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News Star Wars: Galaxy's Edge - Historical Construction/Impressions

Professortango1

Well-Known Member
This is what I find silly. Disney pays 4 billion for an existing story, so they can tell a new story. Then they base all their merchandise for the property off their new story. Why not just skip the buyout in the first place? Seems like a waste of 4 billion to me if you have no interest in using the most popular characters in the series.

It would be like Disney buying Marvel and making all of their films based off of new super heroes they created instead of the old ones. When people think of Star Wars they think of Chewie, C3P0, Darth Vader, Luke, Leia, and R2D2. These characters that Disney created have only been around 4 years and were not even in any films by the time when the land started planning. Hondo who is a character made for a children's cartoon (I had to look it up) is the big AA for the ride? I guarantee you no one in the crowd over the age of 10 knows who he is.

Only nerds are into the "Universe of Star Wars". I grew up loving Star Wars and had seen all the tapes multiple times and had a ton of the video games but never did I care about the "extended universe" which is what this area is. A movie's universe is a setting but the characters and their interactions are what make a movie interesting. A setting that is "based off the universe of Star Wars" doesn't hold much appeal to me. I am going for some of the merchandise and the rides.
To many kids, Hondo is a known character. And they know Kylo Ren more than Darth Vader. These are the movies that this generation is growing up with. Disney isn't making a land for 40 year olds, they are making a land for kids and their parents. Disney has always aimed young for their core enticement. Its one of the reasons Alien Encounter didn't work because it was one of the few things not aimed at kids. My students are incredibly excited to see Kylo and Hondo. They love Po and can't wait to see his X-Wing. They are also incredibly excited to have their parents buy them pricey new lightsabers and merch. Disney isn't making the land to appeal to us, its making the land cool enough for all ages to enjoy but with characters and ideas the kids will recognize.
 

Disney Irish

Well-Known Member
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This is what I find silly. Disney pays 4 billion for an existing story, so they can tell a new story. Then they base all their merchandise for the property off their new story. Why not just skip the buyout in the first place? Seems like a waste of 4 billion to me if you have no interest in using the most popular characters in the series.
Because:

A. They didn't own the IP so they had to buy it in order to use even a reference to the characters you claim they aren't using. Which by the way they are, the only character not in the new trilogy you referenced is Vader, and that's because he died in that existing story you claim Disney isn't using but actually is.
B. You can't make movies with the same actors playing the same characters telling the same stories forever, the actors get old, they want to do something else, and some sadly die as we've seen recently.
C. They are trying to build for the future not the past. So they have to extend the universe beyond the core story that you claim they aren't using, but they actually are.
 

SSG

Well-Known Member
Over on MC a poster called LilMonsterPageant (He claims to be a CM) had this to say. Take it for what it's worth:

Entertainment Cancelled in Star Wars: Galaxy's Edge
Yesterday, 09:58 PM

I rode Smuggler's Run twice during their recent CM testings, and I think it's gonna be out of control popular. I'm not a gamer, so I didn't get that much into the actual ride, but just walking into the Millenium Falcon was awesome, and the queue is beyond belief!!

But being in the land and wandering backstage nearby was painful for many of us in Entertainment, because there was supposed to be so, so, so, soooooo much more to the land when it opens. According to several very knowledgeable Ent CM's it got cut by Bob Chapek in several rounds of cost cuttings over the last three years. After riding the Falcon the second time I learned the following stuff was cut and why----

The Dinner Show - This was supposed to be the big fancy sit-down restaurant next to Oga's Cantina. The Cantina was just supposed to be the small lobby lounge for the Dinner Show, like how Carthay Circle has its lounge downstairs. The Dinner Show would have been audience interactive and had AGVA performers, singers, musicians, and a small army of Tech Services CM's running the show, like a swanky Star Wars version of the Hoop De Doo Revue in World.

The space for the restaurant is still there as a paved parking lot now, and will be used as overflow queue line for the Falcon ride. The dinner show was one of the first things Chapek cut because it would cost a lot to keep running and operating, and Chapek doesn't like to set the bar high on stuff. According to Ent. management, Chapek likes to lower the bar as much as he can and then raise it later if enough people complain.

Oga's Cantina is TINY!!!!! and it's going to be hard to get in there, and they don't want you to stay long.

