Splash Mountain re-theme announced

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DisneyCane

Well-Known Member
Only yourself and others here flailing in their arguments are claiming the “woke” garbage. By accounts of insiders, they knew the problematic elements of the ride for years, hence having artwork and a loose plan in place. It was fast tracked due to recent events.

Of course they care about money; they’re a business. I wouldn’t expect less.

As a business that holds these IPs, they can decided to change what and when they want. In this instance, they chose Splash. As mentioned, it’s likely other changes will come. That is their right.

Get real. Have you read a single rumor on this site about Disney planning to re-theme SM to Princess and the Frog? Then, all of a sudden after a petition pops up, gets reported in the news and suddenly they release these grand plans that have been being worked on for years.

I guess we won't have to wait long for the announcement of the super secret, long developed, "Hall of the Incredibles."

Show me where Disney trumpeted their wokeness.

I'll wait.
Did you not read the quotes from Disney on the WDWmagic article? They didn't officially say why they were changing it but the things they tout about the new theme touches on all the good woke points.
 

celluloid

Well-Known Member
Ray is a alligator and is repaid for him helping the protagonist at the end of the story by playing in her nightclub and having his dream come true so no.

Mama Odie comes closer but seeing as Tiana is black invalidates the trope, she is another trope the “old sage” like Obi Won in a New Hope.

Wrong. You are thinking of Louis. Ray is a firefly. A firefly who is the only one who can take them down the bayou and light the way who(spoiler since maybe youd did not see it) dies at the end and floats to the sky, becoming a star after having nothing but giving evetything to help his friends. A trope is a trope. It does not make it bad, and that one fits your description.

Mama Odie does not help Tiana as much as she helps Navine get the curse lifted, he was the one that started the trouble.
 

wdwmagic

Administrator
Moderator
Premium Member
I'm quite a ways skimming through that thread, and so far all i see is political discussion. I'm looking for details about what sort of scenery the ride will use (how dense the sets will be, physical vs projections) and whether the ride will still retain a similar quantity and quality of animatronic figures. Is any of this addressed by insiders in the thread?
Disney has not yet completed the design phase on this, so nothing has leaked at this point. This project seems a while away from being started.
 

MickeyMouse10

Well-Known Member
Yes. I felt exactly the same when they replaced the stunt show & Backlot tour with Galaxys Edge & Toy Story Land... our beloved history gone :rolleyes:

LOL, the difference between Splash and those two though is that people actually care about it. A restroom would have been an improvement over the Backlot Tour.
 

orlandogal22

Well-Known Member
I actually think the SeaWorld example is a good one. The Blackfish film changed public perception of the park is a major way. Disney wants to avoid something like this happening to them.

You missed my point.

My point was people cherry-pick what they want to be offended by. I'd be on Disney FB pages where people would argue SeaWorld was basically the devil but then completely excuse Disney for having dolphins and other sea creatures in captivity... because, well, it's Disney.

And due to them being Disney fans, it was a bit more inconvenient for them to cancel Disney, to protest Disney, to never go to Disney again - any of the parks - for doing the exact same thing. It was much easier to bash SeaWorld, the smaller of the two.

I should also reference - do you know how Disney acquired their original dolphins? Look it up. It ain't pretty.

Again, point being - people cherrypick what is often the easiest thing at the time to go after. In the context of the conversation last night / early morning, that's all I was referring to.
 

lebeau

Well-Known Member
Wrong. You are thinking of Louis. Ray is a firefly. A magical firefly who(spoiler since maybe youd did not see it) dies at the end and floats to the sky, becoming a star after having nothing but giving evetything to help his friends. A trope is a trope. It does not make it bad, and that one fits your description.

Are you saying Ray, the firefly voice by Jim Cummings, was a magical negro? That's an interesting take...
 

celluloid

Well-Known Member
Are you saying Ray, the firefly voice by Jim Cummings, was a magical negro? That's an interesting take...

No. I am saying if that is a trope, he would fit the description. Color is irrelevant. That is a movie trope, not a race issue within a movie. I was not the one that had a definition for the trope. He was a source of contention from some extremists when the movie was coming out because he was a stereotypical cajun ignorant deipcition, who turns out to be magically right.
 

RoysCabin

Well-Known Member
The politicization of everything continues. Who in their right mind goes on this ride and thinks it is a terrible scourge on humanity, rather than just enjoying it for what it is? Country Bears Jamboree might as well be next, since it is bunch of hillbilly bears, I'm sure there must be hostile undertones there. And, hey, Chef Art Smith, time to change your successful menu to some type of fusion to reflect diversity, etc. We've all gone mad.
I hate to be the bearer of bad tidings, and it may just be my background as a civics teacher talking, but the reality is that everything is inherently political: every public action, ever decision, every artistic choice has an element of the political to it. When we don't notice the politics behind a work or an institution, it's typically because said work or institution simply reflects the values of the current political status quo; for example, a film made in the 1950s that depicts a woman as a traditional housewife would not have been considered political, while one depicting a woman attempting to succeed in an office dominated by men, as most were at the time, would be. But is that fair? Is it not a political choice in that setting to opt to choose "housewife" as the default role for the woman in one's movie, just as much as it is to depict her as a career woman? Both are political, but one reflects what the dominant group saw as the status quo, and thus floats by unquestioned (as context, it's not true that a majority of women in the US during the 50s were housewives; within the dominant social group, however, which at the time was white suburban nuclear families supported most often by office jobs, that was often the expectation).

