Spaceship in Spaceship Earth

[Vernonpush]

Those orbs are actually dust particles on the lense of the camera. I believe that I have seen a similar question posted on this board sealing with all of this spiritual stuff.

Actually they are probably not dust particles on the lense, but just particles floating in the air. The flash of the camera highlights them since they are usually close to the camera.

 

[joel_maxwell]

Those orbs are actually dust particles on the lense of the camera. I believe that I have seen a similar question posted on this board sealing with all of this spiritual stuff.

you just missed a golden opportunity to pull the, "yes, they are ghost and spirits and if you take a flash photo on a dark ride again they will eat you"..... but then again, you could make the kid never want to go back.

 

[WDW Monorail]

you just missed a golden opportunity to pull the, "yes, they are ghost and spirits and if you take a flash photo on a dark ride again they will eat you"..... but then again, you could make the kid never want to go back.

:lookaroun

And yes they could also be dust particles in the air which I thought that I mentioned but I guess not.

 

[Expo_Seeker40]

jmaxwell you know it's the spirit of the little girl who will never be in her window again!!!! :dazzle:

.....oh my I have too much time on my hands sometimes :lol:

 

[jasondiff]

Hi all,
I've been following this thread for a while but didn't have anything to add. But I just got Jeff Lange's SSE DVD today and have been watching it. It has some of the clearest video of the girl in the window, and the ride actually stopped while he was right under the red lights and dome with flashing lights. Also the third verse of TC is on it and quite clear. I'm heading to WDW in two weeks and am very excited to check out SSE especially now with the reports of it being much brighter up there. I hope Epcotrob has some pics by then but if not I'll try to get some. If I can get to EMH at Epcot some night I'll be sure to ride it several times just before closing. This is a great thread and it's amazing the amount of research people can do by collaborating and communicating from different places. Kinda reminds you of the original theme of SSE!

BTW, does anyone have the lyrics of the third verse of TC? I can make out most of it but not the last part. I can only find the lyrics to the first two verses online and my "A Souvenir Disney Songbook" also only has 2 verses.

 

[jasondiff]

Martin,
After watching the DVD and your enhanced video several times, and looking at Planet7's picture, it seems to me that the position of the girl in your groundplan is off. I put in a pink dot where it seems to me the girl is. The yellow dot looks to be the picture of the rocket/engine/shuttle thing in Planet7's pic. This seems to be too far behind the rider to be seen upward and to the right as it looks from the videos. Also the window looks like a flat window, but the rocket/engine thing looks to be cylindrical, although this isn't conclusive at all.
Does this seem possible?

 

[DubyooDeeDubyoo]

Martin's yellow dot is almost exactly where this is. The tunnel going on downwards is directly underneath that. That's the cylinder-like object I referred to and a CM at unload called a rocketship, although I'm only about 70% sure he and I were on the same page.

Someone earlier asked if the girl was actually inside that thing somewhere but I can't imagine so because you never directly face it at any angle. The only way to see it is to turn around in your seat and look behind you to see it and experience a tad of vertigo when you notice just how steep an angle the decline is.

Edited with additions: I downloaded this shot and brightened it up in Photoshop a bit and glared into the murk. I may be going nuts, but I think I'm seeing something. For the old-school riders, does this look right at all? (animated picture below)

I suppose I could just be seeing random pixels lit up by cranking up the settings of the picture, or I could also be seeing the backside of the sphere tiles, or...

But this does not at all jive with where I saw my mysterious reflective object, which was almost directly in front of the passenger once fully rotated and descending.

 

[POOHKILLEDTOAD]

Being the geek I am with these things, I`ve recently been doing some research for a video including 180 top from the Perrin & Cronkite era.

As well as the satellite and astronaut there was also a form - as in a shape in the darkness - of a space station. The station had a window in it which had a girl looking out, hands on glass, watching the work on the satellite. It was this `station` that the ride passed under and into backwards, and it was also the structure that held the red strips of light and dome above the track as the descent began.

Here is a work in progress of the layout of 180 top pre 1994:

see and i thought the led light tubres on the way down either were sent from it or to it.

 

[jasondiff]

Martin's yellow dot is almost exactly where this is. The tunnel going on downwards is directly underneath that. That's the cylinder-like object I referred to and a CM at unload called a rocketship, although I'm only about 70% sure he and I were on the same page.

Someone earlier asked if the girl was actually inside that thing somewhere but I can't imagine so because you never directly face it at any angle. The only way to see it is to turn around in your seat and look behind you to see it and experience a tad of vertigo when you notice just how steep an angle the decline is.