The Droids - These were cut out of the land entirely over a year ago, and the line that it's because of "overcrowding" is totally false. The real reason the droids were cut is because they would be operated remotely by Ent. CM's backstage who would be classified by the union as Puppeteers, and Puppeteers have a higher pay scale than many other Ent. CM's. This was easy for Chapek to cut because he got to it just before fabrication was to start, so he saved on fabrication costs over two fiscal years and saves on the cost of the Puppeteer payscales now.

This was also why they cancelled the Disney Jr. puppet show in DCA and turned it into a dance party, because a Puppeteer payscale is very high. A droid interacting with an audience has to be controlled by a union Puppeteer, so goodbye to all the droids that WDI planned for!!!.

The Land Performers - When we were going into Smuggler's Run, the overhead walkways and bridges nearby in the land were pointed out to me. This is where Ent. had interactive performances planned that would have gone along the rooflines and overhead walkways around the western half of the land. The show concept was going to use stuntmen, AGVA performers, and Tech Services to run it, and all of those classifications have upper payscales in the union contract, especially stuntmen. So Chapek cut them, but says he may approve adding them back later.

Ent. management also says that Chapek is fascinated by making the ride ops and foods and stores CM's get into the "Show" with their Batuu language. He's hoping that the ride ops and shop cashiers and foods CM's will be entertaining enough that you won't miss AGVA performers and professionally trained entertainers. It's much cheaper to pay a ride op to ham it up than it is to pay a professional singer/dancer/actor, plus the Tech Services that run their equipment and backstage support!!!

Also, the Smuggler's Run CM's told us they were supposed to be assigned to Rise of the Resistance, but Resistance is so screwed up and so behind schedule that they have nowhere else to go. They can't get the Resistance ride to run for more than 15 minutes at a time, before it breaks down for two or three hours!!!

I'm going back to the land next week for more rides and previews, I'll see what else gets mentioned!!!
 
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Old Mouseketeer

Premium Member
Over on MC a poster called LilMonsterPageantHe (claims to be a CM) had this to say. Take it for what it's worth:

Entertainment Cancelled in Star Wars: Galaxy's Edge
Yesterday, 09:58 PM

I rode Smuggler's Run twice during their recent CM testings, and I think it's gonna be out of control popular. I'm not a gamer, so I didn't get that much into the actual ride, but just walking into the Millenium Falcon was awesome, and the queue is beyond belief!!

But being in the land and wandering backstage nearby was painful for many of us in Entertainment, because there was supposed to be so, so, so, soooooo much more to the land when it opens. According to several very knowledgeable Ent CM's it got cut by Bob Chapek in several rounds of cost cuttings over the last three years. After riding the Falcon the second time I learned the following stuff was cut and why----

The Dinner Show - This was supposed to be the big fancy sit-down restaurant next to Oga's Cantina. The Cantina was just supposed to be the small lobby lounge for the Dinner Show, like how Carthay Circle has its lounge downstairs. The Dinner Show would have been audience interactive and had AGVA performers, singers, musicians, and a small army of Tech Services CM's running the show, like a swanky Star Wars version of the Hoop De Doo Revue in World.

The space for the restaurant is still there as a paved parking lot now, and will be used as overflow queue line for the Falcon ride. The dinner show was one of the first things Chapek cut because it would cost a lot to keep running and operating, and Chapek doesn't like to set the bar high on stuff. According to Ent. management, Chapek likes to lower the bar as much as he can and then raise it later if enough people complain.

Oga's Cantina is TINY!!!!! and it's going to be hard to get in there, and they don't want you to stay long.

The Droids - These were cut out of the land entirely over a year ago, and the line that it's because of "overcrowding" is totally false. The real reason the droids were cut is because they would be operated remotely by Ent. CM's backstage who would be classified by the union as Puppeteers, and Puppeteers have a higher pay scale than many other Ent. CM's. This was easy for Chapek to cut because he got to it just before fabrication was to start, so he saved on fabrication costs over two fiscal years and saves on the cost of the Puppeteer payscales now.

This was also why they cancelled the Disney Jr. puppet show in DCA and turned it into a dance party, because a Puppeteer payscale is very high. A droid interacting with an audience has to be controlled by a union Puppeteer, so goodbye to all the droids that WDI planned for!!!.