Heck, all we have to do is go back to the opening of Disneyland to see Walt engaging in the political, with his desire to showcase "the ideals, dreams, and the hard facts" that shaped America as expressed in the park's dedication. Well, those are political choices: what are the ideals? Who's choosing which ideals are most important, which don't need to be discussed, or which are considered unacceptable? And the "hard facts"; whose version of history and presentation of facts are we going to be presented with? What if Walt had succeeded in getting Edison Square up and running, but used that as a chance to gloss over Edison's abusive labor practices and his theft from figures like Tesla? Walt would have been free to do so, it was his park and was meant for lighthearted family vacations, after all, but such a choice comes with a very clear political aspect to it that Walt wanted to educate the masses but likely would have only wanted to do so on terms he felt comfortable with.

Basically, it's a dangerous turn of phrase we still see people engage with, that the status quo is somehow inherently apolitical, and any challenge to the status quo is political, and thus unwelcome, when the reality is that both are equally political in nature.
 

Figurehead

Member
In the Parks
No
Dole whips are vegan. 🤷‍♀️

And it’s very classy to tie racist elements that harken back to one of the darkest times in our history with an inappropriate joke. Congrats.
Are you ok with the Pirates of the Caribbean ride? Don't you think their history is problematic or will you look the other way only when it suits you? People like you demand tolerance only for the things you agree with. If someone else has a different opinion you are aghast. We call that hypocrisy. Have a magical day.
 

MerlinTheGoat

Well-Known Member
I'd look at who's spearheading the refresh. That would clue us in as to what to expect. Opinions being what they are; I'm expecting something like Navi River Journey but with a giant showboat at the end and obligatory fireworks in the distance! Screens for areas where they can't afford AAs and the removal of 2/3rd of the AAs because they don't align with the art style of P&F.
That's the same assessment I made in an earlier post in this thread.

I don't see them keeping any of the actual AA's. They're not proportioned to fit the designs of animals or humans from the movie (unless that's not something the imagineers care about). Even if they were reskinned. My guess is MAYBE half a dozen or so new human AA's (and for Louis) if we're lucky. But most animals likely to not be animatronics, instead basic or static figures akin to most of the Little Mermaid characters. And given the people involved and recent trends, much of the physical scenery will probably be gutted and replaced with video screens.
 

PrincessNelly_NJ

Well-Known Member
LOL, the difference between Splash and those two though is that people actually care about it. A restroom would have been an improvement over the Backlot Tour.
People loved ToT and GMR too.. No matter how much you love a ride or show, the parks updating & changing is part of the fun. Being able to make new memories and see cool new uses of technology is always fun.
 

Touchdown

Well-Known Member
Wrong. You are thinking of Louis. Ray is a firefly. A magical firefly who(spoiler since maybe youd id not see it) dies at the end and floats to the sky after having nothing but giving evetything to help his friends. A trope is a trope. It does not make it bad, and that one fits your description.

Mama Odie does not help Tiana as much as she helps Navine get the curse lifted, he was the one that started the trouble.

Im sorry, I actually assumed you mistook the two. Ray is a Cajun, which means he’s a white firefly. Cajuns are descendants of French settlers and didn’t think anyone would try to bring him up. So we have a magical “white” character helping a black character, which is the exact opposite of the trope we were discussing.

It almost would be another problematic trope “the white savior” (Dances with Wolves, Last Samurai or Avatar) but it’s not because Ray is not the protagonist, Tiana is. Therefore Ray is just a sidekick, like Olaf, Jimmy Cricket, etc.
 

lebeau

Well-Known Member
A firefly? But if it is enough to define and be offended, then you are having the same problems you would have with splash mountain?

YOU brought up the firefly! As an example of the magical negro trope. I honestly don't know what point you were trying to make.
 

SpoiledBlueMilk

Well-Known Member
Tony Baxter is described as a "creative advisor" on the project. That tells us literally nothing and could mean as little as "oh yeah he knows about the project and he had an opinion". Baxter is apparently not well liked by a number of high ranking people currently at WDI (including Tom Fitzgerald). Or by executive leaders, including Bob Iger in particular who he has made not-so-subtle public jabs at regarding Imagination/Dreamfinder. I seriously doubt he is being given any substantive involvement or creative control.

Trowbridge has done some good work especially with scenery, especially regarding Harry Potter. But i'm not sure his skillset is optimized for the type of ride Splash Mtn is. A lot of his ride projects have been heavy on video projection and light on animatronics. Also not sure what capacity he's involved.

Charita Carter... I'm sorry but i'm absolutely not impressed with the Mickey ride whatsoever. I'm not familiar with her involvement in prior rides, but if Mickey is her biggest and best work, then i'm very worried. At best, it serves as a nice template for upgrading a ride like Mr Toad. But it was a massive disappointment as a Mickey Mouse ride and is an especially spectacular flop as a replacement for Great Movie Ride (which stands alongside some of the absolute best Disney rides). If the Mickey ride is any indication of how Princess and the Log will turn out, then there are no words for the disappointment.

I didn't realize she led the new Mickey ride. That scares me a bit since she might be included to use the same "2 and a half D" tech they used at DHS for Splash. If they are going to retime the ride, they need to focus on making it as immersive as possible to even come close to the original - that means physical elements and animatronics, not projection screens.
 
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