I think we're talking about the same thing. I was referring to
this pic from Planet7, which looks to be the same picture you have, and in the same place. Are they the same thing? Is that the only thing up there that looks like that? I seem to think the girl in the window was in some sort of horizontal cylinder, not a vertical shaped one like in these pics.

 

[marni1971]

Wahoo! The great debate continues!

jasondiff; the yellow dot is indeed the vertical cylinder-on-the-wall in the various photos. It was the blank rectangle on this that popular concensus says originally had the rectangular window and girl in. From what I remember the girl couldn`t be seen if you didn`t look for her. You really had to turn your head round. It was easier at first since she was up to your right, but as the Omni descended and turned the first core curve she moved to a directly behind and above position. I distinctly recall her being well above the track; you could see the ceiling of the `room` behind her more, as opposed to the back wall of the `room`. This would also tie-in with the info I have about the original plans having wrong perspective and placement, and I quote

It was dumb staging that wasted an expensive set, but obviously some saw it in their peripheral vision and remembered it.

and

the design was wrong, a spaceship in the top of the ride, kind of wasted by being out of the sight lines of the guest

dubyoo; same again. You didn`t actually face the girl at anytime as you say. I agree from the video it seems you would actually have gone totally past her off-axis, as if travelling to the right of her. Interesting. This would indeed place her on the wall to the LEFT of the cylinder. As for the highlighted image in the photo you posted; I can also see something in the murk. What, I don`t know. If I read it correctly it`s looking to the left of the track, just before the descent begins. One of the `94 TV news screen support cables is in foreground. From what I know, nothing was ever supposed to have been placed in the area you note - even the original space station under construction props would have been lower and stretch off to the right of the picture.

Jeffs DVD does sound very interesting; I should hopefully have mine soon (thanks guys :wave: )

 

[DubyooDeeDubyoo]

This would indeed place her on the wall to the LEFT of the cylinder. As for the highlighted image in the photo you posted; I can also see something in the murk. What, I don`t know. If I read it correctly it`s looking to the left of the track, just before the descent begins. One of the `94 TV news screen support cables is in foreground. From what I know, nothing was ever supposed to have been placed in the area you note - even the original space station under construction props would have been lower and stretch off to the right of the picture.

We need to get our left/right orientation worked out here :lol: .

The picture I highlighted appears to be taken after rotating backwards looking out the viewer's right-side. You mentioned the support pole and the stuff in front of it is the walls for the upcoming descent trench.


I kind of assumed this is where the sat was, everything I had seen here said to look out to the right once you finished getting turned around. The thing in the darkness I saw reflecting starlight was almost directly in front of me once I was tilted back for descent (in other words, my line of vision was a few degrees upwards from where it would be rolling along on the flat surface.) I thought this is where the sat was but I could just be seeing a piece of the sat, that mirrored reflection could have been a piece of a panel, although it would really have to be huge (like, 20ft long panels) to have stretched from a core on the right side out to in front of the descent trench.

 

[cloudboy]

This is going way back into the far reaches of my memory, so I may be totally off base on this, but I remember looking UP at the girl as she passed overhead while you were moving backwards.

Is it possible that the time when the ride vehicles turn around has changed?

 

[marni1971]

This is going way back into the far reaches of my memory, so I may be totally off base on this, but I remember looking UP at the girl as she passed overhead while you were moving backwards.

Is it possible that the time when the ride vehicles turn around has changed?

I don`t think so.... though there`s still so many unknowns here. The girl though certainly wasn`t infront of you - as in infront and above your viewing location. The Omni rotation I guess is triggered by hardware in the ride system, and though possible to be physically moved I can`t see a reason why that would be. There is however a discrepancy with the rotation position on official doumentation; I`ve seen the rotation being noted in 2 slightly different locations - though both have the rotation complete well before the descent (If it didn`t it`d be a bit of a mess come the downward ramp if you still faced forward... I wonder if there`s any failsafe for this?)

 

[Expo_Seeker40]

All right kids, get your EPCOT Center T-shirts, Spaceship Earth posters, Communicore Carpeting, and Tomorrow's Child lyrics sheet as Expo proudly presents "Expo's you-know-you-want-to-read-it 180top theory".

Marni I think we need a new yousendit few minute 180top resimulation when you have time! :sohappy:

We leave the commincations corridor/tunnel. Our time machine vehicle is facing forward. Ahead of us are stars. Above us our stars. To our left are stars. To our forward right *think diagonal* is where the astronaut is taking the cyndrical object to the much larger solar paneled satelite *which you can't see yet*. To our left are stars in the distance, but in the foreground are the moonrock set pieces and behind that is the empty platform that was going to house the space station extension....all there is now is the octagonal shaft sticking slightly out of the platform.