The Land Performers - When we were going into Smuggler's Run, the overhead walkways and bridges nearby in the land were pointed out to me. This is where Ent. had interactive performances planned that would have gone along the rooflines and overhead walkways around the western half of the land. The show concept was going to use stuntmen, AGVA performers, and Tech Services to run it, and all of those classifications have upper payscales in the union contract, especially stuntmen. So Chapek cut them, but says he may approve adding them back later.

Ent. management also says that Chapek is fascinated by making the ride ops and foods and stores CM's get into the "Show" with their Batuu language. He's hoping that the ride ops and shop cashiers and foods CM's will be entertaining enough that you won't miss AGVA performers and professionally trained entertainers. It's much cheaper to pay a ride op to ham it up than it is to pay a professional singer/dancer/actor, plus the Tech Services that run their equipment and backstage support!!!

Also, the Smuggler's Run CM's told us they were supposed to be assigned to Rise of the Resistance, but Resistance is so screwed up and so behind schedule that they have nowhere else to go. They can't get the Resistance ride to run for more than 15 minutes at a time, before it breaks down for two or three hours!!!

I'm going back to the land next week for more rides and previews, I'll see what else gets mentioned!!!
My Bothans report that, indeed, entertainment was cut from what was initially planned and that for a time the word being given was ZERO live entertainment in GE. However, now I'm hearing that character performers are being trained and costuming is preparing for a fair amount of characters. Expect a lot of Stormtroopers (and with even more dialog)! Also Kylo Ren, Rey, maybe Chewie, and a new AGVA (union performer who acts live, speaking and on a stage and/or microphone). I hear Launch Bay M&G may shrink a little and probably no more stormtroopers in Tomorrowland. We know there was an audition notice posted online for the AGVA, but I don't know the details.
 

mickEblu

Well-Known Member
Over on MC a poster called LilMonsterPageantHe (claims to be a CM) had this to say. Take it for what it's worth:

Entertainment Cancelled in Star Wars: Galaxy's Edge
Yesterday, 09:58 PM

I rode Smuggler's Run twice during their recent CM testings, and I think it's gonna be out of control popular. I'm not a gamer, so I didn't get that much into the actual ride, but just walking into the Millenium Falcon was awesome, and the queue is beyond belief!!

But being in the land and wandering backstage nearby was painful for many of us in Entertainment, because there was supposed to be so, so, so, soooooo much more to the land when it opens. According to several very knowledgeable Ent CM's it got cut by Bob Chapek in several rounds of cost cuttings over the last three years. After riding the Falcon the second time I learned the following stuff was cut and why----

The Dinner Show - This was supposed to be the big fancy sit-down restaurant next to Oga's Cantina. The Cantina was just supposed to be the small lobby lounge for the Dinner Show, like how Carthay Circle has its lounge downstairs. The Dinner Show would have been audience interactive and had AGVA performers, singers, musicians, and a small army of Tech Services CM's running the show, like a swanky Star Wars version of the Hoop De Doo Revue in World.

The space for the restaurant is still there as a paved parking lot now, and will be used as overflow queue line for the Falcon ride. The dinner show was one of the first things Chapek cut because it would cost a lot to keep running and operating, and Chapek doesn't like to set the bar high on stuff. According to Ent. management, Chapek likes to lower the bar as much as he can and then raise it later if enough people complain.

Oga's Cantina is TINY!!!!! and it's going to be hard to get in there, and they don't want you to stay long.

The Droids - These were cut out of the land entirely over a year ago, and the line that it's because of "overcrowding" is totally false. The real reason the droids were cut is because they would be operated remotely by Ent. CM's backstage who would be classified by the union as Puppeteers, and Puppeteers have a higher pay scale than many other Ent. CM's. This was easy for Chapek to cut because he got to it just before fabrication was to start, so he saved on fabrication costs over two fiscal years and saves on the cost of the Puppeteer payscales now.

This was also why they cancelled the Disney Jr. puppet show in DCA and turned it into a dance party, because a Puppeteer payscale is very high. A droid interacting with an audience has to be controlled by a union Puppeteer, so goodbye to all the droids that WDI planned for!!!.

