

WDW Pro

Well-Known Member
I have not been on the ride and have actively been avoiding too much details about it, but the idea of making it specifically about the "Kessel Run" IMHO sounds dumb.

The Kessel Run was a nice little easter egg (not really the right term, but can't think of one better) from the OT where it was just some undefined thing that the Falcon did. It was made even more infamous by using a unit of distance instead of time. That worked well, as referring to the Kessel Run is a nice in joke for the franchise.

But as is often the case when brief backstory gets expanding upon canonically, the Kessel Run has become less interesting by actually showing it. As an amorphous concept, it was kinda cool. What we got in Solo was a reasonable treatment given the constrains of the details known, but... meh. It would have been more interesting left undescribed and nebulous.

Having the ride be about the Kessel Run would be compounding this. Now, it would have to be tied to the canon from Solo which was okay for a movie, but I don't see it as being a good material for a ride. And the whole idea of the Kessel Run and parsecs is that the doing it "better" involves making it a shorter distance. How do you portray that effectively in a ride?

From what I know about the ride, I don't think the mission used is much of a problem. Having Chewie more involved might be good. As would having some more (any?) references to Han in the queue or maybe mentioning him in the pre-show or such. But using the Falcon to steal and smuggle? Um, that's a good thing.

And any issues with the interactivity - to whatever extent they are a "problem" since it seems to be a mixed bag in terms of how it has been received ranging from dislike to enjoyment - doesn't revolve around the plot of the ride I don't think. And "fixing" them would be easier if the story developers have a blank slate over trying to force in a Kessel Run plot and being constrained by that.

I see your point and agree with you in may aspects. It's just difficult to figure out what storyline you can give at this point with the Falcon being piloted with guests that really pulls you into the concept. What would your best idea be?
 
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