The Earth projection is to our right backish. Directly behind is is the communications corridor/tunnel and access area to the roof.

Our vehicle begins to rotate only seconds after we get into 180top. The astronaut and cyndrical tube come into focus just briefly and now our attention is drawn to the vacant spacestation scene and earth projection. We could also see now in front of us a brief glimpse of the communications corridor/tunnel and access to the hatch which sits above the tunnel.

Now backwards there are stars above us...infront of us...and on out right. To our left is the vacant space station scene area and earth projection.

Now we continue to head backwards and the track begins to turn in order to eventually go down at an angle. Stars are above us....and to our left...and to our right...but also to our right and slightly above us is the astronaut and cylinder piece. Earth is no longer in view...being blocked by the spacestation shaft. And the empty platform for the space station scene is no longer in view, except for the moonrocks.

Now we begin to head down the shaft that runs through spaceship earth and this particular part of the shaft was a simple set for the spacestation.

Above us is the octagonal and geometric overhang roof of the spacestation with pink and white track lighting, and flashing stars or other lights showcased above it. The rest of the space station over hang roof was mostly dark with simple lighting and blinking stars. *beanboon's pics do show the geometry of the space station overhang. As we descened just past the entrance into the space station to our right is the large solar paneled satelite with astronaut working on it. This has no real lighting on it except for our eyes adjust to the space station ceiling light that reflects on it.

There is nothing to our left. Just simple sound panneled walls that you can't even see. Behind us and to our diagonal right....we notice something...a bright light source...we turn our heads and see a girl in a cydrincal futuristic window staring not at us....because remember we travel in time...these people can't see us...but she is staring at the astronaut on the satelite....the satelite is also connected to a mechanical arm that is attached to the exterior of the space station.

You see folks that *object* in the shaft IS the window where the girl was. She was placed there because story wise she is in a window that serves as the EXTERIOR of the space station. The shaft isn't the space station. Only one side of the shaft has a space station exterior wall....the window that sticks out of it...because the little lighting there is makes you see the futuristic materal the window structure is made out of.... you would think that the rest of the space station looks like that...but is just simple sound panneled walls because we can't see it anyway! The only other part of the space station we are meant to see is the overhang roof...which has the satelite under it. An outdoor canopy on someone's home if you will.

Then we leave the space station...directly passing under the window that holds the girl....in theory we would enter the space station itself but instead travel through time more...into mysterious purple gass clouds and the tomorrow's child section.

In 1994 both astronauts...the cyndrical tube....and satelite were removed and were planned to be used again in the 1994 refurb of 180top....but time, money, and budget, and the small demand to reuse them caused these set pieces to never show up again. The earth projection it looks like was a new one in 1994 and in a new place. I think the old earth projection was a duplicate print of the 1975 earth projection that is used in space mountain! Both show a very cloudy earth!

The space station scene now became useless. The white and pink track lit overhang was dismanteled and only its skeletal frame exists to help assist to the now gone second floating television. The first floating television is on its own 1994 created structure.

At one time the skeletal frame of the space station roof was used to house a mist and projector effect. Pretty random it was!

With no space station and no astroanuts and satelites...it made no sense for the girl to be there...so she and the interior of the window is removed...the window frame is boarded up, but I assume the window and walls and roof were always black. The rest of the space station roof and window remain because it is too late and too difficult to take them about with the 1994 reopening approaching....and on the never ever used left side wall of the shaft is the floating classroom scene that is installed.

And there you have it...but in my opinion. :lol:

 

[Expo_Seeker40]

Oh and the enhanced image that was just posted...that murk is nothing more than the geometrically tiled ceiling of 180top that has the stars projected onto it. You wouldn't even be able to see the satelite from there. If we are looking at the picture...the satelite would have been to the right of the screen and below it...completely out of view. The satelite was literally inside the shaft that was the space station.

Now the astronaut with the cyndrical tube would have been to the left of the picture. So evidently the picture captures nothing mysterious! Ahhh!!!!

 

[jasondiff]

One thing I noticed from the videos is that the window with the girl in it has a reflection of the red track lighting. I wonder if it is possible to use that reflection, and knowing where the red track lighting was, to determine where the window would have been. I know it's a long shot but maybe a possibility.

On Jeff's video you definitely see the girl in the window before you see the red track lighting, not that this means anything though...

 

[Expo_Seeker40]

We already know what the window is. It is the large tubular structure that is still on the wall in the octagonal shaft. We also know where it is. It's above the area where we exit the shaft and is the yellow dot on Marni's map.