The Land Performers - When we were going into Smuggler's Run, the overhead walkways and bridges nearby in the land were pointed out to me. This is where Ent. had interactive performances planned that would have gone along the rooflines and overhead walkways around the western half of the land. The show concept was going to use stuntmen, AGVA performers, and Tech Services to run it, and all of those classifications have upper payscales in the union contract, especially stuntmen. So Chapek cut them, but says he may approve adding them back later.

Ent. management also says that Chapek is fascinated by making the ride ops and foods and stores CM's get into the "Show" with their Batuu language. He's hoping that the ride ops and shop cashiers and foods CM's will be entertaining enough that you won't miss AGVA performers and professionally trained entertainers. It's much cheaper to pay a ride op to ham it up than it is to pay a professional singer/dancer/actor, plus the Tech Services that run their equipment and backstage support!!!

Also, the Smuggler's Run CM's told us they were supposed to be assigned to Rise of the Resistance, but Resistance is so screwed up and so behind schedule that they have nowhere else to go. They can't get the Resistance ride to run for more than 15 minutes at a time, before it breaks down for two or three hours!!!

I'm going back to the land next week for more rides and previews, I'll see what else gets mentioned!!!
Well there you have it people. Keep saying how great GOTG:MB is and let’s see what kind of crappy new attractions we get in the future as long as Chapek is in charge.
 

Disney Irish

Well-Known Member
Well there you have it people. Keep saying how great GOTG:MB is and let’s see what kind of crappy new attractions we get in the future as long as Chapek is in charge.
Well, I'm not say Chapek is great or anything and it sucks to hear some of what was cut. But from what Old Mouseketeer is indicating this is slightly outdated information. Some of the stuff is coming back, just maybe not as extensive as it was originally intended to be. This is the nature of projects in large companies, things get cut, things get changed, and some things come back. Its the nature of business.

Just remember things get cut all the time from park projects, even in Walt's day. Its only now with the internet there is much more light shown on it so the fandom can react immediately to it and everyone is up in arm about it.
 

nesboy43

Well-Known Member
well eventually some of those characters had to die and its not like the movies didn't have them in them.
Did Captain America, Thor, Iron Man, and Spider-Man have to die so Disney can usher in new characters for Marvel? Disney bought a series for the characters just to kill them off. Makes no sense. Might as well have made their own series.
 

Disney Irish

Well-Known Member
Did Captain America, Thor, Iron Man, and Spider-Man have to die so Disney can usher in new characters for Marvel? Disney bought a series for the characters just to kill them off. Makes no sense. Might as well have made their own series.
Only problem with that is that the MCU was just starting out when Disney bought Marvel, so most of the public hadn't known about those characters in movies for as long. Also Marvel themselves have killed off Cap, Thor, IM, and SM, at various points (many times even) in its past. So its not a good analogy.
 
For those who have gotten to ride MF:
How would you rate the difficulty of learning how to operate the various controls? (1-10)
And as a follow-up, would you say not knowing what you're "doing" ruins the overall experience?
There are three words to describe the pilot role: High Skill Cap
Gunner: I didn't get a chance to do it but it's more of the press the lit buttons to win.
Engineer: the "hardest" it gets is when the pilots straight up kamikazes into an obstacle or the gunners don't shoot down a tie in time so they shoot back and like 6 buttons and switches ALL LIGHT UP AT THE SAME TIME IN MIDDLE OF A BATTLE and it's quite satisfying to get them as fast as you can.
Overall: Pilot is by far the most difficult role so definitely trade with someone in your group when you're in the chess room if you don't want the pressure of everyone yell at you–effectively backseat drive the whole time haha.

P.S. Gunner and Engineer are non-difficult and you can't put a number on pilot. The handling is what you would call not great so you would either have to be a natural at looking far ahead and steering accordingly or memorize the map.
 

RedGinger

Member
To many kids, Hondo is a known character. And they know Kylo Ren more than Darth Vader. These are the movies that this generation is growing up with. Disney isn't making a land for 40 year olds, they are making a land for kids and their parents. Disney has always aimed young for their core enticement. Its one of the reasons Alien Encounter didn't work because it was one of the few things not aimed at kids. My students are incredibly excited to see Kylo and Hondo. They love Po and can't wait to see his X-Wing. They are also incredibly excited to have their parents buy them pricey new lightsabers and merch. Disney isn't making the land to appeal to us, its making the land cool enough for all ages to enjoy but with characters and ideas the kids will recognize.
My 6 year old son and his friends love Star Wars, have seen all the movies, blah blah blah. When I was his age (1980), every kid I knew (including myself) was FAR more enthusiastic for the original Star Wars films/characters/toys, etc. I don't think the new characters and stories resonate the same as the original ones. For example, the love for Po is nothing like the love for Han. Sure this is anecdotal, but I think a valid observation.