The DVD footage most likely had the filmer filming the stars of 180top as they were heading backwards and down into the shaft and the camera pans down then across the shaft to see the girl in the window since that would be the only good window of oportunity to film her....no pun intended...then the camera pans back to the pink and white track lighting that is on the space station overhang roof. Meanwhile the entire time the satelite would be in view back and forth the video pans, but is nothing more than a white blur I assume. :wave:

 

[Katya]

This is getting fun - but we need someone on the inside to put us out of our misery!

Regarding the red lights, and if this support structure is in planet7`s recent pics, have a look at this:

Hi, new here! :wave:

I know this all seems really old, and I didn't make it through the whole thread, I've just been comping at the bit to say something.

These particular pictures are actually of a structure that used to project lights and I THINK originally was supposed to be for a kinda mist effect.

And I believe the said "space station" everyone's been talking about it what I've always been told is the old Gemini capsule, which is indeed still there, just painted black without any of the appendages sticking out of it. It's actually very easily seen if you know when to look (i.e. instead of looking at the Virtual Classroom you're supposed to be looking at).

I've spent a decent amount of time up there at 180top with work lights on (and off for that matter) and admittedly have walked the entire floor area up there and never seen any remnants of anything I seem to have seen mentioned. But mostly I'm just not surewhat everyone's talking about.

Again, sorry if you've had all these answers already...just so excited to be here.

 

[Katya]

I don`t think so.... though there`s still so many unknowns here. The girl though certainly wasn`t infront of you - as in infront and above your viewing location. The Omni rotation I guess is triggered by hardware in the ride system, and though possible to be physically moved I can`t see a reason why that would be. There is however a discrepancy with the rotation position on official doumentation; I`ve seen the rotation being noted in 2 slightly different locations - though both have the rotation complete well before the descent (If it didn`t it`d be a bit of a mess come the downward ramp if you still faced forward... I wonder if there`s any failsafe for this?)

In fact, there is a failsafe. There are sensors that cause the ride to stop if the cars aren't where they should be at any "stopping" point of the rotations such as this. (And we're talking old sensors, nothing too high tech, they've always been there.)

 

[Katya]

As I got out, I asked a young man on unload if he's ever seen the sets with all the lights turned on and he said yes, so I asked him about this stuff. He said "it's all still there" and talked about how the rocket is there, the satellite is there, and the astronaut frozen in a spacewalk pose. I then left, and thought about Expo_Seeker's comment about the AA in the window and whether she was repurposed for the translation scene. Personally, I'm not sure since they have a live-action video of a girl with the same apparence in that room, but then again the boy AA doesn't look much like the kid on her screen either.

Anyway, the guy at the post-show wall wouldn't let me walk back up the exit to talk to the first guy but offered to take my questions, and he also confirmed everything the first guy said and when I asked about the girl he said it's "very possible." He then drifted into this thing about Walt Disney, the World's Fair, and the hall of Presidents. This was kind of lost on me because as far as I know the only President AA made for a world's fair was Disneyland's Lincoln made for the state of Illinois in '64. I'm not sure if he meant OLD HoP AAs from the MK or what. Either way, he said that most of the AA figs in SSE are former Presidents. And that the guy playing the mandolin in the Rennaisance is Eisenhower.

I know CMs have a tendency for pulling legs and tall tales, and since I can't remember Walt building any Presidents other than Lincoln it's raised a red flag, but I thought I'd throw this to the crowd and find out what anyone else thinks, or if this is commonly known trivia (I'm a DL vet and not much of a WDW info-hound.)

Also, if there's anything someone (Martin in particular since I know he's working so hard on this) wants me to ask around to the various CMs at the ride tomorrow, please let me know promptly. They seem to know what it looks like with the house lights on and some of them are quite eager to talk about their attraction. Thanks.

Indeed, all the CMs do know what 180top looks like with work lights on, as when we're training we spent quite a bit of time up there. Not to mention, it's required for the ability to run things like evacs that we know what's going on.

Now, I will admit that as a CM having worked seasonally at SSE for over a year now, I have never seen the astronauts or the space station or any satellite pieces, so I might have to dsiagree with whoever it was you talked to. Some cast members will indeed exaggerate or sadly, not care enough to remember all the facts.

Although, I will say, I vaguely remember being told that the chances were really high the AA girl is still in the capsule.

Surprisingly enough, there's not really a whole lot behind those black walls to keep you from seeing...well, mostly maintenance stuff, so far as I know. And was a trainee everyone is taken up to around right under the projection and next to the star projector and there is really just....a lot of nothing and empty.

I would, of course, love to answer any other questions I can about my attraction, as much as I can. I think I avoided mentioning directly that I was a SSE CM previously, but I am! And experienced at that (as of tonight, I can say I've officially run two evacs, and in case you're wondering, they arent much fun. )