Us children of the original SW are aging and I don't think we're in the targeted demo anymore ... they're not making these new films for us, or this new land for us. Disney has blatantly said that they're passing the baton and creating new SW character archetypes aimed at a new younger audience. Although it's worth noting that we (the parents) are still the ones shelling out the dough to buy the toys, tickets, etc. for our children.
 

mickEblu

Well-Known Member
Well, I'm not say Chapek is great or anything and it sucks to hear some of what was cut. But from what Old Mouseketeer is indicating this is slightly outdated information. Some of the stuff is coming back, just maybe not as extensive as it was originally intended to be. This is the nature of projects in large companies, things get cut, things get changed, and some things come back. Its the nature of business.

Just remember things get cut all the time from park projects, even in Walt's day. Its only now with the internet there is much more light shown on it so the fandom can react immediately to it and everyone is up in arm about it.
No I get that it’s part of business. But hearing that this guy “likes to set the bar low and raise it only if people complain” is bothersome. Partly because most people don’t complain. Because most people are easily impressed or don’t know what they want. However, I do believe that cheaping out on Marvel Land/ Spider-Man just might be the one that comes back to bite him in the ***.

Disney parks and attractions shouldn’t be created for for the lowest common denominator. If that was the case Walt would have built another crappy amusement park and not this wonderful piece of Americana we spend so much time talking about 65 years later.
 
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Disney Irish

Well-Known Member
No I get that it’s part of business. But hearing that this guy “likes to set the bar low and raise it only if people complain” is bothersome. Partly because most people don’t complain. Because most people are easily impressed or don’t know what they want. However, I do believe that cheaping out on Marvel Land/ Spider-Man just might be the one that comes back to bite him in the ***.

Disney parks and attractions shouldn’t be created for for the lowest common denominator. If that was the case Walt would have built another crappy amusement park and not this wonderful piece of Americana we spend so much time talking about 65 years later.
Well I think its far from evidence, this single poster on another board who we don't know how accurate their information is, but I get the point. History will be the judge on Chapek's tenure.
 

Ismael Flores

Well-Known Member
Did Captain America, Thor, Iron Man, and Spider-Man have to die so Disney can usher in new characters for Marvel? Disney bought a series for the characters just to kill them off. Makes no sense. Might as well have made their own series.
you forget that the actors in star wars original series are much older and also did not really want to continue playing the same character for much longer.
Disney bought Marvel and created the characters and specifically got actors that were young and under contract for certain amount of movies.
yes they introduced new characters without killing them of right away and at the same time create individual storylines for them so that when it came time they were killed or gone to allow new characters to continue.

similar agenda but it works better with marvel because the actors are still young

no comparison to aging or dead star wars actors that cant continue their role

edited because part of post got lost when posting
 
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Disney Irish

Well-Known Member
True but I believe it because it jives with everything he’s done thus far.
Counterargument to that though, is the land or the experience going to suffer because of it? Personal opinion, I don't think so. Would it have been nice to have droids wandering around or a large streetmosphere with entertainers, absolutely. But logistically it may not have been possible in the way WDI was envisioning it with over 10k guests in the land. So "going cheap" may not have been the reason for the cuts.

Anyways, we'll see what happens especially now that we know that some of it is actually coming back. Again history will judge it.
 

mickEblu

Well-Known Member
Counterargument to that though, is the land or the experience going to suffer because of it? Personal opinion, I don't think so. Would it have been nice to have droids wandering around or a large streetmosphere with entertainers, absolutely. But logistically it may not have been possible in the way WDI was envisioning it with over 10k guests in the land. So "going cheap" may not have been the reason for the cuts.

Anyways, we'll see what happens especially now that we know that some of it is actually coming back. Again history will judge it.
So the restaurant wasn’t possible either? It will suffer in varying degrees. The restaurant would help guest experience tremendously by providing more capacity and entertainment to Ogas. Of course there is enough to do in SW that people will be entertained but I just don’t like the guy, what he stands for and how he treats the parks.
 

fctiger

Well-Known Member
This is what I find silly. Disney pays 4 billion for an existing story, so they can tell a new story. Then they base all their merchandise for the property off their new story. Why not just skip the buyout in the first place? Seems like a waste of 4 billion to me if you have no interest in using the most popular characters in the series.

It would be like Disney buying Marvel and making all of their films based off of new super heroes they created instead of the old ones. When people think of Star Wars they think of Chewie, C3P0, Darth Vader, Luke, Leia, and R2D2. These characters that Disney created have only been around 4 years and were not even in any films by the time when the land started planning. Hondo who is a character made for a children's cartoon (I had to look it up) is the big AA for the ride? I guarantee you no one in the crowd over the age of 10 knows who he is.

Only nerds are into the "Universe of Star Wars". I grew up loving Star Wars and had seen all the tapes multiple times and had a ton of the video games but never did I care about the "extended universe" which is what this area is. A movie's universe is a setting but the characters and their interactions are what make a movie interesting. A setting that is "based off the universe of Star Wars" doesn't hold much appeal to me. I am going for some of the merchandise and the rides.
Maybe I'm missing something but all those characters have been used in literally all the new films. Every single one. They created Rogue One just to give Darth Vader a cameo in it. He can't be in the new movies because Lucas killed him off 30 years ago, so what can you do? They also gave old fans a Han Solo prequel that came out just literally a year ago. Yoda showed up in TLJ. The Emperor and Lando are both coming back in Episode 9. And its rumored to be even more.

To me, this is basically a case of damn if you do and damn if you don't. Before Solo bombed, Disney had a rumored line up of standalone films starring everyone from Obi Wan Kenobi to Boboa Fett. But a lot of fans felt Disney was only coasting on the OT characters and not doing more original stories since many thought a Solo prequel was not needed and voted with their wallets. So they scrapped all those other movies and now they are shifting to more original stories with new characters in the future.

But they still brought back all the original characters in the ST, but the actors are in their 60s and 70s now, so its only a matter of time before they simply can't be used anymore. And several of them already passed away, Carrie Fisher in 2016 and Peter Mayhew just recently. And Fisher died before Episode 9 was even written and they still found a way to put Leia in that story too.

Eventually they would have to tell new stories because the actors playing the original characters will not be able to play them 10-20 years from now. And the bad Solo box office told them they can't just make prequel films of these characters for the next 20 years to please fans either. So you create new characters to carry on the legacy while still acknowledging the old ones. No offense, but your argument just doesn't make a lot of sense, especially since Disney has bent over backwards to bring in the old characters in the new stories.

The new land will have some of these characters too but they are also thinking about new fans today. I don't see an issue with that.
 
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Disney Irish

Well-Known Member
So the restaurant wasn’t possible either? It will suffer in varying degrees. The restaurant would help guest experience tremendously by providing more capacity and entertainment to Ogas. Of course there is enough to do in SW that people will be entertained but I just don’t like the guy, what he stands for and how he treats the parks.
We don't know all the answers here. He could be the worst guy to hit the parks in the history of the world. Or it could be that we're getting information from a bad game of telephone and everything is just being accused on him being "cheap". There could be lots of legitimate reasons why the restaurant was cut, including WDI going way over budget (which has been known to happen more than once). But instead of blaming the real reason Chapek becomes the lighting rod because he's the head of the parks.

In my personal opinion there have been far worse people in charge of the parks in its long history than Chapek. Am I pleased with all he's done, no of course not. But I also know that I have no control over anything they do, I only have control over my feelings. And I choose to look at the positive experiences I still have at the parks, the most recent being 2 weekend ago on a solo trip.
 

SSG

Well-Known Member
This doesn't prove that stunt performers will or won't be in GE, but this permit was from last summer:

BLD2018-02794Disneyland - SW - DL Frontierland Expansion - Bldg 10070 - New per-fabricated ship has one stunt performer only. Anchored to existing pad. Foundation under permit BLD2017-02850

So at one time there was at least a plan to have stunt people there.
 
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